Nintendo's 'completely blown' its Wii 2 strategy

[Cube]

I think even the latest Blu-Ray players come with SD connections.

[Jonnas]

I shall furnish you with some FACTS, then you can crawl off back to your PS3 board:

 

Dude, come on, no need for that kind of attitude. Let's keep things civil, ok?

 

And yeah Jonnas I was talking about sales. If you're a shareholder in Nintendo and have seen the fall in sales (especially vs the uprise in 360 ones), what better than to see a new console come out RIGHT before the fiscal year ends and sell out (which is will due, and no doubt they'll be shortages for a fair bit afterwards too). There's a reason why they've always been adamant it'll be out before April, and why a lot of the PR around it has had mixed messages (like the eShop at launch business).

 

I haven't followed videogame sales religiously or anything, but... I'm pretty sure the Wii and DS are still selling pretty well. "Weak" implies financial trouble, or that last year showed unexpectedly low sales... but none of that is truth.

 

Also on your point about not really needing a 3D tv to play in 3D...well, you kind of do. The 3DS is the only exception as it's newish tech, and even then it's on a tiny screen and the viewing angle needs to be correct.

 

Well, of course! I was talking about the 3DS. Perhaps I wasn't clear, let me rephrase my previous post:

"When I think about it, I see that the 3D console 3DS doesn't depend on me owning a 3D television, but the an HD console would (since a HD handheld is pointless). It makes perfect sense"

 

Sorry for the confusion. What I meant was, Nintendo's leap is with the 3DS, while an HD leap would have to be made on a household console.

 

If the the next Nintendo household console is 3D, yeah, that will make very little sense. But this is the first time I've heard something in that direction.

 

Edit: Jonnas, also you posted saying HD isn't the standard yet. Well, it is pretty much. Update has increased a lot and think about it, EVERY TV sold now is in HD. By the end of the current console gen I think most people will atleast have a couple of HD sets in their house.

 

I wonder what percentage of people now own HDTVs. They're becoming so cheap (especially during sales), makes you wonder.

 

Its getting that way here. Maybe its different in Portugal...?

 

Right. For about 5 years now, it's been hard to buy a TV that isn't HD (not that I've got one), so they are "standard" in retail, if not in the home. Is there such thing as an "HD only" console yet though? Can't you use Scart leads?

 

Maybe things really are different here. I bought a TV in October, and HDTVs were still expensive, while SDTVs were still abundant in the store. Hell, I got an SDTV, since there was no point to getting an HDTV.

 

As for consoles not being "HD-only"... I might be wrong, but aren't there videogames in the PS3 or 360 that have things like tiny text, or other details that only an HDTV is able to show properly?

[Retro_Link]

I shall furnish you with some FACTS, then you can crawl off back to your PS3 board:

No need for that Zech, he aint trolling.

 

And I'd have to agree with him tbh!

 

All the Wii's past sales speak for themselves, as a console it's been a phenominal success, far beyond anything Nintendo/Microsoft/Sony could have predicted... and it's even forced these HD giants to alter their strategy and release motion related devices.

 

But looking forward, I don't think the future of the Wii looks entirely strong... unless E3 is set to blow us away.

 

Nintendo seemingly hasn't got the software support to be able to keep growing throughout 2011.

 

And whereas Microsoft and Sony have consoles that they can continue to build upon and develop, Nintendo just hasn't! They underestimated HD and it's gonna come back and smack them in the face, because they're going to be forced to have to release a new console far sooner than the competition.

As the price of the PS3 and 360 continue to fall, they offer additional experiences that the Wii doesn't and now they've also got Nintendo's motion gaming selling point to boot.

 

Unless Nintendo's next console is another revolution, they're are going to be behind the other 2 consoles on every front, there's no two ways about it!

 

EDIT: Oh and Pachter FTW!! Whether he's wrong or not, makes me laugh and he can have a joke about it too!

Edited January 24, 2011 by Retro_Link

[Goron_3]

I shall furnish you with some FACTS, then you can crawl off back to your PS3 board:

 

FACT ONE: The Nintendo DS was the biggest selling system of last year. It sold a massive 21.77 million units worldwide.

 

FACT TWO: The Nintendo DS is the biggest selling system ever released, it has sold a total of 145.30 million units since release.

 

FACT THREE: The Nintendo Wii was the second biggest selling system last year and the biggest home console. It sold 18.65 million units.

