Serebii Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 Handhelds for the traditional Pokémon experience... Home Console for story driven/Pokémon movie like RPG adventure... with some form of trading pokemon/items online if necessary but not essential. Or have it so you download Pokémon on to your 3DS as another feature. They could also outsource these games to Level-5 or another developer. It'd still lose the core aspect of Pokémon... Home consoles are fine for spin-offs, but not for any main series game
Retro_Link Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 It'd still lose the core aspect of Pokémon... Home consoles are fine for spin-offs, but not for any main series game How do both Mario, Zelda, Metroid etc... manage to have both Console and Handheld series then without any of them being called spin-offs?... They offer a different experience, which is what a story driven console RPG would do. Some people don't like 2D Metroidvania... so they have a First Person Adventure... some people don't like 2D Mario... they have 3D Mario as an alternative. Give Pokémon/Nintendo fans an alternative with this franchise. I know it would interest me.
Serebii Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 How do both Mario, Zelda, Metroid etc... manage to have both Console and Handheld series then without any of them being called spin-offs?... They offer a different experience, which is what a story driven console RPG would do. Some people don't like 2D Metroidvania... so they have a First Person Adventure... some people don't like 2D Mario... they have 3D Mario as an alternative. Give Pokémon/Nintendo fans an alternative with this franchise. I know it would interest me. It just wouldn't work. As I explained, it kills the core part of Pokémon. They'd never risk that
Guy Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 (edited) I realised today that Pokemon doesn't ever need to be an MMO. It already is one. You capture and train your team and battle with strangers. The massively multiplayer aspect is real life. When you think back to the original Game Boy games, requiring a physical link cable, it's actually kind of beautiful. ---- I'm happy with the game remaining on handhelds. I wanted a console game for years, but the truth is a console version need to stay true to the handheld titles without feeling extremely limited with the gameplay, which it absolutely would. Give me a proper Pokemon Snap (free-roaming) sequel over that any day. Edited August 13, 2013 by Guy It wasn't perfect enough...
Diageo Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 The large reason of why Pokémon is so popular is the social aspect. The ability to take it with you to battle and trade among many of the other features. This is a core thing as to why Pokémon is popular. Yes, it has online now, but the social aspect is key. The games are developed to be on handhelds, as such, putting them on a home console would lose these core features and would gut the game, with nothing possible on a home console that isn't on a handheld. This is why GameFreak, the developers and people who decide how Pokémon proceeds, have stated that the main series games will forever be on handheld devices. Basically, it won't work That's great, except for the fact that I never trade with anyone, battle anyone else or play it while I'm outside the house.
Retro_Link Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 (edited) It just wouldn't work. As I explained, it kills the core part of Pokémon. They'd never risk thatWasn't the key part of Mario 2D platforming? Now he does both 3D and Story RPG's (2 different series in fact)... Are you telling me Mario RPG on the SNES or Metroid Prime weren't risks?... and look what came from them. The series needs some diversification if it's going to stay relevant in years to come. 10 years from now Pokémon console RPG's could feel the norm, just like it does with Mario. Edited August 13, 2013 by Retro_Link
Serebii Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 Wasn't the key part of Mario 2D platforming? Now he does both 3D and Story RPG's (2 different series in fact)... Are you telling me Mario RPG on the SNES or Metroid Prime weren't risks?... and look what came from them. The series needs some diversification if it's going to stay relevant in years to come. 10 years from now Pokémon console RPG's could feel the norm, just like it does with Mario. Stay relevant? It's as popular, if not moreso, than it has been since it was a fad. It has never stopped being relevant, and nor will it. It also has a number of different styles of games, many of which are on home consoles. All I'm saying is that main games will not be on any console other than handheld. GameFreak have said as much so it needs to be accepted.
Retro_Link Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 Stay relevant? It's as popular, if not moreso, than it has been since it was a fad. It has never stopped being relevant, and nor will it. It also has a number of different styles of games, many of which are on home consoles. All I'm saying is that main games will not be on any console other than handheld. GameFreak have said as much so it needs to be accepted. Are you not understanding that the main series would still be on the handheld... and these games would be story RPG's?
