Stranger of Paradise: Final Fantasy Origin (18th March 2022)

[Julius]

12 minutes ago, drahkon said:

Ehh, guys...I'm enjoying this a lot.

Yes, the characters are stupid and the game's resolution is crap. But the fighting mechanics are great and, while taking inspiration from Nioh, offer a cool way to take on enemies.

WHAT IS HAPPENING

Likewise. 

Just about to take on what I imagine will be Garland, think my time with the demo is coming to an end, so I'll post more fleshed out thoughts afterwards, but so far so good. 

[Julius]

Spoiler

They did the thing they did in FFVII Remake, phase 2 is the Final Fantasy I battle theme! Haven't even played that game but heard it so many times in orchestras and in the Distant Worlds stuff, chills. 

Also Garland is 100% a False King Allant clone in a lot of ways (the grab, the charge stab into the ground, the slashes) but I love it. 

 

[Hero-of-Time]

@Julius and @drahkon do you think the reception of the game would have fared better had they just dropped the demo on the store without the Chaos trailer? It seems the trailer done a lot of damage but people’s feelings about the demo seem to be quite positive.

[drahkon]

6 minutes ago, Hero-of-Time said:

@Julius and @drahkon do you think the reception of the game would have fared better had they just dropped the demo on the store without the Chaos trailer? It seems the trailer done a lot of damage but people’s feelings about the demo seem to be quite positive.

The way it is now, i.e. trailer = memes = lots of outreach + "the game is actually pretty good", seems to work fine

While the trailer surely did some damage, I doubt it would've changed much if they kept it under wraps and just released the demo. People who don't like the game's style will never like it, no matter if they see a trailer or play the demo. The general tone of the trailer is also pretty much conveyed in the game via stupid dialogue

[Julius]

22 minutes ago, Hero-of-Time said:

@Julius and @drahkon do you think the reception of the game would have fared better had they just dropped the demo on the store without the Chaos trailer? It seems the trailer done a lot of damage but people’s feelings about the demo seem to be quite positive.

Absolutely.

I think my biggest gripes with the game based on the demo are the dialogue, and the characters themselves doing nothing to justify being there - in fact, the two other characters with you (the fact that I can barely remember their names says a lot) I found got in the way more than anything. Maybe it's just the demo, I don't know, but there was only an introductory cutscene and a brief one before the final boss, and there was nothing there to attach to, they barely do any damage, they go down pretty quickly and you have to waste potions on them, etc. Make the main character silent (or tone down the edgelord at least) and take those characters out and have the main plot tell the story like in Souls (EDIT: just to clarify here I don't just mean through background info, but rather just the cutscenes themselves), I think it's clear that that decision was made with how they view the western audience in mind. 

The actual game, based on this demo, is extremely solid. Definitely needs more work but I had a lot of fun, feels much more Soulslike than say Fallen Order, and may genuinely be a good way to ease into Souls based on the general gameplay loop (I know it's the Nioh team, but have no experience with those games other than seeing them in a few streams, so it's tough for me to compare to that). 

I'm kind of tempted to go through it again as I noticed in the survey there was an Advanced Job I didn't unlock for the final Basic Job that becomes available (yes, there are jobs, and they're actually pretty cool!), but I'll probably wait until I finish Rift Apart before going back. I played on Normal and it was a bit of a cakewalk until Garland, which took me a few tries as I was caught off guard a bit in the difficulty spike compared to the other enemies up to that point, so will probably crank it up to Hard when I get back to it too, as I think it might flow better for me based on that. 

Will type up some more cohesive thoughts after lunch, but if anything it feels like Square Enix's creative input might be getting in the way here. 

Edited June 15, 2021 by Julius

[drahkon]

42 minutes ago, Julius said:

(the fact that I can barely remember their names says a lot

Wow, you should really pay more attention... it's Jack, other white dude and black guy. 

