Was the Wii a fluke?

[Jamba]

The Wii was fantastically successful for lots of reasons and everyone has been asking whether the Nintendo could bottle lightening for a second time with the Wii U.

 

However if you look at the Wii as an anomaly, what has been Nintendo's general trajectory in terms of consoles (rather than handhelds)?

 

Are we looking at consumer and publisher interest in the big N gradually slipping further and further away?

[S.C.G]

Where there are Nintendo games there will always be interest.

 

To play Nintendo games, you need a Nintendo console... this will never change. :wink:

 

Nintendo make games for gamers, this has always been true and always will be regardless of frequency of releases.

 

These games would not be the same on anything other than Nintendo hardware.

 

In the case of the Wii it was a brilliant console with a simple concept let down only by lack of HD and certain developers treating it like a toy.

 

But in the case of the Wii U we have a brilliant console capable of HD, the general public fail to grasp the concept of the gamepad or even that it's part of a new console, this is partially Nintendo's fault though.

 

I really don't know what else there is to say?

 

All the threads created recently always seem like pointlessly retreading old ground... no offence to you @Jamba as you're a top guy but can we have a little more clarification on what the discussion in this thread should be about please, as I feel like otherwise I may have missed the point and others might do the same; I just don't want to see this turn into another identical thread so if you could further explain - perhaps only for my benefit - then that would be appreciated, thanks. : peace:

[Hero-of-Time]

However if you look at the Wii as an anomaly, what has been Nintendo's general trajectory in terms of consoles (rather than handhelds)?

 

The sales have been slipping ever since the NES, which is probably why they needed to go a different route with the Wii.

 

Nintendo Entertainment System: 61.91 million

Super Nintendo Entertainment System: 49.10 million

Nintendo 64 : 32.93 million

GameCube: 21.74 million

Wii: 100.04 million

[Cube]

The Wii aimed clearly at the untapped casual market, and it had the perfect gimmick, price and marketing so it did hugely well.

 

The Wii U...well, I'm still not entirely sure what market it's aimed at. It seemed they tried to go for something in between casual and hardcore and it hasn't really caused huge excitement for either.

[Sheikah]

The Wii latched onto something that people found really cool at the time, which was partly through design and partly through luck. And it was affordable. They probably never knew they'd be so successful. In saying that though, while the Wii was commercially successful it was, in my opinion, the beginning of a considerable downward spiral in terms of quality and originality of Nintendo game design, as well as a significant reduction in quality / competitiveness of hardware. For me, it was one of the worst consoles Nintendo ever created, while also pretty cool in some respects.

 

Now though the craze that brought the Wii commercial success is gone. People have done it; it's not something they particularly find novel enough to get truly excited over. Like all good crazes, they must come to an end.

[Shorty]

But in the case of the Wii U we have a brilliant console capable of HD, the general public fail to grasp the concept of the gamepad or even that it's part of a new console, this is partially Nintendo's fault though.

It's completely Nintendo's fault. Everything about the Wii U makes it seem like a Wii add-on. When they announced it, they just showed the controller, the console was in a box in the background and you had to look for images online later on to see what it looked like. And what does it look like? A Wii.

 

They should've called it Wii 2 or something completely different, and not underestimate the importance of the system itself. Even if you really want to focus on the main feature of your system, people need to know it's not something you buy for the Wii, it's something you get when you buy a whole new, more powerful console.

 

It's a no-brainer to anyone reading this thread right now, but to parents and average joes, it is not clear enough. When the Wii came out, there were groups of non-gamers at my uni chatting about going home to play Wii Sports, it's no wonder the Wii was a success, it did a tonne of things right in regards to achieving great sales figures and widening the market. The Wii U did pretty much the opposite thing.

[nekunando]

I feel somewhat uneasy about the Wii being called a 'gimmick' because that seems really unfair to me

 

The Wii was a breath of fresh air with a great new controller, challenging gamers and developers to try something different. It was exciting Unfortunately, not everyone embraced the potential and failed to take advantage of the possibilities to innovate.

