Which game do you consider to be the best ever made? Is that your favourite game?

[Fierce_LiNk]

Not really, I'm genuinely curious here... There is a very big difference between the questions "which game is your favourite game" and "which game do you consider the best game ever". They're 2 completely different things, and while many times the answer to both is the same, many other times it probably won't be. The only purpose of the topic was to ask wether your favourite game was also the best game you had ever played... but it has clearly failed that purpose, as the only person who answered that were Jonnas and M_Rock, lol.

 

 

Super Metroid is a very good shout. Metroid Prime has to be up there, too. Personally, I'd say Super Mario Galaxy. It's one of my favourite games, but not my most favourite. If it's not the best game ever, it certainly is the best game of its genre/type.

 

Fuck yooooooooooooooooooooooooooooou. :p

[Diageo]

Not really, I'm genuinely curious here... There is a very big difference between the questions "which game is your favourite game" and "which game do you consider the best game ever". They're 2 completely different things, and while many times the answer to both is the same, many other times it probably won't be. The only purpose of the topic was to ask wether your favourite game was also the best game you had ever played... but it has clearly failed that purpose, as the only person who answered that were Jonnas and M_Rock, lol.

 

 

 

See, you're looking at it from a selfish POV... Sure, the only thing that matters to you (or any of us) is your personal enjoyment of something, but if you want to engage in discussion about that something (which you clearly do, since you're a member here) you have to be willing to look at it with impartiality, otherwise it's just masturbation.

 

The trouble I have is the 'best game' label you use that has no set or quantifiable operational definition and just depends on what categories someone arbitrarily decides to pair with that label. The only time I will have a conversation about something being the best, is when that thing has a set purpose and it's ability to fulfil that purpose is somewhat measurable. I enjoy hearing and talking about the certain elements of an entity that they are impressed with but I do not enjoy conversations were people argue over which elements fit their unique and subjective view of what 'best' means.

[Cube]

That's because Super Mario 64 and Banjo-Kazooie are both clearly better than Galaxy.

[Diageo]

lol he's trying to rope you in again with nonsense @Diageo.

I'm sorry, it has caught me.

[MoogleViper]

My favourite game is Shenmue, and I would say it is one of the best games there is.

[Oxigen_Waste]

The trouble I have is the 'best game' label you use that has no set or quantifiable operational definition and just depends on what categories someone arbitrarily decides to pair with that label. The only time I will have a conversation about something being the best, is when that thing has a set purpose and it's ability to fulfil that purpose is somewhat measurable. I enjoy hearing and talking about the certain elements of an entity that they are impressed with but I do not enjoy conversations were people argue over which elements fit their unique and subjective view of what 'best' means.

 

You can't look at entertainment media using the same set of principles that you use in science. It's a flexible field, but there is a hierarchy in place.

 

I was about to write on, but you know what? Let's wrap this up here, as we've been over this (and it has consumed way too many topics) countless times and we know no good will come of it. Back on topic.

 

My favourite game is Shenmue, and I would say it is one of the best games there is.

 

See, Shenmue is one of my favourite games ever (and Shenmue 2 even more so), but there's just too much wrong with it.

[Diageo]

You can't look at entertainment media using the same set of principles that you use in science. It's a flexible field, but there is a hierarchy in place.

Sure I can. And its why I don't argue with people about the best Zelda or the best TV series. That shit boring.

[Ronnie]

Any good? Does Eric Cartman love cheesy poofs? Hell yes, it's phenomenal. It's to video games as Citizen Kane is to movies. Do yourself a favour and get it somehow. Either on VC on Wii or you can wait for the promotion coming up in a few months on Wii U for €.0.30. I still have my original cart for the SNES and I wouldn't sell it for anything.

 

Haha fair enough. I'll get it when it's out on Wii U VC. I've also somehow managed to not play any of the 3D Metroids as well, only played the NES game (and loved it).

[MoogleViper]

See, Shenmue is one of my favourite games ever (and Shenmue 2 even more so), but there's just too much wrong with it.

 

But then you're not judging what's the best game, you're judging what's the most refined.

 

For me, it's one of the best because it did something radically new. It created it's ow genre, which I'd love to see more games fall into (and as demonstrated by Yakuza, it's a great genre).

 

Another game for consideration. Okami.

[Rummy]

Most of the Zelda games you could choose as 'Best Game Ever', but i would not have any of them in my favourites list because i don't like Zelda games.

 

I think Rockstar make some very well made games too, like GTA 4 and Red Dead Redemption.

