PS4 Pro

[Ronnie]

Ashley, I appreciate you taking my complaint seriously and the time and effort you took into checking the various posts. I wish I could say I had the motivation to do likewise, maybe I will at some point this week. All I'll say is use your gut, and try and think back to the Wii U thread as a whole. You don't need search results to tell you that the majority of that thread is nothing but complaints. As I said, nothing wrong with that, unpleasant as it is, my issue is when I post complaints in the PS4 thread (no folders, no online friend popups, no activity log etc...) I get shot down and accused of having an agenda and people compare and ridicule the Wii U instead.

 

I have every right to be annoyed about the PS4K, it sounds like half the people out there are equally pissed off. I don't think having a go at me for saying "thanks a lot Playstation" and "f you Sony" in the heat of the moment is such a big deal, or deserves all these pages of arguments.

 

 

Does the whole gaming community kick up a fuss when a better graphics card is released for the PC? No, because you don't NEED to get the new one if your computer can already play the game.

 

It's a completely different situation. There isn't one piece of hardware with PC gaming and you know what you're getting into with that ecosystem. With console gaming people don't expect incremental upgrades like this two or three years after release.

Edited April 20, 2016 by Ronnie

[Eddage]

It's a completely different situation. There isn't one piece of hardware with PC gaming and you know what you're getting into with that ecosystem. With console gaming people don't expect incremental upgrades like this two or three years after release.

 

But what harm does it do? If you don't need the new revision to play the games then it shouldn't matter, just don't buy it...

 

If at some point in the future it comes to the stage where there are MAJOR differences between the games, not just looks a bit prettier and runs a bit smoother then I agree it would be bad but at this moment in time, with the facts we have, everyone just seems to be jumping to conclusions.

 

All this is is a nice extra for people who want it and I don't believe it will impact those who don't buy it, just like with games developed for PC which look better and run better if you have a top of the range PC but still play fine on cheaper systems.

[Ashley]

You don't help yourself though when it comes to the agenda thing. You lied in the Uncharted 4 thread, you out of nowhere posted a negative review in The Division thread (your first post in there) without any substantial commentary, you were moaning about your Vita (fine) and then said "maybe I'm just used to the 3DS always working" which comes across as petty point scoring. Maybe in these cases you didn't mean to provoke, but they're often dropped in without context, expansion and often never followed up when questioned. It makes you come across as someone that intentionally tries to provoke.

 

And I do need search results. I need proof as I said. I need to see why you think the thread is mostly negative bearing in mind people are welcome to dislike and criticise Nintendo providing they explain it and are open to discussion, which is often the case, which is not something you yourself do in the examples I give above (but I know those are a few examples amongst other posts). You may not like their answer and it may indeed paint Nintendo in a negative light but that doesn't mean they're not entitled to it. The fact the Wii U has sold so poorly compared to others (this and previous generations) is not an accident. People are going to be disappointed and this is not the first time I've told you that you are not there to police how people feel about Nintendo. People are criticising Sony in this thread (drahkon, kav, DCubed) but are doing so in a more reasonable manner. The reason people are taking concern with your posts is because they have inflammatory language, contradicts your position on how people should treat Nintendo (which is why I pointed out HoTs post) and when questioned you keep coming back with "but everyone hates Nintendo and loves Sony!" without proving it. If you keep doing this you'll lose credibility in the eyes of others.

 

I think I have made a reasonable case to show justified dissatisfaction with any console maker is fine. Your concern seems to be that more people are fond of Sony this generation than Nintendo and I'm sorry but that is not the fault of this forum. The NX may change that. The PS4K may change that. You shouting and accusing and ranting will not.

[Ronnie]

But what harm does it do? If you don't need the new revision to play the games then it shouldn't matter, just don't buy it...

 

If at some point in the future it comes to the stage where there are MAJOR differences between the games, not just looks a bit prettier and runs a bit smoother then I agree it would be bad but at this moment in time, with the facts we have, everyone just seems to be jumping to conclusions.

