Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi (December 2017)

[Mr-Paul]

I've got double-bill tickets for tomorrow night at the O2 Cineworld, then a ticket to see it again at 9:30am at the Science Museum IMAX (15/70mm). Slightly worried about the lack of sleep between, but looking forward to it!

[bob]

Well, I have many thoughts about this. Can't wait for more people to see it so I can discuss them.

Someone ban this man until Sunday please.

[Ashley]

13 minutes ago, bob said:

2 hours ago, will said:

Well, I have many thoughts about this. Can't wait for more people to see it so I can discuss them.

Someone ban this man until Sunday please.

[Julius]

I’m back for all of five seconds to just say that flicking through a couple of completely spoiler-free reviews has pumped me up for this film even more (I didn’t know that was possible)!

And with that, I am returning to my self-imposed exile...

[Julius]

Alright...let’s open the floodgates and talk about this. I’m not even sure where to begin, there’s just that much to talk about. I’m assuming we’ll be using spoiler tags for up until Monday, at least? Or are we just telling others to steer clear of this thread until they’ve seen the film?

@Mr-Paul @will' @dazzybee @Charlie

Edited December 14, 2017 by Julius Caesar

[Cube]

It's kind of sad...after 37 years, Empire Strikes Back is no longer the best Star Wars film.

[Julius]

5 minutes ago, Cube said:

It's kind of sad...after 37 years, Empire Strikes Back is no longer the best Star Wars film.

That’s extremely bold...and I’m loving it.

What do you think makes it better than TESB, @Cube? 

 

[Cube]

12 minutes ago, Julius Caesar said:

That’s extremely bold...and I’m loving it.

What do you think makes it better than TESB, @Cube? 

 

Spoiler

It played with expectations. I didn't know where it was heading. Great character moments, good shocking moments and lots of stunning shots.

 

[Julius]

12 minutes ago, Cube said:

  Vague Spoilers (Reveal hidden contents)

It played with expectations. I didn't know where it was heading. Great character moments, good shocking moments and lots of stunning shots.

 

Spoiler

I’m surprised that I managed to grab a gist of what Rian was going to do with the film from educated guesses (Kylo and Snoke; multiple angles on why Ben destroyed the Jedi; etc.) and was still surprised, not just by other parts of the film, but by those parts in particular. 

As for stunning shots: The Supremacy being destroyed was a particular highlight to me, and you could certainly tell that Rian had been influenced by Japanese culture (that particular shot was straight out of any anime to ever exist) in many ways.

Despite having seen the film...I have no idea how I feel about it. I’m genuinely considering watching the film back-to-back later today to get a better grip on it.

[Charlie]

5 hours ago, Cube said:

It's kind of sad...after 37 years, Empire Strikes Back is no longer the best Star Wars film.

I know, 36 years later Rogue One took the mantel!

Spoiler

I really enjoyed The Last Jedi but I didn't think it was anything special. A solid 7/10. I thought the overall plot of the Rebels trying to get away from the First Order was good but the first 20 minutes were too similar to Empire Strikes Back. I'm not sure why they can't think up new storylines for these new films? THe throwback to ESB at the end with the AT-ATs approaching over the salt, definitely not snow, was quite cool but just goes to show nothing has changed.

Rey's parts were interesting in terms of story but I would've liked to see more Jedi training in there. How is she all of a sudden a seemingly Jedi master when we know she's had no training whatsoever? 

Finn's section on the Monte Carlo esque planet was quite cool and I enjoyed the twist of the thief betraying them and the entire rebel army.

 

[dazzybee]

Rogue one is most definitely not the best Star Wars Film. In fact I reckon the prequels are better 🤣

as for Last Jedi. I’m disappointed in all honesty. I expected greatness. I need to watch it again though, it’s a bit mental so need to soak it all in. 

