Hades (PC, Switch)

[drahkon]

Quote

Defy the god of the dead as you hack and slash out of the Underworld in this rogue-like - it's rogue-lite, god damn it - dungeon crawler from the creators of Bastion, Transistor, and Pyre.

There's a new rogue-lite in town and it's bloody incredible. Trust me, I've played it for 30 minutes.

I've barely scratched the surface but there's already so much to see and experience. I'm currently on my second escape attempt, meaning I've died once (spikes...immediately after I was victorious against a mini-boss).
Looks like story progress comes mostly from interactions with others after you meet your demise. As is standard with Supergiant Games, the voice acting is great.
It's also a gorgeous game. There's so much polish everywhere.

And the soundtrack...a banger.

Managed to beat what I assume is the first real boss (there was a big life bar at the top of the screen, the sign of a boss). It was a tough fight. Had to rely on "death defiance", the first permanent upgrade I acquired. It brought me back to life with half my HP. Can only be used once per run (at least for now), so I gotta be more careful now.

Will this become my new "hey, you gotta buy this"-game? Probably.

By the way, you need to buy Crypt of the Necrodancer and Slay the Spire.

Edited September 20, 2020 by drahkon

[Ganepark32]

Its such a good game. I've put more time into it than Super Mario 3D All-Stars collection and loving getting to grips with it. Very simple to get in to but the nuance is so deep with a lot of combinations of both weapons with randomised boons from the gods from Olympia.

Think I've only done 10 runs so far but managed to get through to the third area. Consistently getting through Tartarus easily, had a few scares here and there with Meg the Fury but managed to beat her on my second or third run with the Shield weapon and a boon from Ares that let me stack Doom.

The jump in difficulty after clearing Tartarus the first time to being in Asphrodel was huge. Didn't last long in there on my first run in there because of all the enemies that drop/throw bombs and all of the fire. Nailed it the second time though and got to the boss without too much bother. Said boss fight was absolutely chaos playing it on a Lite. Maybe a tiny amount of slow down but that fight was so frantic but so good.

I've pretty much exclusively been using the Shield outside of the very first run. The knock back that you can get as well as deflecter buffs really does help in the melee. Add to that you can get boons to buff your shield bash massively (we're talking up to 500 damage against armour when you do hit the attack on the flash). Great weapon and it has meant that my runs through Tartarus at the start are down to single digit minutes now.

Its all about finding that right combo of boons to get you through. The first couple of runs its about getting your head around what symbol refers to which god and boons you want to prioritise with your weapon of choice. Doom does take some time to set in on enemies but its always proved helpful to me, especially with a few buffs to its level. I did get a boon from Poseidon that had my dash result in a wave flood at the end point of each dash so it meant being aggressive on the offense and closing space between me and the enemies was beneficial.

Similarly with your cast. If you get some boons that buff your attacks against enemies who are holding your cast, that can get your through mobs really quickly.

As I say, its simple to pick up but the amount of depth there is huge. Can't wait to play more as its just so well designed and plays extremely well. Thats before mentioning how god damn good the presentation is. Its continued Pyre's visual style with the character art as well as on the expanded narrative, which is great so far as well, and the music is once again superb. Darren Korb hasn't made a bad soundtrack for any of Supergiant Games titles, and they've never made a bad game in my eyes.

I've said several times that I'm a huge mark for their games but this really is a special game. Its the culmination of all their previous titles tied together perfectly. So happy to see it being reviewed so well and to see so many players enjoying it on Switch after it was released (it managing to be the second best selling game on the eShop is crazy considering both Bastion and Transistor have only ever been there because of heavy discounts on the Switch).

So yeah, everyone play this. I'm not a huge fan of roguelikes but this even grabbed me and I can't get enough of it.

[Sméagol]

I'll get it eventually, as a fan of Transistor. I'd probably already have it if they released it on Steam instead of Epic.

[drahkon]

4 minutes ago, Ganepark32 said:

I'm not a huge fan of roguelikes but this even grabbed me and I can't get enough of it.

IT'S NOT A ROGUELIKE

[Glen-i]

16 minutes ago, drahkon said:

IT'S NOT A ROGUELIKE

Am I right in thinking the key difference between roguelike and rogue-lite is that roguelikes are turn-based while rogue-lites are not?

[Nicktendo]

19 minutes ago, Sméagol said:

I'll get it eventually, as a fan of Transistor. I'd probably already have it if they released it on Steam instead of Epic.

I bought it on Steam on Friday night. Are you sure it’s not on there? 

[Glen-i]

Not gonna lie though, I am interested. Permanent upgrades are the thing that made me decide, "I wanna try this"

Thing is, don't have the spare income at the moment. And getting the money for Hyrule Warriors is higher priority right now. So probably next time it's on sale.

