Kids, Marriage, Maternity Leave, Conforminggg

[Fierce_LiNk]

This is somewhat of a rant, but it may interest some people.

 

I've been in my teaching job for about 3 years now. Coming to the end of my third year. A friend who I started with has recently announced that she is pregnant. Another friend who started shortly before us (less than 6 months) is also pregnant, too. Whilst I do share their joy, it has raised a certain amount of questions and issues for me.

 

Due to having Ine living with me and being in a good job, I've been asked by numerous people if my plan was to have kids any time soon. My answer has been somewhere between "hahahha no," and "fuck, no!"

 

When speaking to the second friend about this, she said that, "if I didn't have kids, who would look after me when I was old?" In my mind, I was thinking that this is a bit of a bullshit reason to have kids.

 

I was at the pub earlier and there was a group of us discussing this and when it came to me, people were saying that I would change my mind in 5 years time. My answer to that is, "no, I won't." I told them I had too much I wanted to do. Possibly travelling, having some proper time with Ine, going on holidays (I don't have money to do this yet), it's nowhere near the right time. There's a load of stuff you won't be able to do once you have kids, or certainly can't do without having to re-jig your plans to accommodate them.

 

Another reason why this whole subject annoys me is that I have been through four years of uni (like my friends) in order to get this teaching job. I have various friends who did the same and are now pregnant or have kids. At least 5. What's the point in studying for 4 years for a job you're only going to be in for 3? It seems a bit insane to me. Both of my friends will be taking time off before Christmas for maternity leave, then they'll be coming back before the summer term (literally, a month before we break up for summer), so that they'll be paid over the summer holidays...

 

What I don't like about society is that it seems like you MUST get married, then you MUST have kids. Like you have to do these things in order to fit in. It's the wrong attitude in my opinion. It's annoying me a lot lately.

[Rummy]

One little accident, and YOU might be the people that actually love the next ReZ

[Sheikah]

This is somewhat of a rant, but it may interest some people.

 

I've been in my teaching job for about 3 years now. Coming to the end of my third year. A friend who I started with has recently announced that she is pregnant. Another friend who started shortly before us (less than 6 months) is also pregnant, too. Whilst I do share their joy, it has raised a certain amount of questions and issues for me.

 

Due to having Ine living with me and being in a good job, I've been asked by numerous people if my plan was to have kids any time soon. My answer has been somewhere between "hahahha no," and "fuck, no!"

 

When speaking to the second friend about this, she said that, "if I didn't have kids, who would look after me when I was old?" In my mind, I was thinking that this is a bit of a bullshit reason to have kids.

 

I was at the pub earlier and there was a group of us discussing this and when it came to me, people were saying that I would change my mind in 5 years time. My answer to that is, "no, I won't." I told them I had too much I wanted to do. Possibly travelling, having some proper time with Ine, going on holidays (I don't have money to do this yet), it's nowhere near the right time. There's a load of stuff you won't be able to do once you have kids, or certainly can't do without having to re-jig your plans to accommodate them.

 

Another reason why this whole subject annoys me is that I have been through four years of uni (like my friends) in order to get this teaching job. I have various friends who did the same and are now pregnant or have kids. At least 5. What's the point in studying for 4 years for a job you're only going to be in for 3? It seems a bit insane to me. Both of my friends will be taking time off before Christmas for maternity leave, then they'll be coming back before the summer term (literally, a month before we break up for summer), so that they'll be paid over the summer holidays...

 

What I don't like about society is that it seems like you MUST get married, then you MUST have kids. Like you have to do these things in order to fit in. It's the wrong attitude in my opinion. It's annoying me a lot lately.

 

I agree with all of your points except for the one about being lonely when old. I think about my old relatives such as grandparents and great aunties... without my parents and uncle/aunt to shuttle them between houses for visits they really would be pretty much alone. And the thought of that is pretty much terrifying.

[Ashley]

Kids are the worst.

 

What's the point in studying for 4 years for a job you're only going to be in for 3

 

Well, with the new tuition fee scheme, you get a free education!

[Fierce_LiNk]

One little accident, and YOU might be the people that actually love the next ReZ

 

I'm tired, so this post makes no sense to me. :p Don't get it, dude.

 

I agree with all of your points except for the one about being lonely when old. I think about my old relatives such as grandparents and great aunties... without my parents and uncle/aunt to shuttle them between houses for visits they really would be pretty much alone. And the thought of that is pretty much terrifying.

