Hero-of-Time

PlayStation Meeting 7th September 2016

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PlayStation haven't said a word except suggesting there may not be a PS5, and Microsoft talked about a future without generations. So people on here may have suggested it was always going to be the same gen (though I don't remember that) but everything we've heard thus far from the industry themselves has suggested the lines between gens are going to be blurred.

 

I suspect PlayStation are backtracking after the Scorpio reveal.

 

Moving away from generations doesn't mean the next console would be equivalent to a giant leap every few years though. It's like phones - compare today's newly announced phone to one announced 7 years ago. Year on year things change and improve and may not look like much back-to-back, but with a big gap between it does. That is what might happen - the PS4 Pro may not be a giant leap compared to the PS4, but whatever comes out in ~2020 will be quite different from the PS4. I imagine if Sony did decide to go down this route they're just reset the names and it would just be "Playstation" and then have variations (such as PS4 Pro) down the line. Who knows though, maybe they'll have a Number/Pro cycle like Apple has a Number/S cycle.

 

Blurring the lines doesn't mean that each new console will be a huge change (like we're accustomed to presently). It means the exact opposite really...

 

So people on here may have suggested it was always going to be the same gen (though I don't remember that)

 

You will still be able to play exactly the same games. They might run better on the PS4K, but then they would also run better on a PC, so what's the difference? Nothing. You are still getting your games.

 

- No new games exclusive to PS4K

 

So not splitting the userbase in any way, shape or form.

 

Doesn't the PS4K lengthen the cycle? Why would they release a PS5 so soon if they are planning a PS4K? It's the same for the new 3DS - it's there to act as a buffer until the next handheld.

 

Seems like it is very much a PS4 but with enhancements for 4K TV gaming.

 

P.S I don't think this changes anything in regards to length of console platforms on the Sony side. Also the PS4 slim is still a possibility and probably the mainstream choice.

 

Games will continue to be released on PS4 in an identical state to the way that they currently are. Developers (believe it or not) are not thick as shit and will want to capitalise on the install base that is already there, which will guarantee them sales.

 

Can't be arsed spending money on something that may or may not be an incremental release. This is NOT the PS5. This isn't what the PS3 was to the PS2 or what that console was to the original PlayStation.

 

Exactly. Games will continue running the same as they are on PS4's. Don't own a PS4K and you'll be none the wiser... despite all the comparison videos that IGN will run.

 

It seems to me the extra horsepower is simply being used to optimise games for 4K. I think that's fine, if you own a 4K TV you're presently struggling for content. A wait of 2-3 years for 4K gaming would be frustrating too. If Sony present this as simply that, a PS4 optimised for 4K, I think it's fine and nothing to stress over.

 

(some quotes shortened to highlight).

 

I don't get a sense anyone in these quotes were under the impression that the PS4 Pro was going to be a PS5. Forgive me if I've misinterpreted anyone.

 

This is just from the first three pages before we got more information about it (this is up until April and I think we got more around May).

 

Hell, even you seemed to acknowledge it as possibly just being the same gen:

 

Whether it's a new gen or not really doesn't matter.

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Out this year! Didnt think that was happening.

 

They are consistent with their stance too. MS seem to be the only ones on this no generation thing

Edited by Choze

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Confirmed no 4K blu Ray support

 

Well I'm out. I was debating a 4K tv, and now, I suppose I'll just wait. 5 year old plasma still has a great picture anyways. (I just wanted an excuse for bigger)

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The price of the slim really does end up looking ridiculous when you look at the cost for the 1TB model (£299) versus the Pro which is 1TB and twice the power for only £50 more.

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The price of the slim really does end up looking ridiculous when you look at the cost for the 1TB model (£299) versus the Pro which is 1TB and twice the power for only £50 more.

 

Wait and see. Pricing will be in flux when it comes to retail and bundling. I say this Pro price is good though. The timing even better. I thought it would be a different thing all together. Still I am happy with the PS4 as it is.

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The price of the slim really does end up looking ridiculous when you look at the cost for the 1TB model (£299) versus the Pro which is 1TB and twice the power for only £50 more.

The slim is £259 not £299.

 

I think the price of the Pro is spot on.