[markderoos]

3 minutes ago, Glen-i said:

Am I right in thinking the key difference between roguelike and rogue-lite is that roguelikes are turn-based while rogue-lites are not?

I always though a roguelike = dying resets everything, while rogue-lite = (some) progress carries over after duying. Be it weapons, skills, currency, etc.

[Glen-i]

Just now, markderoos said:

I always though a roguelike = dying resets everything, while rogue-lite = (some) progress carries over after duying. Be it weapons, skills, currency, etc.

How many games these days actually have a complete reset on death though?

I can't think of many.

[drahkon]

31 minutes ago, markderoos said:

I always though a roguelike = dying resets everything, while rogue-lite = (some) progress carries over after duying. Be it weapons, skills, currency, etc.

That is the correct answer.

30 minutes ago, Glen-i said:

How many games these days actually have a complete reset on death though?

Sadly, very few.
Tangledeep springs to mind (you do have the option to turn it into a rogue-lite, though, but that's for wusses). And of course, Spelunky 2 (and the first one).

Made some progress with Hades. Managed to beat the second boss Run's not over, yet. I'm using the bow which I unlocked and it's awesome. Plays much safer than the sword.
Ok, that's enough from me. I'm going back to the game

Edited September 20, 2020 by drahkon

[Sméagol]

51 minutes ago, Nicktendo said:

I bought it on Steam on Friday night. Are you sure it’s not on there? 

Yeah I meant, 1 year ago or whenever it launched.

[WackerJr]

The positive comments here are being echoed by the reviews I’ve read.  I can’t really justify getting it right now with my backlog, but I’m incredibly tempted!

[Jonnas]

The difference between roguelike and roguelite is a hair-splitting semantic inanity. And it was coined by bullshit gatekeepers who claimed "It's not really like Rogue if there's progress!". For both of these reasons, I refuse to humour the distinction.

Anyway, Hades. I got too much on my backlog right now, including Transistor (so I definitely need to take care of that one first), but I respect anything Supergiant games puts out, should be good stuff

Edited September 21, 2020 by Jonnas

[Dog-amoto]

Instantly turned off by the word Rogue (sexy X-Men member excepted) so I’ll give this one a miss despite the great reviews and the fact that I’ve enjoyed their other titles like Bastion and Transistor  

I didn’t really like Dead Cells and Binding of Isaac, so I’m not getting burned again. 

[drahkon]

Put in another hour just now. Unlocked a few new mechanics, reached the third boss and got my ass kicked.

The way Hades handles death is magnificent. It rarely makes me mad. Usually it makes me think: "I wonder what new shit I'll get" or "Can't wait to hear what all the characters have to say."

Decided to focus on using the sword for now. It's more dangerous than the bow, but it let's me get used to enemy attack patterns.

Had my first "synergy" last run: Attacks knock back foes + knocked backed foes suffer from rupture (they take damage when they move).

[drahkon]

Spoiler

Did not expect there to be "variants" of bosses. Well, I've only encountered a different first boss, so no idea if that'll be the same for later stages.

Really cool.

This game's amazing

[drahkon]

Hm...
I may have reached the final boss...and if so, that would be a tad disappointing as the runs would be quite short.

Well, I was actually close to winning the fight. Very impressed with myself as this was only my 9th escape attempt (i.e. run) and I haven't unlocked much of the permanent upgrades I did, however, die.

I'll hold off on any further judgement regarding the game's length for now, though. Who knows what's in store after the boss. I really hope there's more...

I think I should unlock another weapon. Still have only unlocked the bow but pretty much exclusively used the sword

Edited September 21, 2020 by drahkon

[Nolan]

17 hours ago, Dog-amoto said:

Instantly turned off by the word Rogue (sexy X-Men member excepted) so I’ll give this one a miss despite the great reviews and the fact that I’ve enjoyed their other titles like Bastion and Transistor  

I didn’t really like Dead Cells and Binding of Isaac, so I’m not getting burned again. 

Now obviously our tastes are different as I like both of those games you mentioned, I’ll say this is FAR superior to Dead Cells. Dead Cells relies to heavily on being skill based for the lack of true progression between runs. You almost always fail based on your skill until the bosses where it’s just luck of the weapons you have. It’s not a game I’d recommend to everyone.

And Binding of Isaac is nothing but skill and luck of the seed for a run going well (but runs just seem quicker and better than dead cells.) But I find it so fun despite/in spite of its high difficulty. It ironically is a game I would recommend.

Hades is not really like either entirely. It’s rouge like in that when you die you go back to the beginning, all you lose though is gold which is only used during runs for temporary benefits. All your other currencies you keep to improve the hub-ish area and to permanently improve your character or unlock new weapons. Honestly the gameplay feels a bit more Soulsborne in that regard, and in between and during runs has actual story exposition as well. The biggest thing for me though is that, it is just plain fun to play. I find that it plays similar to Bastion, so grinding away like that I never feel that I’m not making progress because I’m just enjoying playing. And like Isaac would definitely recommend. 
 

