The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild Wii U / Switch

[Serebii]

 

Mine is that Skyward Sword was a turd sandwich as far as Zelda titles go. Who's screaming like a 12 year old? Every post, really? You're laughable but so not in a hilarious way.

Yes, you can say that. Your opinion is valid. However, to say that the game was rushed, had a short development cycle and so forth just because you didn't like it is not valid because it is factually inaccurate.

[Ronnie]

The ultimate irony that @Wii is talking about differing opinions given that to him Nintendo should be catering their entire business strategy to his wishes and his alone. "I didn't ask for it, why are they making it" springs to mind.

[Grazza]

I don't see a castle on the map or where it's likely to be. You'd imagine it would be central. Maybe there isn't one.

 

Do you remember the Game Explain video that was made to accompany the E3 footage? They enhanced the overworld image and, at the back of the map were blue spires that looked very, very much like those of Hyrule Castle. That doesn't mean it's definitely still in it (or ever was) but I'm hopeful.

 

I'd love a direct-view version of this and a new Game Explain video. They find hundreds of things I'd never notice.

 

I've watched the video a few times now and I'm as impressed as ever. All the technical things seem right, like dual-analogue camera control and sword-use whilst on horseback (and whilst running?) My one concern is that, if this game allows motion controls, that may once again limit the traditional controls. We still haven't had shield control/the Mirror Shield since Wind Waker, and I for one would like to see its return.

 

Other than that, I just love the whole ethos of the overworld. Mountains, altitude, forests with individual trees (!!!), not to mention being able to glide anywhere... It has everything in its favour. As for it being the Sailcloth instead of the Deku Leaf; considering the heights involved, you'd run out of magic if it was done via the Deku Leaf!

 

Of course, we can't be 100% sure it'll have a good story, dungeons or a magical feeling, but you never can. What we can be sure of is that it'll be well-built and its heart's in the right place.

 

So, did Agro in SotC do the same thing, but better animated, or was I confusing things? I remember he wasn't bothersome during fights that required him, so I guess there was something more going on in there, that I can't remember right now.

 

Agro was brilliant all round. I can't remember if he avoided trees (I didn't try and run into them ) but it really felt like he had a mind of his own. You never had full control over him, but that made it feel all the more like a real horse. Yes, you could nudge, guide and suggest, but he was his own beast.

 

So yeah, I can totally see where @Daft is coming from, and I think he was talking about the double standards of gamers rather than criticising Miyamoto and Aonuma. On the other hand, the fish A.I. thing was funnier - much funnier - as that COD game was being held up as one of the first pieces of next-gen software - something that would show us what the Xbox One could do. By comparison, this was simply two developers talking about improvements they'd made in a game that was never meant to set new technical standards. Also, it just looks brilliant, so that overrides any cynicism I'd have.

[EEVILMURRAY]

the dungeons were plentiful,

 

[Jonnas]

Agro was brilliant all round. I can't remember if he avoided trees (I didn't try and run into them ) but it really felt like he had a mind of his own. You never had full control over him, but that made it feel all the more like a real horse. Yes, you could nudge, guide and suggest, but he was his own beast.

 

I suppose that was it. Agro felt like a real horse, handled like a real horse, but he'd still just stop if you found an accidental obstacle. He'd just do it much more believably (starting to react shortly before, refusing to start running if the obstacle was too close, etc.).

 

This Epona reacts while running, but without stopping, which is new. Here's hoping she will be good enough to surpass Agro.

[Rummy]

Well. I was somewhat underwhelmed, I guess. Watched it this morning after seeing it mentioned a few times a few places, and it's kinda exactly what Daft said originally - just looks like a mostly uneventful horse ride. The whole horse-not-riding-into-trees is something I'd never 'think' of, but seems so basic and obvious now it's been done(apparently done elsewhere too though) but it makes sense and is reassuring it might help stop riding detract from the action of the game.

 

Fighting on horseback etc does bring TP to mind of course - along with the rest of the demo; it's bare. Huge world, big whoop, but TP had a massive world yet so little character, I really found it hard to forgive the game for that. I've always said however that TP is a great game, a really great game, but it just isn't all that great a Zelda imo. Lacked the charm and constant content I felt games like OoT and MM had, along with many other titles in the series - I'm really worried this might end up the same, but really hope it won't.

[Ronnie]

Well. I was somewhat underwhelmed, I guess. Watched it this morning after seeing it mentioned a few times a few places, and it's kinda exactly what Daft said originally - just looks like a mostly uneventful horse ride. The whole horse-not-riding-into-trees is something I'd never 'think' of, but seems so basic and obvious now it's been done(apparently done elsewhere too though) but it makes sense and is reassuring it might help stop riding detract from the action of the game.