[Julius]

DEMO IMPRESSIONS

Got a bit caught up after starting to type this earlier with some other stuff and then the Nintendo Direct. As I mentioned before, I wanted to put together some more cohesive thoughts on the demo, in part to figure out my own thoughts on this game so far, but also because I know not everyone owns a PS5 right now and so there are some missing out on this demo I wanted to go into a bit more detail before (I know there will be online playthroughs and other impressions too, but figured I might as well share my own, as I actually took a lot of notes!). Depending on your pace and how much you explore, as well as how you handle Garland, you're probably looking at somewhere between 1 and 2 hours for this demo. Heads-up: I'll mention PlayStation button and trigger names throughout, it's purely because that's the only thing the demo is on right now, I'm aware it landing elsewhere too!

As with most demos and many games, it starts out with you sorting out your settings, the most interesting of which were English and Japanese voice-acting options and the fact this demo has both Performance and Resolution modes; I personally went with the Performance Mode, which should have favoured frame rate over resolution, but I honestly couldn't tell if that was the case at times, as there were a number of times in the demo (a lot of them on one certain bridge during a battle) where the frame rate absolutely tanked. I know it's an early build, and I'm grateful we got to try it out, but yikes was it rough at times! There are also three different difficulty options available from the start: Easy, Normal, and Hard (I went with Normal for my first time through). Took a little while to load in (clearly not optimised very well just yet) and they had some tips in the loading screens, and I liked that you had the option to proceed rather than just automatically proceeding once the game has finished loading, as I know a lot of games do. 

You then load into a golden field for some tutorials, and it looks rough. Trying to pause the game brings up a menu but, as expected for a game like this, doesn't actually pause the gameplay, and you can still move around while in the main menu (there was seemingly no benefit to this in the demo). It was at this point that I noticed that there was an option in the menu for Job Trees, which got me excited, but it was greyed out for the time being. The tutorials introduce you to a number of key mechanics in the game, namely Soul Burst, Soul Shield, and Lightbringer. Soul Burst is like a special (almost like a riposte, kind of? Except the prompt sticks around for it for a good while longer, as they'll be down for a moment or two) and has its own animation, which we saw in the trailer for the game, where you crystallise your opponent, and you achieve this by selecting Circle on an enemy whose stance you have broken (similar to what I've seen in Sekiro with the Posture gauges, and yes, you have one too). Soul Shield is essentially a way to parry enemy attacks by tapping Circle while in battle, which helps fill up your MP bar, and can be used on both physical attacks as well as magic; for example, you will come across enemies in the demo where they shoot fireballs at you, and using Soul Shield will increase your MP but also allow you to fire these fireballs back their way by pressing Square (and you can do similar for stones thrown at you, but that's nowhere near as interesting!). Lastly, Lightbringer is an ability which will increases your break damage output when you have 1 or more filled MP gauges, and is accessed through L2 + Circle. R1 is your light attack, and R2 is your heavy attack. There are a bunch of tutorial messages scattered throughout the demo as you gain access to more abilities, and while it did feel like a bit much for the demo, over the course of a decently sized game I think it will be fine. Oh, and as you can see above, blood spatters across your character and their weapon. Really trying to justify that 18 PEGI rating!

This brings us onto battles and the general gameplay loop as you make your way through the Temple of Chaos - how is it? I have limited experience with Soulsborne and Souls-like games, and I can't speak to just how similar it is to Nioh having not played those games myself, but it looks like a faster-paced version of that from what I've seen played of it before. It feels much tighter than something like Jedi: Fallen Order in terms of how it feels, but is generally quite forgiving by comparison to Demon's Souls, attacks feel impactful and hefty, but you won't often find yourself locked into an animation and can quickly dodge out of the way, with generous windows for you to use Soul Shield in. Magic attacks are quite overpowered compared to standard melee, whether that be you dishing it out or receiving it, and I had a bit of trouble with Bombs (some wonderful returning classic Final Fantasy enemies throughout, I saw a Cactuar too but a bit like a Crystal Lizard, he pegged it!) until I tried using Soul Shield and throwing their fireballs back at them, and a few of those will cause them to Self-Destruct. I think the demo did a good job of giving you the tools to take enemies on in this sense, and using the Soul Shield is a must - it felt like it was pushing you towards it more than what I experienced in Demon's Souls, where it's more of a smart option if you can land it, but not totally the be-all-and-end-all if you choose not to. No back-stabbing in this demo for anyone curious about that. 