 

But that shouldn't be the number one reason to have kids, though? Yes, if you do have kids, they should probably help you when you're old as you do help them when you're young, but it shouldn't be the main reason to have them.

[Sheikah]

I'm tired, so this post makes no sense to me. :p Don't get it, dude.

 

 

 

But that shouldn't be the number one reason to have kids, though? Yes, if you do have kids, they should probably help you when you're old as you do help them when you're young, but it shouldn't be the main reason to have them.

 

Wow did they really say it was their number one reason? Just sounds kinda odd that they would have that as their number one reason, but I definitely think it is a good reason.

[Fierce_LiNk]

Wow did they really say it was their number one reason? Just sounds kinda odd that they would have that as their number one reason, but I definitely think it is a good reason.

 

It was the very first thing she said when I mentioned that I didn't want them any time soon. The way it was said was almost with a gasp. ...you don't want kids? But you'll be lonely and old!

 

Self esteem smaaaash.

[Sheikah]

Sounds more like a worst case scenario proposition to you rather than confession of harbouring zero love for children, and recreation being a tool to sustain you through old age, tbh. :p

[MoogleViper]

What I don't like about society is that it seems like you MUST get married, then you MUST have kids. Like you have to do these things in order to fit in. It's the wrong attitude in my opinion. It's annoying me a lot lately.

 

Have you ever considered that people might actually want this?

 

 

I know I do.

[gaggle64]

In my experience the best counter argument can usually be found with the nearest parent.

[Jonnas]

When I have kids, it will be because I want them.

 

But if you don't want to, it's best for everyone that you don't have any until you're ready for it.

[Magnus]

So any woman who works with Flink gets pregnant after a while?

 

Hmm.

[Charlie]

In my experience the best counter argument can usually be found with the nearest parent.

 

This isn't directed at you, but most of the people I know who "hate kids" are the ones who have never actually interacted with them before and are only remember the bad experiences they've had with kids. Such as on public transport or in a restaurant.

 

I worked with them for over 4 years and loved it. Sure, I had my fair share of kids who were a pain in the arse but the vast majority were great to be around.

 

I definitely want kids in the future, but definitely not now. I'm not sure when exactly, I don't have any major ambitions to go away travelling. I know that I would need to be on more money than I am at the moment. And then there's obviously the whole having a gf/partner/wife part of it too which I don't have right now.

[Sheikah]

So any woman who works with Flink gets pregnant after a while?

 

Hmm.

 

Bwahaha, you're on fire recently. :p

[gaggle64]

Nonono, you don't understand. Kids I can take or leave, it's the parents I hate specifically.

[Murr]

I'm getting married because I love Heather to bits and enjoy spending my life with her. I'd actually say our mortgage together is a bigger commitment than us getting married due to the amount of complications there would be if we were ever to break up (which is unlikely to happen)

 

As for kids, I want one, I want a boy. Playing football and master System with my dad when I was young was brilliant. He was a fun dad. My mum did any thing and everything for me. I want to have a child/children to be a great dad to them.

 

However I don't plan on it before I'm 30. I've just moved into my 2nd home with Heather, and want to enjoy my game room, I want to enjoy going on holidays, I want to enjoy the money I earn at the moment by spending it on things for me and Heather.

 

I've given myself till 30, then ill start thinking about children. This time next year ill be 27 and married. All my money from May next year will be going on enjoying life (apart from normal expenditures or problems that need money to fix like a boiler or a car etc)

 

There is no right or wrong way to do things, just personal preference and when you personally want to do things

[-Dem0-]

Hmmm, I've been thinking about marriage and parenting for a while now (moreso in the last few years). Personally I want to get married in 2-3 years time. Children, don't know if and when it will happen but I certainly do want to have them, but before then I'm going to have to start working like a donkey.

[Fierce_LiNk]

Have you ever considered that people might actually want this?

 

 

I know I do.

 

There's a difference between what you just said and what I'm saying. If you want to have kids in the next few years, then that's your choice and that's fine. But, if I don't want to have kids before I'm 30, then that should be fine, too. What I don't like is the expectation that if you have a partner, you should be married and have kids by the time you're 30.

 

When I have kids, it will be because I want them.

 

But if you don't want to, it's best for everyone that you don't have any until you're ready for it.

