Nintendo Switch - Happy Switchmas Everyone!

[Shift]

That's progress. Nintendo are learning!

 

Progress? The thing still has an audio port!

 

That's so 2016

[Dcubed]

What's with the silence in regard to whether it's touch screen? They got some kind of surprise?

 

Well the rumours (that have mostly been spot on) stipulate a capacitive touch screen and motion sensors for the JoyCons (along with "next gen vibration technology", whatever that means...), so they've no doubt got some neat surprises up their sleeves here...

 

Also there's the mystery button as well that people think is a Share button of sorts. So there's obviously plenty to it that they're not telling us yet.

 

http://www.ign.com/articles/2016/10/20/nintendo-confirms-amiibo-support-for-nintendo-switch-clarifies-additional-features

 

The dock shouldn't really add much extra cost to the system so price will be interesting. £249

 

Interesting indeed. Sounds like the system just upclocks when docked then and then ups the resolution/graphics/framerate to match the console standard.

 

£249.99 actually sounds doable. If the dock doesn't have any crazy hardware built-in and it's based on the Tegra X2 (which it probably is, considering that N-vidia said that it's based on their same architecture as their top-end Geforce cards; which means Pascal, which means X2 based), then that would put it in the £249.99-£299.99 range.

 

720p screens aren't terribly expensive these days either and they're a sensible target for this kind of hardware on a handheld device if they're targeting Wii U quality visuals on a handheld (which it looks like they've pulled off). Motion control sensors are also dirt cheap these days, as is NFC and a touch screen; so that wouldn't really bring the price up much at all.

 

Yeah, £249.99 might actually be doable (although it'll probably be a bit higher here in the UK, because the pound sterling is basically worth a half eaten packet of peanuts these days)

 

Also, these parts are generally off the shelf so to speak (obviously customised, but not exotic in design) and there's no set cost pieces in there like a hard drive, so the production costs should drop fairly quickly too.

 

BTW, can I just say that JoyCon sounds like some sort of Chinese knockoff?

 

 

'cause it totally does

Edited October 20, 2016 by Dcubed

[The Bard]

I really doubt the undocked console won't be 1080p though. The Nvidia Shield K1 Tablet from nearly three years ago retails for £150 these days and it has a 8 inch screen at 1920x1200. There's legitimately nothing preventing or prohibiting Nintendo from being able to achieve that sort of pixel density and the X1 chip that it's undoubtedly based on would be overkill for a lower resolution.

 

I mean look how beautiful the six games on the trailer are. There's no argument to be made for a lower resolution being a better choice. I don't want to compromise the art with terribly aliased edges and muddy textures just because it might lower the price of the thing by thirty dollars. Fuck I just got a WQHD screen an I'm losing my shit all over again playing Witcher 3 on it, so 1080p has to be the bare minimum.

[killthenet]

I really doubt the undocked console won't be 1080p though. The Nvidia Shield K1 Tablet from nearly three years ago retails for £150 these days and it has a 8 inch screen at 1920x1200. There's legitimately nothing preventing or prohibiting Nintendo from being able to achieve that sort of pixel density and the X1 chip that it's undoubtedly based on would be overkill for a lower resolution.

 

I mean look how beautiful the six games on the trailer are. There's no argument to be made for a lower resolution being a better choice. I don't want to compromise the art with terribly aliased edges and muddy textures just because it might lower the price of the thing by thirty dollars. Fuck I just got a WQHD screen an I'm losing my shit all over again playing Witcher 3 on it, so 1080p has to be the bare minimum.

 

I think the main argument for it being 720p is that it would provide better battery life than 1080p, i'm not sure how much of a boost to battery life it would be but if it gives an extra hour or two then it would probably be worth the drop on quality to many people.

[Blade]

So with the docking station just being a way to connect it to the TV surely this is a handheld that videos out to the TV.

 

All very exciting though!

 

That D Pad is horrid! Looks like playing 2d platformers is a no go when portable.

[liger05]

This been posted?

