Star Wars Episode 7: The Force Awakens

[Jonnas]

Next Kingdom Hearts game should be awesome

 

Did they put Spiderman or the Avengers in recent Kingdom Hearts? If not, well, sorry to burst your bubble :p

[flameboy]

Clone Wars film?

 

You mean the first three episodes of the TV series?

 

No this movie;

 

[Cube]

No this movie;

 

 

That's the first three episodes of the TV series.

[Zechs Merquise]

How anyone who enjoyed episodes 4-6 can claim that episode 1 is anything other than garbage is beyond me!

 

Episode 1 was riddled with plot holes, had the worst most soulless and forgettable characters imaginable and there's literally no tension throughout the whole film. It is never made clear why the bad guys are doing what they're doing, the Jedi are far too powerful basically defeating entire armies of droids on their own meaning there's never a credible threat - and whenever one does seem to appear the Jedi develop a 'new power' which deal with it.

 

The whole film is built around a blockade of a planet so lush and bountiful I can well imagine they could have been 'blockaded' for eternity and no one would have ran out of anything. The whole point of a blockade is to prevent something getting to those being blockaded. It works because those being blockaded have few supplies and are being starved out. It doesn't work when those being blockaded have an entire lush planet to live off!

 

What's more, many of the most endearing parts of the original films are literally shit upon - remember this:

 

"The Force is what gives a Jedi his power. It's an energy field created by all living things. It surrounds us and penetrates us. It binds the galaxy together."

 

This one line is a defining part of the whole Star Wars cannon and yet Lucas totally destroys this in Episode 1 when he 'invents' Midi-chlorians. This utter crap is typical of everything about the prequel films. They basically throw out everything that made the original trilogy magical and shit on their memory!

 

Then there were entire sections of the film which were completely unnecessary and nonsensical. An underwater city? A boat ride through 'the planet core'? These bits of the film were clearly sandwiched in for what? Oh yeah, I forgot, it's a long toy commercial.

 

Finally the ending - the child accidentally saves everyone and wraps it all up nicely with a bow! WTF? He accidently gets in a fighter, accidently takes flight, accidently finds the control ship and basically replicates the death star run by accident. Pretty lucky that there was a child sized helmet and goggles in that fighter!

 

Whilst all that is happening there's a light sabre duel - which means nothing. For all its flashy choreography it's meaningless an soulless. Who cares why they are fighting? Yeah, Darth Maul looks cool, he has a double ended sabre. But he has done nothing throughout the film to make anyone care. He's just a cool looking bad guy, but has no story or emotional weight to him. It's just soulless special effects. The light sabre duels in the original trilogy weren't about great choreography, they were about people fighting them. The fight between Vader and Luke on Cloud City was nowhere near as eye-popping as the fights in Episode 1 - but it will be remembered for a lot longer, because of the emotional meaning. These crazy sabre duels are more about fan wank material than adding anything of substance to the film.

 

George Lucas had far more involvement in the prequel films than he did the original trilogy. Because the original trilogy was a guaranteed hit Lucas was kept on a leash and other people had a hand in shaping the films. In the prequel trilogy Lucas had complete control and no one dared to tell him what a mess the film was.

[Cube]

The whole film is built around a blockade of a planet so lush and bountiful I can well imagine they could have been 'blockaded' for eternity and no one would have ran out of anything. The whole point of a blockade is to prevent something getting to those being blockaded. It works because those being blockaded have few supplies and are being starved out. It doesn't work when those being blockaded have an entire lush planet to live off!

 

Actually, that whole thing is a lot cleverer than people give it credit for. The blockade was to give an "official" reason for the Trade Federation into being there, which then allowed them to be coerced into invading. The invasion is the important part, and the fact that it was a planet like Naboo was also important.

 

As you said, it makes absolutely no sense for the Trade Federation to do what they did. This was equally true in the eyes of the current administration - which is why they wanted to check it out before making a decision. Which, given the circumstances, was probably the right thing to do. However, in the eyes of people who don't necessary see the "bigger picture", something like this is a pretty big reason to support "the little guy" (Naboo) and call for a vote for a new government.

 

The fact that it was Naboo getting invaded also gained a shitton of sympathy votes for Naboo's senator.

 

Basically: it was a carefully calculated plan that got Palpatine the position of chancellor.

[Dog-amoto]

[Retro_Link]

Bit of news...

 

@ IGNUK

Star Wars VII will be an "original story" not an expanded universe adaptation.

 

 

... I'd say this'll be aimed at a Christmas 2015 release, as Avengers 2 will be their big Summer blockbuster, so they'll give themselves 3 years for this.

Edited November 1, 2012 by Retro_Link

[Zechs Merquise]

Actually, that whole thing is a lot cleverer than people give it credit for. The blockade was to give an "official" reason for the Trade Federation into being there, which then allowed them to be coerced into invading. The invasion is the important part, and the fact that it was a planet like Naboo was also important.

