Playstation 5 Console Discussion

[Dcubed]

1 hour ago, drahkon said:

Or they may run well.

Anyway...PS5 in Japan is doomed:

 

Wow, that's a big fat middle finger to Japanese players.  Very sad to see them abandon their preference that they have burnt into their Japanese players for the last 26 years!

If that was Nintendo, I'd be rioting.  You will take my correct Nintendo confirm button placement from my cold, dead hands!

[Happenstance]

It’s an OS level thing and devs can still use circle in their games but I wonder if Japanese games themselves started using X a while ago and this was just a decision made to match things up. Pure guess work on my part of course as I haven’t played a Japanese version of a game in years.

[Dcubed]

1 hour ago, Ike said:

Has Sony said anything on how the backwards compatibly works?

Looks like they'll be implementing a Whitelist of BC games (just like on Vita & Playstation TV), going by this website leak...

Quote

• "playing PS4 games on PS5, some functionalities available on PS4 may not be available. See www.playstation.com/ps5-backwards-compatibility for more details." (dead link, currently)
• "This PS4 game isn't supported with your PS5's current system software. We're continuing to make more PS4 games playable on PS5. Update your PS5, and then try playing the game"
• "PS5 boost mode enabled"

 

Edited October 4, 2020 by Dcubed

[Julius]

10 minutes ago, Dcubed said:

Looks like they'll be implementing a Whitelist of BC games (just like on Vita & Playstation TV), going by this website leak...

 

Eh, I saw that and immediately thought that these are just error messages to cover every potential outcome, so I'm not too concerned just yet. If we don't hear anything two weeks out from launch, then yeah, I'd be a bit confused about why we haven't heard anything, but it's a whole lot of nothing right now. 

I genuinely don't think that this will end up impacting many, if any, PS4 players on N-Europe. How many games are even available on PS4? According to this list on Wikipedia (yeah, grain of salt and all that), there are currently 2916 games available on PS4, as well as a number of other games not included in that list, such as arcade ports, PS2 Classics, etc. Let's be generous and just round up to 3500: even if PlayStation's 1% figure is an exaggeration and it's actually something like 5%, that would still "only" be around 175 games which wouldn't be playable.

Thinking of how much shovelware there is on the PS Store, as well delisted games, and things like that, I really don't see it being an issue for most gamers. I could be completely wrong and just be naively optimistic here, but at the very least in my mind, first party, third party AAA, AA, and most indie offerings are going to be safe in this transition. 

And if that 1% figure is correct? That's only going to be around 35 games which won't be making the transition. Again, odds are, this isn't going to impact any of us. 

Also, PlayStation's messaging being that 99% of PS4 games will be playable makes me think that it's much more likely we'll see a blacklist of games which won't work on the console, rather than a whitelist of games that do, just because that list would be unnecessarily long? But maybe that's just me thinking it's better to put out a shorter list than a long one, because I only see that leading to confusion too. 

Of course I'm hoping for some clarification sooner rather than later, but am I personally worried that PS4 games I want to play aren't going to be playable on PS5? Not at all. 

[Will]

I get why they would change the confirm and cancel buttons to be universal but it’s going to be super weird for anyone in Japan to suddenly have it change.

38 minutes ago, Happenstance said:

It’s an OS level thing and devs can still use circle in their games but I wonder if Japanese games themselves started using X a while ago and this was just a decision made to match things up. Pure guess work on my part of course as I haven’t played a Japanese version of a game in years.

The way I read it was that this is now going to be set for all games rather than devs being able to choose which is confirm and which is cancel. In my experience (Japanese PS4 owner, games from a variety of regions) Japanese titles always use circle as confirm, I’ve never played something that is the other way around, though I don’t know which are picking that up from the system vs. which are coded like that. European and US games either pick up the system setting (so for me confirm is circle) or have it set at a game level (so for me confirm is X) - at least with them unifying this I won’t get the situation of bouncing back and forth because the button system being used keeps changing.

[Happenstance]

6 minutes ago, Will said:

I get why they would change the confirm and cancel buttons to be universal but it’s going to be super weird for anyone in Japan to suddenly have it change.