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The slim is £259 not £299.

 

I think the price of the Pro is spot on.

 

The price of the 500gb slim is £259, the price for 1TB is £299.

 

And why wait and see? We're assessing the value of the packages at the official prices Sony presented them at. Based on those prices there appears to be more value in the £350 Pro going forward.

Edited by killthenet

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The price of the 500gb slim is £259, the price for 1TB is £299.

Oh right fair enough. I guess if you had such a drive for an older model or PS3 you could slap that in, or buy the 500GB model (perform a 2TB upgrade for not much more than the cost of the extra model). Buying the larger space model always seems like a rip off to me.

 

I reckon we will see the price being lower than this anyway at various retailers, at least in bundles.

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The price of the 500gb slim is £259, the price for 1TB is £299.

 

I missed that, I thought the 1TB was £259!! £300 three years on? That's crazy.

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Pre-orders for both models are up on Amazon and Shopto for those interested. I've ordered from Shopto, has anyone ever bought hardware from them on launch? I know they're decent with software releases but was wondering if they're reliable for hardware.

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CBA to quote everyone individually but here's my three cents:

 

PS4 Pro is the perfect name. Doesn't appeal to me but then that was never the intention; from a marketing perspective it's targeting the self-identifying 'hardcore gamer' who can't bear to own a (perceived) lower-end product when there's something new available. I hate to break it to everyone here who complained about the notion of the Pro in the months leading up to the official announcement, but you were part of that target market; idiotic gamers suffering from severe FOMO who can't wrap their heads around the concept of hardware evolution. That you made your decision early not to endorse the product on principle matters not one bit – the sense of jealousy and entitlement provoked by it proves its appeal, whether the appeal is voiced begrudgingly or not. The other part of the market is made up of wealthy people who don't mind paying a bit extra for an upgrade because they already have 4K TVs. Returning to the name, Pro taps into the same thing CoD did with the Elite subscription. It's fucking obvious.

 

Price difference between Slim and Pro: again, seeing as you only benefit from having a Pro if you have a 4K TV, why would you waste that extra £50 on the Pro? You could buy a game or two for that. And it's logical if you think of it in terms of popcorn pricing. Say a small popcorn is £4.00, medium £4.40, and large £4.80. You get a good mark up on all of those sales, but the prices are just close enough to make some people buy more than they need (i.e. you can tempt a customer to purchase a Pro over a Slim even if there's no benefit to that customer. It's the classic sales pitch in Curries when you're encouraged to buy a camera with new features that you'll never use. Same idea with the Pro: you're getting people to invest in a 4K future they won't be able to take advantage of until the PS5 comes out, once 4K TVs are standard).

 

It does seem odd that they compromised on ultra blu ray playback. I'm guessing they were under pressure by Microsoft and had to rush the system a little. Cost is clearly more important to them than ultra HD functionality at this point. The salient point here is that Sony is releasing their intermediary console before Microsoft, as Goron pointed out (a huge lesson learnt from the PS3 failure with regards to RRP and launch date), and if there's anything this generation taught us about consoles, it's that games are still king. Who's going to buy a Pro AND a Scorpio? Very few. There's a sufficiently large gap between their respective launches to make people impatient for whichever upgraded system comes out first.

 

Can't see S.C.G's suggestion of further iterations making any sense. It was hard enough to position the Pro.

 

Ronnie - professional troll or not, why you're linking this announcement to Nintendo is beyond me, if tediously predictable at the same time. If you haven't grasped the huge divergence in target audience between Sony (/Microsoft) and Nintendo over recent years, then you've got a screw loose.

Edited by dwarf

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They might be missing out an a lot of sales, though...I think the group of people who are thinking about getting 4k TV and a device for 4k gaming and movies is pretty big. And with the omission of a UHD Blu Ray drive those most likely won't buy a PS4 Pro.

 

With all their talk about HDR and 4k it just is a stupid decision to not include UHD Blu Ray support.

But adding it would probably raise the price...

 

Difficult.

 

The general reaction to the omission is negative and I think that's what will cost Sony a lot of sales...

 

Agreed. This is targeted at technology enthusiasts first and foremost, the people who are hungry for new tech and (in theory) 4K content. But not only will this decision cost them sales of their console, it'll also cost them sales of their 4K TVs and BD Movies as well.

