Beast Posted July 29, 2013 Posted July 29, 2013 I have a feeling I've posted something like this before but I thought I'd make a thread because of a discussion me and my friend were having last night. So me and my friend were on Skype just having a chat and a catch-up kind of thing when he asks if I believe in marriage and whether I think it's right to marry in a church even though you aren't religious. I said I didn't believe in it as such but maybe my mind may change on it one day if I meet the right girl. He asked me why and I told him because 1) I'm not religious and I feel that marriage is a religious ceremony and I wouldn't want to be a hypocrite and get married under the eyes of God. I know that you can have a registry office but I still see it as a religious ceremony. 2) I don't need a piece of paper to tell someone I love them and I don't believe in spending so much money on a wedding. Some people say it's about telling the one you love you love them in front of everybody. I can do that easily without the need of paper or anything. I like seeing other people get married and I'm always happy for them because they make a commitment and devote themselves to each other and shit. It's just me getting married because I feel like I'm compromising myself and my beliefs in a way just to get hitched. I know someone at the moment who has started to go to church just so he can get married in a church even though he has never believed in God. To me, that is hypocritical. If I ever were to get married, I'd get married in a registry office with close family and friends, people who mean a lot to me. To me, that would be the best way to get married. I don't get these huge extravagant weddings myself. I'd probably be focusing more on the reception afterwards and what food to have there! I don't mean to offend anybody who are getting married or who are married, I REALLY DON'T, but it's just something I feel alone in and I wondered if anybody kind of have the same thoughts on it...
MoogleViper Posted July 29, 2013 Posted July 29, 2013 But marriage existed for thousands of years before religion hijacked it. In early Britain, marriage was used to secure peace treaties and trade relations with neighbouring tribes. So marriage is much more of a tradition than it is a religious ceremony. I don't think there's anything wrong with being against marriage, but you can't just pass it off as a religious notion, ad completely dismiss the millennia of tradition, and the personal notions of professing your love and commitment to another. Yes you can do that in ways other than marriage, but that doesn't invalidate marriage. Plus there are financial benefits (and drawbacks, if it ends in divorce).
Emma Posted July 29, 2013 Posted July 29, 2013 Weddings are super awesome, I love them and can't wait for the next one in September. Strangely, all my friends from college who were anti marriage are now wed or engaged. A lot of people say that their wedding is the best most brilliant day of their lives. Why wouldn't you want to have an awesome day like that @Animal? I'm not fussed about atheists getting married in churches. What bothers me more is when they get their children christened. Uuuerrgh. What I do find strange is that you can't get married outdoors (without a fixed roof) in the UK
Cube Posted July 29, 2013 Posted July 29, 2013 I'm not religious at all, but I like the idea of getting married.
Beast Posted July 29, 2013 Author Posted July 29, 2013 As I said before, if I find the right girl, my mind would change. I wouldn't get married in a church and it would be an awesome day but I don't like the whole "We're getting married in a huge place and we're inviting everybody, including people we've only spoken to once in our lives!" (I'm slightly exaggerating but you get the picture). As I said, I'd get married but I'd have it with close friends and family who mean a lot to me. I guess there are benefits to getting married but as I said, I don't get why I'd promise my life to someone in front of people when I would do anyway...My mind'll probably change when I met that special girl, I guess!
Ashley Posted July 29, 2013 Posted July 29, 2013 If I get married I basically want it to be like Liz Lemons'; teeth bling, Princess Leia outfits and Alec Baldwin reading from The Fountainhead (in an ironic hipster way, obviously because that shit cray). Although I get the feeling I'd mostly get married for the sake of pleasing the family, give them a reason to get dolled up
Oxigen_Waste Posted July 29, 2013 Posted July 29, 2013 Marriage is a subconscious implant dating back to hunter-gatherer nomad cultures. Personally, I think it's meaningless, but I would get married if that made her happier.
Fierce_LiNk Posted July 29, 2013 Posted July 29, 2013 I have a feeling I've posted something like this before but I thought I'd make a thread because of a discussion me and my friend were having last night. Here you go. http://www.n-europe.com/forum/showthread.php?t=37192 Thread thief. :p
Jonnas Posted July 30, 2013 Posted July 30, 2013 Marriage is really just the word for "I want to spend my life with this person". Nothing wrong with that, so as long as you're committed to the idea. You can get married by civil (not sure how you say this in English), so there's no need to drag the church into this.