Fierce_LiNk Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 The large reason of why Pokémon is so popular is the social aspect. The ability to take it with you to battle and trade among many of the other features. This is a core thing as to why Pokémon is popular. Yes, it has online now, but the social aspect is key. The games are developed to be on handhelds, as such, putting them on a home console would lose these core features and would gut the game, with nothing possible on a home console that isn't on a handheld. This is why GameFreak, the developers and people who decide how Pokémon proceeds, have stated that the main series games will forever be on handheld devices. Basically, it won't work The social aspect was important with the first generation and maybe the second. But, a lot of us aren't 12 anymore. We can't just go outside and hang out with others who have 3DSs and play Pokèmon. In fact, you could argue that, in many respects, that aspect of gaming is declining. Just like split-screen multiplayer is taking a backseat to online gaming. I don't see a reason why Pokèmon can't work on a home console any more and why it can't be awesome. Sure, there are lots of reasons why it works better on a handheld. But, there are plenty of RPGs out there that excel on a home console. I'm sure Pokèmon can work here. Given the fact that a home console like the Wii U has its own touchscreen interface and contains an aspect of portability, there might be no better time to give it a try. What about even having some sort of link up between the Wii U and 3DS, so you can trade your pokemon between the two. Different adventures, of course, but making your Pokemon available in both.
Retro_Link Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 There's no reason a home console game couldn't either allow you to download Pokémon to your 3DS to take with you to do some trading, or come with it's own little device that allows you to take Pokémon out and about with you, like Wii Fit U and it's device that keeps track of your activity to take back to the main game.
Ashley Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 It has never stopped being relevant, and nor will it. 3034 called and they have no idea what you're talking about.
Serebii Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 The social aspect was important with the first generation and maybe the second. But, a lot of us aren't 12 anymore. We can't just go outside and hang out with others who have 3DSs and play Pokèmon. In fact, you could argue that, in many respects, that aspect of gaming is declining. Just like split-screen multiplayer is taking a backseat to online gaming. I don't see a reason why Pokèmon can't work on a home console any more and why it can't be awesome. Sure, there are lots of reasons why it works better on a handheld. But, there are plenty of RPGs out there that excel on a home console. I'm sure Pokèmon can work here. Given the fact that a home console like the Wii U has its own touchscreen interface and contains an aspect of portability, there might be no better time to give it a try. What about even having some sort of link up between the Wii U and 3DS, so you can trade your pokemon between the two. Different adventures, of course, but making your Pokemon available in both. Yeah, but a massive portion of the players are young. They shouldn't remove a feature just to cater towards the smaller, older crowd. Putting it on a home console would just cut the features that help it appeal to the good chunk of its userbase. It's not worth it, there are ZERO benefits to being on a home console now. Wii U may have a sense of portability, but it isn't portable There's no reason a home console game couldn't either allow you to download Pokémon to your 3DS to take with you to do some trading, or come with it's own little device that allows you to take Pokémon out and about with you, like Wii Fit U and it's device that keeps track of your activity to take back to the main game. That would be illogical. Why do that when you could just have it on a portable console, with all the features it'd have on the home console, and more
Retro_Link Posted August 14, 2013 Posted August 14, 2013 (edited) That would be illogical. Why do that when you could just have it on a portable console, with all the features it'd have on the home console, and moreI don't think it needs portable features, (there would be the ability to trade online anyway) but you actually seem incapable of imagining how a Pokémon console RPG would play, so I was just offering some alternatives. Edited August 14, 2013 by Retro_Link
Serebii Posted August 14, 2013 Posted August 14, 2013 I don't think it needs portable features, (there would be the ability to trade online anyway) but you actually seem incapable of imagining how a Pokémon console RPG would play, so I was just offering some alternatives. It's not that I'm incapable of imagining it, it's that I know this franchise so well I know it can't work.