 

It's a big cock up. 4K support is like the whole point of this thing and to lack 4K BD movies is a big problem. Not just for SCE, but for Sony as a whole.

 

If the price had to go up as a result, Sony should've waited longer for the price to come down, especially since they would've had the PS4 slim out this Xmas anyway. It's such a gaping hole in this thing.

Edited by Dcubed

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Agreed. This is targeted at technology enthusiasts first and foremost, the people who are hungry for new tech and (in theory) 4K content. But not only will this decision cost them sales of their console, it'll also cost them sales of their 4K TVs and BD Movies as well.

 

It's a big cock up. 4K support is like the whole point of this thing and to lack 4K BD movies is a big problem. Not just for SCE, but for Sony as a whole.

 

If the price had to go up as a result, Sony should've waited longer for the price to come down, especially since they would've had the PS4 slim out this Xmas anyway. It's such a gaping hole in this thing.

 

I honestly don't think this omission will have an impact at all. People like to exaggerate about things that matter to them without realising how their views do not in any way align with most other people.

 

Christmas will roll around and Sony will clean up. You know it will happen, I know it will happen. The competition have no hardware planned whatsoever before this Christmas. It's so obvious it's unreal.

 

I would be surprised if even 5% of gamers would base a console purchase on whether it includes a UHD drive. People will see it plays games better and is called Pro and will buy it. And you can bet, we will remind you of this. :heh:

 

As for another comment in this topic about whether the Pro was ever said to be same generation - we have literally been saying this the whole time!

Edited by Sheikah

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I honestly don't think this omission will have an impact at all. People like to exaggerate about things that matter to them without realising how their views do not in any way align with most other people.

 

Christmas will roll around and Sony will clean up. You know it will happen, I know it will happen. The competition have no hardware planned whatsoever before this Christmas. It's so obvious it's unreal.

 

I would be surprised if even 5% of gamers would base a console purchase on whether it includes a UHD drive. People will see it plays games better and is called Pro and will buy it. And you can bet, we will remind you of this. :heh:

 

As for another comment in this topic about whether the Pro was ever said to be same generation - we have literally been saying this the whole time!

 

Well that's not quite true... Microsoft have the Xbox One s... (and it has an unexpected feather in its cap now).

 

Also, you have to consider that it's not just the PS4 Pro that would be affected by this... it's the rest of Sony that will feel the brunt (TVs, BDs etc).

 

It comes across as short-sighted, in a product that is focused on the 4K experience, to lack the ability to play the majority of 4K content that will be put out there. Especially when they would've had the PS4 Slim out this Xmas anyway. Why not wait a little longer and get it in there?

Edited by Dcubed

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Well that's not quite true... Microsoft have the Xbox One s... (and it has an unexpected feather in its cap now).

 

Also, you have to consider that it's not just the PS4 Pro that would be affected by this... it's the rest of Sony that will feel the brunt (TVs, BDs etc).

 

It comes across as short-sighted, in a product that is focused on the 4K experience, to lack the ability to play the majority of 4K content that will be put out there. Especially when they would've had the PS4 Slim out this Xmas anyway. Why not wait a little longer and get it in there?

 

X1 S is no threat at all, no more than the original X1 ever has been to Sony. It's just an X1, whereas the Neo is an actual upgrade (so the feather, the cap, the bling and the heels).

 

Regarding damage to 4K TV sales - as long as the Pro plays games in 4K, people will still have a reason to buy a 4K TV. It's not like that matters much though anyway, as anyone buying a new TV today for whatever reason will most likely be buying 4K as it's becoming a standard.

 

UHD blu ray is a nice thing to have but I seriously doubt many people care about it right now. I bet they are making more by leaving it out. 349 is a sweet spot and they know full well that number did it for them previously. A massive lead on the competition and a great price can really seal it for them.

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I honestly don't think this omission will have an impact at all. People like to exaggerate about things that matter to them without realising how their views do not in any way align with most other people.

 

Christmas will roll around and Sony will clean up. You know it will happen, I know it will happen. The competition have no hardware planned whatsoever before this Christmas. It's so obvious it's unreal.

