Supergrunch Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 But the animators would generally have a script to follow to know how long to animate the mouth for, my point was it's a lot easier to put a dubbed voice over an animated mouth than a human mouth. Oh yeah, it totally is, although it would of course be slightly harder for another language as the mouth has been animated for the Japanese lines. But I wasn't disagreeing with you. What I do always wonder though is why people bother to make dubs fit mouth movements at all. It's not like it won't look dubbed, and it just makes the translation worse as it has to conform more to the original language. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shorty Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 I'm not sure I agree with this, unless it's for name honourifics (which still wouldn't be appropriate for a general audience release) or things like food that don't have an English name (although this isn't always a problem - c.f. Phoenix Wright, with ramen -> hamburgers, which works fine as everything is so well Americanised). And if subbers go to far, you end up with atrocities like this: I'm referring to things like special moves in shounen series. Also, that classic keikaku fail is not really relevant, because I am talking specifically about quality fansubbing Also whilst a general audience would not 'get' honourifics, I would personally feel that I was missing out. These are Japanese characters with Japanese manners and their relationships are usually best explored through such details. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellmeister Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 I like reading things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 The only thing I can pinpoint wrong with dubs is the cast not being reassembled for future productions. Japan goes to great lengths to ensure actors reprise roles, whereas over here we end up with one or two returns and a bunch of new voices we're not used to hearing from certain characters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heroicjanitor Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 In Naruto, do the Japanese not get annoyed by the way he keeps saying the nonsense phrase "dattebayo"? In the English version everyone was up in arms when he kept saying "believe it!". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 "Believe it!" is a typical example of an intricacy from the Japanese language version being included in the dub and being hit by a massive backlash from fans. They just can't win. Luckily half the people complaining will never buy a domestically released anime DVD in their lives and are therefore no concern to whoever was releasing the Naruto DVDs. Out of curiosity, how many people here actually own the amazing bilingual Death Note DVDs that were released over here? Just as a heads up, actually owning something and having a folder on your hard drive called DEASU NOTU are not the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dannyboy-the-Dane Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 I generally agree with Diageo's points about dubs being an equally good choice as subs, especially regarding the tone and mood. With a language as different as Japanese, a (good!) dub can really help convey the tone and feel of a line that would otherwise be lost on those not familiar with the Japanese language. Also, on rare occasions the dub can actually be better than the original track. That's the case for me with the Danish dub of "The Road To El Dorado". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheikah Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 The vast majority of dubs are poor though, or at least worst than the original VA. A lot more effort goes into matching the right VA with the character, and generally speaking the quality of VAs intended for dubbing anime in Japan is much better than in USA. Of all the dubs I've heard, not a single one has ever come across as better than the original. And reading at the bottom of the screen and flicking between the rest of the action really isn't hard, it's just basic multitasking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan-likes-trees Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 I love how futile, comon, and never-ending the sub / dub argument arguement is... it's almost as bad as subjectivity / objectivity. That said, I always sub. The Ghibli ones tend to be alright though. On an anime related note: has anything as good as Death Note been made since Death Note? I stopped watching anime a few years ago when I realized that barely anything came close to DN quality. Might go buy Summer Wars at some point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coolness Bears Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 I love how futile, comon, and never-ending the sub / dub argument arguement is... it's almost as bad as subjectivity / objectivity. That said, I always sub. The Ghibli ones tend to be alright though. On an anime related note: has anything as good as Death Note been made since Death Note? I stopped watching anime a few years ago when I realized that barely anything came close to DN quality. Might go buy Summer Wars at some point. Baccano! just look at the opening, Stylish: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shorty Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 "Believe it!" is a typical example of an intricacy from the Japanese language version being included in the dub and being hit by a massive backlash from fans. They just can't win. What you call intricacy I call a huge failure to translate. Dattebayo doesn't really mean anything, it's like an extension of Naruto's dialect. Believe it is a shitty catchphrase which they eventually phased out when they realised how lame it was. One thing I will say in credit for the dub team behind Naruto is that they have actually gotten better in recent years, and listened to the fans. Not before ignoring the begging/pleading/general reasoning with them to skip the fillers though, which lost them millions of viewers and meant they had to move to a new network. Luckily half the people complaining will never buy a domestically released anime DVD in their lives and are therefore no concern to whoever was releasing the Naruto DVDs.I bought some Naruto DVDs to support the series, but they come out at about £15 for 13 episodes, which would end up costing hundreds and hundreds for the whole series and take up masses of room. But that's not why I stopped buying the Naruto DVDs, it's because they wrote "Unleased" on the side of the third one, instead of "Unleashed". Fucking stupid. I support Naruto by buying other merchandise, that way I'm putting money closer to the hands of the creators, not the American license-holders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonnas Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 On an anime related note: has anything as good as Death Note been made since Death Note? I stopped watching anime a few years ago when I realized that barely anything came close to DN quality. Might go buy Summer Wars at some point. FMA Brotherhood. Though one should watch it only after either A) Watching the first 25 episodes of the first series or B) Reading the first 30 chapters of the manga. Because the first 15 episodes of Brotherhood (which cover either of the above) are really, really rushed and sloppy. It's all win from then on, though. Regarding the dub vs sub debate, I agree that I was unfair with that comparison (though you have to agree I did point a flaw in the dub). I do think that a dub can surpass the original (I've seen Portuguese voices miles better than Japanese ones and vice-versa. Not to mention the Portuguese Dragonball is one of the most loltastic things I've seen, and it features both great and poor voice acting) It's just that English dubs tend to not be very good. They either fumble when trying to remain faithful to the original ("BELIEVE IT!") or retool everything. Death Note dub is not bad per se, but the Japanese version is so gorgeous already (not to mention having a Japanese setting, and being filled with Japanese culture and references), it's a shame to miss on it just because you aren't used to subtitles (I think dislexya is the only valid excuse to never watch subs, honestly) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rinha Posted May 13, 2011 Share Posted May 13, 2011 My meager 2cents re the dubs Vs subs discussion: I prefer subs, always. I don't think i am a purist but i prefer watching series (or movies or whatever, really) it their original form. Then again, not being a native english speaker makes me process them differently. It just rings wrong to me. Portuguese dubs, i just process them flat and either i like them or i don't. It may seem i'm just talking rubbish here but it's really hard to explain what i mean... I do think that a dub can surpass the original (I've seen Portuguese voices miles better than Japanese ones and vice-versa. Not to mention the Portuguese Dragonball is one of the most loltastic things I've seen, and it features both great and poor voice acting) I can vouch for this. In fact, watching DB in japanese does ring wrong to me. Sounds a bit contradictory, i know, but it's the truth (maybe because i grew up with it? possible). However, the portuguese dub of DB was a work of love- the actors were having fun, with all good and bad, and you could tell. Unlike, for instance, the portuguese dub of Sen to Chihiro. It made me want to boil kittens in hot mint syrup (as Filipa Maló is able to convey emotion as a brick wall being prodded with a pin. I hated her for what she did to Chihiro. Still do. I'll stop ranting now.). Having said that, and getting back to topic, i don't think i can deny there has been much improvement on dubs over the years. The few Death Note eps i watched dubbed in english were really good- but i like the japanese voicing better. FMA:B was not bad either! However, i'm not going to say they suck just because i prefer subs- there are really good people out there doing a great job dubbing series (another example being Haruhi Suzumiya). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReZourceman Posted May 16, 2011 Author Share Posted May 16, 2011 VOLUME 5 AND 6 AND 7 arrived so i am lookin foeward to reading dem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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