MoogleViper Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 Good of you to mention sex trafficking as it's one of the clearest ways to exemplify just how different things are. Sex trafficking is a problem im Europe. In Monrovia it's not a problem... because it's part of every day life. I'm not sure wether you don't understand just how wide that gap is or wether you're just procrastinating for the sake of it, to be honest. There's no black and white scale, but Hackney and Croydon are as tame as it gets. So us acknowledging the problem makes it less of a problem? That's good to know. I'm sure that will provide comfort to all the kidnapped girls who have never know anything other than being pumped full of drugs and being forced to spread their legs their whole life. The lucky bitches.
Oxigen_Waste Posted January 27, 2013 Author Posted January 27, 2013 I'm very confused now as to what this thread is about. Are you saying that you're feeling guilty because you don't feel guilty? This reminds me of all those Ludacris Inception memes. I never said I felt guilty. I made a thread about wether or not each of you felt guilty or not. I don't. But it bothers me that it's treated as though everything's just fine. By the way, it's Xzibit, not Ludacris.
Daft Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 Good of you to mention sex trafficking as it's one of the clearest ways to exemplify just how different things are. Sex trafficking is a problem im Europe. In Monrovia it's not a problem... because it's part of every day life. I'm not sure wether you don't understand just how wide that gap is or wether you're just procrastinating for the sake of it, to be honest. There's no black and white scale, but Hackney and Croydon are as tame as it gets. I'm not sure that you understand that I don't care how widespread or naturalised an issue is. No victim should be marginalised, especially by an utterly outmoded term like 'Third World'.
Fierce_LiNk Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 I never said I felt guilty. I made a thread about wether or not each of you felt guilty or not. I don't. But it bothers me that it's treated as though everything's just fine. By the way, it's Xzibit, not Ludacris. Ah, I'm showing my age now! About your post responding to Daft about problems in London: A problem is a problem. Whether it's sex trafficing in London or slavery in other parts of the world, neither are right. We shouldn't really knock some of those problems because others have it worse elsewhere.
nightwolf Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 Do I feel guilty, no. Why should I feel guilty for the life that I have? Do I feel sad about the anyone who isn't as privileged as myself? Of course I do. That is all I'm putting forward. Sorry folks.
EEVILMURRAY Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 That's ~31,000,000 children a year. An African population of over 1 billion can easily support that. But not all of the population can be considered "third world". And in those third world areas I don't think they could fire out 31,000,000 kids a year.
Oxigen_Waste Posted January 27, 2013 Author Posted January 27, 2013 So us acknowledging the problem makes it less of a problem? That's good to know. I'm sure that will provide comfort to all the kidnapped girls who have never know anything other than being pumped full of drugs and being forced to spread their legs their whole life. The lucky bitches. Not at all. Doesn't mean we can't dissect the problem. =) I'm not sure that you understand that I don't care how widespread or naturalised an issue is. No victim should be marginalised, especially by an utterly outmoded term like 'Third World'. I completely misunderstood your point then. But yeah, you're absolute right.
EEVILMURRAY Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 So us acknowledging the problem makes it less of a problem? That's good to know. I'm sure that will provide comfort to all the kidnapped girls who have never know anything other than being pumped full of drugs and being forced to spread their legs their whole life. The lucky bitches. You mean Taken had an element of fact to it?
Cube Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 But not all of the population can be considered "third world". And in those third world areas I don't think they could fire out 31,000,000 kids a year. Oh, they can. A lot more than that, actually. That's a large part of the problem, and it certainly doesn't help that a lot of them refuse to use contraception.
Serebii Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 I hate to be the one to bring this, but I think our aid has actually made it worse in the countries. While we have helped them with disease and so forth, we've drastically increased their population while their supplies and capability to get supplies have not.
MoogleViper Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 Oh, they can. A lot more than that, actually. That's a large part of the problem, and it certainly doesn't help that a lot of them refuse to use contraception. Don't you just love religion?
Jonnas Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 I hate to be the one to bring this, but I think our aid has actually made it worse in the countries. While we have helped them with disease and so forth, we've drastically increased their population while their supplies and capability to get supplies have not. Not to mention they already count with the presence of foreign volunteers and organizations, and use their existence as an excuse to not tackle and solve those problems themselves. Going back to my previous analogy, it's like refusing to suture the wound because the painkiller is good enough to stop the pain. Don't you just love religion? Like that's the root of the problem. These are countries whose inhabitants think that AIDS is (and I quote) "a woman's disease". The lack of contraceptives and other similar problems are a direct result of a lacking education system in the first place.
