Playstation 5 Console Discussion

[Julius]

An important update on Concord from Firewalk Studios

The game is going offline September 6th while they figure things out, sales to cease immediately and full refunds will be offered for the game. 

Quote

Concord fans — we’ve been listening closely to your feedback since the launch of Concord on PlayStation 5 and PC and want to thank everyone who has joined the journey aboard the Northstar. Your support and the passionate community that has grown around the game has meant the world to us.

However, while many qualities of the experience resonated with players, we also recognize that other aspects of the game and our initial launch didn’t land the way we’d intended. Therefore, at this time, we have decided to take the game offline beginning September 6, 2024, and explore options, including those that will better reach our players.

While we determine the best path ahead, Concord sales will cease immediately and we will begin to offer a full refund for all gamers who have purchased the game for PS5 or PC. If you purchased the game for PlayStation 5 from the PlayStation Store or PlayStation Direct, a refund will be issued back to your original payment method.

Customers who purchased from other digital storefronts will also be refunded. More information about refunds from Steam and Epic can be found below:

Steam Store – Steam Store will refund players who bought the game over the coming days. Steam will send confirmation of the refund once it has been processed.

Epic Games Store – Epic Games Store will refund players who bought the game over the coming days and will contact each customer directly to confirm that the refund has been processed.

Other retailer refunds – For customers who have purchased a physical copy at a retailer location outside of PlayStation directly, please refer to the refund process of the retailer you purchased it from to obtain your refund.   

Once refunded, players will no longer have access to the game. 

We’ll keep you updated and thank you again to all the Freegunners who have joined us in the Concord galaxy.

Holy damn. 

Assuming that this doesn't mean Firewalk gets straight up closed by PlayStation, I'm guessing this means a transition to free-to-play and microtransactions?

Edited September 3, 2024 by Julius

[drahkon]

It's a really good game, but people decided it was doomed from the beginning. What a weird situation.

[Julius]

23 minutes ago, drahkon said:

It's a really good game, but people decided it was doomed from the beginning. What a weird situation.

It's definitely an odd one, and I think is really just another example of PlayStation not understanding this GAAS market they've seemed so desperate to break into. I can't imagine that anyone with their head screwed on even slightly at Firewalk would've thought that the way this game was being released and marketed was a strong sell. 

Funnily enough, I was listening to a podcast just earlier day from Easy Allies all the way back from April 2016 and they were talking about Paragon, and obviously at the time of recording this being not too far out from Overwatch's release at the time, they rightly said the pitch just wasn't enough of a differentiator from other MOBAs like Overwatch, which did do such a strong job in gameplay but also how easily readable those differences were to people who had only seen gameplay and not got their hands on the game.

I think it's applicable here too: these games simply aren't for me and a lot of other people - and I'd argue that the people that it is for are probably already off fully cemented in some other such game anyways - but from the outside looking in, I just don't think that it did a good enough job of showcasing why it was different and, to quote Ben Moore from EZA [again, 2016, talking about Paragon], "you are justifying your existence to me"; it might be incredibly reductive and unfair to the devs to say this, but the general audience reaction when this turned up was "oh, hey, PlayStation are trying to make Overwatch", and so I'm not at all surprised that things have gone the way they have. 

That the game is then a paid-for product and not free-to-play when Overwatch 2 is? It's asking for trouble. And again, I'm not really convinced that was Firewalk's call to make. I mean, just look at PUBG - it's maybe still a pretty big game these days, but Fortnite dwarfed it in so many ways with its Battle Royale and how it evolved and adapted so quickly, but a very strong and compelling reason for that was the fact that it was F2P whereas PUBG was not. Hell, I'm pretty sure that to this day PUBG is still paid-for? 

I'm very interested to see what PlayStation's take away is from this year, if there even is one. 

I'm a little scared for Astro Bot, because some corners of the internet are treating it like the game and poster child which is going to make a statement and singlehandedly force PlayStation's hand to rethink their stance on Japanese studios and smaller games, but it's been a year with a monumental GAAS success in the form of Helldivers 2 which absolutely no-one saw coming, and the unfortunately disappointing reception to and sales of Concord. It has been a very light year for PlayStation otherwise, with no major AAA effort from their own studios - Stellar Blade and Rise of the Ronin being published partnerships on their end - besides The Last of Us Part II Remastered at the very start of the year, to the point I'm honestly not really sure what PlayStation is supposed to take away from this year when it comes to SIE published games? Besides the already widely agreed upon "man, this GAAS initiative needs another look and some serious consideration"? 

