drahkon Posted January 5, 2021 Posted January 5, 2021 17 minutes ago, Sheikah said: Switch bests Wii U purely for not feeling like a Fisher Price toy. Really? The Joy-Cons feel much worse than a Fisher Price toy... The part in between is nice, I guess, but the actual things you hold are horrible... 2 1 1
LazyBoy Posted January 5, 2021 Posted January 5, 2021 On 1/4/2021 at 10:24 AM, Dcubed said: It’s Mindblow Monday! So here’s a fun little nugget of info that will change the way that you view this game’s NPCs forever... That’s right! All of the NPCs in the game are Miis! Could this be part of the reason all the NPCs feel quite unique in BotW? Because they've used a shortcut?
Ronnie Posted January 5, 2021 Posted January 5, 2021 Very clever! Makes sense, the art style lends itself to something like this.
Glen-i Posted January 6, 2021 Posted January 6, 2021 On 05/01/2021 at 11:25 AM, Ronnie said: You don't hear that take every day. As far as Ninty's output goes, it is. If it wasn't for the large amount of Wii U ports, it'd be incredibly barren. And let's face it, Nintendo games are the main selling point for a Nintendo console. Wii U also doesn't have a controller that doesn't break apart in a matter of months. 2 1
Ronnie Posted January 6, 2021 Posted January 6, 2021 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Glen-i said: As far as Ninty's output goes, it is. If it wasn't for the large amount of Wii U ports, it'd be incredibly barren. And the Wii U release schedule wasn't?! 14 million people owned a Wii U, what's the Switch up to now, 70 or 80 million? That's a huge amount of people loving the current output. Then add the amazing indie scene on Switch + actual third party support, GOTY quality games like BOTW, Odyssey and Animal Crossing... I loved my Wii U but there's a reason why it's the butt of jokes and the Switch is almost universally beloved. Edited January 6, 2021 by Ronnie
Sheikah Posted January 6, 2021 Posted January 6, 2021 Really? The Joy-Cons feel much worse than a Fisher Price toy... The part in between is nice, I guess, but the actual things you hold are horrible...Well I don't hold them, because I have a pro controller. They still have a more solid build quality than the gamepad; that thing was flimsy, lightweight plastic with a low resolution screen - compare it to the feel of the Switch itself and you can't go back. 1
drahkon Posted January 6, 2021 Posted January 6, 2021 6 minutes ago, Sheikah said: Well I don't hold them, because I have a pro controller. They still have a more solid build quality than the gamepad; that thing was flimsy, lightweight plastic with a low resolution screen - compare it to the feel of the Switch itself and you can't go back. I prefer the feel of the Wii U pad Obviously the screen was older tech, and the design now seems primitive but compared to Joy-Cons it feels like a much better device. To me, at least. Well, it all comes down to personal preference in the end, though. 1
Glen-i Posted January 6, 2021 Posted January 6, 2021 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Ronnie said: And the Wii U release schedule wasn't?! 14 million people owned a Wii U, what's the Switch up to now, 70 or 80 million? That's a huge amount of people loving the current output. Then add the amazing indie scene on Switch + actual third party support, GOTY quality games like BOTW, Odyssey and Animal Crossing... I loved my Wii U but there's a reason why it's the butt of jokes and the Switch is almost universally beloved. The Wii U release schedule was great, it was let down by the unappealing hardware. Wii U's first party library runs rings around the Switch's. And it's funny that you use BotW as an example, seeing as that's a Wii U port as well. You know what one of the current TV ads Nintendo are using to advertise the Switch right now? New Super Mario Bros U Deluxe. A Wii U title. Face it, the Wii U is carrying the Switch as far as Nintendo games go. Thankfully, you're right about third party support, because it's amazing for a Ninty console and saves the Switch further. Edited January 6, 2021 by Glen-i 1 1
Ronnie Posted January 6, 2021 Posted January 6, 2021 4 minutes ago, Glen-i said: The Wii U release schedule was great, it was let down by the unappealing hardware. This board wouldn't stop complaining how barren the console was in terms of software! That's literally all people talked about, how few games were coming out for it. 6 minutes ago, Glen-i said: And it's funny that you use BotW as an example, seeing as that's a Wii U port as well. It's hardly a port when it releases on the same day on both consoles. It's a cross-gen game. Would you call Spider-Man Miles Morales or Sackboy on PS5 ports? They're widely considered PS5 games, also available on PS4. 7 minutes ago, Glen-i said: You know what one of the current TV ads Nintendo are using to advertise the Switch right now? Not seen that one. The last one I saw was for Animal Crossing. Probably Ring Fit and 51 Worldwide Classics before that. 9 minutes ago, Glen-i said: Face it, the Wii U is carrying the Switch as far as Nintendo games go. Disagree. It's supplementing it. Wii U never had a year like 2019, or even 2017 in terms of quality.