Rather than bonfires, Cubes are your place to restore your HP, MP, and stock you up on potions (in the demo I think I only came across a handful of potions being dropped by enemies, so they're in pretty limited supply), reviving slain enemies and removing unclaimed items from the field, and of course you return to the last field you've touched. Not sure if difficulty has any bearing on the number of Cubes in the Temple, but they were plentiful in the demo. Along with this there's also an option to optimise your equipment, so again, it feels like it could be a good first place to familiarise yourself with Souls mechanics if you're looking to get into those games. I didn't really come across many light puzzle elements, though there was one time where I kicked a ladder down to make a shortcut, but the demo didn't really give you a good reason to go back that way; there was also one occasion where I accidentally nudged a Bomb off a ledge and it exploded and killed some of the enemies below. Some small rooms off the beaten path, but absolutely nothing like Souls, at least here, in terms of larger, interconnected spaces. There's also an option to 'Abandon Mission', which I didn't try out, but I'm curious as to what it is; I'm guessing it just takes you back to the start of the Temple, but that seems a bit counterintuitive in a game like this. The animation for opening doors will look very familiar to most. General background music plays as you make your way through (unsurprisingly, Chaos Temple from the original Final Fantasy is mixed in there), and there's also some encounter music, but it feels a bit out of sorts with the Main Theme (which is pretty damn epic, if I'm being honest), as the standard battle encounter music is more electronic and modern. 

Defeating enemies earns you experience which will in turn level up your proficiency in the job role you were using, awarding you points to further upgrade your skills in that job through a skill tree. You can watch short clips on what the new skill will look like if it is visually distinct from others, and while there are three Basic Jobs in this demo (being Swordsman, Mage, and Lancer) that you can access through picking up certain weapons or getting to certain points as you go through, there are also three Advanced Jobs you can access for them by reaching the end of their respective skill trees (namely Warrior, Black Mage, and Dragoon). Each have their own weapons and abilities, you can save preset loadouts for future use, and you can quickly swap between any two Jobs on the fly by tapping Triangle. I imagine the experience multiplier was bumped up a bit for the sake of this demo, but in my first playthrough I got to Warrior and Black Mage in the Advance Jobs, but you pick up Lancer quite late on, so I didn't manage to really give that a go or get it to Dragoon. I was really pleasantly surprised to see jobs in this, my only wish would be that unlocking a new job came with its own distinct look, I would have liked if becoming a Black Mage netted you a look based on the classic Black Mage appearance from the original Final Fantasy with a blue cloak and pointed hat. Speaking of which, there is a loooooooot of equipment that you'll pick up, either from chests or defeating enemies, and I'm not sure if it was them wanting to make sure you were well-equipped for the demo, but I really didn't understand the benefit of carrying so many swords around with me. Again, feels like one weapon per job type and then having rare equipment to find for each would be the way to go. 

I do want to briefly talk about magic in particular, as I had good fun with it and think it's implemented pretty well. Obviously it uses up some of your MP gauge, no surprise there, but to access it once you've changed over to being a Mage or Black Mage, you hold down R2 which brings up this wheel and that blue ring starts charging in a clockwise manner, and you select the magic element you want to use with your left stick, so for example as you hold R2 with Fire selected, it will charge up from Fire, to Fira, ands then Firaga once fully charged, and you release the trigger to attack. There's a bit of risk-reward, though, as while you prepare a magic attack, you can't move your character, however you can cancel out of it if for example an enemy is charging at you by dodging with X / Cross. And, as you can see above, magic will also be used on environmental hazards to clear them, so I'm curious to see how heavily that features when the game eventually releases. 