Sheikah Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 Not that fussed. When I see the Oxfam adverts with all these sick dying children, I think two things:1] Why don't they just stop having sex and making these living corpses. 2] The advert says something along the lines of "A child dies every 5 seconds from starvation", if that's true and surely the birthrate cannot compensate for that - shouldn't the problem have solved itself? What I never understood was why they keep asking for more money to build village wells. Both me and even my mother remember donating to get a well for a village back when we were in our schools. I would have thought most villages that need one should surely have a well by now...
EEVILMURRAY Posted January 28, 2013 Posted January 28, 2013 Oh, they can. A lot more than that, actually. That's a large part of the problem, and it certainly doesn't help that a lot of them refuse to use contraception. Really?! I seriously cannot imagine that "few" starving families who walk 2,000 miles just for drinking water (move closer dumbfucks) having as many kids as those who die. But I didn't do any research before making those posts so I guess it's possible. What I never understood was why they keep asking for more money to build village wells. Both me and even my mother remember donating to get a well for a village back when we were in our schools. I would have thought most villages that need one should surely have a well by now... I thought that also, but I thought that just because they have a well they're not actually paying for the water (in a way that we would) so even though they may not being getting the same quality of filtered water we get through our taps, we're paying their fucking water bills. Another thing which I've noticed is that the Oxfam ads (I think it was them) made a big note that "they're not looking for handouts, they just want to work themselves out of poverty" and they've dropped that and played the starving kids approach to tug on the heartstrings. Giving money to a civilization so they can make a life of their own I can endorse. But giving money to families who can't stop fucking and firing out babies like they're fireworks in November and expecting food to magically appear is something I won't be losing sleep over anytime soon.
Cube Posted January 28, 2013 Posted January 28, 2013 I hate to be the one to bring this, but I think our aid has actually made it worse in the countries. While we have helped them with disease and so forth, we've drastically increased their population while their supplies and capability to get supplies have not. This is why the Prime Directive exists in Star Trek.
Oxigen_Waste Posted January 28, 2013 Author Posted January 28, 2013 Don't you just love religion? All these years later and they're still the world's #1 killer. Like that's the root of the problem. These are countries whose inhabitants think that AIDS is (and I quote) "a woman's disease". The lack of contraceptives and other similar problems are a direct result of a lacking education system in the first place. Actually, the church plays an absolutely pivotal role when it comes to the rejection of contraceptives in these cultures. They alone have the power to stop it and still refuse to. Yet again proving they are, truly, a tyrannical organization. I approve of all religions, but the catholic church (and not it's followers) is on the most destructive and negative forces there has ever been unleashed upon our world. They preach a message of peace, love and understanding and still manage to subvert and manipulate it into a hate mongering tour de force that sweeps across the whole nation with a strenght unparalleled by any other organization in history. They alone are responsible for the continuing outbreak and prosperity of AIDS in these god forsaken places... they are the de facto supreme social ruler. They have the power to stop it. They choose not to. I am an atheist, but I have alot of respect for those who are religious... and while the catholic faith's message is, for the most part, a thing of beauty, the organs who propagate it are not. It doesn't cease to be ironic, though... here you have the world's most hateful, segregational and bigoted organization preaching a message of love, understanding and togetherness.
Diageo Posted January 28, 2013 Posted January 28, 2013 I'm surprised no one has mentioned that one of the big reasons they have so many kids, is because the death rate is so high. They want to make sure they have the greatest chance that at least one of the children will survive so that they can take care of the parent. Having one kid and focusing resources on that one to prevent them from starving can sound like a good idea, but starvation isn't the only source of death. Also, malnutrition, lack of education and the constant threat of infectious diseases means they have a significantly less well-developed brain. It might be that they have problems with inhibition, which can manifest itself in high rates of sex, rape and violence.