Julius Posted January 6, 2021 Posted January 6, 2021 Determining whether Breath of the Wild is a Wii U or Switch title is certainly interesting, because I guess it really just depends on your own opinion. I mean, it released on both on the same day Seriously though, it is a weird one. Clearly designed initially for the Wii U, shown off first at The Game Awards running on the Wii U, heck, it was basically Nintendo's entire E3 2016, and all shown off on the Wii U because we still hadn't had the Switch officially announced, but we did know it was going to be destined to release on the NX/Switch I guess at that stage. And then it was the centrepiece of the Switch marketing (that reveal trailer, the Tonight Show appearance, the January 2017 Presentation), there day and date with the launch of the Switch (and also on Wii U), and Nintendo have been pretty forward I feel in presenting it as a Switch title (though, of course, that makes sense for marketing purposes). @Ronnie brings up Miles Morales and Sackboy on PS5, and I guess the only difference I would say there is the success of the PS4, making the argument more that it's a title for both from my perspective, purely in a marketing sense. PlayStation are pushing the PS5 first and foremost, but they have to push those games as PS4 titles; they'd be silly not to with the size of their install base on that console, especially with the limited PS5 stock in circulation at the moment. The closest example I can think of is probably Twilight Princess, but even then, didn't that have a delay between Wii and GameCube releases? And, I have to imagine, more noticeable differences between the two versions in that instance too. I guess all I can say is, makes sense for Nintendo from a marketing and financial perspective to release on both, and from a fan perspective to not force people's hands into buying a Switch or Wii just for the newest Zelda I think is pretty good. As for the Switch depending on the Wii U, I've said it before: as someone who didn't have a Wii U, it's great to get the chance to play some of these games. On the other hand, can totally understand why some might be frustrated with them leaning on Wii U ports (and remasters in general) in such a substantial way with the Switch. Much as I enjoy the Switch when I do play it, I don't think that the merging of their handheld and console divisions has quite had the impact fans were hoping for, which is a real shame. But...back to the topic at hand, I've kind of been feeling the pull to return to Breath of the Wild lately, to try out more of the DLC and complete more of the shrines. I really do miss just exploring that world, even if I do feel it slipped up a bit in other areas. On the other hand, I've got other Zelda games to get to, so, we'll see 2
Glen-i Posted January 6, 2021 Posted January 6, 2021 3 hours ago, Ronnie said: It's hardly a port when it releases on the same day on both consoles. It's a cross-gen game. Would you call Spider-Man Miles Morales or Sackboy on PS5 ports? They're widely considered PS5 games, also available on PS4. Yes. They were designed for the PS4 first and then moved on to the PS5. They are PS4 games that were also made compatible for PS5. Just like BotW was a Wii U title made to be compatible with the Switch. This isn't a bad thing, but it's fundamentally wrong to claim otherwise. 1
Ronnie Posted January 6, 2021 Posted January 6, 2021 7 minutes ago, Glen-i said: Yes. They were designed for the PS4 first and then moved on to the PS5. They are PS4 games that were also made compatible for PS5. Just like BotW was a Wii U title made to be compatible with the Switch. This isn't a bad thing, but it's fundamentally wrong to claim otherwise. I couldn't disagree more. But that's fine. Obviously there's nuance to the situation like @Julius suggests, but I suspect if you ask someone in 20 years time "what console was Breath of the Wild" or "what console was Miles Morales", they'll answer Switch and PS5. No one thinks: Twilight Princess = Gamecube. It's fundamentally considered a Wii game... that was also available on Gamecube.