Hamishmash Posted July 30, 2013 Posted July 30, 2013 I'm in that weird space where I completely 100% get that marriage is a rather archaic and disturbing institution and that as a gay person I shouldn't conform to the heteronormative lifestyle just to be a "good little gay" and like every argument against marriage I completely agree with... But then I also wanna wear a nice suit and kiss my boyfriend in front of my family and have a party and nice food... (Also if you're not religious, it's actually VERY HARD to get married in a Church... the vicar or whatever has to meet with you and more often then not if you've never actually BEEN to Church they'll reject you).
bob Posted July 30, 2013 Posted July 30, 2013 Since the last marriage thread i have gained a fiance, and so i know a little bit more about my feelings towards all of this. Luckily, i found that my fiance has similar feelings towards marriage that i do, namely, we just want a massive party with all our friends and family there. Also we want the tax benefits etc. We have absolutely no interest in getting married in a church, or any of the religious crappery surrounding it. Therefore we are planning on doing exactly what we want, and not dealing with all the pointless marriage traditions that are just outdated and silly. Our plan is to hire out a huge mantion/chateau in France for the week (which is more or less cheaper than hiring a venue for the day in the UK), and have a massive party there with all our friends. Since we can't legally get married in France, we'll just put together some sort of humanist ceremony and then sign the right documents later. We're having a very informal thingy, which means no expensive dress/photographer (sorry Goafer)/flowers/caterers. This means our alcohol budget is greatly increased (wahey!), and the planning will be really easy. It won't be for a while yet, but i'm really looking forward to it.
Murr Posted July 30, 2013 Posted July 30, 2013 (edited) Since the last marriage thread i have gained a fiance, and so i know a little bit more about my feelings towards all of this. Luckily, i found that my fiance has similar feelings towards marriage that i do, namely, we just want a massive party with all our friends and family there. Also we want the tax benefits etc. We have absolutely no interest in getting married in a church, or any of the religious crappery surrounding it. Therefore we are planning on doing exactly what we want, and not dealing with all the pointless marriage traditions that are just outdated and silly. Our plan is to hire out a huge mantion/chateau in France for the week (which is more or less cheaper than hiring a venue for the day in the UK), and have a massive party there with all our friends. Since we can't legally get married in France, we'll just put together some sort of humanist ceremony and then sign the right documents later. We're having a very informal thingy, which means no expensive dress/photographer (sorry Goafer)/flowers/caterers. This means our alcohol budget is greatly increased (wahey!), and the planning will be really easy. It won't be for a while yet, but i'm really looking forward to it. I'm almost in the same boat as you in that, we plan on having a massive party / reception after the ceremony, and in fact we've got a little something surprised for all the guests that attend the day ceremony. Won't be revealing anything. There will be pictures. But yeah that's basically to party with friends and families and have a cracking night together. We're getting married at a converted barn, sounds bad, but actually looks incredible. Guess this is where the difference is in that we've got an expensive photographer as priority in that we'd assume we'd only have this day once in our lives, so want good photos of it. Her dress alone is close to £1400, best man gifts, bridesmaids gifts, presents for the mums etc we're doing the whole shabang. our favours for our guests during the day... well we're donating £2 to cancer research for each guest, cancer research have a special wedding favours thing so we'll have a thank you for each guest and a badge / pin Example pic below... (blue for men, pink for women) Estimates without the honeymoon... looking at around £13k so far. but there was no way we wanted a religious do. Neither of us are religious, so it'd be pointless. We've attended 2 religious weddings together, and despite it being a happy occasion for the couple getting married, I don't like singing hyms at weddings and hear someone garble about how god has blessed this couple to find each other yada yada yada... and wouldn't want my guests to sit through all that either. The only singing i'd expect people to do is when they're pissed out their heads at the reception along to some bon jovi or guns and roses. Edited July 30, 2013 by Murr
Shorty Posted July 30, 2013 Posted July 30, 2013 I'm engaged, but our wedding won't be religious, so probably not in a church. To be honest, the engagement for us was about as important as the wedding. Only the idea matters, the commitment, the day itself is less important, and certainly not interested in denting our savings on a big day which could be spent travelling or on a deposit for a house etc.. So because of that, the wedding is a long ways off.
Rummy Posted July 30, 2013 Posted July 30, 2013 Here you go. http://www.n-europe.com/forum/showthread.php?t=37192 Thread thief. :p Was waiting for that :p I forget what I said there but I'll post here anyway. I'm not particularly religious, but I'd probably get married some day. Whatever the other half wanted, and most likely a hindu ceremony too(like super shortish tho). It's not particularly the religious aspect, but just a tradition of it. If that make sense. Really it's the massive party, tradition, and celebration around the marriage, I think. I think I see marriage more as the union of two people, heavily associated with religion but not necessitated by it. Like Moogle I view marriage as a much more longstanding tradition from a sense without religion.
Guy Posted July 30, 2013 Posted July 30, 2013 Marriage is a nice commitment, but I don't think it's a necessary one.
Charlie Posted July 30, 2013 Posted July 30, 2013 which means no expensive dress/photographer (sorry Goafer)/flowers/caterers. If there's one thing you want to spend some money on it's a photographer. These are photos you will have for the rest of your life. Flowers, food and drink are for one night (and day after, in the case of alcohol) but photos are for ever. I'd also recommeding a good DJ who can provide lighting for the event as well as high quality speakers. A good DJ can really help make your night
bob Posted July 30, 2013 Posted July 30, 2013 If there's one thing you want to spend some money on it's a photographer. These are photos you will have for the rest of your life. Flowers, food and drink are for one night (and day after, in the case of alcohol) but photos are for ever. I'd also recommeding a good DJ who can provide lighting for the event as well as high quality speakers. A good DJ can really help make your night Well we're not fussed about the quality of the photos, so the current plan is to invite everyone to bring cameras and then set up a public Flickr account to upload them all to afterwards. Or possibly hand out SD cards or something... DJ wise, we were just going to hire some good quality speakers and plug an ipod in. With some careful thought towards the playlist, i'm sure it'll be fine! We'd much rather save the extra money for a honeymoon too!