Im not super trying to convince you really. Just trying to more explain the game. If you don’t really enjoy Dead Cells or Binding of Isaac, while this is more forgiving you probably still wouldn’t enjoy this. 
 

Anywho....I’m just loving this game currently. Just unlocked a scrying bowl in Hades. I have 11 runs and killed 2026 enemies throughout those. That’s a lot of murder. I’ve made it to the 3rd area, and damn that boss. Like damn. But yeah, this game is right behind Ghost of Tsushima has my top of the year. Course I’m a simpleton and Maneater is up there too. (FFVIIR  is not)

[drahkon]

5 hours ago, Nolan said:

That’s a lot of murder.

Muuuurrrrdeeerreeeeeeeer

 

[drahkon]

14 hours ago, drahkon said:

I may have reached the final boss...

...and I've beaten the final boss on my 11th run.

Spoiler

Second time using the shield. I don't like the weapon, but Curse of Agony and the Call which inflicts Hangover are pretty good. Had to defy death a few times during the final fight (Hades, not that difficult to figure out that he's the final boss).
Annoyingly, he used one of my most hated video-game tropes: Having a second phase once you've depleted his health bar...

A new mechanic was introduced:

Spoiler

Heat. Modifiers that make the game more difficult. You can choose between quite a few and apparently if you win a run while Heat is active you can acquire more resources.

Now that I know how long my winning run took me:

14 hours ago, drahkon said:

that would be a tad disappointing as the runs would be quite short.

30 minutes is par for the course for the genre.
Rogue-lites usually open up once you've beaten them once, and it seems to be the same with this one. Will definitely not stop playing because the gameplay is brilliant.
However, I'm still a little disappointed, because there doesn't seem to be a lot of variance in locations. There's a set amount and that's not a very high one.

Edited September 22, 2020 by drahkon

[MindFreak]

A thing that makes me not really wanting to go back to Dead Cells, even though I enjoy it quite much, is how long a run takes (for me). I spent 1-1.5 hours to reach the final boss (that one time I reached it...). I don't want to spend that long in one sitting only to be killed and lose that progress. So if this has shorter runs than that, I'm getting more interested. 

From the sounds of it, this is a really good game, and I tend to enjoy Supergiant's games so will probably pick this up in the next sale.

[drahkon]

Unlocking all weapons opens up the game quite a bit.

Had a killer run with...

Spoiler

Exagryph.

Got the burst-fire mod (3-round burst + no need to reload), attacks add chain lightning and 10% attack speed.

Easiest win, so far

Gotta say, Supergiant Games is incredible at taking a genre and creating a game with a great story around it.
Bastion and Transistor are based around action-RPGs (the latter adding turn-based combat).
Pyre has a unique take on...basketball, for some reason (and it freaking works). That reminds me...I gotta play it again and actually finish it...
And Hades is a rogue-lite packed with characters, lore and an intriguing plot.

They all play incredibly well, too, and offer some of the most stylish and awesome art and music ever created.

 

[darksnowman]

On 20/09/2020 at 7:23 PM, Jonnas said:

The difference between roguelike and roguelite is a hair-splitting semantic inanity. And it was coined by bullshit gatekeepers who claimed "It's not really like Rogue if there's progress!". For both of these reasons, I refuse to humour the distinction.

Interesting. Even Shiren the Wanderer has some persistence between runs and I've never seen it referred to as anything other than a roguelike.

Without looking into it, I just figured "lite" meant beatable for the average person. (I will look into the specifics of it now.)

[Nolan]

I’ve got like 18 runs in now and still am not getting all the way through it. I just cannot push past a certain boss. Regardless of weapon I can fairly reliably get to the fight and just cannot win. 
 

Still having a good time but it’s like running headlong into a wall over and over. 

[drahkon]

4 hours ago, Nolan said:

I just cannot push past a certain boss.

Spoiler

Theseus and Arterius?

For this fight, try to focus the Minotaur but deal some damage to Theseus, as well, whenever possible. Don't get the latter down to half his HP before Arterius is dead, though. Once Theseus gets help from a God, maneuvering through the arena becomes much more difficult. It's much better to kill the Minotaur first.

Some general tips (if you don't know already)

• put your Darkness into +1 Dash and Death Defiance first !!!
• then collect 15 keys to upgrade the mirror and put Darkness into max health, more Cast, bonus damage while Cast is in enemy, and backstab damage
• get the upgrade which lets you swap your keepsake after every Underworld region
• select a Keepsake, which ensures you a boon that you need (do not underestimate Athena's defensive boons; especially the Dash + Deflect boon is a must)
• for the final area choose a Keepsake that increases survivability