 

All this is is a nice extra for people who want it and I don't believe it will impact those who don't buy it, just like with games developed for PC which look better and run better if you have a top of the range PC but still play fine on cheaper systems.

 

It's just a shitty thing for Playstation to do. People buy their console expecting certain mileage out of it, and 30 million people are now being told sorry, you've now got old tech, spend another 300 quid and our top of the range console, again.

[drahkon]

and 30 million people are now being told sorry, you've now got old tech, spend another 300 quid and our top of the range console, again.

 

They're not, though. Sony tells the user base: You have the option to buy a an improved console.

[Eddage]

It's just a shitty thing for Playstation to do. People buy their console expecting certain mileage out of it, and 30 million people are now being told sorry, you've now got old tech, spend another 300 quid and our top of the range console, again.

 

But no one NEEDS to buy the new one, they'll still be getting all the games they would have gotten if NEO wasn't a thing.

 

I personally think it's great, if people want to spend the money to get a prettier version they can, if not they'll just get the same version that they would have bought anyway.

 

Also you keep mentioning Sony shortening the generations. If anything I believe this will mean the PS4 generation will last longer. The need for the PS5 won't be as great because of the NEO. If this launches at the end of this year then that's three years after the PS4, so it's not unreasonable to think that it would be another three years at least until we see the PS5, meaning a six year generation. Certainly better than the four years between Wii U and NX (assuming NX releases at the end of this year).

[Ronnie]

You don't help yourself though when it comes to the agenda thing. You lied in the Uncharted 4 thread, you out of nowhere posted a negative review in The Division thread (your first post in there) without any substantial commentary, you were moaning about your Vita (fine) and then said "maybe I'm just used to the 3DS always working" which comes across as petty point scoring. Maybe in these cases you didn't mean to provoke, but they're often dropped in without context, expansion and often never followed up when questioned. It makes you come across as someone that intentionally tries to provoke.

 

Lied in the Uncharted 4 thread?? Because I mistakenly wrote weeks instead of months? That was a typo. My post in the Division thread was a little mischievous I'll admit, poking fun at just how every other AAA game these days seems to be an openworld shooter/RPG, but plenty do similar when they say the Wii U had nothing but platformers or bring up (recently) the lack of voice chat in Splatoon as bait/a joke. As for the complaints about my Vita, the way it wouldn't run games was just bizarre. The last time I'd ever experienced something like that was having to blow in NES cartridges. I really was just used to games working on Nintendo consoles.

 

People are criticising Sony in this thread (drahkon, kav, DCubed) but are doing so in a more reasonable manner.

 

Do people complain for pages and pages whenever someone says "Thanks a lot Nintendo" or "f off Nintendo"? No. Other forum members have shared their disbelief at how much grief I'm getting for venting. At that particular moment in time, I was angry. It really isn't that big a deal. People are just far too defensive when it comes to Playstation, the slightest bit of complaining and everyone has a go. Eg: my complaints about the PS4 OS being ridiculed.

 

Your concern seems to be that more people are fond of Sony this generation than Nintendo and I'm sorry but that is not the fault of this forum.

 

I have no problem with people being more fond of Playstation this generation, it's obvious every day on this message board. What I do have a problem with are the double standards which I'm sorry are clear for all to see.

 

They're not, though. Sony tells the user base: You have the option to buy a an improved console.

 

It's just a shitty way of treating the 30 million people who supported your console, subjecting them to an inferior product for the next few years. At least these leaks give them two months to think of a good PR message...

Edited April 20, 2016 by Ronnie
Automerged Doublepost

[Eddage]

I have no problem with people being more fond of Playstation this generation, it's obvious every day on this message board. What I do have a problem with are the double standards which I'm sorry are clear for all to see.

 

No, they are apparently clear for you to incorrectly perceive. There are no double standards.

 

(I know I'm not helping but I don't care anymore)

 

It's just a shitty way of treating the 30 million people who supported your console, subjecting them to an inferior product for the next few years. At least these leaks give them two months to think of a good PR message...

