ReZourceman Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 Hello. So, piracy. The Kodi/Kodie seems to have hit the "mainstream". I heard a few people talking about it a few months ago, and then yesterday I went round a family/friends house and they had it, and my uncle-in-law handed me the remote and said "You can find any film on this", and I was like hmmm and he was like "I don't know how it does it", and I explained it's illegal and he said "It's not illegal, it's from Amazon". (He's not stupid or anything, just not a tech savvy guy...) Anyway, a long distant "friend" just messaged me on Facebook, basically I had recommended an older film and she nonchalantly said "Cool, I've got Kodie so I'll watch it now". I'm bothered by the nonchalance. Do people not realise? I mean. I'm not squeaky clean myself, but I think there's a line. Right? What is the line? What's morally acceptable to you?!
Ashley Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 Before participating remember that we have a "no illegal talk" rule, which in this instance will mean "don't explicitly say where to get illegal stuff from".
Happenstance Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 I used to be a lot worse than I am these days. I tend to put that down to ease of access now. I dont need to pirate a game because Steam has made it easy for me to purchase it and play. Same kind of thing with most other media. I dont have to download comics anymore because I can just buy them on Comixology. I've got a few family members who use Kodi themselves but I've never really felt the urge myself. I'm happy enough with Netflix/Amazon Prime.
bob Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 I get all my films off the Dark Web. Doesn't everybody?
killthenet Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 I definitely prefer to pay for films and TV shows, but do find myself using Kodi and other streaming services to watch new episodes of TV shows that don't air straight away in the UK, so for the likes of Brookyln Nine-Nine and It's Always Sunny I tend to stream them from week to week, but I pay for Netflix and stream a lot of stuff on there so for shows that come out weekly on Netflix (like Better Call Saul) I just watch them there. I find a lot of the illegal streaming services to be really cumbersome, have poor UI and be full of annoying ads so it's never my first choice but sometimes its the only way to watch something. I suffer from agoraphobia so I very rarely leave the house which has meant it is impossible for me to go to the cinema, so I have had quite a painful wait to watch the likes of Arrival & Rogue One, but I am happy enough to wait until they come out officially before I watch them, so I can see them in full HD. For a lot of the awards season fare though I do tend to watch Academy screeners because I'm not too concerned about quality and for the most part don't feel guilty about it. If there is an independent or smaller budget film I will usually wait and buy it digitally though because I feel it's something that is deserving of support, the majority of things that I pirate are either already successful, too big to fail or films that are so old or obscure that there is no legitimate way to watch them. If everything released digitally day and date with theatres then I don't think I would pirate at all though.
Jon Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 As someone who's chosen field is filmmaking, I always pay to watch something. I don't preach at others for choosing not to do that but knowing how much effort goes into the making of something creative like a film/tv show/music, I like to know the people responsible are being compensated for their efforts.
Agent Gibbs Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 I'm amazed how many people have Kodi boxes and don't understand how it works and how its illegal My girlfriend is in the TA and her senior officer recommended she got a Kodi box and get shot of Sky because you get all the same programmes for free. when I said it was illegally streaming/downloading she actually called up this 50 odd year old bloke and asked him and he said it was perfectly legal - like you Rez - because it was from Amazon After a lengthy argument chat I had to show my girlfriend several consumer websites for her to believe me! I think people are ignorant of what these things are and because its become so common place the Police are slow to knock off these things
Ashley Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 I definitely prefer to pay for films and TV shows, but do find myself using Kodi and other streaming services to watch new episodes of TV shows that don't air straight away in the UK, so for the likes of Brookyln Nine-Nine and It's Always Sunny I tend to stream them from week to week, but I pay for Netflix and stream a lot of stuff on there so for shows that come out weekly on Netflix (like Better Call Saul) I just watch them there. I find a lot of the illegal streaming services to be really cumbersome, have poor UI and be full of annoying ads so it's never my first choice but sometimes its the only way to watch something. The TV one is interesting. We (as a country) are in a better position whereby typically shows come out sooner over here, or indeed Netflix picks it up when stations don't (hey Crazy Ex-Girlfriend). However, we still have shows that just never get released over here (such as Fresh off the Boat). It becomes frustrating.
