Cube Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 People need to also realise that some people are happy with the Wii U on here and that there is nothing wrong with holding that opinion. And you know what? We want more of this. If people could post more positive stuff about the Wii U, especially without comparing it to other consoles, then that would be brilliant.
Rummy Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 Also, the vast majority of people unhappy with the Wii U on this forum are Nintendo fans. And most importantly - Wii U owners. I don't want to get embroiled in some of the sillyness of the last few days of this thread - I've found myself identifying very much with @Fierce_LiNk however, and I think I share many of his sentiments. Re:Generations - my worry is that the Wii U isn't really in one. It's almost halfway between 'last' and 'current', my greatest concern is how developers view it really - do they see it as this gen, last gen, next gen? What gen? I want more content, more games, and it's the developers and publishers who are going to give me that - but they aren't giving as much as I feel they could - so why not? This is a very big picture, with many factors. Value is a very big part of it. Sales is too. Money money money, profit profit profit! This all seemed to come out of an argument of value, and prices, and sales. Nobody is neccessarily the Wii U isn't worth buying at all - however I'm solidly inclined to agree that a WiiU+MK8 this summer in the current market is certainly not worth paying £250 for. Maybe £200, possibly £220 with a(as suggested by someone many pages back)+1st party game download code included. Have MK8 as digital download not retail and you've a slightly larger profit margin there too. (What 'generation' was the PS1 in btw? Being first of its ilk - was it the first generation? Where do these 'generations' start and end?)
Cube Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 (What 'generation' was the PS1 in btw? Being first of its ilk - was it the first generation? Where do these 'generations' start and end?) If you listen to EA, the PS1 was the first generation. To everyone else, it was the fifth generation alongside the N64, Saturn and Jaguar.
Falcon_BlizZACK Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 Surely thats subjective as well as unfair. Your comparing the library of a system which has been out for nearly 18 months with with two consoles that are barely 6 months old. As for the DC well Sega's errors prior to the DC was the reason the console died. Still what Sega did in its short lifespan to me is way more than what Nintendo have done for the Wii U. Flip the coin. People are also comparing the future potential library of the PS4/One against the current library of the Wii U as a versus selling point. Subjective. Unfair. Ridiculous.
Blade Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 I find it hilarious how people take offence to someone dissing a console they own. If you are enjoying it then what does it matter? Exactly my point! Issue is if you say you enjoy it you get the standard response "well you might, but no one else likes the mediocre games" line again after again haha!
Ike Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 If you listen to EA, the PS1 was the first generation. To everyone else, it was the fifth generation alongside the N64, Saturn and Jaguar. I'd say it's both. 1st gen in Sony's line of consoles, 5th gen when regarded as a whole.
Retro_Link Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 (edited) Well I personally think the part I've bolded is utter rubbish! A generation is a time frame. People can quite obviously argue that the Wii U is underpowered, which is something we can all debate, but it is quite clearly part of this generation as that is when it was released! I love my Wii U and am currently playing Metroid Fusion - excellent game and the first time I've played. I think with the addition of GBA games I have quite an extension collection of retail and digital downloads! Well then you too overlooked my previous post. The Wii U isn't powerful/popular enough to outlast the current generation it finds itself in, so what will happen when they successor comes out. Nintendo will have the only next gen for 5 years whilst the PS4 and Xbone are then classed as last gen? despite the fact the next Nintendo system will likely only match the specs of the other two consoles. The situation gets rediculous and overly complicated. We might as well just scrap the term altogether. People need to also realise that some people are happy with the Wii U on here and that there is nothing wrong with holding that opinion.As @Hero of Time just said, and I've said countless times... make threads to talk about these positive Wii U things then! Please give me an example of what you'd like to be talking about if 'these other members weren't coming in and ruining