Spoiler

A lot of the comedy didn’t work for me and made me cringe more the anything, and although the film wasn’t surprising, they weren’t necessarily good surprises  smoke getting killed, cool moment, but loses the biggest threat and he never really did anything. There’s not one proper light sabre fight in it. Luke going the way he did was unfulfilling  Luke not having a bad ass Jedi moment... well he did, and it was amazing, but it was sort of ruined by the fact it wasnt him, which again was cool, but disappointing next to seeing Luke take on loads of the new atats and stuff as an all powerful Jedi master which is what I expected  and wanted  .

reyd parent revelation  which they built up  the final ending scene. The awful awful CG horse things  

i don’t know  I was disappointed. And the more I think about it the worse it gets... need to watch it and hope all the surprising decisions are actually really great  

also  ultimately. Nothing happens - we don’t see Rey train, snoke and don’t really do anything except chase a ship, no amazing Jedi skills, Finn does a mission which results in nothing, the resistance again don’t do much. It all just felt very inconsequential, with no amazing Star Wars moments, and very very silly, far too often tipping into stupid  

argh!!! Please let a second viewing let me “get it”

 

[Charlie]

13 minutes ago, dazzybee said:

Rogue one is most definitely not the best Star Wars Film. In fact I reckon the prequels are better 🤣

R1 was just a fantastic standalone film, a great plot and good characters. The fact it tied into Episode IV just made it even better. If it wasn't Star Wars it would still be a fantastic film and to be honest with you that says a lot for the franchise. If the prequel trilogy wasn't Star Wars they wouldn't have bothered making the second.

[Hero-of-Time]

Just got back from seeing it with my mates and we all thought it was average at best. I won't say I'm disappointed with it because I didn't have high hopes for it in the first place. 

@dazzybee I agree with most of what you said.

Edited December 14, 2017 by Hero-of-Time

[Julius]

I’m completely on the fence: having seen the movie, I now have no idea as to what make of it. My second viewing couldn’t come soon enough.

A couple of my nitpicks thus far:

Spoiler

• too much comedy. It felt like 2 in 3 of the jokes landed, but if subtle humour is supposed to humanise characters, I’m not sure what this was supposed to do. I think that this particular aspect of the film will not age all too well.

• the CG was janky as hell at times. I seriously think Hollywood films have ruined me when I say this, but the emphasis on Snoke in this film (who I think looked superb) meant that the budget was very clearly steered towards him as opposed to the rest of the film, in an even worse way than when the focus on Tarkin in RO left a couple of shots looking a bit odd. In particular, shots such as the wide shot on Ahch-To of Rey meditating and the Resistance coming out behind levitating boulders looked downright awful to me. Speaking of the Resistance...

• Rebels or Resistance? Look, I know that many will argue that they’re the same, but that’s not my issue here: the first half of the film refers to them as the Resistance, whereas, in the latter half, that title is thrown away and they’re the Rebellion once again. Uh...okay?

• Phasma was thrown by the wayside...again. What purpose did she actually serve in the film? Why couldn’t Hux, or some other random FO member, serve the same purpose? How was her supposed death here any different to if she had died on Starkiller Base?

• why must the Jedi end? I get it, and they’ve hinted at it absolutely everywhere since Disney’s takeover, but I still do not understand why the Jedi Order needs to go away, from Luke’s perspective: cool, other people can use the Force and it’s not exclusive to the Jedi. So what? The Jedi Order existed for 25,000 years in tandem with other beings using the Force, so what’s so revolutionary about this idea that the Jedi must come to an end?

• why didn’t the First Order just send a legion ahead to land in the hangar of The Raddus, or adversely send loads of TIEs to perform bombing runs, or even just get a ship that wasn’t the Supremacy to move ahead and crash into it/take it out?

 

Edited December 14, 2017 by Julius Caesar

[Ronnie]

Rogue One was not good, mostly because of the terrible, terrible characters.

This is a must watch for why R1 is poor

 

[Julius]

Just now, Ronnie said:

Rogue One was not good, mostly because of the terrible, terrible characters.

This is a must watch for why R1 is poor

 

I think that the original ideas for the characters and their arcs are fine, if I’m honest: the changes made to the film late on clearly changed the paths these characters would take.