Diageo Posted July 31, 2013 Posted July 31, 2013 I'm not sure about the exact tax benefits but if they're appealing enough then you might as well get married. It's an excuse for a party too, whatever size you want it to be. I just look at marriage practically and have no real "wish" to get married.
Charlie Posted July 31, 2013 Posted July 31, 2013 DJ wise, we were just going to hire some good quality speakers and plug an ipod in. With some careful thought towards the playlist, i'm sure it'll be fine! Oh God no...
Emma Posted July 31, 2013 Posted July 31, 2013 DJ wise, we were just going to hire some good quality speakers and plug an ipod in. With some careful thought towards the playlist, i'm sure it'll be fine! Dan's brother did this at his wedding and it was the best music I've ever heard at a wedding, people were on the dance floor the whole evening. He did put in a lot of hours deciding the playlist though. I'd be careful with inviting people to take photos of the wedding, you'll end up with everyone watching the wedding through their phone, camera or iPads.
bob Posted July 31, 2013 Posted July 31, 2013 Yeah, we'll have to tell people to take photos, but in a subtle way. Anywho, i've diverted the thread a bit. Back on track: Marriage as a big ol' party - good. Marriage as a massive waste of money full of pointless tradition and religious nonsense - bad. Those are my feelings.
arab_freak Posted August 1, 2013 Posted August 1, 2013 I'm gonna be the odd one out and say marriage ceremonies are a complete waste of time and money. I don't like making a spectacle out of my union with my wife, and it doesn't help that around these parts marriage ceremonies are done to appease the parents rather than a celebratory congratulations for the couple. I've always found weddings to be boring, awkward, and incredibly superficial considering it's only going to last for a single day. With the amount of money people throw away at these things I'd much rather invest in an ridiculously long, luxurious, and unforgettable honeymoon. Something like a trip around the world or some romantic trek that my wife and I could bond over. I can understand why people might be against marriage itself, but I don't think it necessarily means that the whole thing is wrong. As homo sapiens we might not be biologically built for monogamous relationships, but it doesn't mean that trying to do so will result in disaster. I also think that the government is always going to have to have a role in the matter because marriage documents are what settle things like inheritance, hospital visits, medical decisions in case one partner is in a coma or something, custody rights, etc. I don't like the idea of having the government define what marriage is, but you can't escape the fact that until we live in an anarchist utopia we'll always have a need for the government to step in and enforce the rights and privileges that come with getting hitched. I also don't understand why an atheist would find marriage in a church or whatnot to be something beneath them. Who, besides yourself, would possibly care if you were taking part in a religious ceremony? Shouldn't everyone attending, regardless of their views, feel happy for you first and foremost? If your partner is a theist and wants to have a religious ceremony, why not put your ego aside and let them be happy with it? You might as well boycott printed money if you don't like the "In God We Trust" bit that's written on each note.
bob Posted August 1, 2013 Posted August 1, 2013 I'm gonna be the odd one out and say marriage ceremonies are a complete waste of time and money. Dude, a lot of the people in here agree with you...i certainly do, you're not the odd one out. You might as well boycott printed money if you don't like the "In God We Trust" bit that's written on each note. Actually, the £20 note in my pocket has 'The division of labour in pin manufacturing' written on it.
arab_freak Posted August 1, 2013 Posted August 1, 2013 Dude, a lot of the people in here agree with you...i certainly do, you're not the odd one out. No no that's the thing... Everyone here is talking about having some sort of party, which I've sort of inferred from your last post in particular. I don't want ANY of it. Not even a small gathering of close friends and relatives. Actually, the £20 note in my pocket has 'The division of labour in pin manufacturing' written on it. I guess I was presumptuous. The motto is written in the US Dollar and the Kuwaiti Dinar (which I am more familiar with).
bob Posted August 1, 2013 Posted August 1, 2013 No no that's the thing... Everyone here is talking about having some sort of party, which I've sort of inferred from your last post in particular. I don't want ANY of it. Not even a small gathering of close friends and relatives. I guess I was presumptuous. The motto is written in the US Dollar and the Kuwaiti Dinar (which I am more familiar with). Aaah, i see what you mean. You used the word 'ceremonies', which i took to mean just the religious/traditional bit, vows etc. In the UK, we tend to separate the 'ceremony' with the 'reception', which is the afterparty. The party bit doesn't have to be a big spectacle if you don't want it to be, nor does it have to be expensive. I do think that having your friends and family there is important though...
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