threads'... because quite frankly I don't really see any evidence of members doing it. Positive threads created for the Wii U are seldom posted in when they arise, whilst 'controversial' discussion threads are by far the most popular. Members on here seem to like to say 'I want to come on here and talk positively about the Wii U because I'm enjoying it'... but aren't actually doing it Frankly I'm getting really fed up of it. I've tried myself so many times to create positive discussion and they get ignored, Mods can only do so much, and it isn't even our job to do it, it's only because I like this place and want to see it succeed. Honestly I question sometimes that if I just went ahead and banned all the members that people call for being banned, whether we'd even have a forum left at all. Edited April 17, 2014 by Retro_Link
dazzybee Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 I just don't see it as positive or negative, and I also don't care if the, in my opinion, incessantly negative people are/were Nintendo fans that seems to justify their negativity (this is exactly like "I'm not racist, I have a black friend", it's no argument to support their views, unless it's about specifically stuff we've played) And people do try and be positive, the problem is, some how, it always seems to come back round to being a bitch fest, so then people, I presume, definitely me, think what's the point. And also, I WANT to chat about the negative stuff, and come up with ideas and solutions, but this forum seems a long way away from being able to do that without it descending into madness. I've done this many times, it never seems to get any traction, but ill try again. If this happened, would people think the Wii u was with mario kart was worth £250 June - mario kart July - miamotos gamepad/NFC games August - bayonetta 2 September - Hyrule warriors October - Pilotwings November - Metroid prime December - smash bros Say a good 20 fantastic indies on the eshop. The virtual console getting 2 releases every week on the various platforms If that happened, would people think the Wii u would be more a much more attractive proposition? I genuinely think if there was a steady stream of games, people would be happy.
Fierce_LiNk Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 Flip the coin. People are also comparing the future potential library of the PS4/One against the current library of the Wii U as a versus selling point. Subjective. Unfair. Ridiculous. I don't understand what you're trying to say here. The future potential for any console is a selling point. I bought the Wii U because of Nintendo and their history of creating good games. So, I'm using the potential library as a reason to buy the console. So, it is a selling point. The potential library for the PS4/One is a massive selling point. Even for the general third party games, many of which may not or will not be coming to the Wii U. EA have seemingly abandoned the console. So, looking at the current library and situation, you have to ask yourself "is the situation going to get better?" Are third parties going to come back (because they have left, there's no argument there) and create games for the Wii U? If the answer is no, then what? What Nintendo does have and what the competition will never have are Nintendo's own games. That's their strength and that will determine how long they will keep going with the Wii U. That's one draw that will continue to bring certain gamers in (the lifelong Nintendo fans) as long as they're interested. They have that in their favour.
Goron_3 Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 Can we drop the whole 'Wii U has the best games, it's the next dreamcast' bullshit? Yes, it has 2 multiplayer Mario games, a Pikmin and TW101, but surely the fact that NO ONE is buying the console proves how few people care about those games when it comes to buying a system? The dreamcast didn't just do sequels and follow ups to old games, it did completely new things for a home console and it had some incredible arcade ports. The Dreamcast WAS ahead of it's time. Surely you guys can realise that another Mario multiplayer sequel and another Donkey Kong aren't important to 90% or so of the gaming public? And of course on top of that it has the worst performing version of gamings like CoD, Assassins etc. You can play the 'PS4 has no games' card but look at the multiplatform titles it has; unless you own a great desktop you aren't going to play those games on a better platform.
dazzybee Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 I just re read the discussion again, it was quite an interesting discussion, and then someone came in and - "Wii u doesn't have any games" and critisising people's opinions for enjoying the Wii - "blind" and "excuse mongering" and then it all went to shit Strange because I really like that poster, but lately they're really down on Nintendo and really sticking it in.