My biggest issues with RO are pacing (the first fifteen minutes especially, and let’s not forget the atrocious iMovie title card, nor the location cards) and a dependence on fan service, which kills much of the enjoyment of the first two acts that I had when I went to watch it in the cinema. Running into characters like Cornelius Evazan and Ponda Baba on Jedha, hearing about the Whills, or even the final scene with Vader wrecking shop and a CG recreation of Carrie’s face feels inconsequential, and honestly a little bit stale, if one wishes to watch the film again, in my opinion.

Back to The Last Jedi, though, I’m getting ready to go out and watch it again. Are you planning on seeing/have you seen TLJ, @Ronnie?

[Londragon]

I love Force Awakens and had big hopes for this, but left disliking it.  I hope a subsequent viewing will change my mind, but I'm in no mood to see until the DVD release now.

Spoiler

The pacing of the movie was all over the place.  The opening was too long, and at times there was some incredibly hammy/bad acting that made me cringe.  Princess Leia's Super Woman flying scene was even more cringe worthy, and made me hold my head in disbelief at what the hell I was watching.  There was some real bad dialogue throughout the entire movie, whilst having Yoda pop up was nice but overlong, the way he was utilized just reminded me of an episode of The Clone Wars, then they repeat it with Luke, sending his Force across half the galaxy???  Real weird decisions.  The entire section with Finn and Rose was completely out of place and superfluous, the jokes were cringe worthy, with badly acted slap-stick. 

The CGI on the Casino planet, was dreadful, especially the drunken patron and those horse things.  There were too many big-star cameos, who just looked like they were about to turn to the camera and say, "Hey, I'm in a Star Wars Movie, cool huh".  Plus, what the hell was Maz in this movie for??  The superfluous CG creatures throughout reminded me of Return of the Jedi in a bad way.  And what was that with Snoke's CG, his movement was so jarring, yeah he died, but I knew absolutely nothing about him, where did he come from, etc?, so his death is meaningless, apart from putting Kylo Ren in charge,  It would have been far more interesting for Rey and Ben to join a 1/2 Sith 1/2 Jedi alliance, making the The Last Jedi moniker mean more.  No more Jedi, no more Sith, just freedom of choice, grey, not black and white, and then spoiled by the instances to have a child friendly bad guy/good guy duality that just doesn't exist in reality. 

The fight with the Imperial guards where the insistence to use 'cool looking' weaponry, just made me think I was watching a Transformers movie, I sighed so much.

Rey felt sidelined throughout without anything of importance to do, pretty much all the characters in this had nothing important to do.

The insistence for no important characters to die.  Finn should have been killed off at that point, so should have Leia, and maybe even Poe, would have made their struggle more tangible and desperate, but no, is this the Disney touch?  The whole thing felt like a run of the mill Clone Wars episode.

Luke's death lacked so much impact by the physical lack of his presence, that it soured an already sour experience.

So disappointed.  I didn't feel this down on Star Wars after even watching the Prequels.  And the more I think about it, I just see it for the jarring, childish, Disneyified mess of a plot it is.

 

[Ronnie]

Seeing it this afternoon at 5. Only seen the first teaser trailer and nothing else, which I'm really chuffed about. Very excited. 

I loved Force Awakens, regardless of the blatant retreading of ANH. Not perfect obviously but fun and the characters, Rey, Finn, Poe and Kylo Ren were great I thought. 

Hated the Rogue One location cards. Hated how we went to about seven different places in the first ten minutes. Hated the characters, Jyn's dad apart. His video message to her during the Death Star attack was the best scene in the film. Oh and the ROTJ style space battle was excellent. Much, much better than Abrams' manic pew pew version in TFA. 

Edit: I am however getting very nervous about all the negative impressions in here. Especially by those who liked TFA

 

Edited December 14, 2017 by Ronnie

[Mr-Paul]

Well I really liked it. I think I probably enjoy The Force Awakens more, but I think this is just as good a film. It's just completely different. There are lots of little nitpicks you could probably highlight, but overall I thought it was great. 