Edited September 3, 2024 by Julius

[Dcubed]

On 8/24/2024 at 10:21 AM, Dcubed said:

Sure, it would’ve been publicly embarrassing, but the game really should’ve been cancelled the moment it was clear how tepid the public reaction was.

To put this into perspective, even SEGA had the foresight and good sense to cancel the release of Hyenas when it was clear that it was doomed to failure.  SEGA.  Yes, that SEGA; a company run by literal morons.

Blooming ‘eck! I wasn’t expecting Sony to actually listen to me!

Probably should do the same with Fairgame Dollar Sign before it’s too late as well.

Then dump Bungie, end this failed GAAS initiative and double down on the actual strengths of your development studios.  High quality single player focused titles.

Pray that Astro Bot does well, because that is exactly the kind of game that PlayStation should be making as a platform holder!

Edited September 3, 2024 by Dcubed

[Hero-of-Time]

Insane that they had the balls to do this. The numbers must have been absolutely dire.

[Cube]

I wonder if they'll do a "surprise" free to play relaunch in three months when that Secret Level TV episode comes out.

 

Although I think that episode would be kind of more fascinating if Concord is never mentioned again.

[Hero-of-Time]

Quite tempted to pick up a copy. I imagine retailers will be ordered to return all their copies. Could be a neat collectors piece.

[Dcubed]

37 minutes ago, Hero-of-Time said:

Quite tempted to pick up a copy. I imagine retailers will be ordered to return all their copies. Could be a neat collectors piece.

Stranger things have happened... Would you believe that NBA Elite 11 (a game cancelled so last minute that some PS3 copies actually reached store shelves prior to getting pulled) is the single rarest and most valuable PS3 game on the second hand market?

Honestly may be worth picking up.  As a now "cancelled" first party Sony release? It has a decent chance of being worth actual money in the future!

Worst case scenario? It'll be an interesting little piece of history for the collection shelf.

Edited September 3, 2024 by Dcubed

[Hero-of-Time]

Here's a good piece from Push Square about the whole thing.

Quote

In an unprecedented move, Sony will axe Concord on 6th September, just two weeks after the high-budget first-person shooter released. This multi-million dollar blunder goes beyond disaster – it’s an absolute embarrassment, and will forever be a stain on the format holder’s record. PlayStation’s always had first-party flops, but this product was so utterly rejected by its audience and the industry at large that it gives us a glimpse into an organisation utterly out of touch. It’d also probably put PS Studios boss Hermen Hulst under the microscope – if he hadn’t already been prematurely promoted to co-CEO.

As it happens, the ex-Guerrilla managing director will probably escape most of the blame here, as ire will instead be directed at disliked executive Jim Ryan, who departed the company earlier in the year. However, Ryan would have only been responsible for signing the cheques in this excruciating incident – this was Hulst’s baby through and through.

He said as much in 2023, when PlayStation acquired developer Firewalk Studios. “We continue to be impressed by the team’s ambitions to build a modern multiplayer game that connects players in new and innovative ways,” the Dutchman wrote on the PS Blog. Concord would go on to connect players in new and innovative ways, of course – as it was met with a level of disdain and indifference on a scale we’ve never seen before. Analysts suggest the title may have sold as few as 25,000 copies, undoubtedly making it PlayStation’s biggest ever bomb. Even forgotten forays like Kill Strain lasted six or so months.

It’s worrying that Sony allowed this product to reach the market at all. There would have been focus testing and extensive analysis behind-the-scenes, and apparently no one on a six-or-seven figure salary was able to pick up on the problems. The platform holder, instead, doubled down: spare a thought for poor upcoming Amazon Prime television show Secret Levels, which has an entire episode inspired by the universe of Concord. The release will have been offline for three months by the time that airs.

Pay your respects to Haven, too, the Canadian studio behind the widely disliked Fairgame$ – another title signed by Hulst. This co-operative shooter was announced alongside Concord last year, and was criticised much harder than Firewalk’s FPS. It simply can’t reach market without an extensive post-mortem; whoever has been championing these projects internally is going to need to take a long, hard look at the direction they’re steering the company because this ain’t it.