 

FACT FOUR: The Wii is already the fifth best selling system of all time and looks set to leapfrog the PS One this year. In total it has sold 85 million units since release.

 

FACT FIVE: These incredible sales have been reached with very few (if any some territories) price cuts.

 

In economic terms that is amazing, as even inspite of massive record braking sales the Wii and DS still haven't reached saturation point at the current price level.

 

FACT SIX: Nintendo are far more intelligent than Sony or Microsoft as they have ensured that a profit was made on every unit sold, unlike other consoles which are still making a loss on each unit sold.

 

FACT SEVEN: Looking at weekly software sales you will see that each week the vast majority of the top ten selling titles are on the Wii or DS. What's more Wii software sales have seen over 100 million selling titles on the system.

 

So really as you will see, your whole argument falls to pieces like a leper in a wind tunnel as soon as you start speaking of the 'weak' Wii and DS!

 

This is easily the greatest post I've ever seen on this board. Seriously, you deserve an award.

 

Firstly, I'm one of the biggest Nintendo fans on this board; it's called N-europe, and I've been here since it was called cube-europe, so don't troll with comments like 'go back to your PS3 board', because like the next comment said, with a username like Goron (you know, from Zelda) it's pretty obvious where any loyalties I have lie.

 

Secondly, you missed the most obvious part of my post. I'm talking straight business sense here; yes the Wii's sales in the past have been great (amazing actually, it'll have a long legacy that's for sure), but sales this year dropped a lot from what they would have been expected and I'm sorry but if you think the Wii will have stronger years than it did in 2008-2009 then you are sadly mistaken. It's still selling well but shareholders and company execs need to keep sales of Nintendo consoles high, hence why the 3DS is coming out so soon with mostly a bunch of ports in the pipeline and a massive pricetag.

 

I'm not 'dissing' the Wii, jeez. Nintendo's stock a couple of years ago was at a massive high and the Wii and DS were both selling very well, but those peaks (esp. relative to price point) won't come back. You make fun of my point yet clearly have forgotten that Nintendo announced the 3DS the moment they saw a downturn in DS sales; why not with the Wii? That's what pachter was saying. If you honestly think that's a stupid idea then you must also think that the 3DS is a pointless upgrade, which frankly it's not.

 

Thirdly, 'Nintendo are far more intelligent than Sony or Microsoft as they have ensured that a profit was made on every unit sold, unlike other consoles which are still making a loss on each unit sold'. I normally not one to bother highlighting a comment like this but it's comments like this which make you sound like an idiot and why people hate fanboys. Sony and Microsoft were willing to take a loss on hardware because they make money on software and other royalties. If anything that is a MASSIVE bonus because unlike Nintendo who only make video games, Sony and M$ actually have resources which they can dip into; it's a massive bonus. If Nintendo and Sony were to both release a console for £199 we all know which one would have a better online setup and graphics.

 

Jeez I'm a bit of a Nintendo fanboy it must be said but for the love of god stop acting like acting like a child. You post something like 'here are the fact's' with the most narrowminded view in the world.

 

Edit. Retro sums it up well above. If anyone honestly thinks the Wii is going to get 'stronger' from here they are just disillusioned.

[51MM5]

This is easily the greatest post I've ever seen on this board. Seriously, you deserve an award.

 

Firstly, I'm one of the biggest Nintendo fans on this board; it's called N-europe, and I've been here since it was called cube-europe, so don't troll with comments like 'go back to your PS3 board', because like the next comment said, with a username like Goron (you know, from Zelda) it's pretty obvious where any loyalties I have lie.

 

Secondly, you missed the most obvious part of my post. I'm talking straight business sense here; yes the Wii's sales in the past have been great (amazing actually, it'll have a long legacy that's for sure), but sales this year dropped a lot from what they would have been expected and I'm sorry but if you think the Wii will have stronger years than it did in 2008-2009 then you are sadly mistaken. It's still selling well but shareholders and company execs need to keep sales of Nintendo consoles high, hence why the 3DS is coming out so soon with mostly a bunch of ports in the pipeline and a massive pricetag.

 

I'm not 'dissing' the Wii, jeez. Nintendo's stock a couple of years ago was at a massive high and the Wii and DS were both selling very well, but those peaks (esp. relative to price point) won't come back. You make fun of my point yet clearly have forgotten that Nintendo announced the 3DS the moment they saw a downturn in DS sales; why not with the Wii? That's what pachter was saying. If you honestly think that's a stupid idea then you must also think that the 3DS is a pointless upgrade, which frankly it's not.