 

You are seriously declining on my list of favourite bobs.

 

 

Personally, I don't feel I've played enough of the greats(ie such as Super Metroid) to pass judgement on the best game ever. I understand than Metroid has had quite a legacy(inspiring the 'Metroidvania' style), I'd say something like that must show some sort of greatness.

[bob]

You are seriously declining on my list of favourite bobs.

 

As long as I'm top 5, i'm happy.

 

To be fair I've only played OoT, TP and SS, and i only finished TP, so that doesn't qualify me to comment on all of them. I like the idea of Zelda games, but then I start playing them and get stuck about a third of the way through and then just give up. I came to the conclusion that perhaps they just aren't for me. But I can see that they are very well made games!

[Rummy]

As long as I'm top 5, i'm happy.

 

To be fair I've only played OoT, TP and SS, and i only finished TP, so that doesn't qualify me to comment on all of them. I like the idea of Zelda games, but then I start playing them and get stuck about a third of the way through and then just give up. I came to the conclusion that perhaps they just aren't for me. But I can see that they are very well made games!

 

You're lucky I don't know that many bobs, bob! I take your comments on board though, quite rational. I always say TP was a good game, though a terrible Zelda - lacks the magic of the earlier ones for me. I find the Zelda's a tricky subject, I always wish I could get new/objective eyes on them now to see how people really find them. You say you can see that they are well made, how so? What stands out as such?

[dazzybee]

I side with more with Diago on this, favourite and best ARE linked together. Like any art, technique is only there to accomplish a goal, if that goal doesn't fulfil it's intention then how is that best when they've missed the absolutely fundamental most important aspect of games. If you found citizen Kane dull but an absolutely technical masterpiece which blow everything out of the water nd still does, you can't call it the best film just because its technically good, because it failed in engaging you, entertaining you or whatever. But something like labyrinth, it may not be technically superior to most films, or have the best performances, but the sheer enjoyment one could get from it could make it their best film.

 

The purpose of games is to engage you, thrill you, whatever it is you want from games. The game that succeeds in that is the best game!

[The Peeps]

QWOP is the best game ever made but it's not my favourite :p

[MoogleViper]

QWOP is the best game ever made but it's not my favourite :p

 

Then you have bad taste.

[Grazza]

The only objectivity I really acknowledge with gaming is things like: Mega Drive games had better sprites than Master System games; PS3 has better polygon models than N64... that sort of thing.

 

But, to answer Oxigen Waste's question, I have to split it into genres, but yes, the ones I think are the best are also my favourites. Link's Awakening is (in my opinion) the best 2D Zelda, and my favourite. Same goes for Metroid Fusion in its own genre.

 

You're lucky I don't know that many bobs, bob! I take your comments on board though, quite rational. I always say TP was a good game, though a terrible Zelda - lacks the magic of the earlier ones for me. I find the Zelda's a tricky subject, I always wish I could get new/objective eyes on them now to see how people really find them. You say you can see that they are well made, how so? What stands out as such?

 

Yes, what exactly is Zelda? I've been thinking about this recently, and it could even be its own thread. I'm of the opinion that the best ones, like Ocarina of Time, are amazingly-advanced games.

[Jonnas]

High encounter rate, too easy, way too slow, extremely by the book in it's gameplay design. It's undeniable that it's a great game, but I think's hard to argue it's anywhere near the top of the RPG genre. It's a very solid 8, imo.

 

Fair enough. I think "playing it safe" in certain areas is not a flaw per se (it's only a flaw if it undermines the good things), but whatever.

 

True... but LttP is even better.

 

And here's an interesting disagreement. I find Link's Awakening to be up there with Majora's Mask, and an example of what you define as objectively good.

 

Couldn't stand LttP when I first played it. Link's movement is slow, the pace of progression is inconsistent, and there were so many moments I didn't realize what I had to do to proceed (in fact, I stopped playing around Turtle Rock because I needed some item I never heard of, that was found in some place I never knew I had to visit). To me, the game has aged really badly, and if that happens, I can't honestly call it "a great game". To me, its popularity feels like nostalgia at work.

 

I did vow to take another shot at it in the future (as I usually do when I dislike a popular game), but even if I end up liking it as much as Minish Cap, I can't possibly judge it in the same plane as Link's Awakening (it's like comparing OoT and MM).

[Oxigen_Waste]

And here's an interesting disagreement. I find Link's Awakening to be up there with Majora's Mask, and an example of what you define as objectively good.