 

Fighting on horseback etc does bring TP to mind of course - along with the rest of the demo; it's bare. Huge world, big whoop, but TP had a massive world yet so little character, I really found it hard to forgive the game for that. I've always said however that TP is a great game, a really great game, but it just isn't all that great a Zelda imo. Lacked the charm and constant content I felt games like OoT and MM had, along with many other titles in the series - I'm really worried this might end up the same, but really hope it won't.

 

Completely agree with this.

 

The gameplay they showed reminds me of a cross between the lifeless world of Twilight Princess and the even more soul-less one of Skyward Sword. Very early footage obviously but I haven't seen anything that's made me convinced it will be a return to form like Wind Waker/OOT/MM. "Massive open world where you can travel anywhere" would be way down my list of priorities for a console Zelda game.

[EEVILMURRAY]

This will all become redundant once Ocarina* ch00n shortcuts are available.

 

 

 

*instrument flavour of the day

[Mr_Master_X2]

The ultimate irony that @Wii is talking about differing opinions given that to him Nintendo should be catering their entire business strategy to his wishes and his alone. "I didn't ask for it, why are they making it" springs to mind.

 

It is an issue. Who are they making for? They're only partially made for fans. They're mostly made for new gamers (even though they make up the small percentage of sales, the majority being fans who've bought previous games). And yet every game they get easier...and easier. And every game they feel the need to clog up the first hour or so with pointless explanations that aren't needed by the majority and can easily worked out by those just starting. So many of them hand-hold the entire way though explaining nearly everything...most what needs no explanation. it's not just a problem for Zelda games. Mario & Luigi games takes it too far. Pokemon is so easy it's mentally painful. I happen to be one of those Pokemon gamers who's not a newbie starter or an obsessed elite who only plays for IVs/breeding/online battling. I'm just a guy who wants a long challenging game, pitting my mon against the best. Apparently they don't cater to those people; in their eyes you're either a newb and needs it sickeningly sweet easy or an elitist player who doesn't care about single player and is just all for online battling so single player doesn't matter. I know I'll get it from Serebii for saying that, but it rings so true and things never change. I can't be the only person who feels this way?

 

Completely agree with this.

 

The gameplay they showed reminds me of a cross between the lifeless world of Twilight Princess and the even more soul-less one of Skyward Sword. Very early footage obviously but I haven't seen anything that's made me convinced it will be a return to form like Wind Waker/OOT/MM. "Massive open world where you can travel anywhere" would be way down my list of priorities for a console Zelda game.

 

I was sort of underwhelmed. But mainly because of the lack of what they showed, which is understandable since all it was was a "barely a game" event.

 

The footage was clearly cut in places, though. Obviously so as not to let us see things (though people have been giving the video a once over and spotted quite a few things).

 

There's also seems to be lag or framerate issues and this may not even be the current build but an old build designed to show elements off. Nintendo likes to show specific things off, it's not out there that even if it was current build they deliberately removed elements by varying methods so as not to detract from what they were showing.

 

That map. Even zoomed out, that ridiculously huge area was still clearly only a fraction of the map. Even the traditional Zeldas have their emptyish field type parts. Maybe this part is just one of those areas, but y'know, blown up in effect because of the huge world.

 

Could it turn out to be empty and boring? Sure. I doubt it will though, and I hope these reasons above help people not to sink into negativity as this could be the best Zelda ever.

Edited December 8, 2014 by Mr_Master_X2
Automerged Doublepost

[Agent Gibbs]

you should check out neogaf, two members are going through the trailer with some crazy analysis levels, poitning out what looks like the great bridge over lake hylia, death mountain, goats, flower other missed scenery, a scale for the map - which is huge! that forest link flies over with the sail cloth, they overlay its size onto the three zoomed maps and by the full map its about a pixel

 

I'm more hyped by the analysis than anything else

[Jonnas]

It is an issue. Who are they making for? They're only partially made for fans. They're mostly made for new gamers (even though they make up the small percentage of sales, the majority being fans who've bought previous games). And yet every game they get easier...and easier. And every game they feel the need to clog up the first hour or so with pointless explanations that aren't needed by the majority and can easily worked out by those just starting. So many of them hand-hold the entire way though explaining nearly everything...most what needs no explanation. it's not just a problem for Zelda games. Mario & Luigi games takes it too far. Pokemon is so easy it's mentally painful. I happen to be one of those Pokemon gamers who's not a newbie starter or an obsessed elite who only plays for IVs/breeding/online battling. I'm just a guy who wants a long challenging game, pitting my mon against the best. Apparently they don't cater to those people; in their eyes you're either a newb and needs it sickeningly sweet easy or an elitist player who doesn't care about single player and is just all for online battling so single player doesn't matter. I know I'll get it from Serebii for saying that, but it rings so true and things never change. I can't be the only person who feels this way?