The way I read it was that this is now going to be set for all games rather than devs being able to choose which is confirm and which is cancel. In my experience (Japanese PS4 owner, games from a variety of regions) Japanese titles always use circle as confirm, I’ve never played something that is the other way around, though I don’t know which are picking that up from the system vs. which are coded like that. European and US games either pick up the system setting (so for me confirm is circle) or have it set at a game level (so for me confirm is X) - at least with them unifying this I won’t get the situation of bouncing back and forth because the button system being used keeps changing.

I think someone already posted an image of circle still being used as confirm on Twitter which was why I was wondering.

[drahkon]

41 minutes ago, Julius said:

this isn't going to impact any of us.

Speak for yourself...if I won't be able to replay My Name is Mayo...not only will I cancel my PS5 pre-order, I will actively hunt down all consoles and destroy them.

[Rummy]

19 hours ago, Ike said:

I more mean will it play it straight from the disk or will it download the digital version ala Xbox One backwards compatibility, will they run better, etc. But I guess they haven't said anything yet. I'm in 2 minds on keeping my digital only preorder.

yeah tbh as I'm just getting a ps5 because I'll eventually be getting a ps5 if just love it being mad good fast on loads and stuff over ps4. I got fed up playing some big games with long transition screens between.

[Jimbob]

Yeah, this BC issue isn't really going to affect a lot of people.  Unless a lot of people plan to play that Black Tiger game or something.

My PS5 launch games are set.  Got Miles Morales and Sackboy pre-ordered.  Have Destiny 2 Beyond Light upgrade sorted too for PS5.  Would get Valhalla as a launch title, but still have Odyssey to finish which i'll get through before Christmas either on the PS4 or via BC on the PS5.  Speaking of which, i've got a few other games left on PS4 i'd like to play (Maneater is one title, which has a free PS5 upgrade for launch and Crash Bandicoot 4).  Plus, there's the PS+ collection to check out.

[Sheikah]

Both Sony and Microsoft are basically saying the same thing - that being that effectively "thousands" of games will work. Neither have said that every game would work, which is pretty much to be expected.

[Ganepark32]

For backwards compatibility, as long as the majority of games work (which I suspect will be the case) then thats fine. The likelihood is that most people will only play a small number of PS4 games from their library through backwards compatibility. I know that's the case for me as I've played and bought a ton of stuff over the years on PS4 and its unlikely I'd go back to everything. Sure, I'd like to know that everything I've bought digitally over the years will be playable on my PS5 but I know that a small number of titles in my library won't be. That ultimately doesn't bother me as I could always boot up a PS4 and play them there. But as I say, the vast majority of the games in my PS4 library have been played and completed and I'm unlikely to go back to them despite really enjoying them.

Take The Witness for instance. Loved that game. But I've not played it again since I platinumed it and I'm unlikely to do it on my PS5. Even something like say Life is Strange or the Telltale games or whatever. They're unlikely to be things that I'd play again but if I really wanted to, I could load them up on a PS4.

I get we all want total access to our libraries in one place like PC (as I said, I'd love to have full access as a possibility of maybe dipping in and out of stuff here and there) and maybe as the months/years go on, every PS4 game becomes compatible but some games will sadly be left behind on the PS4 for various reasons but they won't be gone completely if you already have the game in your library on a PS4.

Saw snippets from yesterday's Japanese influencer hands on. Think I'm most impressed with the quick reload that was shown for Godfall (despite the game not really looking all that appealing to me). Knowing that things like loading into a new zone in say Destiny 2 will be much, much quicker is actually genuinely exciting. Less downtime between missions or levels is always a good thing. Curious if we'll see any other interesting uses gameplay wise beyond Ratchet and Clank Rift Apart for this improved loading.

Still mulling over launch day choices. Kind of getting cold feet with AC Valhalla because as much as I love the prospect of pillaging, shield walls, massive battles and just getting to be a viking in game, the AC side of things and the prospect of it all being drawn out is kind of worrying me giving just how drawn out Odyssey felt (I love Odyssey but its overly bloated). I know Miles Morales will be there day and date, will be taking advantage of the new console to play Cyberpunk 2077 but may just look to indies ala The Pathless and other such things that might come instead as I'll not be short of stuff to play with those aforementioned games so AC Valhalla probably wouldn't get a huge amount of a look in. There's also the possibility of there being a slight sale price on it come the Xmas sale on the PS Store. I'll see. Would really like to know what's coming beyond what we know to finalise choices/how much I'll be spending on games on day 1.