 

But it doesn't matter, the games that would have been released on the base PS4 are not going to suddenly become shit just because slightly better versions are available!

[Ronnie]

But it doesn't matter, the games that would have been released on the base PS4 are not going to suddenly become shit just because slightly better versions are available!

 

No but there's going to be a better version out there, for all those suckers who spend another 300 quid.

[drahkon]

It's just a shitty way of treating the 30 million people who supported your console, subjecting them to an inferior product for the next few years. At least these leaks give them two months to think of a good PR message...

 

That "inferior" product is pretty damn great, though.

 

And so far Sony hasn't announced anything so right now they aren't treating anybody in a shitty way. Just wait and see what this new console will be and how they'll announce/market it.

 

If they fuck it up, they have no one but themselves to blame. If they sell another 30 million of the new console and "standard" PS4 consoles continue to sell they did everything right.

 

Time will tell.

 

No but there's going to be a better version out there, for all those suckers who spend another 300 quid.

 

And for those who don't spend another whatever the price will be NOTHING has changed...

[Ronnie]

I hope whoever double dips remembers how the gaming industry cried with laughter over this, because it's basically what you're paying for a Playstation console this gen:

 

[drahkon]

I hope whoever double dips remembers how the gaming industry cried with laughter over this, because it's basically what you're paying for a Playstation console this gen

 

Can't you see how wrong you are?

It's what you would pay for two consoles. If the PS4.5 gets release I won't buy it, yet I'd own a PlayStation console this gen and wouldn't have paid what you posted there.

 

What if the NX was a hybrid and comes in two iterations: one home console for 250-300 bucks and one portable device for 200-250 bucks. Would you be upset, too?

[Eddage]

No but there's going to be a better version out there, for all those suckers who spend another 300 quid.

SO DON'T BUY IT THEN!

 

No one is forcing you to upgrade, you can still play all the same games without buying it. It is not the end of a generation, like I said earlier, if anything, it is an attempt to lengthen the current one.

[Ashley]

Lied in the Uncharted 4 thread?? Because I mistakenly wrote weeks instead of months? That was a typo. My post in the Division thread was a little mischievous I'll admit, poking fun at just how every other AAA game these days seems to be an openworld shooter/RPG, but plenty do similar when they say the Wii U had nothing but platformers or bring up (recently) the lack of voice chat in Splatoon as bait/a joke. As for the complaints about my Vita, the way it wouldn't run games was just bizarre. The last time I'd ever experienced something like that was having to blow in NES cartridges. I really was just used to games working on Nintendo consoles.

 

You could have had the decency to go back in and say you made a mistake, otherwise yes it appears like a lie.

 

Your post in The Division thread was an intentional bait, which is against the rules. When raised you then 'justified' it by saying "As much bait as "The Wii U has nothing but 2D platformers' was". If you search for "The Wii U has nothing but 2D platformers" across the whole forum yours is the only post that comes up. Yes it's a specific quote but it does show how you have a habit of misremembering or misinterpreting situations (its fine, it's human).

 

Do people complain for pages and pages whenever someone says "Thanks a lot Nintendo" or "f off Nintendo"? No.

 

Because as I have proved people do not say this.

 

Other forum members have shared their disbelief at how much grief I'm getting for venting.

 

If you wish to play this game, other forum members have complained about how much grief you are giving. Not just in this thread or the NX but other threads recently.

 

At that particular moment in time, I was angry. It really isn't that big a deal. People are just far too defensive when it comes to Playstation, the slightest bit of complaining and everyone has a go. Eg: my complaints about the PS4 OS being ridiculed.

 

As others have said in this thread, you are complaining that Sony is "making" people update and the PS4 games will now look "shitty". Both of these are untrue. You may feel that Sony is making you update. You may feel that the PS4 games will look comparatively shitty but Sony is not forcing anyone to update (a lot of people in this thread are saying they won't update and nobody from Sony is knocking on their door) and the PS4 games will still look the same as they did a month ago before this all started.

 

Please can you provide me with some examples of being ridiculed and I shall follow up.

