dwarf Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 dwarf gourami likes that awkward moment when your parents claim videogames are purely violent entertainment and you stumble to convince them otherwise by showing you don't have to kill the entire Russian population in Call of Duty
gaggle64 Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 Hotel Dusk for the DS? Yet to play it myself but it's squatting at the back of my head for ages now. I really should get on to it.
Sméagol Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 It's actually a bit depressing that thinking of a game sans-conflict is actually really, really difficult. Outside of other genres, like puzzle games, yeah, it's kind of hard.. It's because the drama and thriller genres are barely represented in videogame entertainment. With that said, maybe Silent Hill: Shattered Memories is a suggestion, but perhaps a bit of a stretch. Other than that, I'd look for point & clicks.
nekunando Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 I forgot to mention Another Code: Two Memories and Another Code: R in my original post..
Grazza Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 Professor Layton series? (I haven't played them myself.) On the issue of games without conflict being rare, I personally don't have a problem with combat, as long as it's not gratuitously violent. The best games need some sort of repetitive action, such as jumping on enemies, hitting them with a sword etc. I would like more colourful, non-gory games though - when I look at the RPGs on the HD consoles, they don't seem anything like Dragon Quest or Zelda (which I know isn't an RPG). Shame.
dwarf Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 Narratives are at their best when they involve conflict, every good play or film likely showcases some form of conflict. This crosses over to videogames well in terms of physical conflict as it makes for an easily understandable and fun gameplay mechanic. This just isn't the case for subtler things like speech etc, which explains the reliance on face-value violence and in-ya-face imagery.
gaggle64 Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 Narratives are at their best when they involve conflict, every good play or film likely showcases some form of conflict. This crosses over to videogames well in terms of physical conflict as it makes for an easily understandable and fun gameplay mechanic. This just isn't the case for subtler things like speech etc, which explains the reliance on face-value violence and in-ya-face imagery. But violence isn't the same as "conflict," they're two completely different things. When we talk about conflict we talk about rivals, struggles, competing interests, ideologues - contexts for any actions that may or may not be violent. Right now I feel we have too many video games that are just endless violence with no conflict that provides any actual narrative drama, no story, to really engage the player. That's not to say all games need narrative but I think the mainstream as a whole really needs to step up it's game.
Aimless Posted February 25, 2011 Posted February 25, 2011 Combat is one of the easiest things to code: you hit/shoot a guy, a number's subtracted, they die and the player moves on. It's obvious what you have to do (fight), why you have to do it (this person/creature only wants to fight) and there's a neat closing out of the loop (you defeat/kill said entity, thus ending the period of interaction). Human interaction is one of the hardest things to code. Not only does the NPC have to be receptive to untold different stimuli, they also need to offer varied, contextual responses. They also need to be ready to react to behaviour that very few would enact in real life but many do in a virtual world, such as jumping on to every possible surface, throwing objects at people, trying to attack everything, et cetera. Artificial death is far easier to craft than artificial life.
Dan_Dare Posted February 26, 2011 Posted February 26, 2011 True- i think the problem really comes down to a basic problem that even the best of the best facial animation etc is miles and miles behind the likes of physics and particle effects. Fireballs and debris come to gaming far easier than a nuanced smile. I'm hoping games like Heavy Rain and L.A Nior are representative of a trend towards something a little more balanced.
dwarf Posted February 26, 2011 Posted February 26, 2011 But violence isn't the same as "conflict," they're two completely different things. When we talk about conflict we talk about rivals, struggles, competing interests, ideologues - contexts for any actions that may or may not be violent. Right now I feel we have too many video games that are just endless violence with no conflict that provides any actual narrative drama, no story, to really engage the player. That's not to say all games need narrative but I think the mainstream as a whole really needs to step up it's game. That's what I was trying to point out... Sorry for poor clarity.
MadDog Posted February 26, 2011 Posted February 26, 2011 If put on peaceful difficulty... The only objectives really are the ones you set yourself.
Ville Posted February 26, 2011 Posted February 26, 2011 For some reason I absolutely hate it. I don't really know why, but I can't stand it! Well darn. Same thing with Harvest Moon? Puzzle league? Picross?
Mundi Posted February 26, 2011 Posted February 26, 2011 Not played it recently but have you checked out Simon The Sorcerer? A charming point and clock, dunno if I'm just influenced by nostalgic by it but I recommend it. Also: I Have No Mouth But I Must Scream, which you have probably heard of. If not, you really should. On a similar subject, The Chzo mythos Is very worth checking out if you're a point and click fan, plus it's free. They can range from "meh to "pretty damn good" in my opinion.
Jonnas Posted February 26, 2011 Posted February 26, 2011 For the record, Soul Bubbles is indeed level-based (which is the "substance" I was talking about). You don't need to blow into the DS, by the way (you only need to do it for 5 seconds at the very beginning, but that sequence has no bearing in the rest of the game) Also, I might as well say that the game is quite easy. I'm not too bothered by it (as I don't think that it is attempting to be challenging, or a mind-bending puzzle game), but I've heard complaints about it before, so I'm throwing it out there. @Dan Dare: I'm assuming you meant games without physical conflict. I don't think they're that hard to find, I mean, they're in the minority, but there have been plenty of good suggestions thus far. And the reason there haven't been more suggestions was because Oxi_Waste gave more restrictions (like avoiding level-based games). It is also the reason I didn't suggest Elite Beat Agents, as I don't think that's the sort of thing he's looking for. EDIT: Also, another one of his restrictions is that the game should be current gen, but if he's also looking at older games, I'm sure I can take a look for more suggestions.