 

Couldn't stand LttP when I first played it. Link's movement is slow, the pace of progression is inconsistent, and there were so many moments I didn't realize what I had to do to proceed (in fact, I stopped playing around Turtle Rock because I needed some item I never heard of, that was found in some place I never knew I had to visit). To me, the game has aged really badly, and if that happens, I can't honestly call it "a great game". To me, its popularity feels like nostalgia at work.

 

I did vow to take another shot at it in the future (as I usually do when I dislike a popular game), but even if I end up liking it as much as Minish Cap, I can't possibly judge it in the same plane as Link's Awakening (it's like comparing OoT and MM).

 

 

I literally have no idea what you mean in the underlined part. The bold part I agree with, but IMO that's what makes it the best Zelda and the reason all the other ones feel too linear in their progression. It has that same appeal Super Metroid did in that it requires you to pay attention in order to be able to progress, and you might dislike that but I like it so much none of the other Zeldas ever even come close. To this day I still firmly defend and believe that LttP is clearly the best Zelda, by far... and it's funny that you mention MM and OoT as parallels to LttP and LA, because I much preffer MM to OoT. The 16 bit gen was my favourite precisely because of those same reasons you apparently dislike... LttP, Super Metroid and Chrono Trigger represent my personal pinnacle of gaming, and it's mostly because they all have that feel you apparently dislike of not knowing what to do unless you were thorough. IMO, LttP is THE Zelda game. I think it has aged marvelously in that it's charms have not aged a single day if you're into them (which seems to be the main issue here). All in all I'd say it's a perfect game, a label I reserve for very few games. Well, almost perfect... that pink hair never did make any sense at all...

[Jonnas]

I literally have no idea what you mean in the underlined part.

 

Link hops and trots around like he's frigging Heidi, and he takes too long to do simple things like climbing stairs. Controlling him wasn't very fun, which is a pretty big flaw in such a game.

 

The pacing part had more to do with how the different places you could visit had to be visited in a certain order without much rhyme or reason as to why. I might be misremembering that part, though.

 

The bold part I agree with, but IMO that's what makes it the best Zelda and the reason all the other ones feel too linear in their progression. It has that same appeal Super Metroid did in that it requires you to pay attention in order to be able to progress, and you might dislike that but I like it so much none of the other Zeldas ever even come close. To this day I still firmly defend and believe that LttP is clearly the best Zelda, by far... and it's funny that you mention MM and OoT as parallels to LttP and LA, because I much preffer MM to OoT. The 16 bit gen was my favourite precisely because of those same reasons you apparently dislike... LttP, Super Metroid and Chrono Trigger represent my personal pinnacle of gaming, and it's mostly because they all have that feel you apparently dislike of not knowing what to do unless you were thorough. IMO, LttP is THE Zelda game. I think it has aged marvelously in that it's charms have not aged a single day if you're into them (which seems to be the main issue here). All in all I'd say it's a perfect game, a label I reserve for very few games. Well, almost perfect... that pink hair never did make any sense at all...

 

See, Super Metroid does it right. The game is subtly designed to guide you in the right direction, the map is filled as you progress, and if you're stuck, there are always plenty of pointers as to where you might go*. Odds are, you won't be running around in circles, nor will you be revisiting what are now dead ends.

*Except for blowing up the glass pipe, which shouldn't be required, but I digress.

 

With LttP, on the other hand, I had visited the Zora King once, and figured he was a sidequest that came later, so I ended up putting him in the back of my mind. Much later, there I am, climbing that mountain, finally reaching the top to find... a dead end. After consulting Gamefaqs, oh I needed something from that guy in the boondocks, and no shortcut between places. That's bad design to me. Had this been Metroid, you'd need the thing at the beginning of the path, not the end, and had it been Wind Waker, there'd be plenty of "Hoy-small-fry" telling you the Zora King had something important, at the very least. Combine this with my dislike of controlling Link, and I was fed up.

 

Like I said, I will give the game another shot, maybe playing it with a different mindset... But I was not pleased with that experience. Pretty much only the dungeons and bosses kept me playing.

 

Finally, I'm not sure why you mentioned Chrono Trigger, that game sets the path pretty blatantly for you, even side quests

[Cube]

See, Super Metroid does it right. The game is subtly designed to guide you in the right direction, the map is filled as you progress, and if you're stuck, there are always plenty of pointers as to where you might go*. Odds are, you won't be running around in circles, nor will you be revisiting what are now dead ends.

 

I got lost around 20 minuted into the game. Spent about 40 minutes lost. Haven't touched it since.