Falcon_BlizZACK Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 (edited) I don't understand what you're trying to say here. The future potential for any console is a selling point. I bought the Wii U because of Nintendo and their history of creating good games. So, I'm using the potential library as a reason to buy the console. So, it is a selling point. The potential library for the PS4/One is a massive selling point. Even for the general third party games, many of which may not or will not be coming to the Wii U. EA have seemingly abandoned the console. So, looking at the current library and situation, you have to ask yourself "is the situation going to get better?" Are third parties going to come back (because they have left, there's no argument there) and create games for the Wii U? If the answer is no, then what? What Nintendo does have and what the competition will never have are Nintendo's own games. That's their strength and that will determine how long they will keep going with the Wii U. That's one draw that will continue to bring certain gamers in (the lifelong Nintendo fans) as long as they're interested. They have that in their favour. Well, sure it is a selling point - But to say the PS4 best suits my needs CURRENTLY over the Wii U (which is my point), based on games that will PROBABLY arrive (on the PS4), is just trolling. People speak like there is literally no game they can play on the Wii U - at one point when I was looking to buy a PS4/One - I saw very clearly the Wii U line-up is the strongest. Edited April 17, 2014 by King_V
dazzybee Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 Can we drop the whole 'Wii U has the best games, it's the next dreamcast' bullshit? Yes, it has 2 multiplayer Mario games, a Pikmin and TW101, but surely the fact that NO ONE is buying the console proves how few people care about those games when it comes to buying a system? The dreamcast didn't just do sequels and follow ups to old games, it did completely new things for a home console and it had some incredible arcade ports. The Dreamcast WAS ahead of it's time. Surely you guys can realise that another Mario multiplayer sequel and another Donkey Kong aren't important to 90% or so of the gaming public? And of course on top of that it has the worst performing version of gamings like CoD, Assassins etc. You can play the 'PS4 has no games' card but look at the multiplatform titles it has; unless you own a great desktop you aren't going to play those games on a better platform. NO!!! What a ridiculous thing to say, if people think it has the best games, which I do, then they are allowed that opinion. The fact people aren't buying it DOES NOT SHOW THE GAMES ARENT GREAT, is shawshank redemption awful because it bombed at the cinema. I detest this simplistic way of thinking. And in the same breath you say but the ls4 is great because it has multiplatform games... So weird. Why is it okay for you to say ps4 is great because it has multiplatform games, but not people to say the Wii u has nintendo games? And why do you and people care how many people buy mario, or pikmin, or w101? Why do you care? Why is it such a sign of quality for you?
Retro_Link Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 One thing that makes me laugh is the view that the WiiU isn't worth buying because of the lack of games... "when all the big games are out then it's a worthwhile purchase" etc posts. Then you've got the reply of "It's got the best line-up of the 3 latest gen consoles". Followed by "People buy the XBO/PS4 for the games that will eventually come out" Erm, first post moot much then? The opposing view to that is that the PS4 and the Xbone have been out 6 months, the Wii U 1.5 years. The two shouldn't even be being compared. The Wii U had sod all in it's first 6 months, just like the PS4 and Xbone. 1 year further down the line and the Wii U has a good games library, just like the PS4 and Xbone will have 1 year from now (which is the 'games will come' part). It's quite simple. Some members just seem incapable of opening their minds and have to compare things in the now to score points.
dazzybee Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 @Goron_3 your post is literally the problem people have here in a nutshell. You basically said no one is allowed to say the Wii u has great games and is like the dream cast. But the ps4 is amazing because in the future it will have all this amazing 3rd parties.... I can't believe you posted it actually.... The opposing view to that is that the PS4 and the Xbone have been out 6 months, the Wii U 1.5 years. The two shouldn't even be being compared. The Wii U had sod all in it's first 6 months, just like the PS4 and Xbone. 1 year further down the line and the Wii U has a good games library, just like the PS4 and Xbone will have 1 year from now (which is the 'games will come' part). It's quite simple. Some members just seem incapable of opening their minds and have to compare things in the now to score points. But everyone's comparing them in some way, in whatever way suits their opinion. Now the Wii u has better games, but the future is better on ps4 and xb1. What is the actual thing we're debating because it's all getting thrown in, what console has the games you want to play now? What console has the games you want to play in the future? It's pretty simple and no one needs to justify their decisions, but here we have to. I think we should have a business thread so people who want to discuss how Nintendo can get more sales can post in there, as we literally talk about success more than quality in here.