 

I would be surprised if even 5% of gamers would base a console purchase on whether it includes a UHD drive. People will see it plays games better and is called Pro and will buy it. And you can bet, we will remind you of this. :heh:

 

As for another comment in this topic about whether the Pro was ever said to be same generation - we have literally been saying this the whole time!

 

I more or less agree, but I was hoping for the UHD drive. It's a lost sale, and I doubt I'm alone. It is a misstep on their and does give a bonus to Microsoft.

 

I do agree that it's not a huge mistake; let's be real 4KTV market penetration isn't huge yet and the media available is an even smaller pool. I mean how many actual 4K Bluray movies are out? And I don't mean the ones masters in 4K and then scaled down to 1080p. Really the pro will likely be the top seller come Christmas, the latest and greatest always has appeal.

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PS4 Pro is already top a seller on Amazon.com and Amazon.co.uk. Sony will ship consoles. Let's see how many :D

 

Not up for pre-order in Germany, yet.

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If I had a 4k TV I couldn't care about 4k blu rays. I have never played blu rays on my PS4 as it is and neither do I have a separate blu ray player.

 

I just stream films or box sets that I want to watch. I imagine a lot of people will be the same. It does seem rather strange that Sony has not included a player but to be honest I doubt it will have that much of an impact.

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If anyone spots any PS4 trade in deals can they @ me! :)

 

It's the only way I'll pick up the Pro for the time being.

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Worth a read,

 

I went into the PlayStation Meeting today as a sceptic, believing that the hardware may not be up to the task of powering a 4K display. The good news is that several hours later, I emerged from the event impressed with the quality of the experience and respectful of the wizardry utilised to make this GPU punch above its weight. However, fundamentally, there's little doubt that PlayStation 4 Pro is going to be a tough sell. Traditional gaming media simply can't capture and communicate the quality of the imagery I saw today, as there's no real way to showcase HDR meaningfully. And this is actually a key component of the PlayStation 4 Pro experience. 4K is impressive and a worthy upgrade in its own right, but HDR takes it to the next level.

 

Pre-ordered.

 

Cancelling my PSVR pre-order.

 

Starts looking at 60" 4K HDR TVs.

Edited by Daft

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The pro looks lovely, except aesthetically which I am not sold on at all. It should have more of an accent, sharper edges and be more different to the new slim. However, a 4k TV and this might be my next luxury purchase when I have the spare cash. Was going to be a HTC Vive but now I'm having my doubts about the (near) future of VR. At first I was put off by no 4k blu-ray but then I realised I'm the same as @Blade, I don't buy Blu-rays or any videos on physical media anymore so not too bothered about that.

But I was speaking of myself, not others. As I said, it's what I'm interested in.

I'm not sure if we're getting our wires crossed but against your original concern that PS4 Pro multiplayer players could have an advantage over PS4 players, I was trying to explain that, as evidenced by existing circumstances with PC gamers, the hardware discrepancy shouldn't affect your gaming experience, because they will use software to level the playing field.

Edited by Shorty

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Worth a read,

 

 

 

Pre-ordered.

 

Cancelling my PSVR pre-order.

 

Starts looking at 60" 4K HDR TVs.

 

Was just going to post this. It really does sound like a stellar upgrade.

 

Almost certainly can't buy a decent 4K TV for a while though as planning for our wedding next year... :(

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...I'm not sure if we're getting our wires crossed but against your original concern that PS4 Pro multiplayer players could have an advantage over PS4 players, I was trying to explain that, as evidenced by existing circumstances with PC gamers, the hardware discrepancy shouldn't affect your gaming experience, because they will use software to level the playing field.

 

Ah, yeah, definitely had my wires crossed then! Haha

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My favourite reaction has been about the HDR; "I see no difference!"; "Looks the same to me."; yeah, no fucking shit poindexter, you're watching a shitty stream on a non-HDR, non-4K screen.

 

Cerny, "Old screens literally cannot display the whole gambit of colours, brightness and intensity of new screens." T'internet's response, "I can't see all these new colours, WTF?"

 

This is like when HD was the new thing and people couldn't see the difference, until they had the capability to.

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