 

But why were the trade federation there? The film never explains. If they're a trade federation why would they be blockading something and stopping trade? What are they blockading? Nothing! What single crucial thing was prevented from reaching or leaving Naboo? Nothing!

 

Also, why are the Trade Federation listening to a shadowy guy in a robe? They have a massive army, dozens of huge ships and clearly wealth and power on a galactic scale. Yet they're doing the bidding of a guy in a robe who's identity they don't know. What do they have gain... no one knows.

 

As you said, it makes absolutely no sense for the Trade Federation to do what they did. This was equally true in the eyes of the current administration - which is why they wanted to check it out before making a decision. Which, given the circumstances, was probably the right thing to do. However, in the eyes of people who don't necessary see the "bigger picture", something like this is a pretty big reason to support "the little guy" (Naboo) and call for a vote for a new government.

 

So they send two Jedi. This kicks things off again in a way full of plot holes. Remember the super speed power they develop for one scene, but Obi Wan forgets when he tries to rush to save Qui Gon?

 

Then they go to the planet, to warn about the invading forces. Well that's a little odd, as since they're arriving with the invading force they're not really in a position to warn anyone. Surely, being killing machines that could easily cut through millions of pointless, boring cannon fodder droids they should have just gone to the command ship and deactivated the droid army?

 

The fact that it was Naboo getting invaded also gained a shitton of sympathy votes for Naboo's senator.

 

Basically: it was a carefully calculated plan that got Palpatine the position of chancellor.

 

It was actually a poorly orchestrated and half baked scheme that makes no sense and was full of holes.

 

Oh - and as everyone can sense how strong the force is in other force attuned individuals - then why not Palpatine? I suppose he was so powerful he blocked it.

 

The whole thing is an appalling mess which is badly explained and riddled with holes. After watching A New Hope I knew what had happened, felt a sense of tension, understood the peril the protagonists were in and felt a connection to the characters who were all strong and memorable individuals.

 

After watching Phantom Menace many things were left unanswered, the 'plot' was loosely strung together and we had a main protagonist and a main antagonist were killed off without any of us really witnessing anything that made the conflict between the two meaningful.

[EEVILMURRAY]

Quick theory: The Trade Federation were there because of Sideous fisting their arses into doing whatever he wanted, claiming it to be in the name of peace instead of the true Sith motive of ruling the Galaxy for no real reason. He'd get the droids to invade the planet and then have Darth Maul kill them all (which later Anakin did with the rest of the seperatists).

 

Sideous manufactured some of it nicely, by getting the blockade on Naboo he coerced Padmé into issuing the vote of no confidence of Valorum, placing himself as the Supreme Chancellor. Then by manipulating the seperatists he gave himself emergency powers and eventually created the Galactic Empire.

 

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Palpatine Gives a very detailed report about his shady happenings.

[Daft]

Actually, that whole thing is a lot cleverer than people give it credit for. The blockade was to...

 

[Retro_Link]

 

You say that Daft, but for someone who hates the franchise, you're spending more than your share of time in here! :p

 

[Daft]

I don't hate it, I feel it was poisoned by Eps I-III. I'm bitter about it. I'm actually sure Disney will do great things for it but the franchise has lost me. I've also grown up and expanded my horizons, there are way better stories and universes out there.People bang on about constant sequels and nothing original, well, here are another three. Not to say that they should be enjoyed any less. I hope they are excellent. But I'm still bitter about sitting through three movies of crap.

 

And that 'Who cares' was my reaction to the scrolling blurb at the beginning of Episode I, not what Cube was trying to say.

 

(I'd have written all that in the response but...it wouldn't have been as amusing.)

Edited November 1, 2012 by Daft

[Fierce_LiNk]

I'm not ashamed to say that I moaned like a bitch when I heard that there were going to be more "episodes". Star Wars is the perfect example of a franchise that has been milked and where every last bit of mystery that was within it has been "explained" or taken away.

 

Darth Vader was an excellent character in the originals. The prequels do nothing but butcher his character. They take away all the mystery and charm that existed in 4,5 and 6, which is something you just cannot get back once it's happened on screen.

 

Also, some of the script-work and acting in the prequel trilogy is dreadful. Again, there was charm in the original trilogy, with characters like Han and Lando having some memorable lines. I just cringe when watching the prequels, particularly episode 2 which is just so forgettable on so many levels.

 

I wouldn't mind if Disney came along and started from scratch and made a new set of Star Wars films. But, Episode 7...please God, no. The series is tainted enough now as it is, it doesn't need to be destroyed any more.

[Mokong]

The thought of that makes me puke. It's like putting Nintendo's characters into Elf Bowling.

 

 

 

August/September next year I think.

 

Why the huge gap since teh 3D release of Ep1 though? I thought they planned to have all 6 out in 3D a few month apart Ah well.