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

It is and always will be "The Legend Of Zelda: The Wind Waker"

When I got my hands on it, the game was pure magic. I was blown away by the immersive and gorgeous 3D world, the lovely and very lively characters and most of all by the engaging story and the oh so polished gameplay.

Most people consider the game flawed because of speculated missing dungeons, and the triforce quest. To me it felt all right, the game had new challenges that weren't always very conventional, but it also very clearly built on the foundations of Ocarina of Time. The scale and impact of the game was so large, that anything that wasn't perfect just didn't matter anymore. And after all this time, this game still looks and plays perfectly. It is the most acurate example that a game can be developed to be withstand time and mere technical improvements over time. To sum it up I remember it as the perfect adventure I always wanted to experience. To me it is the best game made, and that also happens to make it my favorite.

 

Amen! A lot of people were bothered by the scale and relative emptiness of the ocean, but to me that just made it all the more epic and mysterious. I always had that feeling of the world being so utterly big and full of the unknown; there were little, strange islands, curious people mumbling about forgotten lore, mysterious events such as a disappearing ghost ship ...

 

It all fit in very well with the legend of the sunken kingdom and the lacking history of the current world, which in turn held plenty of mysteries of secrets of its own. Since the islands were so far apart, few of the people you met had actually seen much of the world, and that added to the mystery surrounding all the myths and rumours.

 

Also unlike many, I loved that you had to go on a proper, old treasure hunt for the maps and the sunken pieces of the Triforce. Again, it all played into the forgotten legends of the sunken kingdom, which you then had to rediscover. It was simply brilliant to me.

 

Link's movement is slow

 

Oh, god, yes. Of all the things I remember about ALttP, the horrible experience of controlling Link sits close to the top. :p I absolutely love the Oracle games and The Minish Cap, though; I find those games quite underrated (or at least less known than they ought to be).

 

As for my own best/favourite games, my avatar and signature (credit goes to the talented Mr Ripley @Eddage!) should give you a clue; the Ace Attorney series has taken a very firm spot as my favourite game series, beating out strong competitors such as The Legend of Zelda and Star Fox. I absolutely love the universe and the characters, and the writing and localisation are superb.

 

A contender for best game that I haven't seen mentioned yet is Portal 2. It took the ingenious concept of the first game and not only added a bunch of brilliant additions, but also vastly expanded the world and its history through clever storytelling and amazing character development.

[Grazza]

Link hops and trots around like he's frigging Heidi, and he takes too long to do simple things like climbing stairs. Controlling him wasn't very fun, which is a pretty big flaw in such a game.

 

I wonder is this is because we played the 50Hz version? I'm really hoping all SNES Virtual Console games are 60Hz from now on, so we can see how they were meant to feel.

 

But I did love A Link to the Past when it was released, I just don't find it quite so good to go back to. Link's Awakening, however, is just as good now as it was then.

[tapedeck]

Was debating if I should comment incase my favourite games get slated by the wealth of outstanding game designers in this forum. (I'm joking c...good to see some healthy debate!)

 

The best ever 'made' game for me continues to be Mario64.

 

Although it looks simple by today's standards, upon release it screamed quality and revolution.

 

The way everything gelled together was seamless as the castle setup allowed for a range of pioneering experiences.

The hand-holding was carefully managed with signposts, clever puns and conversational hints from characters meaning players were never really lost. It gave 'just' enough to let you explore this wonderland of colour and imagination, never becoming overwhelming. The game cared for you every step of the way.

The analogue control system was also slowly unveiled to the player through the courtyard tutorial area.

 

Mario64 is one of the (if not the) greatest educational experiences I have ever had. Proof being that by the end of it navigating 3D space was instantly understandable, controllable and made everything before it look like a mere blueprint. It also drip-fed you skills and abilities in a non-patronising way that gave you confidence to try, fail and ultimately master and enjoy every moment of it.

 

From the title screen until the final scene, the game was a labour of love, solidifying my own passion and wonder in gaming and confidence in the fact that (when they do AAA games), no-one makes games like Nintendo.

Edited March 4, 2013 by tapedeck

[daftada]

My joint favourite games are Xenoblade and Tales of Symphonia, but I wouldn't place them in my top ten best games ever because they're flawed (but, for me, so much more than the sum of their parts). There are a couple of games I'd say are the 'best' ever, either because they are so perfectly designed that they couldn't be improved like Tetris (GB), Yoshi's Island and Super Metroid or they pushed the boundaries of the video game medium so far beyond what had gone before like Super Mario Bros, Super Mario 64, Zelda OoT and Doom.