EEVILMURRAY Posted January 28, 2013 Posted January 28, 2013 All these years later and they're still the world's #1 killer. Actually, the church plays an absolutely pivotal role when it comes to the rejection of contraceptives in these cultures. They alone have the power to stop it and still refuse to. Yet again proving they are, truly, a tyrannical organization. I approve of all religions, but the catholic church (and not it's followers) is on the most destructive and negative forces there has ever been unleashed upon our world. They preach a message of peace, love and understanding and still manage to subvert and manipulate it into a hate mongering tour de force that sweeps across the whole nation with a strenght unparalleled by any other organization in history. They alone are responsible for the continuing outbreak and prosperity of AIDS in these god forsaken places... they are the de facto supreme social ruler. They have the power to stop it. They choose not to. I am an atheist, but I have alot of respect for those who are religious... and while the catholic faith's message is, for the most part, a thing of beauty, the organs who propagate it are not. It doesn't cease to be ironic, though... here you have the world's most hateful, segregational and bigoted organization preaching a message of love, understanding and togetherness. Yes. And I'll be damned if someone is trying to make me feel guilty for not giving them £2 a month.
bob Posted January 28, 2013 Posted January 28, 2013 I used to live in Africa, and my dad still does, so whenever i go to visit him, I get reminded of the poverty and inequality that exists between the two halves of our world. Because of this, i do experience this 'guilt', although it doesn't keep me awake at night. It does though cause me to donate money to alieviate my guilt, something which i do fairly often, either through causes like Red Nose Day, or Kiva.org. I also give money to Water Aid once a month. I don't give money to Oxfam, as i think that they aren't particularly effective at helping poverty, as they have grown to have too many overheads, and aren't the most efficient way of tackling the problem. Schemes like Kiva seem a good way of helping, as you are (via a middle man) giving money directly to people in these countries, who then stimulate their own economy by running their businesses and paying the money back to you (which you can then give to someone else etc). I know all the cons of a system like this (it would be better without the middle man obviously) but this is better than nothing.
Dannyboy-the-Dane Posted January 29, 2013 Posted January 29, 2013 If I can do it, anyone can do it Provided they're lucky enough to be in the right place at the right time with the right resources and the right opportunities. --- I definitely feel guilty about it, though guilty probably isn't the most accurate description of the feeling. It's part of it, but I mostly feel furious and hopeless that we as a species can come so far, yet be so horrible.
Serebii Posted January 29, 2013 Posted January 29, 2013 Provided they're lucky enough to be in the right place at the right time with the right resources and the right opportunities. --- I definitely feel guilty about it, though guilty probably isn't the most accurate description of the feeling. It's part of it, but I mostly feel furious and hopeless that we as a species can come so far, yet be so horrible. It had nothing to do with luck
bob Posted January 29, 2013 Posted January 29, 2013 I think he means being born a white guy in the UK (presumably?) rather than in Sudan or India. That's luck.
Diageo Posted January 29, 2013 Posted January 29, 2013 It had nothing to do with luck You're kidding right?
Cube Posted January 29, 2013 Posted January 29, 2013 I think he means being born a white guy in the UK (presumably?) rather than in Sudan or India. That's luck. For a lot of us, it's because we come from a long line of people from an era that caused the industrial revolution, as well as other events much further back. Heritage, not luck.
Zechs Merquise Posted January 29, 2013 Posted January 29, 2013 I hate to be the one to bring this, but I think our aid has actually made it worse in the countries. While we have helped them with disease and so forth, we've drastically increased their population while their supplies and capability to get supplies have not. You are correct. African families have 10 children because only two or three survive, the population is stable. But white liberals feel sad because children are dying. White liberals ensure medical help reaches these people - so now 8 out of 10 survive. The population booms, then the local environment cannot cope with the number of people, water is short, food supplies dwindle, the environment is damaged. Now you have a huge population that is starving and the land cannot cope. So now the white liberals must feed these people - hence the population continues to grow. What has essentially happened is the more we go against the laws of nature and play with the delicate balance the more we move toward chaos and suffering. Not everyone can prosper, not everyone can live and be happy. The law of nature is that the strong survive and the weak don't. The pursuit of ensuring that everyone lives as long as possible is only doing one thing - destroying the planet and ultimately ensuring the deaths of countless species of animals and plants and our entire ecosystem! This will eventually lead to the end of us all.
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