 

I have no problem with people being more fond of Playstation this generation, it's obvious every day on this message board. What I do have a problem with are the double standards which I'm sorry are clear for all to see.

 

This is where I stopped trying to reason with you and got frustrated again.

 

I previously told you that until you can provide clear proof that this is happening - that unjustified criticism is encouraged, celebrated and revelled in while Sony criticism is shut down like you claim - stop saying stuff like it is "clear for all to see" because you seem to be the only one seeing it. Saying "it is clear" does not make it clear. I have now given you two warnings about this. You are skating on thin ice. Not just because of this, but because of past issues.

 

You are clearly not listening to me.

 

It's just a shitty way of treating the 30 million people who supported your console, subjecting them to an inferior product for the next few years.

 

Let other people decide if they feel they're being treated in a shitty way. You can feel like you're being treated like shit. Others can. They will. People will. You have proven this with your opinions and with that video and previous mentions to IGN. What you have not, and categorically cannot, proven is 30 million people are feeling like they're being treated in a shitty way.

 

Right now I feel like you're treating me in a shitty way, but does this make it a universal truth?

 

No but there's going to be a better version out there, for all those suckers who spend another 300 quid.

 

There's a better version of my tablet out there, I have chosen not to buy it. There's about 10 years of better versions of my TV out there, I have chosen not to buy it. There's a better version of my ipad out there, I have chosen not to buy it. There's better versions of my laptop out there, I have chosen not to buy it.

 

Someone who chooses to spend money is not a sucker. They are an individual with their own capacity to make decisions. You calling them suckers for choosing to do so is rude.

Edited April 20, 2016 by Ashley

[Nolan]

As I said, nothing wrong with that, unpleasant as it is, my issue is when I post complaints in the PS4 thread (no folders, no online friend popups, no activity log etc...) I get shot down and accused of having an agenda and people compare and ridicule the Wii U instead.

It's taken them far too long (years I'd say) but I believe with the latest firmware they've added popups for when friends come online and finally added appearing offline. Folders could be nice but I personally don't see the point, and I'm not sure what you mean by no activity log. I was under the impression that under a users profile there was a category to show their recent activities.

 

It's just a shitty thing for Playstation to do. People buy their console expecting certain mileage out of it, and 30 million people are now being told sorry, you've now got old tech, spend another 300 quid and our top of the range console, again.

 

In the PC side of things its somewhat standard operating procedure. A 3 year old GPU right now can still play games, but to really get the most every year or two is an upgrade.

 

Granted on the console side of things, people get and want a console that just works and delivers perfectly acceptable performance. They don't want the headache or cost of staying cutting edge which is what this console essentially is. Just an upgrade to stay a little closer to the cutting edge. It is a shitty thing to do, but current trends are pointing towards consoles possibly becoming more modular and PC-lite in terms of hardware.

[Ronnie]

Can't you see how wrong you are?

It's what you would pay for two consoles. If the PS4.5 gets release I won't buy it, yet I'd own a PlayStation console this gen and wouldn't have paid what you posted there.

 

What if the NX was a hybrid and comes in two iterations: one home console for 250-300 bucks and one portable device for 200-250 bucks. Would you be upset, too?

 

No because I'm buying two separate devices that do two separate things. Glad to hear you won't buy the PS4.5, I hope you enjoy the next three or four years knowing the games you're playing could look much better on Sony's top of the line PS4.

 

SO DON'T BUY IT THEN!

 

No one is forcing you to upgrade, you can still play all the same games without buying it. It is not the end of a generation, like I said earlier, if anything, it is an attempt to lengthen the current one.

 

It's just a terrible way to treat your consumers and the people who've supported you from the beginning.

[Sheikah]

It's just a shitty thing for Playstation to do. People buy their console expecting certain mileage out of it, and 30 million people are now being told sorry, you've now got old tech, spend another 300 quid and our top of the range console, again.

