Rummy Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 It'd be one of the more sensible options to try to attempt to get a good chunk of the market again though - if they can test the waters of a decent OS/online infrastructure with NX and contemplate competing with the next gen PS5/XBTwon on the same sort of playing field - what wouldn't work? If they came absolutely on par for everything they'd be giving a tough run on the competition. /pipedreams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pestneb Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 (edited) I can't see this happening in a million years! I COULD see it happening. I think the NX is the successor for the 3ds, Nintendo just don't want to say it because they still want a second console. I think the companion to the NX will be a more home console style format, possibly working in tandem with the NX. If Nintendo have actually found a way of dividing processing intelligently between the handheld and home console side of things... I mean Nintendo have set a precedent for this in the past with their handhelds, no? having the old architecture present for backward compatibility, then during current gen mode that hardware is relegated to making the tea for the more current hardware... so to speak. in terms of battery though... A wii U uses 35kw, while a 3ds uses 4kw? SO that's the main issue.. will NX in portable mode use up the battery about 8 times faster (so about half an hour of gaming???) or will it drop power consumption somehow (half the power of the console somehow... to give us a whole hour? :s). Wii mini used 13 watts, compared to regular wii using 18. let's just call it a third... so assuming a Wii U mini would be using 24kw or there abouts... I'd guess at between half an hour to 2 hours battery life with low settings(and no screen). idk. I find it hard to believe their next console could be as powerful as the Wii U... if it was Wii levels then maybe they could have gotten power consumption to 8 watts? that would be more feasible in my mind.... (I imagine some people on here have a better idea of the hurdles and what is/n't feasible) But surely a Wii U handheld just isn't a possibility, unless Tesco had the price point about right.... Edited October 4, 2016 by Pestneb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronnie Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 I can't see this happening in a million years! Really? I think it's quite likely tbh, especially if NX doesn't do well. The only unlikely part, which you may have been referring to, is them competing with Scorpio/PS5 on power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hogge Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 I can't see this happening in a million years! How so? Nintendo seem to realise that third party support is important. The NX is launching 2017, I'd be expecting to see the next generation to launch in in late 2019. The NX would thus no longer receive the latest AAA games past that. Which isn't a problem if it's just a portable console that hooks up to your TV. But it'd be disastrous if it's supposed to be your only machine. One option is for Nintendo to eventually launch a more powerful dock. Not likely, considering that would probably cause confusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pestneb Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 How so?Nintendo seem to realise that third party support is important. The NX is launching 2017, I'd be expecting to see the next generation to launch in in late 2019. The NX would thus no longer receive the latest AAA games past that. Which isn't a problem if it's just a portable console that hooks up to your TV. But it'd be disastrous if it's supposed to be your only machine. One option is for Nintendo to eventually launch a more powerful dock. Not likely, considering that would probably cause confusion. how did motion plus work with the Wii? Just thinking, if they have a NX+ add on to boost the NX dock, and then sell new NX consoles only with the NX+ dock from then on.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kav Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 (edited) @Ronnie has got what I meant, specifically that their next home console won't be as powerful as the PS5 or next Xbox. Not just because of the cost of developing said console, but also because I think all the R&D, development and distribution costs of the NX warranting a full cycle and that they'd therefore not release a "stop-gap" console. It just isn't viable. Edited October 4, 2016 by Kav Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pestneb Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 (edited) @Ronnie has got what I meant, specifically that their next home console won't be as powerful as the PS5 or next Xbox. maybe not teraflop for teraflop, but the current gen generally go for 1080p resolution. I imagine they will target 4k UHD next gen (although perhaps much like last gen where effectively they were still 720p consoles, even if they were technically capable of 1080) If the next home console from Nintendo hits 1080p it would be able to run games that look just as impressive with significantly weaker hardware - on a 1080p screen that is. So it hinges on the resolution of the average screen in the early 2020's, I suspect 4K will only really be a real thing in the later 2020's personally, if at all (with issues of bandwidth needing to be addressed). Even now I would say the average tv screen resolution sits between 720 and 1080. Even if I am right Nintendo would need to significantly up their game to have games that look as good as the competition on 1080p tv screens - presumably the internal behind the scenes work would be the same on a 1080p screen as a 4k one, so the CPU and Ram in particular would need significant boosts. If they talk to 3rd parties and NX takes off, giving them the financing to pull it off, it is possible. an outside chance, but still a possibility, that on a 1080p screen a Nintendo home console game would look and play as well as the competition. Yeah ok.. very slim chance But if they can bridge the gap that would be awesome! **edit** seems I'm massively wrong on 4k (unsurprisingly ) Apparently in the US they expect about 1/3 sets to be UHD, which is significant and I suspect more so amongst gamers. about 1 in 7 tv's sold worldwide are UHD (from figures I have found) so.. probably by the end of next gen 4k will be fairly common and the move will be toward 8k. however :P resolution is the least important picture quality improvement we could be going for. That's still the case, and in test after test we still see evidence that the improvement from 1080p to 4K resolution is really difficult to