 

While Bethesda's much beloved Skyrim was clearly shown during Nintendo's Switch reveal video, the publisher told us today that it's not officially confirming the game just yet. "We're happy to have had the opportunity to collaborate with Nintendo on the video. While we are not confirming any specific titles at this time, we are pleased to announce our partnership with Nintendo and support of the Switch. We look forward to revealing specific games and details in the future," a spokesperson said. Skyrim Remastered is set to launch on October 28 for Xbox One, PS4 and PC; perhaps the Switch will receive a version of the Remastered game at launch?

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2016-10-20-nintendo-switch-officially-revealed

 

I really doubt the undocked console won't be 1080p though. The Nvidia Shield K1 Tablet from nearly three years ago retails for £150 these days and it has a 8 inch screen at 1920x1200. There's legitimately nothing preventing or prohibiting Nintendo from being able to achieve that sort of pixel density and the X1 chip that it's undoubtedly based on would be overkill for a lower resolution.

 

Do the games run at native 1080p?

Edited October 20, 2016 by liger05

[Eenuh]

@Fierce_LiNk is forcing me to post on here, but I don't really have much to say. :P

 

I think the console looks very interesting, I quite like the name, but not too sure about (the size of) the logo. I am a bit of a handheld gamer though, so this appeals to me on that level. And I've often wanted to be able to play my home console games on the go, and this seems to offer that!

 

I am still undecided on the whole thing though, as it will all depend on the games that come out on it. The Wii U was a massive disappointment for me as it simply didn't bring the games I wanted. So I'm hoping that they will have learned from their mistakes and get the third party developers on board (not just at launch but throughout the console's lifespan).

 

So I will hold off any judgement until I see what games are coming out for it and how it all works. Also, not convinced by the multiplayer aspect on the go, like people said, those controllers are wayyy too small. Also worried about the battery life for this thing, it is kind of pointless if it can only be used for 2-3 hours... but worried that will be the case.

 

Probably not a day one purchase for me, but might buy it down the line if the games announced for it look good and the console doesn't have any issues/things that annoy me.

[Retro_Link]

Reading Nintendo talking to IGN, I'm not sure I like the name Switch.

[RedShell]

Wow, quite a bit to take in here! I'm still trying to get my head around it all.

Will post some thoughts tomorrow.

 

There's part at the top which sticks out which kind of annoys me.

That struck me as being quite strange too, but I'm pretty sure there's a good reason for it. Yeah, I reckon that small section of screen will provide notifications when the system is docked, like so:

 

 

Or it really is just there to annoy you, we shall see.

[liger05]

So with the docking station just being a way to connect it to the TV surely this is a handheld that videos out to the TV.

 

All very exciting though!

 

That D Pad is horrid! Looks like playing 2d platformers is a no go when portable.

 

 

Yeah it's a pure handheld to me. Can't believe they didn't look at the dpad and think WTF. It's ridiculous.

[bob]

The D pad is like that so it matches the other side. So the two mini halves are the same for two player gaming.

[Shift]

I think the main argument for it being 720p is that it would provide better battery life than 1080p, i'm not sure how much of a boost to battery life it would be but if it gives an extra hour or two then it would probably be worth the drop on quality to many people.

 

Kind of depends on the battery.

 

Using the K1 tablet just for an example (I own one), you can get ~4 hours play time on the thing, which while isnt great is still kind of good considering what games you can play on it.

 

Looking at the thickness of the Switch it looks about twice the thickness of the K1 tablet.

 

So if the Switch is kept at a similar resolution I don't think it would be out of reach for it to achieve 6-7 hours of gameplay.

 

Now would more people prefer 6-7 hours at 1080 or 8-10 at 720 i cant say.

 

Although I can say id prefer the higher resolution

[Fierce_LiNk]

The D pad is like that so it matches the other side. So the two mini halves are the same for two player gaming.

 

Yeah, I thought that was obvious. Seems only fair, really.