 

And those people are still getting the mileage out of it. Because according to what we have heard, there will be no exclusive PS4 games. If this is indeed the case then those people will still get a full console life of games running at the graphical level they bought into. In that sense, nobody has been duped, and the mileage has not diminished; if anything I can see this generation lasting even longer now due to a revised console keeping it relevant for longer.

 

What I don't understand is why you are seemingly so livid over the PS4K rumours and yet I heard absolutely nothing like this from you regarding the N3DS. The N3DS was worse than the PS4K because unlike what we know so far about the PS4K, the N3DS did segregate its audience by having exclusive games. It was a clear technical upgrade (reducing load times, smoother OS) and also ran games better, to the point it could actually run them (unlike the older model). You only need to look at Xenoblade Chronicles running on N3DS to see that the system was much more capable. That to me is a much bigger shafting as you expect your system to run all the games released on that brand...yet, seemingly you were not nearly as bothered by it.

Edited April 20, 2016 by Sheikah

[drahkon]

No because I'm buying two separate devices that do two separate things.

 

They play games...possibly the same games because that would be the crux of the hybrid aspect. So how do they do separate things?

 

Glad to hear you won't buy the PS4.5, I hope you enjoy the next three or four years knowing the games you're playing could look much better on Sony's top of the line PS4.

 

First of all: We don't know how much better games would look on the new PS4, if they even do at all...

Secondly: I'll be very happy with everything the standard PS4 has in store There's so much coming out that I will enjoy a lot and nothing will change that.

[Retro_Link]

No but there's going to be a better version out there, for all those suckers who spend another 300 quid.

Sorry Ronnie but the NEW 3DS version of Hyrule Warriors runs perfectly, whilst the 3DS version has fewer enemies and you can't even turn on 3D...

 

What's been frustrating me today is you don't even seem to be factoring in that we do not even have confirmation of what the PS4K is. Everything is hyperbole, absolutes and assumptions. I don't see why you're taking it upon yourself to get so worked up over rumours.

 

For all you know Sony will give you £200 off a PS4K if you buy one. They may not at all, but the fact is that's just as likely a statement right now.

 

And really, why do you suddenly care about a few up-scaled textures and the like? You were happy playing Wii games whilst the PS3 and 360 were in HD. And every multiplatform game on the Wii and Wii U for the last 8 years has been an inferior version. You and others still buy them.

[Eddage]

It's just a terrible way to treat your consumers and the people who've supported you from the beginning.

Or its a fantastic way to treat your customers who want to play prettier games on newer tech. And those that aren't worried about that are in exactly the same position they would be in if it was never released.

[Blade]

No because I'm buying two separate devices that do two separate things. Glad to hear you won't buy the PS4.5, I hope you enjoy the next three or four years knowing the games you're playing could look much better on Sony's top of the line PS4.

 

 

 

It's just a terrible way to treat your consumers and the people who've supported you from the beginning.

 

Have I missed something? Has it been confirmed yet by Sony? Please could someone @ me when it does.

 

Until then @drahkon doesn't know whether his games could look so much better on the PS4k as (to my knowledge, please tell me if i'm wrong) it has yet to be confirmed.

 

I think Ronnie its the language you use. Its fine being pissed off with rumours and not wanting them to be true. Its fine to express your disappointment with rumours. The problem is that you express your disappointment as if what the PS4k can do as fact when everything is still unconfirmed. Its like you don't even acknowledge they are runours but instead just have the intention to get a reaction.

 

Has Sony even confirmed the existence of the PS4k?

[Ashley]

Has Sony even confirmed the existence of the PS4k?

 

Not officially. It is very unlikely they will do it until E3 (or maybe just before E3).

[Sheikah]

Or its a fantastic way to treat your customers who want to play prettier games on newer tech. And those that aren't worried about that are in exactly the same position they would be in if it was never released.

 

The more I think about it, the more it makes sense for them to do this, at least for their own interests.

 

End of generation is a risky time when people may cross sides, as they did PS2 to 360 and similarly 360 to PS4.

 

Rather than take a gamble sooner with the PS5 with many unknowns it makes quite a bit of sense to extend the life of a generation that is doing awfully well for you.