In fact, with the exception of Helldivers 2, the firm’s whole live service push looks like it’s in tatters right now. Pulling the plug on Concord this quickly, without any rescue attempt, will have consequences. Why should you trust Sony with your money and, more importantly, your time when it axes releases so ruthlessly? Yes, this underlines just how profoundly awful the sci-fi shooter has performed, but it’s a stench that will stick to all of the firm’s future multiplayer products – especially those that have turbulent starts.

Firewalk says that it’s exploring its options, but that’s a euphemism and we’re sad to say the studio will likely be shut down. While we hate to see talented developers out of work, we don’t think the developer itself can entirely be absolved of the blame. To our knowledge it made the experience it wanted to make, and that doesn’t automatically entitle it to success.

But this game is symptomatic of wider problems within the PlayStation hierarchy. Hulst’s rapid rise to the top is giving us pause, especially when his hit rate thus far includes the acquisition of self-destructing studio Bungie and the biggest flop in PS Studios history. He, along with his advisors and subordinates, have a lot of soul searching to do over the coming days.

Sony needs a cash cow, because its single player games are costing too much and taking too long to make. The mistake it’s made is trying to force the initiative on a fanbase that’s disconnected after years of being kept in the dark. For the enthusiasts reading Push Square, Concord is more than just an uneventful hero shooter: it’s emblematic of an organisation at odds with the demands of its most committed players.

Astro Bot’s inevitable acclaim will help heal wounds this week, but the soul searching must continue behind-the-scenes: PlayStation needs to find a way to fix the frayed relationship with its fans, otherwise we don’t see this tug-of-war with its most engaged players coming to an end.

Lots of good points made by Sammy.

I do hope this disastrous failure makes the Sony bigwigs take a long hard look at where they were heading with all of this GaaS nonsense and instead get back to basics. Sammy mentions how their single player games are costing too  much to make and while this is very true, Sony could do more by releasing small versions of their main IP, just like they done with Uncharted: The Lost Legacy or Spider-Man: Miles Morales. Smaller games built using assets and engines from main games. 

They could also scale back the games they make. I mean, just look at the size and length of something like Uncharted 4 or God of War 2018 when compared to the earlier games. There was a time when I would play through previous entries of a series when a new entry was due to be released but you just can't do that anymore due to how big these games are now. This isn't just a Sony problem though but an industry wide one and it has been a costly one, with developers being laid off left and right because companies can't afford to make these huge games anymore.

[Jimbob]

Didn't think they'd shelve the game this soon after release.  Wonder if they will re-release on FTP (PS+) or not bother, even with the beta, it didn't seem people were that interested in the game then.

[Julius]

idk seemed relevant

[drahkon]

Thanks to Vampire Survivors I put Nex Machina on hold.

But about 60 minutes ago I decided to boot it up again and tackle Arcade Mode on Veteran once more.

I played like a madman, completely in the zone. Didn't even have to use a continue. 
Funnily enough, I didn't need practice for worlds 4, 5 and 6. After getting my ass kicked once by the third boss I was afraid I needed more practice but not this time.
Beat the third boss with ease and blasted my way through the remaining worlds without any major difficulties

Well, that's the most difficult trophy down.

Now I gotta beat the first world on Master, and beat it again on Experienced in under 5:45 (hate speed-run trophies ).
After that it's a matter of achieving 100 feats!

That's gotta wait until after Astro Bot, though. Priorities and all that

[Julius]

PS5 Pro time is upon us, with Mark Cerny himself hosting the PlayStation 5 Technical Showcase tomorrow (10th September) at 16:00 BST. 

Given that it's just 9 minutes long, figured it didn't warrant its own thread  but I'll be tuning in, love a Cerny breakdown! 

Edited September 9, 2024 by Julius

[Dcubed]

Really interested to see where the price is gonna land with this thing…

Crazy that we’re getting a PS5 Pro before a Switch 2 (crazy on Nintendo’s end for being late, not Sony’s for being early), but there ya go!

[Hero-of-Time]

1 minute ago, Dcubed said:

Really interested to see where the price is gonna land with this thing…

Crazy that we’re getting a PS5 Pro before a Switch 2 (crazy on Nintendo’s end for being late, not Sony’s for being early), but there ya go!

I'm guessing $599. The base model is still a high price and so I can see them charging a premium for this.

[Julius]

1 hour ago, Dcubed said:

Really interested to see where the price is gonna land with this thing…

Crazy that we’re getting a PS5 Pro before a Switch 2 (crazy on Nintendo’s end for being late, not Sony’s for being early), but there ya go!