 

The introduction of Wii Motion Plus was basically the arrival of the device that many thought they were getting originally when the Wii came out, but by that time a lot of gamers seemed to have given up on the Wii, for whatever reason, and an upgraded controller that not everyone had meant developers couldn't embrace it fully.

 

Maybe Pachter's call for a Wii HD back in 2010 wouldn't have been a bad call after all. All it needed was the power of the Wii U and to come with Wii Motion plus as standard, fully compatible with all existing Wii software. They could probably have got that out on the shelves for £199 and lowered the price of the original Wii..

[Rummy]

The Wii was fantastically successful for lots of reasons and everyone has been asking whether the Nintendo could bottle lightening for a second time with the Wii U.

 

However if you look at the Wii as an anomaly, what has been Nintendo's general trajectory in terms of consoles (rather than handhelds)?

 

Are we looking at consumer and publisher interest in the big N gradually slipping further and further away?

 

Short answer: Yes.

 

Longer answer: It was a gimmick that they hoped would take off and would work, but I don't think they expected it quite like it happened - nor how huge it would be. So yeah, I'd say it was definitely a fluke in that sense.

 

Now they've had that, they played to it, and they lost their way with it all. They got caught up in the madness and made a mess of the Wii U - it's lacked focus in many ways imo.

[Serebii]

Fluke? No. Risk that paid off? Absolutely.

[tapedeck]

To regard the Wii as a fluke is perhaps not giving Nintendo the credit they deserve.

They knew they had to do something different after the GC and did it brilliantly. They also did it right from the start with early software to the adverts shown. It was also 'new' and unique which can have a huge impact on consumers.

Over 100 millions consoles sold is phonomonal in the face of powerhouses such as MS and SONY. Also: Many gamers will have grown up on Wii and so Nintendo will also be synonymous with gamers of the future. I don't believe it was a fluke.

 

The Wii U is an amalgamation of Wii and core gamers (dubbed U) so that's the WiiU market. The system has piggybacked on PS3/360 releases like AC/Arkham etc ticking the boxes for U - and this is where the biggest failing has come from, seeing as those titles are already available on other systems which are much cheaper and cater to a more mature demographic.

 

Nintendo have tried to create software that straddles the line of casual and core through Nintendoland and their legacy games like 2D Mario. It works...but Nintendo haven't really made a 'casual' Wii type game using Mii's. I think they've underestimated Wii Sports massively - it's a universal concept as opposed to, say, a 2D platformer or multi-faceted, asymmetrical game like Nintendoland.

 

Wii Sports U for Christmas with more modes/online leaderboards and optional Gamepad integration (using controls on off-TV if you want), would have set the Wii U rolling more than a conceptually confusing (to the casual crowd) 2.5D Mario game. Nintendo doomed themselves when they bought into this whole Wii and U concept (or casual/core division). Instead they should have just kept on focusing on games that sell to get their console off the ground - peppered with their legacy characters in HD.

 

That would have been fine. Instead we've got this confusing scenario where Nintendo dont seem to know who they are appealing to. Strange for a company so focused on making games that encompass every age.

[Zechs Merquise]

The Wii was certainly not a fluke! Nintendo just got things right - right price, right marketing, accessible to the masses and a return of the Nintendo charm!

 

The problem with Nintendo, is often when they make a console they manage to make life more difficult for themselves by doing something that makes the console less attractive to the masses or to developers!

 

With the N64 they refused to use disks and instead went for cartridges. Development costs were much higher, as were the costs of the games. Despite the system's power, four controller ports and the excellent analogue control - no to mention some of the greatest games ever made - the N64 couldn't compete.

 

With the Gamecube they made it purple and for good measure gave it a handle. It was almost as if they wanted everyone to know that owning a Nintendo system was 'uncool'. Also, their refusal just to adopt a regular sized disk was a little baffling!