 

Thirdly, 'Nintendo are far more intelligent than Sony or Microsoft as they have ensured that a profit was made on every unit sold, unlike other consoles which are still making a loss on each unit sold'. I normally not one to bother highlighting a comment like this but it's comments like this which make you sound like an idiot and why people hate fanboys. Sony and Microsoft were willing to take a loss on hardware because they make money on software and other royalties. If anything that is a MASSIVE bonus because unlike Nintendo who only make video games, Sony and M$ actually have resources which they can dip into; it's a massive bonus. If Nintendo and Sony were to both release a console for £199 we all know which one would have a better online setup and graphics.

 

Jeez I'm a bit of a Nintendo fanboy it must be said but for the love of god stop acting like acting like a child. You post something like 'here are the fact's' with the most narrowminded view in the world.

 

Edit. Retro sums it up well above. If anyone honestly thinks the Wii is going to get 'stronger' from here they are just disillusioned.

 

People posting about how Wii sold squillions think that this will continue forever, Nintendo need to adapt otherwise they may fall from their leading position. Nintendo & Sony had previous generations where they were the dominating platform and have also end up losing positions because they got complacent.

 

Nintendo handhelds and the 3DS potentially are under attack from smartphones (ios and android devices) for casual gaming which are gaining momentum.

[Fierce_LiNk]

Its all well and good saying Nintendo should do this and Nintendo should do that. They're not stupid (Well, Nintendo of Europe certainly are. FUCK YOU, NoE). Nintendo are a business and they know exactly what to do to continue to make money. Honestly, who the fuck knows what they're working on right now?

 

If Nintendo thought a WiiHD was some kind of answer, they would have done it by now. They're not particularly afraid to whore things out or take the piss (DSi). So, to them, it wasn't worth it. Unless they just haven't released it yet.

 

As for the idea that the year ahead doesn't look great: What are we basing that on? The fact that right now we know little about which games will be coming out at this point? Is it really that different to how things were this time last year? Didn't the Wii then go on to have a brilliant year in terms of releases last year? The games will continue to come, or at least I hope so anyway.

[Jonnas]

Yeah, people tend to forget Nintendo is keeping most of their development undercover until near-launch. For example, the 3DS was announced less than half a year ago (while the DS and Wii were announced a year or so before release (I think))

[Goron_3]

Yeah, people tend to forget Nintendo is keeping most of their development undercover until near-launch. For example, the 3DS was announced less than half a year ago (while the DS and Wii were announced a year or so before release (I think))

 

Well they mentioned Revolution as far back as E3 2005 I think but we didn't get the controller unveil til 2005 TGS that September. They did a press release in january/Feb for the 3DS, so we're getting that about 13 months after it's announcement.

[Jonnas]

Well they mentioned Revolution as far back as E3 2005 I think but we didn't get the controller unveil til 2005 TGS that September. They did a press release in january/Feb for the 3DS, so we're getting that about 13 months after it's announcement.

 

Huh. I could swear it was a longer time ago...

 

Still, my point remains. The gap between "Revolution" and "Wii launch" was considerably bigger than what happened with the 3DS (the gap was only a year long)

[Captain Falcon]

As for the idea that the year ahead doesn't look great: What are we basing that on? The fact that right now we know little about which games will be coming out at this point? Is it really that different to how things were this time last year? Didn't the Wii then go on to have a brilliant year in terms of releases last year? The games will continue to come, or at least I hope so anyway.

 

Well this time last year, we knew we'd be looking forward to Super Mario Galaxy 2, Metroid: Other M, Sin & Punishment from Nintendo (some hoping for Zelda to creep in too) as well as third party stuff like Red Steel 2, Monster Hunter Tri, Tatsunoko vs Capcom, No More Heroes 2 and Disney Epic Mickey.

 

2010 was a brilliant year for "hardcore" games on the Wii and 2011 might be just as good but I felt I had a much greater idea of the games that would be piquing my interest throughout the year than I do right now.

 

 

The question of "weak" performance... weak to analysts isn't just about it selling more or less than it's competitors, it's about year on year performance and how that affects confidence of the company in the market. Nintendo revised forecasts through the year not just because of just exchange rate fluctuations but also admittedly lower sales than would be ideal of both hardware and software across both machines. That's a warning sign right there and stock prices too a hit following announcements. That currency write off did them no favours either.

