Thoughts on Wii from a long time fan

[Zechs Merquise]

I have been reading this site since back when it was an N64 site, however I have never been a member of the forum. However with the current controversy surrounding the Wii I felt I wanted to have my say.

 

I’ll start off by saying that I’ve been playing Nintendo since the days of the NES, in fact before then, when Game & Watch were the must have toy in the playground. I got my first home console back in 1988 at Christmas, it was the Mario and Duck Hunt pack, and I still have it in its original box. I loved that machine, and played it to death. I went on to own a SNES, N64 and now a Gamecube, all of which I loved.

 

Now 18 years later I’m looking toward a Christmas with a new Nintendo console and I’m not filled with my usual giddy joy, but instead very mixed feelings indeed. I’m actually happy in a way that Nintendo has taken the direction it has with the new controller. I think this opens up vast new gaming opportunities and can definitely revolutionise the way we play games.

 

However at the same time I worry, I worry because I can imagine developers trying to implement Wii-mote features to games where this controller wouldn’t be suited. I think games like Farcry and Metroid Prime would work great with this new scheme, but at the same time I am less than thrilled at the thought of playing the new Zelda title with it. I hope there are options with many games that allow us to us the regular controller.

 

I also worry that instead of genuinely innovative design (which I am sure Nintendo themselves will implement with the Wii-mote) many developers will use it as a gimmick or simply tag on a few poorly implement Wii-mote ‘extras’ as we have seen with the use of the second screen and stylus on the DS.

 

I’m happy that Nintendo are putting the emphasis on the game play rather than just on a technological race to produce the prettiest games. However at the same time I’m saddened that we won’t be seeing Hyrule in beautiful HD with all the bells and whistles that could have been there if this game was running on a system with the power of the XBOX 360 or the PS3.

 

Whilst I will no doubt still buy these games, and I’m in no doubt at all that the experience of playing them will be just as rich in terms of game play, I would love to explore Samus’ universe in the level of graphical beauty that this next generation of consoles is capable of.

 

I also worry that because of the lack of graphical power we won’t see as many multi-platform games coming to the Wii, and if we do they’ll be a stripped down and ugly version. I fear that we may not see the next instalments of the Rainbow Six series, or the Time Splitter series, or the next true Resident Evil game.

 

Then on the other hand I’m overjoyed about the virtual console, being able to download and play every classic Nintendo title from the NES, SNES and N64, all on one console. The possibility of a full library of Nintendo titles right from the 8-bit days is great, and a real selling point. This coupled with the Gamecube backwards compatibility makes me extremely happy.

 

So all in all, I reckon the Wii looks like a mixed bag. I just wanted to know if my thoughts are echoed with any other long time Nintendo fans.

[mcj metroid]

yes that is how i feel,but i find the most annoying thing is games will get marked down BECAUSE they dont use the wii-mote.i have seen this happen with countless ds games.

[Pit-Jr]

I also worry that because of the lack of graphical power we won’t see as many multi-platform games coming to the Wii, and if we do they’ll be a stripped down and ugly version. I fear that we may not see the next instalments of the Rainbow Six series, or the Time Splitter series, or the next true Resident Evil game.

 

At first i thought that the lack of graphical power would be a boon to the Wii library and discourage porting. Then reality set in that instead of creating brand-new games, alot of 3rd parties will merely port theyre current-gen games

 

Hopefully this is just a launch period side-effect.

 

Props to Elebits, Red Steel, THawkDJ and Sonic Wildfire for being made from scratch

[Zechs Merquise]

I also have to say that those on these boards who are simply parroting the rubbish that 'it's the gameplay that counts not the graphics' are really missing the point.

 

Everyone knows that it's great gameplay which makes a game stand out, but graphics count too. They enhance the playing experience and make it a more immersive experience. I remember when I first walked out onto Hyrule Field in the Ocarina of time, the wow factor was fantastic, that game was so beautiful for it's time. Or when I was expoloring the rich world of Metroid Prime, the icy wastes were just jaw droppingly beautiful. The beautiful graphics added to the playing experience.

 

I remember when I showed my friends Super Mario 64 and Turok on the N64, they were blown away. Just as everyone at my school was when we first played Street Fighter 2 Turbo on the SNES. The problem for Nintendo of entering the next generation console battle with a system that doesn't produce next generation visuals is that it will put a lot of people off. As for me, I just wish we were going to see Link and Samus in the same beautiful detail that Halo fans will be seeing Master Chief or Metal Gear fans will be seeing Snake.

[triforce_keeper]

I also have to say that those on these boards who are simply parroting the rubbish that 'it's the gameplay that counts not the graphics' are really missing the point.