Retro_Link Posted August 14, 2013 Posted August 14, 2013 It's not that I'm incapable of imagining it, it's that I know this franchise so well I know it can't work.You seem to be thinking of it as playing like the handheld games... but on a home console. I'm not sure you understand or are listening to what anyone else is actually suggesting for this game.
Debug Mode Posted August 14, 2013 Posted August 14, 2013 Has this thread basically become Serebii telling everyone their opinions are wrong?
Fierce_LiNk Posted August 14, 2013 Posted August 14, 2013 Yeah, but a massive portion of the players are young. They shouldn't remove a feature just to cater towards the smaller, older crowd. Putting it on a home console would just cut the features that help it appeal to the good chunk of its userbase. It's not worth it, there are ZERO benefits to being on a home console now. Wii U may have a sense of portability, but it isn't portable They wouldn't be replacing the younger crowd with an older one. They would be catering to both. Also, as I've pointed out, there would be numerous benefits. A Pokemon game in full 3D with the HD and audio quality prowess of the Wii U, compared to the 3DS. There are umpteen possibilities out there and there are many benefits. It's not that I'm incapable of imagining it, it's that I know this franchise so well I know it can't work. Sorry, but this is such a bullshit reply. Things NEED to keep adapting and evolving in order to survive. You amongst many others should know this, as Bulba are catching up to your site. Staying the same and keeping things unaltered hinders progress.
Serebii Posted August 14, 2013 Posted August 14, 2013 (edited) You seem to be thinking of it as playing like the handheld games... but on a home console. I'm not sure you understand or are listening to what anyone else is actually suggesting for this game. Then if you're suggesting a spin-off, then that's fine as there are countless others. However, one with the mechanics of the main games. No. I have explained countless times why Pokémon is popular and the core aspect of that is the social aspect. Without that, Pokémon would be a footnote in gaming history. They wouldn't be replacing the younger crowd with an older one. They would be catering to both. Also, as I've pointed out, there would be numerous benefits. A Pokemon game in full 3D with the HD and audio quality prowess of the Wii U, compared to the 3DS. There are umpteen possibilities out there and there are many benefits. Sorry but losing the social aspect is a massive issue with it. You really do underestimate the power of it. I just don't see the benefits that outweigh removing the social aspect. All I can see it having is sharper graphics. Sorry, but this is such a bullshit reply. Things NEED to keep adapting and evolving in order to survive. You amongst many others should know this, as Bulba are catching up to your site. Staying the same and keeping things unaltered hinders progress. Please. Bulba is not "catching up". Yes, its existence stopped me being complacent and thus I created things like my Item Database, Pokéarth and updated the table aesthetics, but I would never remove the core aspect of the site. There's evolving, and then there's suicide. The fact is, GameFreak have said it's not happening, so it's not going to happen. Edited August 14, 2013 by Serebii
Shorty Posted August 14, 2013 Posted August 14, 2013 (edited) What is your "core aspect"? The splash page? Nobody is saying to remove anything... What do you consider "catching up"? Once upon a time, you were top of google for pretty much every pokemon name there is, with the exception of the likes of pikachu. Lets see how that is now... http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Porygon-Z http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=chimchar http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=skuntank http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=farfetchd http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=hipppowdon http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=phione http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=squirtle http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=qwilfish On the topic of a console game, I actually agree that it'll probably never happen. That said, I totally disagree that it couldn't happne. It's obvious you are unable to disconnect yourself from what you consider the key makeup of the game in order to see how it could transform into a fully fledged RPG (without becoming a "spinoff") Edited August 14, 2013 by Shorty