 

And it's not just Nintendo's sales that are down, sales across the industry are down. It's tough times out there. But a big chunk of that overall decline is directly attributable to performance of Nintendo hardware and third party software sales on said hardware. Investors see that and want to know what the company are going to do to stimulate the market again. 3DS will no doubt prove useful with analysts expecting it to have a noticeable impact but that was before the pricing announcements and I've not seen what they've been saying since. But as for the Wii's replacement, no news isn't good news to these people. And we know Nintendo like to keep quiet out of fear of others stealing their ideas but until that point, nobody judging your company's worth has a real idea.

 

To say that the Wii may not have experience price cuts is true in Europe but most other places, it saw price cuts. And to compensate that, they did the whole "added value" thing to make it more appealing. Nintendo haven't packed in games with a console since the SNES days and didn't even include Wii Sports in Japan. So the whole "no price cuts" argument isn't as solid as it sounds.

 

 

But have they blown their Wii 2 strategy?

 

Depends on what the Wii 2 is and how much it costs. If it's just the fabled Wii HD which has probably floating around some tech lab over at Nintendo HQ for a couple of years, then yeah, it doesn't look great for them. 8 million sales of Kinect devices in 2 months on a console that typically appealed to an entirely different market isn't to be sniffed at - especially when you can pick up both the machine and magical gizmo for much more reasonable price when brought together at most retailers. Sony seem a bit more cagey with the Move sales (4.1m shipped as at end of Novemeber being the last update I could find) but then they flog that as an all in one media device anyway.

 

It's got to offer something more, something new if it's to capture the consumer market's attention. I think the investors will just be happy to see new hardware even if it doesn't do anything special. Nintendo have their following and as long as they continue to make their franchise games, and don't do anything disastrously wrong, they should sell enough to make it profitable - even in HD.

 

 

And I'm probably just rambling no cos I'm mega tired so I'll shut up and go to bed.

[Hero-of-Time]

Another analyst disagrees with him.

 

"A two-console strategy is perfectly feasible (as Sony have proved for the last decade) but requires a sufficient perceived value and price difference between the two consoles, a broadly separate set of core demographic and geographic targets for each console, and, arguably, sufficient competitive pressure to launch a new console. Wii is still quite an expensive (and highly profitable) console and continues to match or exceed 360 and PS3 in ongoing sales. Nintendo clearly feels it is not under significant competitive pressure and does not need to drop the price at this stage , irrespective of what we analysts say! The Wii has a very broad demographic target market and any successor would likely need to target the same market to replicate the Wii's success. Since the core of Wii owners are unlikely to care about processing power or graphical fidelity, any successor is likely to need more than just an HD upgrade and it may simply be that Nintendo has yet to develop a sufficiently compelling new feature to build Wii 2 around. A next generation of home consoles is coming, just not for several years yet." - British games industry analyst, Nick Gibson

 

"Although the consumer excitement for a second Wii console in 2011 would be undeniable, it's perhaps premature to suggest it's in any way dropped the ball by concentrating on 3DS. It is true that the Wii is built on last-gen technology to a degree – which would leave it two generations behind any new home console from Microsoft or Sony. But it's equally accurate to say that for a low manufacturing cost, Nintendo has created a technologically and cultural phenomenon, from which it has reaped huge fiscal rewards. Wii's popularity may be on the wane, but Nintendo's ability to wring the most interest from an untested and undemanding gaming audience is beyond question. I have no doubt that the 3DS will be another runaway success, and that Nintendo will further perfect a marketing strategy which simply can't be judged against traditional games industry parameters. The design and functionality of its next home console – whether Wii 2 or something else entirely – is under pressure from all sides, as rivals begin adopting the cleverest factors that have contributed to Wii and DS' breakthrough triumph." - CVG editor Tim Ingham

 

In terms on needing another hook or gimmick for their next console, i'm wondering if the vitality sensor could be it. It seems strange that they showed it at E3 2009 and then have never mentioned it since.

 

When the Wii sales do start to fall to a level that can be seen as low, i'm sure a price cut to £99-£130 would easily get an increase in sales.

[Burny]

3DS will no doubt prove useful with analysts expecting it to have a noticeable impact but that was before the pricing announcements and I've not seen what they've been saying since.

 

You haven't read that Patcher thinks Nintendo is stupid for selling the 3DS under 300 bucks?