[The Bard]

I think the main argument for it being 720p is that it would provide better battery life than 1080p, i'm not sure how much of a boost to battery life it would be but if it gives an extra hour or two then it would probably be worth the drop on quality to many people.

 

It's a fair argument but these components are essentially being taken from gaming tablets - portables that run at 1080p, so while I haven't done the research, I'm assuming the K1 shield tablet had a decent enough battery life, and that was with an 8 inch screen running the android os. Nintendo's OS and API will likely be extremely streamlined reducing the power overhead.

 

That plus hey, like almost every other console on the planet maybe it could allow you to choose the resolution you render at - 720p if you're on the road for the long haul, 1080p if you're not away for long.

 

Something tells me that that much choice isn't in keeping with Nintendo's style :p.

[Dcubed]

BTW, before anyone else nicks it...

 

Trauma Center: Under the Switch Knife

 

That's my witty title. Don't steal it!

 

I really doubt the undocked console won't be 1080p though. The Nvidia Shield K1 Tablet from nearly three years ago retails for £150 these days and it has a 8 inch screen at 1920x1200. There's legitimately nothing preventing or prohibiting Nintendo from being able to achieve that sort of pixel density and the X1 chip that it's undoubtedly based on would be overkill for a lower resolution.

 

I mean look how beautiful the six games on the trailer are. There's no argument to be made for a lower resolution being a better choice. I don't want to compromise the art with terribly aliased edges and muddy textures just because it might lower the price of the thing by thirty dollars. Fuck I just got a WQHD screen an I'm losing my shit all over again playing Witcher 3 on it, so 1080p has to be the bare minimum.

 

1080p is a huge waste on a handheld. It's a massive extra drain on GPU resources for something you're barely going to even notice on a small 6.3 inch screen.

 

There's no way they could run games at Wii U level, at 1080p on a handheld. The tech simply isn't there. You'll also ramp up the production costs of the screen too, costs that can be much better spent elsewhere (like on the GPU and RAM for instance...)

 

720p at 6.3 inches gives you 233.11 PPI, which is better than the PS Vita. That's more than good enough; those extra resources are better spent elsewhere. Besides, the thing would output 1080p to the TV screen anyway, so you'll get your 1080p support that way.

 

Plus there's the issue of battery life too. They're apparently already struggling to get it up to something acceptable. 1080p would just destroy it completely. Bigger numbers aren't always better, it's a balancing act.

[Retro_Link]

BTW, before anyone else nicks it...

 

Trauma Center: Under the Switch Knife

 

That's my witty title. Don't steal it!

I don't get it, so it's yours :p

[The Bard]

BTW, before anyone else nicks it...

 

Trauma Center: Under the Switch Knife

 

That's my witty title. Don't steal it!

 

 

 

1080p is a huge waste on a handheld. It's a massive extra drain on GPU resources for something you're barely going to even notice on a small 6.3 inch screen.

 

There's no way they could run games at Wii U level, at 1080p on a handheld. The tech simply isn't there. You'll also ramp up the production costs of the screen too, costs that can be much better spent elsewhere (like on the GPU and RAM for instance...)

 

720p at 6.3 inches gives you 233.11 PPI, which is better than the PS Vita. That's more than good enough; those extra resources are better spent elsewhere. Besides, the thing would output 1080p to the TV screen anyway, so you'll get your 1080p support that way.

 

Plus there's the issue of battery life too. They're apparently already struggling to get it up to something acceptable. 1080p would just destroy it completely. Bigger numbers aren't always better, it's a balancing act.

 

Delightful reductionism there in saying that 1080 is simply a "bigger number" than 720, rather than a fairly colossal upgrade in image quality . Having the system run in handheld mode at 1080 would undoubtedly reduce the gaming battery life to ~3 hours, which I understand would be unacceptable in a dedicated handheld, but I don't necessarily see it as that as much as it is a home console that can be played away from the home environment in short bursts.