 

Now you have the Wii U. The gamepad has made the system expensive and inaccessible to those who bought the Wii. It's like they have gone back to their old ways - doing things differently in an odd way that isn't really conducive to selling consoles!

 

So I don't think the Wii was a fluke, it was just Nintendo actually coming up with a well priced, well marketed system that was clearly accessible and attractive to a very wide market. It isn't beyond them to do well again and make a successful system, it just seems that they prefer to shoot themselves in the foot when it comes to home consoles!

[Grazza]

To me, the Wii wasn't really a proper console, it was more of a well-designed toy. When I used to hear people call the GameCube "a child's toy" I used to think "Oh, grow up", but that's what the Wii was. I don't mean it was childish, I just mean it was designed for a very limited purpose. Nintendo had the opportunity to take advantage of motion control technology - they did so and it was a huge success, but nothing about it was designed to enable the next level of greatness in Nintendo's franchises. It was always going to be a cul-de-sac.

 

I'm not saying it was impossible to create good games for, but that wasn't its main purpose. I honesty would have preferred it if there had been more... well, frankness, about the fact it was just a motion control machine to play things like Wii Sports, with less pretence about it being a good all-round console. Maybe it would have been better if it never had the Nunchuk, just to make it more obvious there was no need to buy it. Trying to force motion controls onto franchises like Metroid and Zelda may have been done with good intentions, but it hasn't got us anywhere.

 

That's not to say it's all bad. Thanks mainly to the DS, Nintendo has learnt how to make Mario and Mario Kart more successful than the GameCube days. I wouldn't say Nintendo can't be mainstream again, but what they need now is clarity about what they're trying to achieve.

[Ronnie]

Maybe it would have been better if it never had the Nunchuk,

 

Yep, who needs Super Mario Galaxy, Metroid Prime 3, Twilight Princess, Skyward Sword.... It may not have ushered in a new era in gaming, but it was a hell of a ride.

 

Would have loved to see Nintendo market the Wii as 'Come play our motion controlled toy! It's not really a console, just for silly little games'.

[Zechs Merquise]

To me, the Wii wasn't really a proper console, it was more of a well-designed toy. When I used to hear people call the GameCube "a child's toy" I used to think "Oh, grow up", but that's what the Wii was. I don't mean it was childish, I just mean it was designed for a very limited purpose. Nintendo had the opportunity to take advantage of motion control technology - they did so and it was a huge success, but nothing about it was designed to enable the next level of greatness in Nintendo's franchises. It was always going to be a cul-de-sac.

 

I'm not saying it was impossible to create good games for, but that wasn't its main purpose. I honesty would have preferred it if there had been more... well, frankness, about the fact it was just a motion control machine to play things like Wii Sports, with less pretence about it being a good all-round console. Maybe it would have been better if it never had the Nunchuk, just to make it more obvious there was no need to buy it. Trying to force motion controls onto franchises like Metroid and Zelda may have been done with good intentions, but it hasn't got us anywhere.

 

That's not to say it's all bad. Thanks mainly to the DS, Nintendo has learnt how to make Mario and Mario Kart more successful than the GameCube days. I wouldn't say Nintendo can't be mainstream again, but what they need now is clarity about what they're trying to achieve.

 

I'm sorry, but I've never heard so much shite in my life.

 

No need for the nunchuck? No need for the perfect smooth aiming in Metroid Prime Trilogy? No need for Mario Galaxy and Mario Galaxy 2? No need for the excellent sword play in Skyward Sword?

 

The Wii had some amazing games and saw some brilliant rebirths of dead franchises: Donkey Kong returned to his platforming greatness, Punch-Out came back to critical acclaim and Mario Kart Wii was the biggest version of the franchise.

 

The Wii was an amazing console and Nintendo released some of the best games they've ever made on the platform. To even try and claim it wasn't a proper console or it was a 'toy' is just madness.

 

If anything the Wii brought back the Nintendo magic!

[liger05]

I wouldnt call it a fluke but I think what Nintendo has done with the Wii U and 3DS to an extent has show it was an anomaly.

