Raining_again Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 Was he hated all his life, though? For years before his change, he didn't seem to be someone that was hated. He posted about his regular days and stuff and they never seemed out of the ordinary. Except that he had some of disability so he couldn't work? That's all I remember. He definitely never posted about constantly being hated. If I'm wrong about that, then I apologise. However, as Raining said, the problems came from his change. Not from his change in appearance. But his change in attitude. There were maybe a small handful who resented his appearance, but they were outweighed by those who just thought "ok, you do what you want to do, that's ok." His change in attitude was far, far more of a problem than the change in his appearance. Ironically, to me, his new persona seemed more of a front than the one he claimed he created for most of his life. It didn't seem real. That's my own opinion. I'm sure he was troubled. But, I think you'd be giving him far too much of an easy ride if you said that it was the sole reason of why he acted the way he did. I don't think he was quite the victim you think he is. Just to make it clear, I like(d) the guy. But, I did not like his aggressiveness. I think he loved causing trouble and being the centre of attention. Which, is not something I associated with him beforehand. I often suspected he used that as an excuse. Hell, I've been tormented most of my life, and hated for something I've got no control over, and that's precisely why I'd never do that to anyone. It's no excuse. If he's got mental issues he needs help not random people to treat like crap to make him feel better. I've got every respect for transgenders/lesbians/gays/whatever.. I actually really had a lotta respect for rok until just before he got banned.
Ashley Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 Yeah but the problem wasn't that he was a transexual (and yes, transphobia is a societal problem but its almost moot in this particular case as this started years ago), it was that he turned into a genuinely vulgar person. I can only begin to imagine how difficult his life must have been but this was someone who judged and verbally assaulted others for who they were, or who he believed/decided they were. This was the person that happily boasted about the fact he kept some games that were accidentally delivered to his house "because they probably were meant for those fucking chavs down the street so they deserve it." (I've never understood selective liberalism, but another argument for another time). And let's not forget several years ago I infractioned him (or warned...I don't think infractions existed then) for being incredibly homophobic in the Doctor Who thread. I mean really, it was appalling what he was saying. Maybe it was a repression thing, I don't know his mindframe back then (or ever obviously) but to say the things he did, and then several years later claim anyone who takes a dislike to his personality (a self-serving, martyr playing, violent and profusely profane individual) was transphobic not only demeans himself, but other transgendered individuals because it could lead to beliefs that "they're all like that". Hopefully it doesn't, but the connection could happen. At the end of the day I'd like to believe people here didn't begin to dislike him because of his transexuality (afterall, there was a period in which he was the same old Rokhed essentially, just a newly discovered version) but because he became this horrible individual and we knew he could be better. He was never Mary Poppins, his 'roughness' was part of his charm in a way, but he became something very nasty. All being said, I hope he is happier in his life now.
MoogleViper Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 It just staggers me that no one will admit that transphobia is a problem. Fair enough if you have your reserves about the concept of trans, and are skeptical about the whole affair, but to flat out deny that everyone you know being disgusted by the very idea of your identity wouldn't have any affect on your mental stability is just flawed. What has it got to do with trans phobia? People get abused for all sorts of reasons. Is it right? No. Is it fair? No. But then the world isn't fair, so you'll just have to get over it and move on.
chairdriver Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 What has it got to do with trans phobia? People get abused for all sorts of reasons. Is it right? No. Is it fair? No. But then the world isn't fair, so you'll just have to get over it and move on. People had the same attitudes about slaves / black people. Thankfully eventually some people decided not to just get over it, and actually do something to change people's opinions. I'm not defending Rokhed, since he was a genuinely vile person - it was more that he was mentioned, and his fucked-upness is a textbook example of what repression and being on the receiving end of hate can do to a person. I know the thought of a man deciding he is actually a woman offends you, and you'd prefer not to think about it, and that trans people just wore the right clothes and got on with their lives like everyone else. [Maybe you don't feel that, and I hope you don't. But pretend I'm addressing someone else. The rhetoric still works] The idea of black people having equal rights offended people 250 years ago. They preferred not to think about slaves, and they preferred slaves just got on with picking cotton and didn't cause a fuss. This comparison may be interpreted as equating the evilness of slavery with however evil transphobia is - that is not my intention. I'm merely pointing out that people's opinions change. Slowly, but surely; if people are pro-active in their campaigns. If a problem is never challenged, it will never be solved.