Yeah, I think I agree with @Hero-of-Time in that it's going to be in that $599/£579 sort of region, not only is it premium but the fact that prices have only increased for the base model since launch means they're likely going to struggle to keep the price down. $549 or lower would be very competitive but also nuke the base PS5 sales, and I doubt they'd consider going that low. I think the absolute top end of this at retail has to be £600 over here, so that'd be like $629 or something like that? 

I'm still not quite sure there's a market for it, but I mean, the same was said for the PS4 Pro and it seemed to do fine, I think it was being sold at a 1:4 ratio compared to the base model PS4, which considering the Slim, the price drop, the many bundles the base PS4 had, wasn't too shabby. 

What I think is going to be perhaps more interesting than the price is how Cerny and PlayStation are going to try to sell this thing. With the Pro, it heavily featured Horizon Zero Dawn in its marketing despite releasing 3 or 4 months ahead of it, but that game was stunning and did a great job of singlehandedly showcasing why people should at least be considering a Pro model.

Here? We have no idea what the next big game is from PlayStation which could sell this thing, and GTA VI - which I think is going to really be what drives this thing's sales - is 12+ months away, PLUS whatever delays Rockstar inevitably adds on. It's a really hard sell for now and I have to think that they want to get a launch out of the way here, however quite it might be, so that it and the base PS5 have a chance at a price cut 3-6 months ahead of whenever GTA VI launches. 

[Hero-of-Time]

26 minutes ago, Julius said:

Here? We have no idea what the next big game is from PlayStation which could sell this thing.

Probably another port of The Last of Us 

[Julius]

41 minutes ago, Hero-of-Time said:

Probably another port of The Last of Us 

Don't go giving Neil ideas H-o-T, delete this at once 

Edited September 9, 2024 by Julius

[Julius]

Accidental double post, but what can you do: name confirmed as PS5 Pro in an unlisted video on PlayStation's own YouTube channel. 

Shocking, I thought the PS5 AddPlusTripleDeluxe rolled right off the tongue! 

[Ike]

Curious if it will eliminate the need for separate performance or high quality options.

Apparently Sony has increased the RRP of the Dual Sense by £5. Sauce: https://www.eurogamer.net/sony-quietly-increases-price-of-playstation-5-dualsense-controller

[Ashley]

3 hours ago, Hero-of-Time said:

I'm guessing $599. The base model is still a high price and so I can see them charging a premium for this.

$555 hopefully

[Hero-of-Time]

27 minutes ago, Ike said:

Curious if it will eliminate the need for separate performance or high quality options.

Apparently Sony has increased the RRP of the Dual Sense by £5. Sauce: https://www.eurogamer.net/sony-quietly-increases-price-of-playstation-5-dualsense-controller

I'm baffled why they keep raising prices on their PS goods. Don't components usually get cheaper as time goes on or is that just a thing of the past now? It's crazy how we don't really get cut price consoles at the end of a generation anymore.

[Julius]

3 minutes ago, Hero-of-Time said:

I'm baffled why they keep raising prices on their PS goods. Don't components usually get cheaper as time goes on or is that just a thing of the past now? It's crazy how we don't really get cut price consoles at the end of a generation anymore.

It's a very complex issue with many factors to consider, but first and foremost it's down to Sony/PlayStation needing to search for a way to make profits to please shareholders despite the incredibly weak yen, which has depreciated significantly and consistently since COVID hit back in 2020; in mid-March 2020 the JPY was valued at 0.0077 GBP, whereas today it is valued at 0.0053 GBP, and it seems that search has started to even extend to their accessories, which really sucks. I imagine it's also been factored into Nintendo's reasoning for not reducing the price of the Switch. 

It sucks but Japan has had it really rough the last few years, I remember hearing during the COVID recovery phase (2021/2022, can't remember exactly when because so much of the early 2020s are a blur) that at one point they were literally giving away vouchers worth hundreds of £s worth of ¥ in an attempt to boost their domestic tourism, seeing as they made the decision to keep their borders closed to tourism much longer than many other countries around the world and their typically strong domestic tourism was rocked by people being afraid to move around because, well, COVID.

Rock and a hard place and all that 

[killthenet]

I've got a feeling it'll be even more expensive than $599

[Julius]

What sort of price do you think we might end up seeing @killthenet?