Falcon_BlizZACK Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 Can we drop the whole 'Wii U has the best games, it's the next dreamcast' bullshit? Yes, it has 2 multiplayer Mario games, a Pikmin and TW101, but surely the fact that NO ONE is buying the console proves how few people care about those games when it comes to buying a system? The dreamcast didn't just do sequels and follow ups to old games, it did completely new things for a home console and it had some incredible arcade ports. The Dreamcast WAS ahead of it's time. Surely you guys can realise that another Mario multiplayer sequel and another Donkey Kong aren't important to 90% or so of the gaming public? And of course on top of that it has the worst performing version of gamings like CoD, Assassins etc. You can play the 'PS4 has no games' card but look at the multiplatform titles it has; unless you own a great desktop you aren't going to play those games on a better platform. Sadly thats the problem right there - People, for whatever reason, in disbelief of another persons opinion, tries to make them 'see the light' and almost persuade others to believe their line of thinking. I just wanna be 'atheist', dude. Stop preaching.
Fierce_LiNk Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 (edited) Well, sure it is a selling point - But to say the PS4 best suits my needs CURRENTLY over the Wii U (which is my point), based on games that will PROBABLY arrive (on the PS4), is just trolling. People speak like there is literally no game they can play on the Wii U - at one point when I was looking to buy a PS4/One - I saw very clearly the Wii U line-up is the strongest. I think we have a very different definition over what trolling is. The Wii U line up now is and should be better than what the PS4/One have. It's had more time in the market, developers should have been spending that time making games, Nintendo should have got to grips with the console/controller, etc. I don't think it's unreasonable to say that the PS4/One have good futures ahead of them when you look at the current trends and compare it with the previous generation. The Wii was a great machine for me and my favourite console (figure that one out) but I also admit that there were a shit ton of games that simply didn't come because the Wii couldn't handle it. It's going to be the exact same situation this time around, but at least the Nintendo games will be in HD. (which is a good thing in itself, since games like 3D World look lovely) :p The third party situation is something that haunts every Nintendo console after the SNES. I can't tell if it's getting worse or better, but it's certainly not good. Even if you can get by without these games, there will be tons of gamers who can't. If there's alternatives to these games, then that's ok. For example, if we had a Goldeneye-style shooter for the Wii U instead of a regular Call of Duty game, that might help. Whether these will come or not is another matter. Edited April 17, 2014 by Fierce_LiNk
Goron_3 Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 (edited) @Goron_3 your post is literally the problem people have here in a nutshell. You basically said no one is allowed to say the Wii u has great games and is like the dream cast. But the ps4 is amazing because in the future it will have all this amazing 3rd parties.... I can't believe you posted it actually..... You missed my point. People are complaining that the Wii U has all these great games but fail to realise that very few people have any interest in those games. I LOVE my Wii U and the games I have for it but I can't name one person I know who would buy a console for those NSMB, Donkey Kong etc. Secondly, people are upset the Wii U doesn't have 3rd party titles but are then dismissing the PS4 which HAS all the 3rd party titles, and the best version of them as well? Why dismiss a console if it has exactly what you want? Yes, it only has Infamous on it in terms of 'new AAA' releases or whatever but it's barely been out for 6 months. Us Wii U owners had to wait long than that for games like Pikmin and Mario. Unlike the Wii U, the PS4 has EVERY major 3rd party title, so why look down on it and criticise them? Give them some credit. I love my Wii U, it's awesome, but I completely understand why it's tanking. The problem is, whenever we discuss that and have a decent discussion, the thread goes absolutely crazy. We were having some great discussions last night; how has this happened overnight? Edited April 17, 2014 by Goron_3
Retro_Link Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 But everyone's comparing them in some way, in whatever way suits their opinion. Now the Wii u has better games, but the future is better on ps4 and xb1. What is the actual thing we're debating because it's all getting thrown in, what console has the games you want to play now? What console has the games you want to play in the future? It's pretty simple and no one needs to justify their decisions, but here we have to. I think we should have a business thread so people who want to discuss how Nintendo can get more sales can post in there, as we literally talk about success more than quality in here. Dazzy you don't have to 'put forward' an idea for a thread! I don't know anymore. Like I said, I was enjoying the discussion about the Gamepad yesterday, not what it's become.