 

While I can understand the frustration, I think the worst tutorial (TP) is behind us. I don't think they'll have us waste 1 hour with wooden swords and useless slingshots again.

[Grazza]

Could it turn out to be empty and boring? Sure. I doubt it will though, and I hope these reasons above help people not to sink into negativity as this could be the best Zelda ever.

 

Yep, I think it's got a very good chance of being just that.

 

There comes a time when technology advances so much, you have to leave your old favourites behind (as yardsticks). We've had a long, long period where that didn't happen, but I think the time is coming.

[Ronnie]

Yep, I think it's got a very good chance of being just that.

 

There comes a time when technology advances so much, you have to leave your old favourites behind (as yardsticks). We've had a long, long period where that didn't happen, but I think the time is coming.

 

What old favourites do you mean we're leaving behind? I don't understand how people are calling this a potential best Zelda ever. All we know is the world is huge, that's no indicator of quality whatsoever, only scope.

[Blade]

What old favourites do you mean we're leaving behind? I don't understand how people are calling this a potential best Zelda ever. All we know is the world is huge, that's no indicator of quality whatsoever, only scope.

 

You're right a game world that is huge is no indicator of quality.

 

However, every 3D Zelda game has been quality. I see no evidence, bearing in mind how far this game is in development that it will be anything but quality.

[Kav]

I love these videos...

 

[Rummy]

You're right a game world that is huge is no indicator of quality.

 

However, every 3D Zelda game has been quality. I see no evidence, bearing in mind how far this game is in development that it will be anything but quality.

 

Out of interest, how would you personally rank the 3D zeldas, with reasoning?

[Ronnie]

I'm just glad the magic metre seems to be back. About time!

[Sheikah]

Yep, I think it's got a very good chance of being just that.

 

There comes a time when technology advances so much, you have to leave your old favourites behind (as yardsticks). We've had a long, long period where that didn't happen, but I think the time is coming.

 

We'll see how it pans out, but I definitely I agree the scope of the land is a good thing.

 

I know you and I both agree with DQVIII being so utterly brilliant in the series, partly because of the sense of scale.

[nekunando]

Out of interest, how would you personally rank the 3D zeldas, with reasoning?

 

I'm just about to head out so I don't have time for reasoning, even if the question wasn't directed at me

 

1. Ocarina of Time

2. Wind Waker

3. Skyward Sword

4. Twilight Princess

5. Majora's Mask*

 

*I've never completed it, as you know, so that could move up the list when I eventually get my hands on the 3DS version #reasoning

[peterl0]

Based on the first playthrough:

1. Majora's Mask (High because of the character story arc involvement and the Zora/Goron masks)

2. Ocarina of Time (High because first 3D Zelda with many groundbreaking innovations)

3. Skyward Sword (Good: Motion controls/stamina meter, Bad: Unconnected level like world, desolate sky, the fat boss)

4. Windwaker (Good: Musical combat/prehistory/graphical style, Bad: Empty sea/Triforce quest/Photo quest)

5. Twilight Princess (Good: Spinner/Ice Dungeon/Temple, Bad: Dull world, boring post game content - poes)

 

If we are including the HD remake, probably want to switch SS and Wind Waker.

 

SO in this Zelda I want:

1) Stamina meter (or more precisely running) from SS

2) Not too fussed about motion controls because the horse back fighting and slowmo seems cool.

3) Character involvement/side stories from MM.

4) OOT is the template, so no worries there.

5) Combat/History from Windwaker

6) Pro controller support because now my arms of too weedy for the gamepad with larger battery.

7) From Twilight Princess the promise of the original trailer?

[Sheikah]

Based on the first playthrough:

1. Majora's Mask (High because of the character story arc involvement and the Zora/Goron masks)

2. Ocarina of Time (High because first 3D Zelda with many groundbreaking innovations)

3. Skyward Sword (Good: Motion controls/stamina meter, Bad: Unconnected level like world, desolate sky, the fat boss)

4. Windwaker (Good: Musical combat/prehistory/graphical style, Bad: Empty sea/Triforce quest/Photo quest)

5. Twilight Princess (Good: Spinner/Ice Dungeon/Temple, Bad: Dull world, boring post game content - poes)

Personally I would rearrange that so it would go

1

2

4

5

3

 

With 1 being a clear cut above the rest, despite 2 being immense also.

 

 

SO in this Zelda I want:

1) Stamina meter (or more precisely running) from SS

2) Not too fussed about motion controls because the horse back fighting and slowmo seems cool.

3) Character involvement/side stories from MM.

4) OOT is the template, so no worries there.

5) Combat/History from Windwaker

6) Pro controller support because now my arms of too weedy for the gamepad with larger battery.

7) From Twilight Princess the promise of the original trailer?