Sheikah Posted January 6, 2021 Posted January 6, 2021 (edited) 5 hours ago, Glen-i said: The Wii U release schedule was great, it was let down by the unappealing hardware. Wii U's first party library runs rings around the Switch's. And it's funny that you use BotW as an example, seeing as that's a Wii U port as well. You know what one of the current TV ads Nintendo are using to advertise the Switch right now? New Super Mario Bros U Deluxe. A Wii U title. Face it, the Wii U is carrying the Switch as far as Nintendo games go. Thankfully, you're right about third party support, because it's amazing for a Ninty console and saves the Switch further. Have to disagree with you there. I don't think the Wii U lineup can be praised that much compared to the Switch. Mario Odyssey was better than 3D World, BoTW was basically on both, while both consoles had a Splatoon game of their own. Switch also had a new Smash, Animal Crossing, and mainline Pokemon game (huge games), as well as a Fire Emblem whereas Wii U didn't. Wii U had Mario Kart which was ported, but much new content has since been released for Switch and to be honest I don't feel that Mario Kart really even needs a new game every time - it could exist as a title supplemented by DLC for a long time. The best case for Wii U was Pikmin 3, to be honest. Edited January 6, 2021 by Sheikah
Ike Posted January 6, 2021 Posted January 6, 2021 On 05/01/2021 at 7:21 AM, Glen-i said: It is really cool though. @Dcubed was suggesting the idea that it was gonna be a full Mii feature where you had the option to import your Mii's into the game before it got shifted to a multi-platform title. I'm inclined to believe that. Between this and the ditched Gamepad support, I do wonder what WiiU BotW would've been like. I think they just re-used the engine to save on developement. 1 hour ago, Glen-i said: Yes. They were designed for the PS4 first and then moved on to the PS5. They are PS4 games that were also made compatible for PS5. Just like BotW was a Wii U title made to be compatible with the Switch. This isn't a bad thing, but it's fundamentally wrong to claim otherwise. They were developed at the same time, so are they ports (referring to Twilight Princess and BotW)? Ys: Memories of Celceta started life as a PSP game but was released on Vita. Is that a port?
Ronnie Posted January 6, 2021 Posted January 6, 2021 (edited) I loved the Nintendo-published stuff on Wii U, frankly that's all there was. And the Switch has a similar line-up in terms of Nintendo published stuff in the first 3/4 years... Mario 3D World / Odyssey Smash Bros Wii U / Ultimate Mario Maker / Mario Maker 2 Splatoon / Splatoon 2 Hyrule Warriors / Age of Calamity Xenoblade Chronicles X / Xenoblade 2 Colour Splash / Origami King Yoshi's Woolly World / Crafted World Kirby Rainbow Paintbrush / Star Allies Wii Fit U / Ring Fit Adventure Ultra Smash / Aces Wii U has: Mario Kart 8, NSMBU, Pikmin 3, Donkey Kong Country TF, Wonderful 101, Captain Toad, Star Fox Zero. Switch has: Luigi's Mansion 3, Fire Emblem, Animal Crossing, Pokemon Sw/Sh, ARMS, Pokemon Let's Go, Pokemon Snap, Nintendo Labo, Clubhouse Games, Astral Chain, Octopath Traveller (kind of, published by them outside of Japan) From a quality pov, Ultra Smash and Starfox Zero were pretty disliked, and NSMBU didn't get much love either. But throw in all the third party support, indie stuff and all the ports and Switch is miles ahead from a software pov. The hardware is obviously better too, that goes without saying. (Oh and Covid has obviously delayed stuff) Edited January 6, 2021 by Ronnie
Dcubed Posted January 6, 2021 Posted January 6, 2021 7 hours ago, Sheikah said: On 05/01/2021 at 11:33 AM, drahkon said: Really? The Joy-Cons feel much worse than a Fisher Price toy... The part in between is nice, I guess, but the actual things you hold are horrible... Well I don't hold them, because I have a pro controller. They still have a more solid build quality than the gamepad; that thing was flimsy, lightweight plastic with a low resolution screen - compare it to the feel of the Switch itself and you can't go back. The Wii U Gamepad is a lot of things, but flimsy isn’t one of them. That thing is made of pure nintendium! 1 1
Sheikah Posted January 6, 2021 Posted January 6, 2021 The Wii U Gamepad is a lot of things, but flimsy isn’t one of them. That thing is made of pure nintendium!One of the definitions of flimsy is "made of inferior materials and workmanship". That suits the gamepad to a tee. I was meaning more or less that if feels cheap.