Falcon_BlizZACK Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 (edited) For example, if we had a Goldeneye-style shooter for the Wii U instead of a regular Call of Duty game, that might help. Whether these will come or not is another matter. But what makes people think we won't get games like this? (or games full stop for that matter?) The N64, GC, and Wii all produced a fair plod of third party/quality games - that we all mostly look back and commend... Yet we were also having these same thoughts and discussions - only now its crazier. Anyway, thumbs up for the civil posts, just at work with deadlines and ish so sorry for partial replies. You missed my point. People are complaining that the Wii U has all these great games but fail to realise that very few people have any interest in those games. I LOVE my Wii U and the games I have for it but I can't name one person I know who would buy a console for those NSMB, Donkey Kong etc. Secondly, people are upset the Wii U doesn't have 3rd party titles but are then dismissing the PS4 which HAS all the 3rd party titles, and the best version of them as well? Why dismiss a console if it has exactly what you want? Yes, it only has Infamous on it in terms of 'new AAA' releases or whatever but it's barely been out for 6 months. Us Wii U owners had to wait long than that for games like Pikmin and Mario. Unlike the Wii U, the PS4 has EVERY major 3rd party title, so why look down on it and criticise them? Give them some credit. I love my Wii U, it's awesome, but I completely understand why it's tanking. The problem is, whenever we discuss that and have a decent discussion, the thread goes absolutely crazy. We were having some great discussions last night; how has this happened overnight? I don't know man. When I play Pikmin with glee, or just kick back and do some convenient off-screen stuff - why on earth would I care for the people who can't experience this? Im enjoying it, you're enjoying it and thats all that should matter. You can just stop at "I love my Wii U". And I'll just call it and say this aggression pretty much accelerated when Jamba stepped in - no matter how Serebii's comments can come about sometimes, I'd still prefer him to have the motivation to post than to avoid posting because of the near personal abuse he gets. Edited April 17, 2014 by King_V Automerged Doublepost
Zechs Merquise Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 I'd say it's both. 1st gen in Sony's line of consoles, 5th gen when regarded as a whole. What? That just doesn't make any sense! So by that logic the 6th gen was also the first gen because that was when MS released their first console, so was the 3rd gen also the first gen as that was when Nintendo released their first console? It just amazes me how all of a sudden everything gets twisted. Generations no longer relate to when things were released, 1st gen is now when Sony released their first console (as obviously the whole gaming world revolves around them).
Kav Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 The opposing view to that is that the PS4 and the Xbone have been out 6 months, the Wii U 1.5 years. The two shouldn't even be being compared. The Wii U had sod all in it's first 6 months, just like the PS4 and Xbone. 1 year further down the line and the Wii U has a good games library, just like the PS4 and Xbone will have 1 year from now (which is the 'games will come' part). It's quite simple. Some members just seem incapable of opening their minds and have to compare things in the now to score points. You've missed my point. My point is that if you can justify buying a WiiU once the big games are all out, why is it not justifiable buying one with the knowledge these games will come and yet it is justifiable buying an XBO/PS4 with the knowledge games will come and not having to wait until those games are out before it's worthy of a purchase?