Slaggis Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 It just staggers me that no one will admit that transphobia is a problem. Your lies are annoying me. "No one"? That's crap. A couple of people may have disagreed with you, but just because of said disagreement, that doesn't mean suddenly no one is aware that it's a problem. Also, having problems (however big or small) in your life is no reason to act like the idiot he did before eventually getting banned. Yes, he obviously felt as though he was hated and whatnot. But he seemed to assume every angry comment aimed at him was because of what he seemed to base every post he made about, and not the simple fact that he was constantly rude, annoying and generally a bit of a knob.
chairdriver Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 Why do you think he acted like he did then? / I hate the idea of discussing Rokhed, so can we change the subject / veer it towards trans issues in general?
EEVILMURRAY Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 Maybe he got bored banging Stormtroopers' heads together and fancied a new direction in life? The aesthetic change alone was staggering.
Slaggis Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 Why do you think he acted like he did then? You confuse me. You really think that's the sole reason he acted like the rude man he so obviously was? Some people are just idiots, he's blatantly one of those people. He seemed to revel in getting a rise out of people on the forum, and once someone disagreed with him the reaction was "YOU HATE ME BECAUSE OF WHAT I AM". He used it as an excuse to be rude constantly. How about just trying to be a nice person, rather than blaming your rudeness on the problems you're experiencing/have experienced in life? -- Anyway. Not looking forward to today. 3 hours in an I.T suite discussing research methods. Kill me now.
Fierce_LiNk Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 / I hate the idea of discussing Rokhed, so can we change the subject / veer it towards trans issues in general? But the subject was Rokhed, and not about trans issues. I think the only one pushing the idea that it was down to his appearance is you. I'm not saying that it wasn't a factor, but I don't honestly think it was the biggest factor in why he acted the way he did. Also, if you wanted to talk about trans-issues, then surely the stuff in the sexuality thread would already be doing that?
Goafer Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 (edited) / I hate the idea of discussing Rokhed, so can we change the subject / veer it towards trans issues in general? Didn't that already happen (or is still happening) in the sexuality thread? One topic is enough surely? Edited January 26, 2010 by Goafer
Paj! Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 I don't even understand what these discussions are. As far as I can see it's established that; 1) Rok probably had a tough life/time, if even only mentally, being what he is, growing up, but never exposing it or whatever. This most likely made him a bitter/angry individual, leading to his peculiar turn into a horrible poster before he got banned. 2) Everyone understands that, and no one is saying it's an excuse for his behaviour. ...? I don't get what the discussion is about/where it's leading. --- Anyway. Went to a friends house for a Burns night gathering/dinner. I hate haggis, so the dinner for me was mashed potato and wee willie winkies (YES *orgasms*). General chat etc. Fun times in general. Came home, intended do another page/drawing in sketchbook, but instead I just painted it black and will do a chalk drawing tomorrow morning before college.
MoogleViper Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 If you're gonna use that as an excuse for his actions then you could probably find an excuse for every dickhead in the world if you wanted to. Or you could stop making excuses for people and starting blaming them for their own actions instead of blaming everyone else. I fucking hate this culture of excusing people's actions. Some people are just pricks.
chairdriver Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 Never once did anyone excuse him on this thread. I'm just trying to get people thinking about transphobia. (Didn't see Flink and jayseven's posts earlier, so my argument seems a bit strange re-reading it, but still I meant what I said)
Fierce_LiNk Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 (edited) I'm just trying to get people thinking about transphobia. This really isn't a transphobic place, though. It's not like every post for example is "oh my god, you're gay/black/a traaaaannnnny." I think generally it's quite an accepting place. And yeah, most people here would agree that there are some people out there (in the wooorld) who have trouble accepting others for who they are or their beliefs. Edited January 26, 2010 by Fierce_LiNk
MoogleViper Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 Never once did anyone excuse him on this thread. I'm just trying to get people thinking about transphobia. (Didn't see Flink and jayseven's posts earlier, so my argument seems a bit strange re-reading it, but still I meant what I said) Well it did seem that way. Yeah, we all hated him because he was a douche. He was a douche because there was obviously deep internal strife. I'm saying that being on the receiving end of hate his whole life is partly the reason for him being so fucked up. It just staggers me that no one will admit that transphobia is a problem.