Glen-i Posted January 7, 2021 Posted January 7, 2021 11 hours ago, Ronnie said: I loved the Nintendo-published stuff on Wii U, frankly that's all there was. And the Switch has a similar line-up in terms of Nintendo published stuff in the first 3/4 years... Mario 3D World / Odyssey Smash Bros Wii U / Ultimate Mario Maker / Mario Maker 2 Splatoon / Splatoon 2 Hyrule Warriors / Age of Calamity Xenoblade Chronicles X / Xenoblade 2 Colour Splash / Origami King Yoshi's Woolly World / Crafted World Kirby Rainbow Paintbrush / Star Allies Wii Fit U / Ring Fit Adventure Ultra Smash / Aces Wii U has: Mario Kart 8, NSMBU, Pikmin 3, Donkey Kong Country TF, Wonderful 101, Captain Toad, Star Fox Zero. Switch has: Luigi's Mansion 3, Fire Emblem, Animal Crossing, Pokemon Sw/Sh, ARMS, Pokemon Let's Go, Pokemon Snap, Nintendo Labo, Clubhouse Games, Astral Chain, Octopath Traveller (kind of, published by them outside of Japan) From a quality pov, Ultra Smash and Starfox Zero were pretty disliked, and NSMBU didn't get much love either. But throw in all the third party support, indie stuff and all the ports and Switch is miles ahead from a software pov. The hardware is obviously better too, that goes without saying. (Oh and Covid has obviously delayed stuff) When it comes to Nintendo, you are ignoring one thing, their handheld library. With the Switch consolidating the usual handheld projects and home console ones into one device, you'd expect there to be more stuff, but there really isn't. I look at my 3DS, and the amount of Ninty stuff alone is dizzying. Combine that with the WiiU, and it was a smorgasbord of First Party content! Oh, and I don't care what anyone claims, if a game began development for a certain console and then releases on said console, it's a game for that console, no matter how many other platforms it also releases on. 2
Dcubed Posted January 7, 2021 Posted January 7, 2021 11 hours ago, Sheikah said: 12 hours ago, Dcubed said: The Wii U Gamepad is a lot of things, but flimsy isn’t one of them. That thing is made of pure nintendium! One of the definitions of flimsy is "made of inferior materials and workmanship". That suits the gamepad to a tee. I was meaning more or less that if feels cheap. But it literally isn't made of inferior materials? It might not be stylish, but it's certainly made of quality material & craftsmanship. The reason why the Gamepad is so bulky and expensive is because they invested a lot of the Wii U console's manufacturing costs on making it sturdy, reliable and using quality parts (including it's WiFi Direct chip; which was cutting edge tech for 2012) Now the Joy-Cons. They are the literal polar opposite of the Gamepad! They're stylish, but shoddily made; with some of the worst quality bluetooth chips I have ever seen in a commercial device from this century!
Sheikah Posted January 7, 2021 Posted January 7, 2021 But it literally isn't made of inferior materials? It might not be stylish, but it's certainly made of quality material & craftsmanship. The reason why the Gamepad is so bulky and expensive is because they invested a lot of the Wii U console's manufacturing costs on making it sturdy, reliable and using quality parts (including it's WiFi Direct chip; which was cutting edge tech for 2012) Now the Joy-Cons. They are the literal polar opposite of the Gamepad! They're stylish, but shoddily made; with some of the worst quality bluetooth chips I have ever seen in a commercial device from this century!They invested a lot of money into developing/manufacturing it but it wasn't well spent. There were android devices being sold for peanuts that were made of better materials and to a better spec than the Gamepad. It's made of a cheap feeling plastic, the whole things feels like plastic, and they didn't sufficiently weight it so it felt like a premium product. You can't tell me it's a well built product of quality - as I said before, it feels like a Fisher Price toy.