Raining_again Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 Colleagues: yea its free oh go n get it why you paying for sky etc me: Don't you realise its illegal? colleague: its not me: you haven't paid for that film that's not even on dvd yet, you bet your feckin ass its illegal, you not heard of copyright laws? colleague: oh she professes to be clever in computer related things but she's as thick as sh*t Not that I'm innocent in this but at least i'm not deluded to the fact.
killthenet Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 The TV one is interesting. We (as a country) are in a better position whereby typically shows come out sooner over here, or indeed Netflix picks it up when stations don't (hey Crazy Ex-Girlfriend). However, we still have shows that just never get released over here (such as Fresh off the Boat). It becomes frustrating. Even if they came to Netflix and the like a couple of months after airing in the US then I'd be happy enough to wait, but likes of It's Always Sunny don't come onto Netflix for about a year after their initial airing. Being able to use US Netflix used so solve some of these problems but since they really cracked down on VPN's it's become too much of a hassle because you're never quite sure it's going to work.
Eddage Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 I pirate the shit out of TV and films. Games I don't but then if it was as simple as downloading a film then I probably would do that as well. I do try and go to the cinema to see the films I actually care about but other stuff I have no issues with just illegally downloading. I probably should feel bad about it but I really don't care.
Raining_again Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 Piracy wouldn't be such a problem if the products weren't so expensive. Ie - if I could download an episode of a TV programme for a £1 or £2, or a film for £3-5, I wouldn't be a pirate. But to pay £20 quid for 2 people to watch the film once with a bunch of antisocial twats who are either kissing in the back, shouting, eating or general idiotic behaviour. NO.
killthenet Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 I think the landscape is definitely changing, 6 years ago I probably pirated a lot more but thanks to the introduction of services like Netflix and Spotify my pirating habits have definitely changed. If Sony was able to introduce Playstation Vue in Europe and I was able to watch the likes of Sky Sports for a nominal fee every month then I wouldn't have to illegally stream football either so hopefully in the next few years the legal streaming options begin to evolve. I think movie studios will start to offer digital home viewing on films closer to theatrical release more and more.
Emerald Emblem Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 (edited) When Anime was still not that big in the UK I did illegally download the ongoing anime airing in Japan, but when i did start getting my own money I did start buying the DVD's, I even bought a region free blu ray player so I could import the series the US got and we didn't, then sites like Crunchyroll, Funimation and a few other legal anime streaming sites cover the whole ongoing seasons in Japan, even Netflix and Amazon Prime started getting anime and even the US and UK selection of DVD's and Blu Rays has exploded in recent years, it's been great. I even import the anime theme CD's from Japan though downside there is stuff goes out of print and never get reprinted so buy them within 7 years or so or you can't get them again, I wish UK iTunes would get a lot more anime theme singles and collections to ease it, I'm sure Japan iTunes has most of the stuff I wanted but missed out on. I've never even heard of a Kodi box, but I have everything I need TV wise. Edited January 23, 2017 by Emerald Emblem
Jimbob Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 The way i look at it, if i can't find the movie legally, then i watch it via other means. That's my line.
MoogleViper Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 I used to be a lot worse than I am these days. I tend to put that down to ease of access now. I dont need to pirate a game because Steam has made it easy for me to purchase it and play. Same kind of thing with most other media. I dont have to download comics anymore because I can just buy them on Comixology. This. Piracy wouldn't be such a problem if the products weren't so expensive. Ie - if I could download an episode of a TV programme for a £1 or £2, or a film for £3-5, I wouldn't be a pirate. But to pay £20 quid for 2 people to watch the film once with a bunch of antisocial twats who are either kissing in the back, shouting, eating or general idiotic behaviour. NO. And this. I pay for Netflix (well my OH does). But if some shows aren't on there, then how can I watch them? We also have prime (again paid for by her) but amazon are kind of shit, a lot of there shows are partly free, and then pay for the rest. I do go to the cinema, but it's undoubtedly a rip off. I never pirate games as steam is good and the (sale) prices are often reasonable. I used to pirate films but since Spotify and apple music (also the OH) I no longer do. I still watch TV and films via illegal streaming sites, but I don't feel guilty. We have two TV streaming subscriptions. If they want to continue with an archaic, restrictive, extortionate distribution model then I'm happy to not support it. Maybe I'm just trying to justify it to myself, but I genuinely feel no guilt. I try to pay for albums of smaller, independent bands. But for larger bands I'd rather put that money towards tickets that generate the bands lots of income, and create more jobs, than CDs which mostly benefit retailers and record labels.