 

[Goafer]

On 04/10/2020 at 11:20 AM, Ike said:

I more mean will it play it straight from the disk or will it download the digital version ala Xbox One backwards compatibility, will they run better, etc. But I guess they haven't said anything yet. I'm in 2 minds on keeping my digital only preorder.

Just had a thought on this. If it does download a copy of the game and just uses the disc for verification, like the XBox currently does, what will it mean for games with licenced music or other content (cars, teams etc)?

Surely if the licence doesn't get renewed, they can't offer a new download of it, even if the player already owns the disc? Would the download count as a new, digital copy or an extension of the disc version?

[Julius]

1 hour ago, Goafer said:

Just had a thought on this. If it does download a copy of the game and just uses the disc for verification, like the XBox currently does, what will it mean for games with licenced music or other content (cars, teams etc)?

Surely if the licence doesn't get renewed, they can't offer a new download of it, even if the player already owns the disc? Would the download count as a new, digital copy or an extension of the disc version?

I have to imagine that it's going to be a bit of both, as it seems more like the PS4 Pro boosted mode from the little hints we've heard about it from the website data.

My guess would be that a game running with enhanced performance only, akin to the Pro's boosted mode, would run straight from the disk, whereas upgraded, PS5 versions of the game will require the disc for authentication and to be downloaded completely (I imagine this is how the Miles Morales PS4 > PS5 upgrade will work, for instance) more akin to what Xbox has done to this point. 

Could be completely off the mark there, but that's what I'd expect based on what we know and heard from Cerny's presentation, too. While the Xbox One line requires the disc for authentication but is otherwise just a downloaded application in most cases, if I recall, I think that's down more to it not being an integrated feature from launch, as is the plan here. 

[Ike]

4 hours ago, Goafer said:

Just had a thought on this. If it does download a copy of the game and just uses the disc for verification, like the XBox currently does, what will it mean for games with licenced music or other content (cars, teams etc)?

Surely if the licence doesn't get renewed, they can't offer a new download of it, even if the player already owns the disc? Would the download count as a new, digital copy or an extension of the disc version?

Chances are the game won't be supported if the licence is expired (if it's a download).

[drahkon]

 

[Ganepark32]

So the thought popped into my head last night and I'm not sure if its been discussed previous or not but thought I'd see what everyone thinks: do we think Sony will include a PS5 title in the November PS+ lineup or do we think they'll stick with offering up the PS+ Collection to get started out of the gate before adding PS5 games in down the line?

With the PS4, Resogun and Contrast we the titles for the first month at the launch of that console so they have included new games at the launch with PS+. But the announcement of the PS+ Collection does make me wonder if they'll not do it this time as we'll be getting 18 PS4 games included as part of the collection, which will presumably have more titles added and stuff being removed as the months and years go on.

Not that I'd complain if it was simply the Collection with no PS5 PS+ titles until a little down the line but just curious how they'll handle it out of the gate in light of that announcement.

If they do go with PS5 titles added to PS+ at launch, I'd suspect that it'll be indie games over bigger titles but I'm no entirely sure what those games would be. Giant Squid didn't give a price for The Pathless and instead have said to wait until the end of the month for that news. Could that possibly be a PS+ title at launch? The game is going out on Apple Arcade so presumably they would be open to it given that there would be a similar deal with Sony to get the game on there compared to Apple Arcade. Guarantees the success of the game before its even launched.

Anyway, thoughts anyone?

[drahkon]

3 minutes ago, Ganepark32 said:

Could that possibly be a PS+ title at launch?

The devs said no.

I'm not expecting any PS5 title on PS+ for a while. It'll most likely continue to consist of PS4 titles (which will also be playable on PS5, of course). My guess is: The first true PS5 game on PS+ will arrive in August next year.

Edited October 6, 2020 by drahkon

[Ronnie]

The PS+ Collection seems a bit of a slap in the face to their biggest fans, who've surely already played all those games. Sure there'll be a handful they've not played but it seems a lot lower value in that case compared to new gen games each month. Not sure if you can subscribe to just their online service without the PS+ Collection, if so then that's not so bad I guess, just a shame.