 

You mentioned the Vita and the image quality on that for full 3D games eg. Gravity Rush and Uncharted were beyond abysmal. I have nothing against that resolution so long as it isn't running modern 3D games with a good polygonal complexity, while being completely incapable of wrapping those geometrical models in anything but the dumpiest looking crayon doodles. Play Spelunky or Guacamelee on the Vita and you'll have arguably the best experience available with those games. Not so with, say, Killzone or pretty much any other full price game released on that console.

 

Obviously 720 is a large step up from that so who knows, I'll have to try it in person to get an adequate idea of how compromised its image quality is. You're probably right in that it won't be much of a problem for the handheld itself, but I don't want it to set a precedent where we're then forced endure that on a 40+ inch screen too.

 

Also the tech totally is there dude. I mean they can run the goddamn Talos Principle on the the Shield K1 at 1080p, I don't buy the idea that Wii U games won't work on it. It's essentially halfway house between PS3 and 4, it could do that shit easy.

[Hogge]

BTW, can I just say that JoyCon sounds like some sort of Chinese knockoff?

 

 

'cause it totally does

 

It makes me think of:

Negcon

 

Guncon

 

Jogcon

 

Raccon

[Dcubed]

 

You mentioned the Vita and the image quality on that for full 3D games eg. Gravity Rush and Uncharted were beyond abysmal. I have nothing against that resolution so long as it isn't running modern 3D games with a good polygonal complexity, while being completely incapable of wrapping those geometrical models in anything but the dumpiest looking crayon doodles. Play Spelunky or Guacamelee on the Vita and you'll have arguably the best experience available with those games. Not so with, say, Killzone or pretty much any other full price game released on that console.

 

Those games were not native resolution, almost no Vita games were. That was kinda of half the problem with it. The screen was too high res for the hardware powering it and was a poor use of the total handheld budget. The costs associated with the screen would've been put to much better use elsewhere (or just dropping the cost of the machine) and it would've lead to a better experience overall, because the games would've run in their native res and not look like a blurry mess.

 

Also the tech totally is there dude. I mean they can run the goddamn Talos Principle on the the Shield K1 at 1080p, I don't buy the idea that Wii U games won't work on it. It's essentially halfway house between PS3 and 4, it could do that shit easy.

 

As much as people like to joke about it, the Wii U is actually a significant step up from the PS3 and 360. Mario Kart 8 is a much harder game to get running at the same quality as the Wii U version than the Talos Principle on Shield (remember, it has to run at a perfect 60FPS, even in splitscreen. Framerate dips aren't acceptable here).

 

The Shield K1 fails to match the Xbox 360 version of Resident Evil 5 in like for like tests and the same applies for Metal Gear Rising (before anyone quotes the Doom 3 BFG test, that one is kinda rigged since most people don't know that the Shield version has a lot of graphical compromises, allowing it to "outperform" the PS360 versions in like for like tests). Wii U is a step up from the Xbox 360 even still, so matching it in a handheld is no small feat. The Switch is basically the cancelled Shield K2, in terms of hardware (hence why Nintendo got such a good deal on the chips for it, they basically stole them all when the K2 was cancelled), which should be able to comfortably match or exceed the Wii U now; but not to the point where it can do so at 1080p (and even then, the specs are better spent elsewhere - You don't want non-native res games on a handheld).

 

Also, you have to remember that most tablets and smartphones cheat when it comes to games. Yeah, they've got super high res screens, but almost no 3D games on there actually render at their native resolutions... With the Switch, gaming is the whole point, so you need to set a sensible target that your hardware can comfortably reach; otherwise, you're just wasting the money you spent on the screen, like what Sony did with the Vita.

Edited October 20, 2016 by Dcubed

[nekunando]

Thank goodness they didn't call it Nintendo Swiitch

[liger05]

Those games were not native resolution, almost no Vita games were. That was kinda of half the problem with it. The screen was too high res for the hardware powering it and was a poor use of the total handheld budget. The costs associated with the screen would've been put to much better use elsewhere (or just dropping the cost of the machine) and it would've lead to a better experience overall, because the games would've run in their native res and not look like a blurry mess.