Goafer Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 I'm all about dat warez yo. I haven't actually pirated anything for a long time. Mainly because things like Steam, Netflix and Amazon has made it cheap and easy to get games, movies and music respectively. Games on the PS4 are different, as they're still expensive. But it's too much hassle to pirate games for it. Not like the wild west days of the Dreamcast and original XBox.
Naar Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 Make content affordable. Ten bucks @ the theatre, 20 bucks on DVD, then 30 bucks on bluray on now again 30 bucks on uhd formats. So no, im not going to pay twice for the same content. I bought Skyrim for 55 euro's at launch for the 360. Few months after i sold my 360 i felt like playing Skyrim again. So i downloaded an illegal copy. Bethesda and everyone involved already had me paying full price for their product. When it comes to movies: i dont care if Tom Cruise can buy his 7th island today or next week.
Raining_again Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 This. And this. I pay for Netflix (well my OH does). But if some shows aren't on there, then how can I watch them? We also have prime (again paid for by her) but amazon are kind of shit, a lot of there shows are partly free, and then pay for the rest. I do go to the cinema, but it's undoubtedly a rip off. I never pirate games as steam is good and the (sale) prices are often reasonable. I used to pirate films but since Spotify and apple music (also the OH) I no longer do. I still watch TV and films via illegal streaming sites, but I don't feel guilty. We have two TV streaming subscriptions. If they want to continue with an archaic, restrictive, extortionate distribution model then I'm happy to not support it. Maybe I'm just trying to justify it to myself, but I genuinely feel no guilt. I try to pay for albums of smaller, independent bands. But for larger bands I'd rather put that money towards tickets that generate the bands lots of income, and create more jobs, than CDs which mostly benefit retailers and record labels. Couldn't agree more. Steam is great and you own a copy (that you'll never lose!! Yay). I don't like Netflix on the premise that some stuff gets taken off, or is regionally locked. I want a physical copy of it forever lol I don't feel any guilt for doing the warez dance because I only download now n again. Like maybe one or two episodes a week. Maybe a film now n again. My ex on the other hand has his computer on 24/7 downloading stuff that he'll never even find the time to watch. That's just silly. Also I love Blindspot and we're half a season behind here. So I warez the shit out of that. But would probably just watch it on my paid sky subs if it was current!
Jonnas Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 As a teen, I used to pirate almost anything. Sure, part of it was money, but most of it was convenience: I wasn't going to wait a year for the next season of Prison Break, nor was I going to search high and low for an old copy of Soul Reaver 2. But as an adult, convenience is available more than ever. I still do it more often with series and Anime (especially the latter). DVDs are by far the worst way to enjoy them, as they're released late, cumbersome to own and way too expensive, especially considering that A. I'm usually walking into a show I know little about; and B. There are already other series airing regularly on TV as well. And since the piracy methods have their own drawbacks, I'll likely get Netflix and Crunchyroll in the near future. Only thing stopping me is my currently-horrid internet. I used to download/acquire most non-Nintendo games, too. Steam and GOG put an end to that. Much better services. I almost never downloaded comics. That's a medium I'd very much rather have in my hand. The main exception is Manga, since most series are way too long, some are difficult to find in the first place, and I'm not even guaranteed a good translation. But I do try to buy a few volumes of series I like (in Portuguese whenever possible, but I'll gladly buy German, too), it's so much better than reading sketchy fan translations. Films are like comics, it's bothersome to watch an inferior version on my computer. I'll prioritise going to the theatre, or wait for them to show up on TV proper (though that's less of an option, now). Also, unlike with series, I can trust that a single 10€ DVD will be worth my time. Overall, my move away from piracy has been gradual, but certain. I don't mind paying for stuff, but it's gotta be sensible. As for the moral aspect... I lose little sleep over pirating stuff with millions of fans in more relevant markets, or out of circulation entirely. It's obscure stuff (which includes Portuguese products or official translations) that I go out of my way to support.