Spoiler

The one thing I didn't really like was Leia floating in space. I wanted to know more about Snoke too, but who knows, that could come in Ep 9 maybe somehow?

I loved seeing Yoda again, but did think it would have been better had it been Obi-Wan talking to Luke. He was his true mentor who talked to him beyond death through the Original Trilogy, yet he's nowhere to be seen in the sequel trilogy. I understand it's harder to bring back Obi-Wan considering Alec Guinness is long gone, but there's always Ewan McGregor or Rogue One-esque Tarkin/Leia tech.

What I found quite striking is that going into Episode 9, we really don't know where they're going to go with it. Force Awakens had the Rey handing the lightsaber to Luke cliffhanger, you knew that the First Order would be pursuing the Resistance, that there would be some more about Rey/Kylo Ren and their origins. Other than knowing they're going to have to handle Leia's death somehow, that it will probably culminate in a Rey v Kylo showdown, and there was a hint towards a kid with force powers/rebuilding the rebellion, it could go anywhere.

 

[Happenstance]

I hated it. Worst one since Final Frontier.

[lostmario]

I loved it.

There was only one scene I didn't like. it involved Leia...

Those who have seen it, know which scene I'm talking about.

[Charlie]

15 minutes ago, lostmario said:

I loved it.

There was only one scene I didn't like. it involved Leia...

Those who have seen it, know which scene I'm talking about.

That scene is the single most ridiculous thing I've ever seen. I have no idea why it was included. Just a 'what the fuck' moment.

[Julius]

I was completely clueless about how I felt about the film after first seeing it, but boy did my second viewing of the film work wonders for my thoughts.

Still a long way off feeling like I can definitively give my final thoughts and verdict on the film, but it’s up there for me.

[somme]

I was pretty disappointed.

Spoiler

A few of the things that irked me:

- Leia flying through the vacuum of space and waking up a little while later virtually unscathed. I understand she's force sensitive but that was out of nowhere.

- Luke was pretty unbelievable in generally really. He turned the most reviled man in the galaxy back from the dark side, yet a few years later makes a conscious decision to murder a child, his nephew, in his sleep because there's a chance he'll turn one day. 

- Snoke was pretty pointless in the end.

- The revelation of Rey's parents was so underwhelming. Even if it turns out Kylo lied that'll feel like a copout. 

- Too much comedy. I'm all for comic relief but not the whole way through. Very little tension in what should've been an epic move. 

I have more but can't be bothered to write it all up. 

1

I loved Rogue One. That third act was Star Wars perfection. And I liked the characters, especially the droid. 

[Mandalore]

Got mixed feelings after watching it earlier. 

Spoiler

Very few locations. The whole Finn side quest seemed utterly pointless and had really awkward acting. Way too much cheap humour, although the person sitting next to me was laughing almost every scene so I guess it worked somewhat. The Yoda scene felt off somehow. The very last scene with the random little kid, wtf why was that in there? Felt too Disneyfied.

Spoiler

The surprises, like Snoke getting killed and Luke projecting himself across the galaxy. The fight with Snoke's guards was really cool, and the familiarity with Palpatine's throneroom from Episode 6 but totally different sequence of events.

Got so many questions about Episode 9, really looking forward to it.

Spoiler

How big is the resistance in the outer rim? Was that the entire First Order in the film? How well trained is Kylo Ren? He seems like an amateur, it'll be a strange end to the trilogy having such an incompetent bad guy. How much Jedi training did Rey get? Will we learn more about Snoke? He seemed extremely powerful and Luke knew of him. Luke mentioned Kylo only killing some of his apprentices and taking others. What happened to the rest? Were those the old Jedi texts I saw in the Millenium Falcon at the end? Will Luke appear as a Force ghost to both Ren and Rey? How will they deal with Leia, were some scenes from Ep 9 already filmed? Were Rey's parents really just randomers? The way both Rey + Ren and Luke + Leia were linked seemed very similar.

Definitely need to watch it a second time.

Edited December 14, 2017 by Mandalore