 

 

I think building on the characters and theme is crucial; MM had a very dark atmosphere and the characters actually made you want to save them. The time aspect (ie. they didn't just stand in one place forever) had a massive impact on making the characters seem real.

 

The 'goofy' sort of theme to WW probably suited its graphical style but ultimately it was hard to really care about the characters in that.

Edited December 9, 2014 by Sheikah

[Mr_Master_X2]

Personally not sure how to rank the Zeldas. Nostalgia has such a factor for me that it might outrank a game in the series I know to be technically and gameplay wise superior.

 

My first Zelda was Zelda 2. I really don't get the hate for it. It's great fun. The only reason I could see of for the hate for it would be "it's not like other Zelda games", which is a dumb reason, to be honest. Also the,"man, it's too hard". It's stupidly easy.

 

I've finished every Zelda EXCEPT Skyward Sword and Zelda 1. When I had the NES I just never got around to buying it (could NEVER find it in the shops...days before the internet, am I right?). The next time I had it was with the Collector's Edition that had 1/2, OOT & MM on it. Let's face it; the analogue didn't suite the play and the CUBE D-Pad is the worst D-pad in existence and is so uncomfortable and next to impossible to precisely use. Skyward Sword (which I DO own LE one) is just down to the fact that main consoles are set up for the main TV and it's usually always in use for something else, so as you can imagine a 50+ hour RPG is pretty awkward). I just sold my unused copy of Xenoblade because a 100+ hour RPG would take like 2+ months of everyday play to get through at the small amount of time the TV is available.

 

I recently (a few months back) got through the AGES games on e-shop and really enjoyed them. Only one playthrough of each game, but I have the codes on my 3DS notepad incase I want to 100% them. It was nice to play a traditional topdown Zelda game.

 

LBW was excellent. Beyond easy (even for 100%...except for that where you have to dodge chickens for 16 minutes...screw that!).

 

I...have to stop writing now. I can't put them in any order because I like them all for different reasons. Most of them have faults, but also greta things about them. Which is whyI know that even if U has many faults it'll have many great things about it which will still give me that "Zelda magic feeling" regardless.

[Ronnie]

I'm not gonna bother ranking the games as they're all special for one reason or another, but Wind Waker and Adventure of Link are two my favourite games. The former of all time. It will never happen of course but the thought of DLC for Zelda II with whole new areas to explore and dungeons to conquer fills me with joy.

[peterl0]

Nostalgia plays a part in the ordering but I don't think that it factors for Majora's Mask as it came out after the formative game (Ocarina of Time). Usually it is the first Zelda game (or first 3D variant that a person plays that they end up loving the most. If it wasn't that, it must be because the game does something pretty different.

[Grazza]

I love these videos...

 

 

That's the stuff! Absolutely brilliant!

 

You didn't see the castle in the centre because that was only a tiny fragment of the map. Yes, that huge zoomed out map was just a small portion of the map. And that small portion of THE SMALL PORTION of the map takes minutes to get across.

 

I think that's the whole world. The map zoomed out as far as it could go. It's ∞ bigger than Skyward Sword. I wonder if Monolith Soft are helping with this game, I bet they are.

 

Looks like Wii was 100% right about this (and the sailing). That is the whole map.

 

Hyrule Castle isn't visible because icons only appear when you've actually been to a place. I for one hope it's in there because I really want to see its latest build. :awesome:

 

I reckon Link will have a small sailboat that is good enough to reach local islands, but not sturdy enough for the high seas.

 

One of the things I'm most looking forward to is revisiting the Hyrule as depicted in Twilight Princess, except much bigger. I love the fact the bridge at Lake Hylia is in it (also, Eldin Bridge? I hope so.) Also can't wait to visit the Gorons and, as well as Hyrule Castle, I'm hoping for Zora's Domain (looks likely as there's a huge waterfall).

 

Another thought - does anyone think they've taken the "I'd like Link to just have a sword and bow" idea literally? Apart from when he's using them, the bow, sword and shield are always visible on his back. I must admit, there aren't too many weapons I'd miss, although bombs would be one of them as they are brilliant for finding secret passages.

 

Also, fire and ice arrows back?

 

We'll see how it pans out, but I definitely I agree the scope of the land is a good thing.

 

I know you and I both agree with DQVIII being so utterly brilliant in the series, partly because of the sense of scale.

 

Absolutely. Regardless of personal fondness for individual games, I'd say Ocarina of Time set the standard for overworlds, then Wind Waker (although very different). This seems to be the first time since Wind Waker that there's been an undisputed technical leap - it just couldn't have been done before. This gameplay footage is proof enough for me that they've addressed several issues in the series. Exploration in itself is one of the most important gameplay features, and here we have a guarantee there'll be plenty of it.