dazzybee Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 You missed my point. People are complaining that the Wii U has all these great games but fail to realise that very few people have any interest in those games. I LOVE my Wii U and the games I have for it but I can't name one person I know who would buy a console for those NSMB, Donkey Kong etc. Secondly, people are upset the Wii U doesn't have 3rd party titles but are then dismissing the PS4 which HAS all the 3rd party titles, and the best version of them as well? Why dismiss a console if it has exactly what you want? Yes, it only has Infamous on it in terms of 'new AAA' releases or whatever but it's barely been out for 6 months. Us Wii U owners had to wait long than that for games like Pikmin and Mario. Unlike the Wii U, the PS4 has EVERY major 3rd party title, so why look down on it and criticise them? Give them some credit. I love my Wii U, it's awesome, but I completely understand why it's tanking. The problem is, whenever we discuss that and have a decent discussion, the thread goes absolutely crazy. We were having some great discussions last night; how has this happened overnight? I see, sort of the same thing, which console has the games YOU (bing all of us)want to play. Yes it would be amazing if the Wii u had the same power and had all Nintendo games and all third parties, I would love that, but it doesn't. And all three consoles will have incredible games to play, they'll all be brilliant. Me personally, I'll end up getting another, but likely not all 3 this gen, I have such a huge backlog spanning past generations that I'd prefer to play through them. But at the same time, there'll be some 3rd parties I simply have to play, and exclusives - namely uncharted, whatever QD do, even titanfall appeals to me. I guess what I hate, isn't that people prefer other consoles, hate Nintendo games etc. is the constant - there are no Wii u games, Nintendo just rehash all their franchises, Wii u isn't popular so it must be shit, Nintendo are idiots because they were brave enough to try something new with the gamepad, Nintendo are idiots because they weren't brave enough with sky landers, the virtual console is shit, mario kart looks amazing but who cares because it won't make people buy a Wii u, and so on....
Goron_3 Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 But what makes people think we won't get games like this? (or games full stop for that matter?) The N64, GC, and Wii all produced a fair plod of third party/quality games - that we all mostly look back and commend... Yet we were also having these same thoughts and discussions - only now its crazier. Anyway, thumbs up for the civil posts, just at work with deadlines and ish so sorry for partial replies. I don't know man. When I play Pikmin with glee, or just kick back and do some convenient off-screen stuff - why on earth would I care for the people who can't experience this? Im enjoying it, you're enjoying it and thats all that should matter. Well I think many on this thread are talking about Nintendo's situation as a whole and how they fix issues with the Wii U. There are also others who are put off buying a Wii U for various reason and finally those who have one and arne't happy. You don't have to care about those people but in order for there to be good discussion, their points have to respected. Flinky made some great points about the gamepad yesterday and a few others basically dismissed everything he said, which I don't think is fair as his points were very well made and contributed to discussion.
Fierce_LiNk Posted April 17, 2014 Posted April 17, 2014 But what makes people think we won't get games like this? (or games full stop for that matter?) The N64, GC, and Wii all produced a fair plod of third party/quality games - that we all mostly look back and commend... Yet we were also having these same thoughts and discussions - only now its crazier. Anyway, thumbs up for the civil posts, just at work with deadlines and ish so sorry for partial replies. Where will the games come from? Right now, our best hope for exciting experiences for the Wii U are from Nintendo themselves, with the likes of Retro, etc. What are the likes of Konami, Capcom, Rockstar, Activision, Atlas, Bethesda, Ubisoft doing? Does it make sense for a developer or publisher to create something for the Wii U where the audience is limited or go with one of the other two? What's the Wii U like to develop for, is it easy? Do developers mind that much if the Wii U is weaker? (I'm guessing yes?) Do we currently know of any huge third party exclusives coming our way? Based on what we currently know, and if you examine the current third party situation, it doesn't look particularly great. I think it was myself and Dazzy who had a discussion about this recently and we both agreed that the third parties won't be coming. So, in my mind anyway, it's up to Nintendo to keep the system afloat with games now.
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