Which brings me onto the boss of the demo, Garland. I mentioned it before in a spoiler tag with the boss's name, but I'll do it here without: this boss battle reminded me very much of a certain battle in Demon's Souls - with the attempted grabs, jumping up in the air and throwing stuff down at us, the charged attack into the floor which ends up being a wider range AoE-type deal, the speedy charges from across half of the room - and I loved it. I want to say he wasn't as aggressive here as a Souls boss, but there were times where he was absolutely chaining one attack after another, and if you don't react quickly enough, you could easily go from 3/4 health down to none at all. He cuts an imposing figure, is a really fun challenge, and the music in his second phase harkens back to the original Final Fantasy in a really fun way. It does a great job of forcing you to balance multiple aspects, for example if you go in with ranged magic attacks you don't have any items to replenish your MP (at least that I came across in the demo), so you need to use Soul Shield to build your MP back up, but be careful to not get greedy as he can break your stance pretty quickly if you parry him a lot and then don't manage to dodge away. Charging a Thundara, having him lunge at me from across the room and then dodging it, backing away, him throwing a fireball my way, using Soul Shield to absorb it and throw it back at him just before dodging away because he follows up instantly with a flame-coated sword charge felt so great. 

I want to reiterate for like the twentieth time: this absolutely feels like a natural jumping in point for these games because, as I mentioned, Cubes are plentiful throughout; unlike Souls there's a Cube right outside Garland's room, so you don't need to really worry about making your way through any of the Temple again. Sure, that comes with its own missed elements from those games (like not learning the level inside and out), but I think it's great that there will be more options, and I also just love the process of learning a boss fight (as much as I loved it in Demon's Souls, I loved learning attack patterns the most when it came to the bosses). I would hope in the actual release it didn't happen until after a number of attempts, as it happened after my first in the demo, but boss hints turn up next to the door too after losing, which again, will help a lot of people to adjust I feel. 

The demo ends pretty abruptly after that, but I really enjoyed it from a gameplay perspective. As I mentioned above, if you've played a Soulsborne game to completion before, it's probably best to play this on Hard; my biggest difficulty with Normal is that regular enemies felt like relative fodder (at least after I learned how to best handle Bombs!) compared to Garland, and so I wasn't as prepared to slow myself down, as I didn't really have to do that throughout the rest of the demo. I want to play through it again on Hard to see what that's like and to try out the Dragoon, and would be curious to see if the windows for dodging and using your Soul Shield are a bit more cruel at a higher difficulty than they are on Normal. 

Downside is, as I mentioned above, the characters themselves (at least in the demo and trailer) feel very one-note, I feel the game might be more enjoyable without your two companions in the way half of the time, and the dialogue is pretty atrocious. Scale it back, get rid of this plain Jack guy (by the way, don't understand why they showed him off in the trailer like the Scalebound guy in a plain t-shirt, because you pick up armour almost instantly in the demo), get rid of his friends: make this a create-a-character game with more elements of classic Final Fantasy and less edgy and aimed at teens (it's PEGI 18, for crying out loud), convey your story through the cutscenes if you have to, but I hope Team Ninja heed the feedback from the survey and realise that the biggest thing getting in the way of this game being great right now is pretty much everything we've learned so far to be directly attributable to Square Enix. 

[Sheikah]

I just beat Garland and really enjoyed my time with the demo. The combat (and particularly the boss) was a joy, and learning his attack patterns and when to absorb them was really entertaining.

The game looked terrible, and the allies were a liability (I'm not spending a potion reviving them), but the overall combat and game mechanics were a lot of fun. I'm pretty sure I'll be picking this one up somewhere down the line.

[Julius]

Demo period extended to 26th June, feedback until 2nd July:

 

[Sheikah]

Is there any reason why this demo is restricted to PS5 owners only? Especially since it looks like a PS3 game.

[Julius]

4 minutes ago, Sheikah said:

Is there any reason why this demo is restricted to PS5 owners only? Especially since it looks like a PS3 game.

I'm going to guess that money changed hands for demo exclusivity. Honestly, I think it kind of sucks in this instance (and was silly of Square to accept that money), because the demo itself is what won me over, not that trailer (at all). 

Funny thing too is that, as a PS5 exclusive demo, I saw more loading screens in the first 30 minutes with this than I did the entirety of the PS5 exclusives I've played so far. I know it's a demo but I wasn't expecting that going in. 

[Julius]

The game is releasing way earlier than I was expecting, on 18th March 2022. New demo available until 11th October 2021. 

TGS trailer:

Quote

“When darkness veils the world, four warriors of light shall come.”