 

Your first sentence is what I'm getting at. You should have them because you want them, when you feel the time is right. Not because it's expected that you SHOULD have them.

 

So any woman who works with Flink gets pregnant after a while?

 

Hmm.

 

I'm laughing nervously at this. :p

 

This isn't directed at you, but most of the people I know who "hate kids" are the ones who have never actually interacted with them before and are only remember the bad experiences they've had with kids. Such as on public transport or in a restaurant.

 

I worked with them for over 4 years and loved it. Sure, I had my fair share of kids who were a pain in the arse but the vast majority were great to be around.

 

I definitely want kids in the future, but definitely not now. I'm not sure when exactly, I don't have any major ambitions to go away travelling. I know that I would need to be on more money than I am at the moment. And then there's obviously the whole having a gf/partner/wife part of it too which I don't have right now.

 

Yes, kids are great fun and I love working with them. Teaching is a big part of my life and I get home every day with at least one funny or interesting story about what happened that day. But, there also needs to be other forms of outlet. There are teachers at work who have their kids attending the same school...so they are around their kids (as well as other kids) before work, during work, and after it. There's no outlet.

 

At the moment, what I love is that I can do a job that I enjoy, come home and then do something a bit different. I'm not at that stage when I can be around children 24/7, especially as how my job revolves around them.

 

I'm getting married because I love Heather to bits and enjoy spending my life with her. I'd actually say our mortgage together is a bigger commitment than us getting married due to the amount of complications there would be if we were ever to break up (which is unlikely to happen)

 

As for kids, I want one, I want a boy. Playing football and master System with my dad when I was young was brilliant. He was a fun dad. My mum did any thing and everything for me. I want to have a child/children to be a great dad to them.

 

However I don't plan on it before I'm 30. I've just moved into my 2nd home with Heather, and want to enjoy my game room, I want to enjoy going on holidays, I want to enjoy the money I earn at the moment by spending it on things for me and Heather.

 

I've given myself till 30, then ill start thinking about children. This time next year ill be 27 and married. All my money from May next year will be going on enjoying life (apart from normal expenditures or problems that need money to fix like a boiler or a car etc)

 

There is no right or wrong way to do things, just personal preference and when you personally want to do things

 

I've bolded the part that I think is important. Realistically, I am just about at that stage where I can start to enjoy life a bit more due to having a bit more money, whereas before it was a struggle. Having kids is a huuuuge commitment and when it does happen, I'd like to be in a position where I have a decent amount of money to do things properly, and not have to struggle through it.

 

Part of this is probably due to my sister as well, who started having kids at 26 years old. I've seen how her life has changed due to it and it's just not for me at the moment.

[Guy]

Having kids because it seems like part of life is dumb. Most of my school friends who had kids early are now bound to the life they're currently living and essentially exist for their kids. No freedom, no options, no thanks.

 

I'm still too selfish to not put myself first and I can barely look after myself at the moment, so kids are definitely not on the cards right now.

 

The "But you'll be alone when you get older..." argument also infuriates me. There's no guarantee your child won't be an asshole and anyone who has kids with the expectation they'll always be there to keep them company is being unreasonable. You should have children to create a cool person and hope they have a more amazing life than yours, not to guarantee someone will come over every Sunday and listen to you complain about the government.

Edited May 4, 2013 by Guy

[nightwolf]

Sigh, this is always the time when I get incredibly annoyed and irritated but here we go.

 

I don't want kids. I don't want to get married.

 

The response I receive is the same as yourself @Fierce_LiNk

 

''You're only *insert my age here*, you'll change your mind''

 

Whilst that may possibly be true, I don't know what is going to happen in the next 5+ years, I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt, since I was able to comprehend both babies and marriage, I have never felt any twinge to do either. I have never, ever wanted children.

 

But for some unknown reason, society, friends, family deem that I will have children, that its the thing 'to do' as you get older. Its certainly frowned upon by a number of people if you do not have children.

 

Thankfully, in all this mess that is soceity, my parents are very supportive and have always known that it wasn't my deal and I wanted to focus on my career, my home, holidays etc, that it wasn't really for me at all. As my step-mum has never had her own children (she adopted me and my sister when she married my dad), she's been giving me all the support I need and talks to me about it often and how she always had the same issues.

 

Thats not to say however, that I do not like children and the idea of marriage, I would love to be an aunty and hope that sometime in the future that my sister will get the child she's wanted for a long time now. This also goes for marriage, marriage is a pretty cool thing, so is sharing a house together and committing.