Retro_Link Posted August 14, 2013 Posted August 14, 2013 (edited) Ok let me put this very simply, watch this trailer... Now... replace the Familiars creatures with Pokémon And replace the story and cutscenes with an animated Pokémon Movie style one... ... What would you now class this game as? A Pokémon console RPG right? Now add in using the Gamepad - To scan the environments for hidden Pokémon etc.. - Using it as a fully voiced Pokedex in the palm of your hands Now add in online aspects... - Trading of Pokémon and items - Miiverse intergration through Pokecentre's where you can leave messages for one another and... - Invite one another for battles in a nearby Gym or Stadium, which are where online matches could play out in a Pokémon Stadium type way. Therefore retaining a social aspect but importantly a different one, and a different experience that perhaps appeals to other gamers who do not go to school or meet up in groups. Does that not sound like an exciting prospect and a different enough game to co-exist with the handheld titles? Edited August 14, 2013 by Retro_Link
Serebii Posted August 14, 2013 Posted August 14, 2013 (edited) What is your "core aspect"? The splash page? Nobody is saying to remove anything... What do you consider "catching up"? Once upon a time, you were top of google for pretty much every pokemon name there is, with the exception of the likes of pikachu. Lets see how that is now... http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Porygon-Z http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=chimchar http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=skuntank http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=farfetchd http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=hipppowdon http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=phione http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=squirtle http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=qwilfish On the topic of a console game, I actually agree that it'll probably never happen. That said, I totally disagree that it couldn't happne. It's obvious you are unable to disconnect yourself from what you consider the key makeup of the game in order to see how it could transform into a fully fledged RPG (without becoming a "spinoff") Google prioritises wikis. I have no control over that, and it sucks (especially considering the atrocities those have done). Despite that, I still get much more traffic. Hell, I had almost 1 million unique visitors on Thursday. Normally I don't reach those heights. Ok let me put this very simply, watch this trailer... Now... replace the Familiars creatures with Pokémon And replace the story and cutscenes with an animated Pokémon Movie style one... ... What would you now class this game as? A Pokémon console RPG right? Now add in using the Gamepad - To scan the environments for hidden Pokémon etc.. - Using it as a fully voiced Pokedex in the palm of your hands Now add in online aspects... - Trading of Pokémon and items - Miiverse intergration through Pokecentre's where you can leave messages for one another and... - Invite one another for battles in a nearby Gym or Stadium, which are where online matches could play out in a Pokémon Stadium type way. Therefore retaining a social aspect but importantly a different one, and a different experience that perhaps appeals to other gamers who do not go to school or meet up in groups. Does that not sound like an exciting prospect and a different enough game to co-exist with the handheld titles? The problem is that you're misunderstanding the social aspect. It's not just the battling/trading. It's the taking it with you to meet and battle with your friends. I get that people in America and Europe struggle to get this since they have been indoctrinated by Microsoft's "online is better" philosophy, but when you look at Japan and see how Pokémon is there, you will see that a home console game just wouldn't work. I wouldn't mind a cool home console game. All I'm saying is that it'd lose what makes Pokémon Pokémon. All of the stuff you suggested is doable on a handheld, afterall, (especially Miiverse once that's on the 3DS), so why deprive that market of it? Edited August 14, 2013 by Serebii Automerged Doublepost
Shorty Posted August 14, 2013 Posted August 14, 2013 Google prioritises wikis. Have you got a source for this? Wikis are higher up google because they have a simple, accessible system with good markup and url structure.
Fused King Posted August 14, 2013 Posted August 14, 2013 It's kind of ironic that a full-fledged Pokémon RPG with marketing power behind it could do the WiiU a world of good.
Retro_Link Posted August 14, 2013 Posted August 14, 2013 No Serebii you are not understand... what you're talking about is important to the the handheld Pokémon! This wouldn't be handheld Pokémon! It would be the Mario Galaxy to your New Super Mario Bros... two completely different experiences. One very handheld orientated, the other far more story driven, grander and fleshed out offering a different experience. You would still have the handheld games for what you're talking about. Don't advertise it to the Japanese market as heavily then... in the same way that they're not interested in 3D Mario games. And just like 3D Mario, this Pokémon game wouldn't do the same numbers as the handheld games, but it's important to diversify to stay fresh... offer different people different opportunities to enjoy a franchise and its characters... those who have either grown tired of the current formula, those that hadn't taken an interest before, or those new to it.
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