Jack and his comrades must hazard numerous challenges to bring the light of the crystals back to Cornelia, a kingdom conquered by darkness. Will restoring the crystals’ light usher in peace or a new form of darkness? … Or perhaps something else entirely?

Step into a world of dark fantasy and revel in the exhilarating, action-packed battles!

STRANGER OF PARADISE FINAL FANTASY ORIGIN will be available March 18th, 2022 on PlayStation®5, PlayStation®4, Xbox Series X|S, Xbox One, PC (via Epic Games Store). Play the new Trial Version, available on PlayStation®5 and Xbox Series X|S until October 11, 2021.

This trailer is leaps and bounds better than the debut trailer. Really excited for the new demo and to see what multiplayer features they're thinking of including! 

Though, XIV: Endwalker in November, this in March, Forspoken in spring...guess XVI is a release for next autumn at the earliest then.  

EDIT: Demo is up on the PlayStation Store. 

Edited October 1, 2021 by Julius

[Dcubed]

How has nobody posted this art yet!?

This had me absolutely HOWLING so hard last night I could barely even sleep through my fit of giggles 

Edited October 2, 2021 by Dcubed

[Glen-i]

Honestly? If all the cutscenes are of that quality, I might have to play this!

Edited October 2, 2021 by Glen-i

[Ashley]

Found my new way of leaving meetings. 

[LazyBoy]

I think I’ll just have to play this for the cutscenes. I mean that’s just golden. They must know what they’re doing, surely. 

[Julius]

Alright, say what you will about how hilariously bad this game's story looks, the steelbook with Amano artwork has to be one of the cleanest steelbooks in gaming:

 

[Julius]

Square Enix have announced a livestream of the game to take place on December 18th at 19:00 JST (10:00 GMT) to commemorate the franchise's 34th birthday. 

Quote

December 18 is the birthdate of the original Final Fantasy, so Square Enix will celebrate its birthday while unraveling the connection between the original Final Fantasy and Stranger of Paradise: Final Fantasy Origin, as well as share the latest information about the game.

Presenters include Hatsune Matsushima (host), Kasumi Ashizawa (game talent, voice actor), Yoshinori Kitase (Final Fantasy series brand manager), Tetsuya Nomura (Square Enix creative producer, voice-only), Masashi Fujiwara (Square Enix producer), and Daisuke Inoue (Square Enix director).

In addition to the main broadcast, Square Enix will host a Let’s Play sub broadcast of the original Final Fantasy on Famicom at the same time.

Source: Gematsu

Edited December 14, 2021 by Julius

[Julius]

The official box art for the game has been revealed:

That's Square Enix box art alright. The stitched together character portraits form Chaos. 

[Julius]

Two months out, but here's the final trailer?

The music choice in the second half of the trailer has me bawling  one of the messiest trailers I've seen in a long time. Weirdly edited, feels like it shows way too much, the music choice is hilarious...I refuse to believe Team Ninja and S-E are playing this straight (if they ever were up to this point). Feels quirky and campy as hell, I dig it. 

Edited January 24, 2022 by Julius

[Dcubed]

The official soundtrack is up on Spotify now…

https://open.spotify.com/playlist/0Uc3aYcEH5Oe97OBuqPKxf

… it literally reads like a shitpost; I can’t believe that’s real!!

Edited January 25, 2022 by Dcubed

[Sheikah]

I actually really liked that trailer!

[Julius]

Even the key art is pretty nutty 

[Glen-i]

4 hours ago, Dcubed said:

The official soundtrack is up on Spotify now…

https://open.spotify.com/playlist/0Uc3aYcEH5Oe97OBuqPKxf

… it literally reads like a shitpost; I can’t believe that’s real!!

Nobuo Uematsu being lower on the playlist then Spice Girls is something I'd never thought I'd see in my lifetime.

It's really impressive that the Final Fantasy Prelude is the one song that looks out of place in this Final Fantasy Soundtrack!

[Julius]

So...I guess that wasn't the final trailer? What is going on over at S-E? 

 

The hilarity ensues. 

Edited January 25, 2022 by Julius