Grazza Posted January 23, 2017 Posted January 23, 2017 Even taking the moral argument out of it, it bothers me how this sort of thing has destroyed the market model. It used to be that if there was a market for something (and it was legal, of course), the people who wanted it would pay money for it, and that's how it could exist. In the 1990s, you could go to a shop in town (one of many) and browse thousands of VHS tapes. There was much, much more choice than there is now. DVD was a bit worse, and Blu-ray is terrible (the choice, I mean - I love the format). OK, people can nick Hollywood films, but almost nothing else gets made, because there is not that culture of going to the shop and buying it. It doesn't seem like much of a win to me. (On a side note, I don't think legit downloads are a great alternative, as there are too many problems with it.) We stand on the frontier of 4K Blu-ray (and presumably 8K), which could offer us a golden age of quality and variety, if only we could get back to that idea of paying for a physical thing.
Ashley Posted January 24, 2017 Posted January 24, 2017 Piracy wouldn't be such a problem if the products weren't so expensive. Ie - if I could download an episode of a TV programme for a £1 or £2, or a film for £3-5, I wouldn't be a pirate. But to pay £20 quid for 2 people to watch the film once with a bunch of antisocial twats who are either kissing in the back, shouting, eating or general idiotic behaviour. NO. I saw someone calculate that now that Frasier isn't on UK Netflix, the only way to own a digital copy is to buy episodes/seasons and they calculated that while you can pick up the DVD set for say £20-30, it would cost ~£150 to buy everything digitally. It does seem that digital TV purchases weren't made for scaling (from episodes to seasons or indeed seasons to series*) *I'm using the American difference between season and series because the British series/series to describe both an individual season and a collection of them is just bollocks.
Shorty Posted January 24, 2017 Posted January 24, 2017 (edited) What's a shame is that Kodi's getting a bad rep from this. I've been using Kodi since it was XBMC/Openelec, as a way of streaming video files (using it for ripped dvds and unlicensed anime etc, when I was in my late teens/early twenties) to various devices from a NFS. Even back then you could get illegal stream services etc, but that was a long way from what most people were using it for. I remember it was a lot of fun trying to configure it to run on various chipsets, the first raspberry pi, and control it using a phone app or such. Now it's becoming synonymous with the illegal streams, as people sell Raspberry Pis and Firesticks with Kodi and the illegal plugins already loaded. And as Rez points out, some people don't even know they're doing anything wrong (although that's pretty ignorant, nothing is free). However, despite this, piracy must be down quite a lot, right? Netflix is spending $6bil on original programming this year or something. Steam generates millions for developers. Gabe Newell said once that the only way to beat piracy is to make it easier than piracy, and Netflix, Steam and such have made great strides in that department. Edited January 24, 2017 by Shorty
sumo73 Posted January 24, 2017 Posted January 24, 2017 (edited) I get all my films off the Dark Web. Doesn't everybody? I don't. I still buy DVD's/Blu-ray's even if some of them are second hand. I guess I'm a fossil around here. I'm still a big fan of owning things I guess. Even places like the Poundshop in the UK have £1 DVD's and while the selection is not great and the movies are not so recent I can normally find something to buy and watch. When I can I still go to the cinema as well. Compared to when I was young the move from analogue to digital TV channels, the rise of YouTube and being able to buy DVD/Blu-rays from anywhere means that I can watch so much more. I'm not perfect and when I was younger about a third of my Amiga games were copies but I felt guilty about it and some years later I went around and destroyed them. I know now I could get whatever I want from the net for no cost but I really am not interested in it. People who copy a lot don't see the end effects and the drip drip effect it has on the industry as a whole. I still buy new stuff but I normally wait a few months for a price drop or see if I can get it second hand. If I don't have enough money for something I can wait. Edited January 24, 2017 by sumo73
dazzybee Posted January 24, 2017 Posted January 24, 2017 I think people who download music/TV/film illegally and barely actually pay for content (they can afford) are deeply unpleasant to be honest. They could have excuses like ignorance, not realising it's illegal, or if they are poor and can't afford it, they're reasonable reasons I guess. I used to have the naive opinion that people who could t afford it would eventually pay for it when they had the means to but I'm not so sure. Hope that's the case. The only illegal streaming I do is live football that's not on any service. So basically the same as Jimbob, if I can't access it legall I used to a little more when I was younger, I still refused to downalod anything from independent artists/filmmakers, but even then not really. It's a sensitive subject and even reading the comments in here you can get a sense of it, the entitlement, creating this reluctance to want to pay for stuff. It's gross. And the cost of books and films and music really shouldn't be cheaper in my opinion, this shit games hundreds, thousands of hours of skilled work, and people want it for almost nothing.
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