 

It really was lightning in a bottle which cannot be replicated.

 

The Wii was an amazing console and Nintendo released some of the best games they've ever made on the platform. To even try and claim it wasn't a proper console or it was a 'toy' is just madness.

 

It def had some great games. I just wish they kept supporting it instead of in 2011 allowing it to die a slow death!!

[Kav]

Yeah, sorry @Grazza I can't help but see that as crazy talk. The Mario Galaxy games are amongst the best games ever created, Metroid Prime 3 controlled beautifully, Skyward Sword realised some of the best sword controls in a game to date.

The CoD games had such a level of customisation to control that I can honestly say, when tinkered with to your suiting, the Wiimote is by far and away better than dual analogue when it comes to FPS games.

Tiger Woods was infinitely better on Wii with Motion+ controls too.

 

To dismiss it so easily as a games console is crazy talk.

[Sheikah]

 

The Wii was an amazing console and Nintendo released some of the best games they've ever made on the platform. To even try and claim it wasn't a proper console or it was a 'toy' is just madness.

 

If anything the Wii brought back the Nintendo magic!

 

Oh god. Never have I disagreed more with anything. The scary thing is, I actually think you believe it.

[Ronnie]

I'm sorry, but I've never heard so much shite in my life.

 

Completely agree, crazy talk indeed.

[Blade]

Oh god. Never have I disagreed more with anything. The scary thing is, I actually think you believe it.

 

For me the nintendo magic never went but I disagree with the above.

 

The Wii was not a shitty toy but was a console that nintendo released some classic games for.

 

Why do you think it wasnt?

[Sheikah]

I meant more that I disagree with it having the best console games they have ever made. They pretty much poured whatever little Nintendo magic they had down the drain after making Mario Galaxy and hopped the formulaic sequel train. To think that the games they made for Wii were generally better than many of the games they made for SNES, N64 and GC is the talk of a madman.

[Wii]

The Wii has its faults and its pluses but if there's 1 thing the Wii did right it's FPS controls. I never want to see dual analogue controls ever again in my life. Pure perfection.

[Zechs Merquise]

Oh god. Never have I disagreed more with anything. The scary thing is, I actually think you believe it.

 

The Nintendo magic is seeing dozens of people queuing in Tesco to have a go at Wii Sports. The Nintendo magic is watching your entire family playing a game together and everyone enjoying themselves. The Nintendo magic is a new Mario that yet again redefines gaming and a sequel that is even better. The Nintendo magic is a new beautiful art style for Zelda but on top of that a whole new way to play the game. The Nintendo magic is seeing Donkey Kong come back and be jaw dropping all over again. The Nintendo magic is winning awards for graphics on a less powerful console. The Nintendo magic is introducing a new controller that reshapes the entire industry.

[Daft]

Personally, the Wii marks the point of transition where Nintendo finally turned completely from a games company into a toy company. It's a line the treaded carefully for years.

[Ashley]

I know I'm not contributing here, but Jamba I want to change the title as I keep reading it as "Was the Wii a flute?"

 

The Nintendo magic is seeing dozens of people queuing in Tesco to have a go at Wii Sports. The Nintendo magic is watching your entire family playing a game together and everyone enjoying themselves. The Nintendo magic is a new Mario that yet again redefines gaming and a sequel that is even better. The Nintendo magic is a new beautiful art style for Zelda but on top of that a whole new way to play the game. The Nintendo magic is seeing Donkey Kong come back and be jaw dropping all over again. The Nintendo magic is winning awards for graphics on a less powerful console. The Nintendo magic is introducing a new controller that reshapes the entire industry.

 

Mario Kart Wii redefined gaming...?

 

What was gaming before then? Maybe I misunderstood what it was...

[Rummy]

To me, the Wii wasn't really a proper console, it was more of a well-designed toy.

 

Have you read an article similar to that effect? I swear I read something just like that not to long ago, but I can't remember anything but that nor find it and I'm feeling like I've gone a bit mad!