appreciate. (https://www.cnet.com/news/4k-tvs-arent-stupid-anymore/) which kinda backs up the next Nintendo console could still give us beautiful looking games. Just simply dropping texture sizes for example would not cost companies much money.. it would drop the beauty of their game, but if the console is good, they can do that. Simplifying other things not so easy though and if the games don't sell anyway... Edited October 4, 2016 by Pestneb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hogge Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 @Ronnie has got what I meant, specifically that their next home console won't be as powerful as the PS5 or next Xbox. Not just because of the cost of developing said console, but also because I think all the R&D, development and distribution costs of the NX warranting a full cycle and that they'd therefore not release a "stop-gap" console. It just isn't viable. I don't mean that Nintendo would discontinue the console once the PS5 comes out. I mean that from that point on, it would solely be Nintendo's portable console, rather than their ONLY console. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheikah Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 So it hinges on the resolution of the average screen in the early 2020's, I suspect 4K will only really be a real thing in the later 2020's personally, if at all (with issues of bandwidth needing to be addressed). Nah, it won't be that long. TVs now are shifting at 4K for very reasonable prices. In 5 years a lot of people will have upgraded their TVs, as people tend to, and they'll probably be 4K on anything above 40". It's just like how now all HDTVs being sold are at least 1080p (pretty much) and not 720p. Newly sold 4K TVs will completely replace 1080p. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pestneb Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 Nah, it won't be that long. TVs now are shifting at 4K for very reasonable prices. In 5 years a lot of people will have upgraded their TVs, as people tend to, and they'll probably be 4K on anything above 40". It's just like how now all HDTVs being sold are at least 1080p (pretty much) and not 720p. Newly sold 4K TVs will completely replace 1080p. but in fairness if most of the market are at least 1080p, and a third of the market have 4k tv's, is it worth making everyone pay for a 4k images when a 1080p image can be enjoyed by all? Probably yes, but I'd prefer Nintendo do a bigger upgrade on the CPU to allow for more immersive worlds, with a more modest upgrade boost to the GPU to allow it to get the most out of a 1080p screen, then next gen have a strong 4k offering that can just about do 8k. I just don't see Nintendo being able to make the giant leap in one go (or having the will to). Of course the hardware is only a single piece of the puzzle which can be undone/fixed by several others so... But back to NX, I'm not going to be up to date on gaming news for a couple of weeks so... hopefully when I get back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent Gibbs Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 So since we are talking about TV's i guess no news? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pestneb Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 Well I guess it is a part of our future set ups that we can speculate on a bit more than the console itself,so in many ways it is more interesting than repeating pure NX speculation :P Although to bring it back to the NX (if it does indeed send a video signal to tv's at all) I expect it will support 1080p comfortably, possibly struggling with 4k for the occassional game. Speaking of setups as a whole, my current sound set up for my consoles is pathetic - simple stereo through tv speakers. Any recommendations for a surround system that would let me get the most out of the Wii U? (I won't be buying any however because...) What improvements (if any) do you expect (or hope) to see with the NX's audio capabilities? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazzybee Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 The guy who plays francis - boogie or something said he's chatted to two people about nx in a q and a he did at an event. One at ubisoft who said it's a dream to develop for and as an example, playing assassins creed at home, then taking the assassins creed mobile game with you.... does this imply not all games will work mobile and have an app instead? Hinting at a power boost on the home console unit?! Also said someone else played it for 20 minutes and said the gimmick is so good they wished they'd thought of it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nekunando Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 The guy who plays francis - boogie or something said he's chatted to two people about nx in a q and a he did at an event. One at ubisoft who said it's a dream to develop for and as an example, playing assassins creed at home, then taking the assassins creed mobile game with you.... does this imply not all games will work mobile and have an app instead? Hinting at a power boost on the home console unit?! That's pretty much what I was expecting, to be honest, and I imagine there will be people who are up in arms if they can't, for example, take something like Breath of the Wild with them on the go There will no doubt be a wide range of experiences across the home and handheld spectrum! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rummy Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 So since we are talking about TV's i guess no news? Yeah pretty much. I've taken a rather lax attitude to the thread going off-topic because of the epic lack of anything new to really discuss - though I note a few points have been thrown in such as sketches etc and if anyone feels actual genuine NX discussion is getting drowned just give a shout and we'll try to get it back on track! Such a broad topic a lot can be made relevant to it(such as discussion on TVs!) That's pretty much what I was expecting, to be honest, and I imagine there will be people who are up in arms if they can't, for example, take something like Breath of the Wild with them on the go There will no doubt be a wide range of experiences across the home and handheld spectrum! Yeah I thought this was pretty much one of the actual consistent things most people seem to be expecting of it. It's certainly a good idea - just need execution of the system as a whole to be done well, in addition to ensuring there are as few limitations as possible caused by the approach. Sounds re-assuring atm though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liger05 Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 RETROPALOOZA confirms