 

I still think that there is potential positive in this for non-PS4K adopters, if these rumours are true - this could keep the generation going for longer, including for base model owners.

Edited April 20, 2016 by Sheikah

[Ronnie]

What I don't understand is why you are seemingly so livid over the PS4K rumours and yet I heard absolutely nothing like this from you regarding the N3DS. The N3DS was worse than the PS4K because unlike what we know so far about the PS4K, the N3DS did segregate its audience by having exclusive games. It was a clear technical upgrade (reducing load times, smoother OS) and also ran games better, to the point it could actually run them (unlike the older model). You only need to look at Xenoblade Chronicles running on N3DS to see that the system was much more capable. That to me is a much bigger shafting as you expect your system to run all the games released on that brand...yet, seemingly you were not nearly as bothered by it.

 

The new 3DS was released four years after the original, not two and a half to three and apart from Xenoblade and Hyrule Warriors Legends, games look exactly the same on both. The PS4K will have two modes for every game, original, and upgraded.

 

For all you know Sony will give you £200 off a PS4K if you buy one. They may not at all, but the fact is that's just as likely a statement right now.

 

Given the backlash out there at the moment about these PS4K leaks they may very well be planning something like that. I hope so anyway, that would certainly make up for things in my mind.

 

Or its a fantastic way to treat your customers who want to play prettier games on newer tech.

 

The PS4K is a "fantastic way to treat their customers"? Do you honestly believe that? It's a fantastic way to treat customers who don't have a PS4, for sure. Everyone else, not so much.

 

Has Sony even confirmed the existence of the PS4k?

 

They'll confirm it at E3. The fine print and PR will be interesting.

 

You could have had the decency to go back in and say you made a mistake, otherwise yes it appears like a lie.

 

You call me a liar, because of one typo, and then complain that I'm treating you in a shitty way? I should "have the decency" to go back and correct this "lie"?? It was obvious to anyone reading my post that it was inaccurate. I hadn't been back in the Uncharted 4 thread until today when I've only just realised my typo. Next time someone makes an obvious error while typing like saying the release of Starfox is out in a couple of weeks instead of a couple of days, are you going to call them a liar as well?

 

If you search for "The Wii U has nothing but 2D platformers" across the whole forum yours is the only post that comes up.

 

You're honestly telling me I'm the only person who said that? That sentiment has been said over the past year or so at least a dozen times. Want proof? Here you go...

 

Now we have 2D platformers everywhere and if they're not 2D, they're semi-3D like Mario 3D World.

 

The online infrastructure is pales in comparison to what is offered elsewhere - no party chat, no streaming, the over reliance on platformers and party games - people want to see variety

 

This conversation is all that is wrong with the Wii U... platformers, platformers and platformers!

 

A lot of their games are platformers, or games we have seen from them before

 

It doesen't matter. 2D platformers are still waaaay to big of a part of Nintendo's lineup.

 

The system has a lot of the same kind of stuff (much of which is 2D platformers)

 

The only genre Nintendo dominate is 2D platformers.

 

it's not just the droughts, but the fact that for about a year all they released were bloody platformers.

 

Also with regards to variety, they do release too many platformers, and they're beginning to bore me a little at the minute

 

The Wii U catalogue is already saturated to the max with platformers

 

That's after a very quick search, there's probably far better examples out there.

 

people do not say this.

 

Yes they do. You posted people saying those exact words.

 

until you can provide clear proof that this is happening

 

I bring it up every time it happens. Apologies, I'm not about to spend even more time trawling through an entire message board looking for more examples. From now on I'll flag them up and PM them at a later date if you'd like.

[Retro_Link]

Could you just clarify this part of my post @Ronnie, because it's puzzling...

 

And really, why do you suddenly care about a few up-scaled textures and the like? You were happy playing Wii games whilst the PS3 and 360 were in HD. And every multiplatform game on the Wii and Wii U for the last 8 years has been an inferior version. You and others still buy them.