 

But y'know its just not for everyone and thats cool.

[Josh64]

I honestly could never see myself as being mature enough for either of those things, I swear I'm just stuck in the mind-set of a 16 year old.

 

Anyway, I'd say as long as you and your partner are happy not having kids then there is no problem what other people think about the situation and vice/versa.

[MoogleViper]

There's a difference between what you just said and what I'm saying. If you want to have kids in the next few years, then that's your choice and that's fine. But, if I don't want to have kids before I'm 30, then that should be fine, too. What I don't like is the expectation that if you have a partner, you should be married and have kids by the time you're 30.

 

I completely agree with that, but it's important to not go the other way. The amount of times I've heard somebody criticising people who have children, acting as if they do it because they had nothing else to do, or because they're a slag or wahtever; it's such a terrible attitude. Some people don't want kids, some people do.

 

We seem to live in a society where people can't fathom the possibility that some people may want something that they don't. Especially when it's a popular thing (they're only doing it to fit/don't know what else to do/can't think for themselves). It really does make you hate the human race sometimes.

 

[not aimed at you by the way, just thought I'd make it clear]

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

I can barely look after myself at the moment, so kids are definitely not on the cards right now.

 

Haha! That's exactly how I describe my situation at the moment as well. I would barely even trust myself with keeping a plant. :p

 

The "But you'll be alone when you get older..." argument also infuriates me. There's no guarantee your child won't be an asshole and anyone who has kids with the expectation they'll always be there to keep them company is being unreasonable. You should have children to create a cool person and hope they have a more amazing life than yours, not to guarantee someone will come over every Sunday and listen to you complain about the government.

 

At first I was unsure where I stood on the "you'll be alone" argument, but when you phrased it like that, I realised how horrible it is. I absolutely cannot stand it when people have children for their own sake.

 

When the great debate about Western vs. Eastern upbringing methods was roaring (the whole "Tiger Mother" thing), one thing I noticed was that the traditional Asian parents often felt that their kids owed them everything for creating them, which they used as justification for their strict, success-oriented upbringing methods: The kids had to become successful so they could pay back their parents (for instance by taking care of them when they got old).

 

That simply infuriated me. That's right, you created them, took care of them and readied them for the world, because that's to be expected of you. You made the decision to create them - they didn't have a say in it - and by doing so you took on that responsibility. You're not doing them a favour which they're obliged to appreciate and pay back, you're doing your job as a parent. Of course, if you're a great parent, then they're likely to become great people as well and love you and appreciate you and reciprocate everything you've done, but don't ever have a kid on the grounds that you'll then have an existential debt slave, because that's horrible.

 

If you have a kid, have it for the kid's sake - not your own.

[bob]

Possibly unrelated, but if you suspect that someone might be about to be proposed to - don't fucking tell them. No good will come of it, and you'll just ruin everything.

[Fierce_LiNk]

I completely agree with that, but it's important to not go the other way. The amount of times I've heard somebody criticising people who have children, acting as if they do it because they had nothing else to do, or because they're a slag or wahtever; it's such a terrible attitude. Some people don't want kids, some people do.

 

Whilst I do agree with what you're saying, you also can't deny that some do just finish school and have kids purely because they don't have something else to do. Some, not all.

 

In my experience, those people who leave school after GCSEs or A Levels/College did one of the following:

 

1. Uni

2. Straight into a job

3. Had kids

 

That'll differ from area to area and person to person, and personally, starting a family or having 2 kids before the age of 20 isn't for me, but I know plenty who have done it. If they're happy doing it, then it's good for them, but in my opinion it's far too young.

 

We seem to live in a society where people can't fathom the possibility that some people may want something that they don't. Especially when it's a popular thing (they're only doing it to fit/don't know what else to do/can't think for themselves). It really does make you hate the human race sometimes.

 

[not aimed at you by the way, just thought I'd make it clear]

 

Oh yes, I agree with you there. But, in this instance, I could never really advise anybody that having 2 kids before the age of 20 is a good idea.

 

Possibly unrelated, but if you suspect that someone might be about to be proposed to - don't fucking tell them. No good will come of it, and you'll just ruin everything.

 

Yeah...that's a dick move. What exactly happened there?

Edited May 5, 2013 by Fierce_LiNk