Edited October 6, 2020 by Ronnie

[Sheikah]

2 hours ago, Ronnie said:

The PS+ Collection seems a bit of a slap in the face to their biggest fans, who've surely already played all those games. Sure there'll be a handful they've not played but it seems a lot lower value in that case compared to new gen games each month. Not sure if you can subscribe to just their online service without the PS+ Collection, if so then that's not so bad I guess, just a shame.

I think the primary purpose of the PS+ Collection is to entice people over who had an Xbox last gen and so never got to play these exclusive games. When you look at it that way it's kind of a fantastic package that can tempt people over.

Sony also said The PS+ Collection was a bonus thing you get, so it's not replacing the Plus games each month. That said, as @drahkon mentioned, don't expect to see full PS5 games in it for a while. We saw this at the start of the PS4 generation; it takes a while before they start giving away those sorts of games.

Edited October 6, 2020 by Sheikah

[Ronnie]

Oh ok if you also get a set of free Plus games every month then that's good, I got the impression from their marketing that this was replacing that.

[Ganepark32]

22 hours ago, drahkon said:

The devs said no.

I'm not expecting any PS5 title on PS+ for a while. It'll most likely continue to consist of PS4 titles (which will also be playable on PS5, of course). My guess is: The first true PS5 game on PS+ will arrive in August next year.

Ah didn't see that. That crosses that off the list then. Weird that they haven't announced the price yet but they're saying they'll have more to say soon on pre-orders and such so I do wonder if the Apple Arcade deal they're locked into is making them a bit more cagey about announcing pricing for The Pathless.

Yeah, I'm not expecting big AAA games out the gate for PS+ on PS5. That looks to be reserved for the Collection for the time being at least which is still great value especially given the games that they're putting on there day 1. Totally fine with that and happy with the Collection because with going digital, I obviously won't be bringing the majority of the games in that collection across to PS5 with having bought and played them physically. It gives someone like me a chance, should I want to, to replay those games which is something I'll happily do for the likes of God of War.

I'm not expecting any AAA or even AA games for at least a year on PS+ but do wonder if they've got some smaller indie titles lined up. Whether that be for launch or a couple of months down the line, I don't know but I could see them having some cross gen indie titles there for the service and framing them in the way they did for some of the early PS+ titles on PS4 by saying that you can play them either on PS4 or of you've upgraded, you'll get access to the free upgrade to the version for that console. Thats at least where I think they'll fall for PS+ for the first year, indies predominantly.

I'd imagine we'll hear more about games at launch in the coming weeks. We know, obviously, about a lot of the bigger games but with how they're framing indie titles this time around, and a lot of the stuff they've been working on behind the scenes with Shuhei Yoshida going to and speaking with indie devs, you'd expect to hear and see more from those conversations in the coming weeks. Hopefully a few big surprises in store for the indie side at launch as I imagine they've been very deliberate in which teams they've spoken to about getting those titles on the platform at or around launch.

 

Edit: Having also watched the gameplay for it yesterday, I have to say I'm excited to sit down and play Astro's Playroom on launch day. Never did get a PSVR headset so haven't played the original but even as a pre-loaded title at launch thats designed to show off features, it looks surprisingly polished and fun to play.

Edited October 7, 2020 by Ganepark32

[drahkon]

Turn on CC.

I know pretty much nothing about how any of this works, but it sure looks nice.

Removing the side panels seems to be very easy. Good for those who don't like the colour and want to replace them eventually.
Also: The side panels are pretty much the things that make this console so large. Without 'em it doesn't seem that big.

Edited October 7, 2020 by drahkon

[drahkon]

To all of you hardware/engineering people here:

Why is liquid metal better than thermal paste?
What is a vapor chamber and why is the heat sink built to work like one?

Edit: Nevermind, I was bored and looked it up myself.

The PS5 seems to be engineered with a lot of cooling in mind They listened to those who suffer from jet-engines in their living rooms.

Edited October 7, 2020 by drahkon

[Cube]

It's like 75% cooling.

They're definitely going to sell different designs for the shells. I imagine third parties will sell some too.

[Aneres11]

Not sure if already posted. Apologies if so. 

Change to the Trophy system. About bloody time too! 

Sounds great now. 

https://blog.playstation.com/2020/10/07/upcoming-trophy-levelling-changes-detailed/#sf238573826