 

Everyone knows that it's great gameplay which makes a game stand out, but graphics count too. They enhance the playing experience and make it a more immersive experience. I remember when I first walked out onto Hyrule Field in the Ocarina of time, the wow factor was fantastic, that game was so beautiful for it's time. Or when I was expoloring the rich world of Metroid Prime, the icy wastes were just jaw droppingly beautiful. The beautiful graphics added to the playing experience.

 

I remember when I showed my friends Super Mario 64 and Turok on the N64, they were blown away. Just as everyone at my school was when we first played Street Fighter 2 Turbo on the SNES. The problem for Nintendo of entering the next generation console battle with a system that doesn't produce next generation visuals is that it will put a lot of people off. As for me, I just wish we were going to see Link and Samus in the same beautiful detail that Halo fans will be seeing Master Chief or Metal Gear fans will be seeing Snake.

 

I have to agree with you on that one. But the screens we are seeing now are mostly Gamecube graphics from 3rd parties because of the dev kit. I think nintendo want to give out the message of gameplay not graphics, at first.

 

But when we get to end of next year we will probably see gorgous games that will blow us away like OOT did on n64. I think Wii is a really powerful machine but Nintendo don't want to push it just yet.

[LazyBoy]

The problem with the Wii, which also happens to be its strength, is that it's different from your traditional console. That "wow factor" you talk of will come through 1:1 control of a sword or striking a home run. And thats great. But just because the Wii is different it doesn't mean people still don't like the old style of games.

 

And so that's where the PS3 and 360 come in. They'll provide that graphical factor you want. The Wii will be your second console. So yes you'll have either pick one, or buy both. Its not the perfect situation, but that's capitalism.

 

Oh and gimmiky games are always going to be a problem. Its just one of the hardships we'll have to endure.

[Letty]

There are a tonne of really gimmicky games on the DS, in my opinion very few games have used the console to its full potential.

[Gaijin von Snikbah]

I think there is a difference between an extra layer of paint, and a visual presentation that defines the gameworld. I also think the graphical wow factor wears thin over time, while gameplay can last longer.

[The Bard]

Woooaaah! It's Zechs, he was so awesome. Gundam ftw!

[Patch]

I have been reading this site since back when it was an N64 site, however I have never been a member of the forum. However with the current controversy surrounding the Wii I felt I wanted to have my say.

 

I’ll start off by saying that I’ve been playing Nintendo since the days of the NES, in fact before then, when Game & Watch were the must have toy in the playground. I got my first home console back in 1988 at Christmas, it was the Mario and Duck Hunt pack, and I still have it in its original box. I loved that machine, and played it to death. I went on to own a SNES, N64 and now a Gamecube, all of which I loved.

 

Your whole post was well thought out and I enjoyed reading it, especially since your first two paragraphs sounded exactly like my history with Nintendo. However, I am looking forward to the Wii more than I have with any other console. As an experienced and long time fan, I am sure you agree with me that a console as revolutionary as the Wii is a breath of much-needed fresh air.

 

I think your point is simply that Nintendo should have included better graphical hardware. Certainly some of the most jaw-dropping defining moments of the GC's life were induced by impresive visuals. For example, Phendrana Drifts in Metroid Prime, the castle interiors in Resident Evil 4 and even Rogue Squadron's groundbreaking visuals from the get go.

 

However I believe that for each of those moments in the Gamecube's life where you unconsciously said 'Wow' at the TV, there will be five times as many moments where you are unconsciously laughing, and smiling at the sheer *enjoyment* of playing games that require a whole new way of playing. It will be like playing a Game and Watch for the first time and you were unable to stop smiling at the sheer magic of it.

 

Undeniably the Wii would be a greater experience were it to have HD, but I know I will still have a whole lot of fun and I would prefer neither of the alternative outcomes: spending more money or have Nintendo risk posting losses at the end of the year.

[Zero]

tbh I dont think graphics matter all too much but they do count. I played Grandia not so long ago and the graphics are terrible but its still one of my favourite games.

[Zechs Merquise]

I'm pleased you enjoyed reading my thoughts on this. I agree that the Wii is a breath of fresh air, and for this I'm grateful.

 

I do also agree that there are many moments on the Gamecube which have been fabulous and haven't been based around a graphic WOW factor. Battalion Wars was fabulous from start to finish and the graphics for that whilst very clean, smooth and wonderfully stylish were hardly ground breaking. Also Donkey Konga could probably have been done on the N64, but damn was it fun. And to hammer the point home I reckon I probably had as much fun out of the Zelda collection disk than I did any other game on the Gamecube.

 

I just have this yearning to see Hyrule and Samus' Universe in the beautiful detail it that other gamers will be experiencing MGS, Halo etc.