 

 

 

As much as people like to joke about it, the Wii U is actually a significant step up from the PS3 and 360. Mario Kart 8 is a much harder game to get running at the same quality as the Wii U version than the Talos Principle on Shield (remember, it has to run at a perfect 60FPS, even in splitscreen. Framerate dips aren't acceptable here).

 

The Shield K1 fails to match the Xbox 360 version of Resident Evil 5 in like for like tests and the same applies for Metal Gear Rising (before anyone quotes the Doom 3 BFG test, that one is kinda rigged since most people don't know that the Shield version has a lot of graphical compromises, allowing it to "outperform" the PS360 versions in like for like tests). Wii U is a step up from the Xbox 360 even still, so matching it in a handheld is no small feat. The Switch is basically the cancelled Shield K2, in terms of hardware (hence why Nintendo got such a good deal on the chips for it, they basically stole them all when the K2 was cancelled), which should be able to comfortably match or exceed the Wii U now; but not to the point where it can do so at 1080p (and even then, the specs are better spent elsewhere - You don't want non-native res games on a handheld).

 

Also, you have to remember that most tablets and smartphones cheat when it comes to games. Yeah, they've got super high res screens, but almost no 3D games on there actually render at their native resolutions... With the Switch, gaming is the whole point, so you need to set a sensible target that your hardware can comfortably reach; otherwise, you're just wasting the money you spent on the screen, like what Sony did with the Vita.

 

Good point. I would rather have 720p with every game hitting 720p native rather than 1080p and the majority not hitting the mark

[Nolan]

Huh....and I thought most games looked pretty good on the vita.

[The Bard]

Those games were not native resolution, almost no Vita games were. That was kinda of half the problem with it. The screen was too high res for the hardware powering it and was a poor use of the total handheld budget. The costs associated with the screen would've been put to much better use elsewhere (or just dropping the cost of the machine) and it would've lead to a better experience overall, because the games would've run in their native res and not look like a blurry mess.

 

 

 

As much as people like to joke about it, the Wii U is actually a significant step up from the PS3 and 360. Mario Kart 8 is a much harder game to get running at the same quality as the Wii U version than the Talos Principle on Shield (remember, it has to run at a perfect 60FPS, even in splitscreen. Framerate dips aren't acceptable here).

 

The Shield K1 fails to match the Xbox 360 version of Resident Evil 5 in like for like tests and the same applies for Metal Gear Rising (before anyone quotes the Doom 3 BFG test, that one is kinda rigged since most people don't know that the Shield version has a lot of graphical compromises, allowing it to "outperform" the PS360 versions in like for like tests). Wii U is a step up from the Xbox 360 even still, so matching it in a handheld is no small feat. The Switch is basically the cancelled Shield K2, in terms of hardware (hence why Nintendo got such a good deal on the chips for it, they basically stole them all when the K2 was cancelled), which should be able to comfortably match or exceed the Wii U now; but not to the point where it can do so at 1080p (and even then, the specs are better spent elsewhere - You don't want non-native res games on a handheld).

 

Also, you have to remember that most tablets and smartphones cheat when it comes to games. Yeah, they've got super high res screens, but almost no 3D games on there actually render at their native resolutions... With the Switch, gaming is the whole point, so you need to set a sensible target that your hardware can comfortably reach; otherwise, you're just wasting the money you spent on the screen, like what Sony did with the Vita.

 

You make good points, sensei. Consider me educated.

[Helmsly]

I was disappointed with what I saw. I don't care much for the portability feature of this console as its a feature I almost certainly will never use, and they had to make a bunch of compromises to make it happen. Sorry to be a downer but it just looked bad to me.

[Debug Mode]

Huh....and I thought most games looked pretty good on the vita.

 

I agree. The Vita games were rarely at native resolution as the screen resolution was just far too fucking high, but stuff like WipeOut managed it (but sacrificed the series staple of being 60fps), still very impressive graphics which made going back to the 3DS a little bit of an eyesore.

 

But hey, we're now back to the waiting game! So... who wants Persona 5 Portable?!