Ashley Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 I'm just trying to get people thinking about transphobia. Well then keep it in the thread you've already geared towards it. All in all, GET OWF OF MAH STOOP! *shakes fist* (God one (non sexual) night with Jayseven and I'm turning into him) Plus as a bystander it did come across like you were saying "Its fine for him to act that way, he will have been victimised because he was transexual, you all just don't understand/want to understand!" Which I know was not your intention. I often missay things in similar ways. Lets share the looooove
Paj! Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 That's why I didn't get what this was all about, no one was excusing him...chair just decided to talk about Rok (though realistically we all, or should be understanding of the fact, he probably had a hard time/life) as part of his awakening to the seeming lack of acceptance of transgender people in the world. a traaaaannnnny I lol'd. I just imagined you shouting it really dramatically.
MoogleViper Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 (God one (non sexual) night with Jayseven and I'm turning into him) So the sexual nights didn't affect you at all?
jayseven Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 Move this to sexuality thread NOW. Any replies, just quote what you're referring to in the ST. Let's keep this all happy and emo-day-core, ok? I CBA doing the hard work and moving the relevant posts now, so just be warned; I will just delete rokhed/transexy posts from now on, even if they have some HWYD-related material. Go use the thread and let people get on with the voyeurism in here. EDIT: lol - time it takes me to post that and Ashley beat me to it IN A ME WAY!
Ashley Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 So the sexual nights didn't affect you at all? Oh they did. And in six years time I hope someone will be defending my descent into evilness because of those nights and the deep, deep psychological scarring they caused.
jayseven Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 I will have you know it was only once, and besides blood is a food group.
Eenuh Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 I lol'd. I just imagined you shouting it really dramatically. He does that with a lot of things. I think he wants to be a film character sometimes. =P My day was crappp. Afternoon teacher didn't show up, found out I failed on a presentation, so hooray! Also my back is still killing me. I want a new one, I don't like this one anymore.
jayseven Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 (edited) My Tuesday So far; This is the first house I've LIVED where I can rightfully claim to own stairs. I've only just realised this. I've also started growing attached. My old flat, while it had the zeppelin love of Shorty and Nami (xbox and washing-up spring to mind), does mostly remind me of a very depressed part of my life. My room there was a hovel, a sty, a pit of despair, and I spent most of my time in it, wallowing in various suffixes of self. Tomorrow I (re-re-)start uni; a second semester in a second-chance year. It feels like christmas, and Muse's cover is playing perpeptually in my mind. New day, new dawn, new life. I do feel good. I've started writing again. Short, crap poems but still proof that there is intelligence in my mind - something I gave up on a long time ago. Too obsessed with the physiology of friends, too worried about how my face is unable to convey what I am thinking. Hope's a rare thing, but oh so wonderful. The permanence of life is so etched into my eroding teeth that I often forget how much more time I have to make an impact - to become someone admired, respected, loved, cherished, needed... wanted. There is chance, and it's not a lottery of ambition, it's a possibility. I just need to... believe. It's easier when someone else believes it to, when everybody doesn't remember me for the failures but instead upholds the positives. I too often read into what everyone else is thinking before I make up my own mind and that does nothing but put me on edge. I need to be more selfish, but at the same time less cynical and more respecting of other people's complexities. I wish shoulder angels were more real. I wish people were more honest. I wish for too much. Edited January 26, 2010 by jayseven
nightwolf Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 Todays been mostly useless, got up too late and forgot to ring the doctors before they shut, so now I have to ring them tomorrow to get them to fix my stupid loud and now very hurtful coughing. Gah self-inflicted procrastination. Grr. Went to the pub, drank too much, ate a shed load of chinos and wandered home. Fun times. ^_^
The fish Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 Went to a friends house for a Burns night gathering/dinner, etc, etc... Oh, balls, I totally forgot it was Burns night yesterday, I'd even seen haggis cheap the day before - damn you maths revision, damn you! Actually, on a less Scottish note, the maths revision, whilst anti-Burns, made my exam go pretty well! I'm still annoyed someone, somewhere has fucked up and I'm not getting the extra time I deserve yet as I really could have done with it, but I think I did all right regardless. Oh, and shit, it's 4:39am. To me, Empire Total War is more addictive that crack cocaine, I tell you!
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