NX to be a hybrid? "I've talked to two people who have used it. One is from Ubisoft and he said programming for it is actually really nice and Nintendo is working very closely with him and that the concept is great because he said, you could play... Uh, I dunno how careful I should be with it... Let's say you could play Assassin's Creed once you have your handheld plugged into your console. And then, you could then detach the thing and take it with you and play the Assassin's Creed mobile game out of your pocket. And then when you get back home, plug it directly in and now it attaches back to the... That's brilliant. That's smart, right? Taking a form of the game with you as you go. So he says it's a dream to code for. And then somebody I know who's played on the NX for 20 minutes said... It's as innovative as they'd hoped and 'we wish we had done that.'" via:https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX/..._huge_nx_bomb "Taking a form of the game" I really hope this is just a play on words. If we can't play the same game that would suck!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 I don't mind if the game takes different forms across the formats, as long as you don't have to buy them all separately... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pestneb Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 um... that tesco page talked of the NX Wii U right? " Let's say you could play Assassin's Creed once you have your handheld plugged into your console" so you plug the NX into the Wii U, play assassins creed (with boosted power from the NX) then the NX on it's own takes a downgraded version of the game when you unplug the handheld.... now bearing in mind the handheld would have a smaller screen, and presumably lower quality screen at that, I imagine a huge amount of power savings could be made just from not needing to render quite as good a picture. But I'm starting to question... is the NX actually a handheld with a home console base unit? And will that base unit basically be a Wii U for the next couple of years?? I'm kinda seeing an NX home console (the actual Wii U successor) being released in 2019 from this statement. But maybe I am reading WAY too much into things Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 Interesting. Maybe it all depends on the game or developer? For example I'd expect Nintendo will develop titles that fully work in both docked and portable mode, whereas other developers could port their high-power console games over to run on the docked system and, rather than do even more work to get the game working on a comparatively under-powered handheld, create a different (mobile-style) experience (complete with a lucrative microtransaction system) to give players a different vers- Aw, who am I kidding? I have no fucking idea what's going on with this thing anymore. Just reveal it already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pestneb Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 I am aware these numbers don't work.. but to give an idea, this is how much "stronger" the Wii U needs to be to match up to the competition. Wii is assumed at 100, strength of the other two will be :(PS4)[XBOX] Price ($114)[$100] Ram(4*GB)[4*GB] CPU (2.66 * cores)[2.66* cores] GPU (3.6 * shaders)[2.4 * shaders] GPU peak shader (5.2*)[3.7*] Internal storage (16*)[16*] Price wise Perhaps Nintendo can afford to push closer to PS4 prices to get tech included. Ram is a clear weakness that needs sorting (perhaps the NX base unit could have boosted this) Internal storage another huge downside. Either this needs sorting or cloud storage needs to be implemented REALLY well. GPU is probably the next point needing work on. To be able to comfortably run 1080p resolution the GPU NEEDS to be probably PS4 levels at least. CPU wise, this looks the easiest bridge for Nintendo. Price, Ram and the internal storage solution are things well within Nintendo's grasp. The CPU is plausible.. the biggest leap needed now would be the GPU. Having said that though, graphically I understand (speaking globally because I am aware that there are regional discrepancies) nes-n64 = 480i with hardware still not maxing out capabilities of 480i sets GC mainly 480i with some 480p support - still not maxing out display capability of screens Wii 480p Wii U 720p (occassional 1080p) so for me NX system should be around 1080p, with perhaps the odd attempt at 4k if they try to be adventurous - I imagine not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtMediocre Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 (edited) Soooooo just a side note here, if noone else brings it up.. Remember earlier this year when rumors started floating about Beyond Good and Evil 2 suddenly being saved by Nintendo? And apparently going to be an exclusive, like Bayonetta? And remember when Ubisoft really praised the NX for being a really awesome system, them being like, one of the few developers that have seen it? Now, remember, Ubisoft is the publisher of Beyond Good and Evil. These past days, the director of Beyond Good and Evil, Michel Ancel, has said the 2nd game is now finally in pre-production. And he's been posting some new of concept art on his instagram page saying things like "Endangered species - now saved - Game in pre-production - Stay tuned !" What the hell?? Isn't this just a bit too close to the NX reveal to be a coincidence? Are the rumors really true?? ...if they are, then god dammit Nintendo, you've might just have blown us away again :P. Source: Michelancel's instagram Edited October 5, 2016 by ArtMediocre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazzybee Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 If the handheld games can be a new type of thing, does that mean this IS the home console and a handheld is still ap possibility? Sort of hope not, although originally I would've loved two devices (though always presumed it would be a hybrid) I'm really sold on this hybrid idea now and would be disappointed if it wasn't. The very original WSJ article also hinted at mobile unit to play apps on too... so maybe they were right all along. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashley Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 When the thirst is so real you go for anything. [tweet]783556357073035264[/tweet] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronnie Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 It's the new Half Life 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashley Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 Now the question is 'will the NX look better than a pizza box?' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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