Oxigen_Waste Posted February 27, 2011 Author Posted February 27, 2011 Hotel Dusk for the DS? Yet to play it myself but it's squatting at the back of my head for ages now. I really should get on to it. is (supposedly) much better. With that said, maybe Silent Hill: Shattered Memories is a suggestion, but perhaps a bit of a stretch. Other than that, I'd look for point & clicks. SM is awesome. But I've been there. I forgot to mention Another Code: Two Memories and Another Code: R in my original post.. Gah, lame. Hated the first one. Nothing at all too it. Just... lame. Professor Layton series? (I haven't played them myself.) Hmm, had forgotten about those! Well spotted! I'm hoping games like Heavy Rain and L.A Nior are representative of a trend towards something a little more balanced. I thought L.A. Noire was GTA in the 40's... no? If put on peaceful difficulty... The only objectives really are the ones you set yourself. Don't like it. Don't see the point to it, really. Waste of precious time, imo. Well darn. Same thing with Harvest Moon? Puzzle league? Picross? Nah, I used to love Harvest Moon. Maybe I'll try the new ones. Picross is awesome and so is Puzzle league, but not what I'm looking for. Not played it recently but have you checked out Simon The Sorcerer?A charming point and clock, dunno if I'm just influenced by nostalgic by it but I recommend it. Also: I Have No Mouth But I Must Scream, which you have probably heard of. If not, you really should. On a similar subject, The Chzo mythos Is very worth checking out if you're a point and click fan, plus it's free. They can range from "meh to "pretty damn good" in my opinion. I Have No Mouth, and I Must Scream... I never heard of it, but I like what I'm seeing... hmmm... For the record, Soul Bubbles is indeed level-based (which is the "substance" I was talking about). You don't need to blow into the DS, by the way (you only need to do it for 5 seconds at the very beginning, but that sequence has no bearing in the rest of the game)Also, I might as well say that the game is quite easy. I'm not too bothered by it (as I don't think that it is attempting to be challenging, or a mind-bending puzzle game), but I've heard complaints about it before, so I'm throwing it out there. @Dan Dare: I'm assuming you meant games without physical conflict. I don't think they're that hard to find, I mean, they're in the minority, but there have been plenty of good suggestions thus far. And the reason there haven't been more suggestions was because Oxi_Waste gave more restrictions (like avoiding level-based games). It is also the reason I didn't suggest Elite Beat Agents, as I don't think that's the sort of thing he's looking for. EDIT: Also, another one of his restrictions is that the game should be current gen, but if he's also looking at older games, I'm sure I can take a look for more suggestions. Not hard to find, no. And the only reason I'm limiting it to current gen is because I've played most older games of this "type". What I could really go for is some Grim Fandango 2!
Magnus Posted February 27, 2011 Posted February 27, 2011 What I could really go for is some Grim Fandango 2! Oh, God, no. Let's not soil the first game with a sequel. I vote for 999. It's awesome. Much more interesting that what I've played of Hotel Dusk. Plus you're clearly interested in playing it. Or, if by some miracle you haven't played them, the Telltale Monkey Island episodes were really good.
Oxigen_Waste Posted February 27, 2011 Author Posted February 27, 2011 Or, if by some miracle you haven't played them, the Telltale Monkey Island episodes were really good. Do you mean the new ones? Or the remade ones? I've played the originals, and most people tell me the new ones aren't worth the trouble, so I haven't played the new ones.
Magnus Posted February 27, 2011 Posted February 27, 2011 I meant Tales of Monkey Island, since you said you'd played Sam & Max. Though in retrospect, I guess you were probably talking about the original game. The Telltale Sam & Max games are pretty good, too (they get better as they go along).
Dan_Dare Posted February 27, 2011 Posted February 27, 2011 OW: L.A Nior is more like an old point and click than GTA. It's open world to a point but it's not all action- most of the game is investigative police work based on NPC interaction and interrogation etc. Hence the sphincter dilating quality of the facial animation etc, which is key to the gameplay.
jayseven Posted February 28, 2011 Posted February 28, 2011 (but there'll still be a fair bit o' shoot-out :P)
Retro_Link Posted February 28, 2011 Posted February 28, 2011 (edited) Okami, the combat is the type you'd expect from a zelda, it's an epic quest, full of humour, relaxation and boobs! Little Kings Story, full of character, awesome music, again a great quest that just keeps on growing and giving. Endless Ocean 1/2, whats further away from guns than a relaxing dive! Edited February 28, 2011 by Retro_Link
Oxigen_Waste Posted February 28, 2011 Author Posted February 28, 2011 Done Okami. Awesome indeed! Had completely forgotten Endless Ocean!!!! Is 1 useless since 2's out?
Retro_Link Posted February 28, 2011 Posted February 28, 2011 I think other than ebay, you might find it hard to find the first Endless Ocean. Endless Ocean 2 I believe does improve on a lot of things. Most noticably, many more areas to dive in rather than just one large area.
Oxigen_Waste Posted February 28, 2011 Author Posted February 28, 2011 I think other than ebay, you might find it hard to find the first Endless Ocean. Endless Ocean 2 I believe does improve on a lot of things. Most noticably, many more areas to dive in rather than just one large area. The question here is, since I'm not into collecting things, is it worth it to get the first one? 'coz I know where to buy it, if so!
flameboy Posted February 28, 2011 Posted February 28, 2011 The question here is, since I'm not into collecting things, is it worth it to get the first one? 'coz I know where to buy it, if so! It is very much explore an area stroke a fish and then thats it return to your boat having stroked all the fish and "cleared" that area.
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