[heroicjanitor]

I wish I was an analyst like him. Getting paid for sprouting utter nonsense sounds like fun.

 

I wish I was an analyst like him. Getting paid for sprouting utter nonsense sounds like fun.

 

ಠ_ಠ

 

Did he actually say they should sell it for more than 300?

[Cube]

ಠ_ಠ

 

I think I'm in there.

[Burny]

ಠ_ಠ

 

Did he actually say they should sell it for more than 300?

 

I think I'm in there.

 

Yep, he actually did.

 

He thinks of course of the shareholders and that the 3DS would still sell out at a higher price. He's not completely wrong about it either, I think. It's just that the damage Nintendo would do by selling the 3DS at the PS3's price might outweigh the increased profit of the launch period in the long run.

 

Suggesting to sell a device for a certain price at launch in the knowledge that it'll sell anyway and than lowering the price after the product doesn't sell on it's hype alone after two months... It's a bit like suggesting to kick any early adopter in the balls when he leaves the shop.

Edited January 25, 2011 by Burny

[Captain Falcon]

You haven't read that Patcher thinks Nintendo is stupid for selling the 3DS under 300 bucks?

 

Yep, he actually did.

 

No i hadn't read that but thanks for the link.

 

He makes a valid point in some respects. They would still sell out at launch for $300 dollars and it give Nintendo more freedom to apply price drops as well as justifying higher prices on hardware revisions.

 

It's just you have to wonder how it would affect short to mid term sales at that price. I wouldn't call $300 a mass market price for handheld games machine that doesn't make phone calls. I know millions of American's bought WiFi only iPads for ridiculous prices but it still has more functionality overall so they whilst they aren't averse to spending money on expensive toys, they do look for value in them too. Long term it's complete unsustainable so they'd never leave it like that but it's when they reduce it.

 

So they'd have to wait for price cuts for it to reach that point and then further price cuts before it falls into the universal gift buying category.

 

Annoying early adopters with rapid price discounting is never a good thing (the N64 saw a £100 price cut just months after launch if I recall) but you'd be surprised how much crap these guys will put up with just to be "first" and you know most of them will be queuing up to own the next thing they put out at an overly inflated price too. Most early adopters know they are going to get stung but it's the price they pay for being early adopters

[Goron_3]

I think Nintendo will regret not selling it at $300 too. The Wii was sold out for like what, 18 months? That's a shitload of extra profit down the drain. The same will apply to the 3DS, especially given the low shipments we'll get at launch.

[Tissue Town]

I think Nintendo will regret not selling it at $300 too. The Wii was sold out for like what, 18 months? That's a shitload of extra profit down the drain. The same will apply to the 3DS, especially given the low shipments we'll get at launch.

 

Fuck it. Just sell the shit for £500. People will still buy it. I would follow Nintendo to hell it self.

 

*goes to his Nintendo shrine and has a wank

[Fused King]

Fuck it. Just sell the shit for £500. People will still buy it. I would follow Nintendo to hell it self.

 

*goes to his Nintendo shrine and has a wank

 

Ladies and Gentlemen, here we have a person who defines the term 'hardcore gamer'.

 

Word. Written word.

[Dante]

 

It does look like the Wii is having small drops in sales in Europe and Japan than the US but having better sales in the software.

[Zechs Merquise]

Thanks for that Dante, I've been saying for a long time that Nintendo Wii software sales were strong, but now I have graphs to prove it

[Captain Falcon]

Does those charts include all versions of software - i.e. pack in titles as well?

 

Wii Sports Resort was packed in as standard with the console for the best part of the year so I can't imagine for a second it reached such high positions from non-bundled software sales alone.

[mcj metroid]

hmm well most of those games are either nintendo or just dance lol..

 

Just have to wonder what nintendo is doing that third parties don't seem to be able to handle.

[Burny]

hmm well most of those games are either nintendo or just dance lol..

 

Just have to wonder what nintendo is doing that third parties don't seem to be able to handle.

 

It's what they're not doing: Powerful hardware, good online stuff and two analog sticks.

[Zechs Merquise]

hmm well most of those games are either nintendo or just dance lol..

 

Just have to wonder what nintendo is doing that third parties don't seem to be able to handle.

 

And most the games on the other systems from third parties are just yearly updates of existing franchises - it's hardly fresh material. COD, FIFA, Assasin's Creed, F1 and Pro Evo dominate, not exactly ground breaking stuff there.