Dcubed Posted January 7, 2021 Posted January 7, 2021 (edited) 14 hours ago, Ronnie said: I loved the Nintendo-published stuff on Wii U, frankly that's all there was. And the Switch has a similar line-up in terms of Nintendo published stuff in the first 3/4 years... Mario 3D World / OdysseySmash Bros Wii U / UltimateMario Maker / Mario Maker 2 Splatoon / Splatoon 2 Hyrule Warriors / Age of Calamity Xenoblade Chronicles X / Xenoblade 2 Colour Splash / Origami King Yoshi's Woolly World / Crafted World Kirby Rainbow Paintbrush / Star Allies Wii Fit U / Ring Fit AdventureUltra Smash / Aces Wii U has: Mario Kart 8, NSMBU, Pikmin 3, Donkey Kong Country TF, Wonderful 101, Captain Toad, Star Fox Zero. Switch has: Luigi's Mansion 3, Fire Emblem, Animal Crossing, Pokemon Sw/Sh, ARMS, Pokemon Let's Go, Pokemon Snap, Nintendo Labo, Clubhouse Games, Astral Chain, Octopath Traveller (kind of, published by them outside of Japan) From a quality pov, Ultra Smash and Starfox Zero were pretty disliked, and NSMBU didn't get much love either. But throw in all the third party support, indie stuff and all the ports and Switch is miles ahead from a software pov. The hardware is obviously better too, that goes without saying. (Oh and Covid has obviously delayed stuff) What you also really need to take into account is that all of the bolded games are clearly built on top of their Wii U counterparts; reusing their engines and art assets heavily, to the point where they are glorified ports with added content moreso than true sequels. And in the case of MT Aces especially? That is literally the finished version of Ultra Smash, which was shoved out the door blatantly unfinished. So it's not really a new game. Age of Calamity and Origami King get a pass though; even though they’re reusing BOTW's/Color Splash’s art assets, they’re very different games to BOTW/Color Splash (or even the original Hyrule Warriors). Edited January 7, 2021 by Dcubed
RedShell Posted January 7, 2021 Posted January 7, 2021 24 minutes ago, Dcubed said: That is literally the finished version of Ultra Smash I never played Ultra Smash, but if Aces is considered the finished version then damn, Ultra Smash was seriously unfinished!! 3
Ronnie Posted January 7, 2021 Posted January 7, 2021 2 hours ago, Glen-i said: Oh, and I don't care what anyone claims, if a game began development for a certain console and then releases on said console, it's a game for that console, no matter how many other platforms it also releases on. That's your own personal reasoning, no problem. I consider it differently.
Dcubed Posted January 7, 2021 Posted January 7, 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, RedShell said: I never played Ultra Smash, but if Aces is considered the finished version then damn, Ultra Smash was seriously unfinished!! Oh. You have NO idea mate... You have literally seen the entirety of Ultra Smash’s content in less than 5 minutes Calling it a skeleton of a game is bloody charitable! That thing is like a 0.3 Alpha version release! Edited January 7, 2021 by Dcubed 1
Ronnie Posted January 7, 2021 Posted January 7, 2021 34 minutes ago, Dcubed said: What you also really need to take into account is that all of the bolded games are clearly built on top of their Wii U counterparts; reusing their engines and art assets heavily, to the point where they are glorified ports with added content moreso than true sequels. And in the case of MT Aces especially? That is literally the finished version of Ultra Smash, which was shoved out the door blatantly unfinished. So it's not really a new game. Age of Calamity gets a pass though; even though it's reusing BOTW's art assets, it's a very different game to BOTW (or even the original Hyrule Warriors). I'm sure I read that Smash Ultimate was built from the ground up. And the two Paper Mario's are completely separate games, regardless of a shared engine. But sure, Mario Maker and Splatoon are upgraded versions of Wii U games. It raises the question of what's being argued though. Creatively, absolutely, I can agree that Nintendo put out more original and innovative content on Wii U, but I thought what we're discussing is which console has better software, and going on that I'd rather play Splatoon 2 or Mario Maker 2 than the Wii U equivalents.
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