 

Did they put Spiderman or the Avengers in recent Kingdom Hearts? If not, well, sorry to burst your bubble :p

 

Good point... but you never know what might happen with the next one :P

[Zechs Merquise]

I'm not ashamed to say that I moaned like a bitch when I heard that there were going to be more "episodes". Star Wars is the perfect example of a franchise that has been milked and where every last bit of mystery that was within it has been "explained" or taken away.

 

Darth Vader was an excellent character in the originals. The prequels do nothing but butcher his character. They take away all the mystery and charm that existed in 4,5 and 6, which is something you just cannot get back once it's happened on screen.

 

Also, some of the script-work and acting in the prequel trilogy is dreadful. Again, there was charm in the original trilogy, with characters like Han and Lando having some memorable lines. I just cringe when watching the prequels, particularly episode 2 which is just so forgettable on so many levels.

 

I wouldn't mind if Disney came along and started from scratch and made a new set of Star Wars films. But, Episode 7...please God, no. The series is tainted enough now as it is, it doesn't need to be destroyed any more.

 

Too right!

 

The worst thing about Episode 2 is when Yoda gets out his tiny light sabre and you start to ask yourself - did anyone producing that film actually pay any attention what-so-ever to The Empire Strikes Back?

[Cube]

Why the huge gap since teh 3D release of Ep1 though? I thought they planned to have all 6 out in 3D a few month apart Ah well.

 

Episode 1 was just a test to see if there was any demand for it.

[Retro_Link]

The worst thing about Episode 2 is when Yoda gets out his tiny light sabre and you start to ask yourself - did anyone producing that film actually pay any attention what-so-ever to The Empire Strikes Back?

Why, what was wrong with that?

[Zechs Merquise]

Why, what was wrong with that?

 

In The Empire Strikes Back when Luke goes to Dagobah to train he believes that Yoda (the great Jedi master) will be a stereotypical warrior. At first he completely over looks Yoda believing him to be just a simple and annoying local.

 

Through this test Yoda shows Luke the most important thing, that his strength doesn't come from his physical prowess with the light sabre but from spiritual development and his mastery of the force.

 

Yoda is a wise and great Jedi not because he's some light sabre wielding action star, but because he mastered the force through thoughtful mediation.

 

 

The whole point that Yoda teaches Luke is that it's not about the physical, it's about spiritualism and self belief.

[Retro_Link]

I'd say Yoda shows all that (that it doesn't come from physical prowess) through being able to achieve what he does through his massive physical disadvantage! He has the self belief within himself to overcome the greatest situations.

 

---

 

I think it's a bit much to think the fans know more about the franchise than the creator himself.

This is and has always been his vision for the saga. Finally years later with advanced techniology he was able to achieve it to the potential he wanted.

[Zechs Merquise]

I think it's a bit much to think the fans know more about the franchise than the creator himself.

This is and has always been his vision for the saga. Finally years later with advanced techniology he was able to achieve it to the potential he wanted.

 

That's the problem though. Lucas was not solely responsible for the original trilogy. In fact he was under heavy scrutiny from others and that's clearly why the original films were so magnificent.

 

When Lucas came to make the prequels he was the big cheese and no dared to challenge him. It was all his way and it showed. When one guy makes all the decisions and everyone around him lets him have his way often things spiral out of control.

 

And the fans clearly do know more about the franchise. Because in the prequels Lucas completely changes central threads of the mythos without giving it a second thought or explaining it!

 

The greatest case in point is the force, look how Yoda describes it above. It's something deep and spiritual and something that anyone can understand and has a certain magic and wonder to it. Episode 1 changes all of this - it's microorganisms living in cells - WTF???

 

Another small point that illustrates this is when Luke is on the Falcon and Obi Wan comes up with a make shift way of training him using a helmet with a blast shield down and the laser ball.

 

In the prequels this is then changed to be standard Jedi training technique with all the Jedi Kids doing it with mini-light sabres. Utter crap.

 

There are countless poor bits in the prequels which are totally at odds with the original trilogy!

[Mr-Paul]

For what it's worth, it's not the midichlorians that give Jedi/Sith the force. They are just micro-organisms that gather around those with lots of force energy. Hence being a way to detect those strong in the ways of the force, the stronger the force, the more midichlorians there would be. Doesn't totally affect the force being a deep, spiritual, magical thing, in my opinion.

[lostmario]

I get the feeling George Lucas severely raped Zechs's childhood.

 

Let go of your hate. Look forward to this new trilogy you will.

[MoogleViper]

[Zechs Merquise]

I get the feeling George Lucas severely raped Zechs's childhood.

 

Let go of your hate. Look forward to this new trilogy you will.

 

He raped Star Wars and Indiana Jones, you may have heard?

 

[flameboy]

That's the first three episodes of the TV series.

 

Well if that's the case that's fucking bullshit...why cobble together three episodes of a tv show release it and market it as a movie when it in fact isn't?! Just about sums up everything that's become wrong with Star Wars.