 

As for Game and Watch, damn I loved those things, I still have the Legend of Zelda Game and Watch fully boxed and in fully working order. Game and Watch were magical.

[Zell]

Ok, here's my say on the whole graphics vs gameplay fiasco.

 

Graphics matter. No question. But now with this next generation, graphics don't matter as much as they used to.

 

Looking at the previous console generations, we can see the clear graphical jumps. But this generation has seen least improvement in graphics. We've only gone from detailed 3D (ps2/gcn/xbox) to even more detailed 3D (360/ps3). Games look nicer yes, but I wasn't wowed as much as I was when I first saw the ps2 or gamecube in action. What's more these graphical enhancements add nothing to the gameplay, unlike when we moved from 2d to 3d. And what about the generation after? Can graphics improve anymore than they are now?

 

Looking at the wii strategy I can kinda see where nintendo are coming from in terms of not being HD. The most important thing is that the difference between wii and ps3/360 is only significant when played on a HDTV. If played on a SDTV they is little to no difference between the consoles. So nintendo are saying: pay £180 for a new experience or pay £450 + another £400 for a HDTV for some jaw-dropping graphics that aren't even as jaw-dropping as you first thought.

 

I am disappointed that wii will not be hdtv but you can't have it all.

[raven_blade2006]

I agree with some of you guys that Nintendo could have given Wii a little bit more of a hardware boost. If not to HD, then just to further push it away from comparisons to Current Gen. Anyway I know it still has a lot of untapped potential and will be a console experience like no other. Im eagerly anticipating when the demo units make it into stores.

[ShadowV7]

Although I don't care as much about graphics compared to gameplay,it's still a good thing to have.

Good to see a Gundam Wing fan

[DCK]

The general misconception is that the Wii's graphics are no good simply because they're not up snuff to the competition. That's just a matter of perspective... If you would have posted Metroid, Mario or Zelda screens before the first Xbox 360 screenshots came out everybody on these boards would orgasm over them. Quite honestly, I think the Wii graphics are great, the 360's and PS3's graphics are just outstanding. I can settle with merely great graphics if the rest of the system is as good as it promises to be though.

[Zechs Merquise]

I can see Nintendo's point of view on HD, I think HD will not truly be any sort of standard for years to come. Most people I know are still running on standard CRT TVs, a few have plasma or LCD screens and fewer still have HD ready sets. But it's a nice option to have, and I think by the end of this coming generation's lifespan HD will have a much much wider user base and it will be an attractive prospective to play games in HD.

 

Although I would've liked Nintendo to include HD, I would've been happy simply with the same graphical power as the 360 (minus HD). I think it's because Nintendo has been such an important part of my life since I was 8, I feel I've grown up with Characters like Link, Mario and Samus. Because of this I would've liked to see them in even more glorious detail.

 

On a side note, pleased to see there are plenty of Gundam Wing fans on here. They used to show it on Toonami (formerly CNX on Sky/Cable). I loved it, I also liked Outlaw Star, that was awesome, anyone else catch that?

[Kav]

It's good to see a well thought of and constructed piece of writing in regards to the Wii's graphical power. Having just come off the gamespot boards it is always nice to read the posts of people that aren't idiots! (a sly dig at them I know!)

 

I love your post Zechs and must say that I certainly do agree to the extent that I would love to see these beloved games in even greater detail. Although I wouldn't say that I'm not hyped as much for this console... the Wii is the console that has had me more hyped than any other! The Virtual Console alone does this for me! Having read the most recent impressions of games like Zelda and Mario and Metroid I'm super hyped for this machine!

 

...also, Outlaw Star is great! Just finished watching the series on youtube, it's great!

[Fresh]

Now Playing: Battalion Wars, Rainbox Six Lockdown and Super Monkey Ball

 

I think the now playing box is for music, not games. but whatever.

[YenRug]

A nice thread with some good points, rather than the usual degeneration into a slagging match, for once. My take/clarification on the situation:

 

1. I'll start with this rather pertinent point; there are still around two months until launch. I've mentioned it once or twice before, but most of the graphical polish on a game comes in the last month before release; a lot of people will claim that's BS, but if you ever read any developer's interview/blog/whatever, they all pretty much say the same. That can be the difference between an average looking game becoming a pretty amazing one, or a pretty good one just looking that little bit more shiney. As it stands, a lot of the games being slagged of as having sub-GC quality graphics need to be seen at release, before a genuine judgement can be made.

 

2. The Wii, according to recent interviews, is capable of producing graphics superior to the Xbox, although some effects are easier to achieve than others. This does not mean that the Wii has crap graphics, it just means that they will not be as good as the PS3/Xbox360; a lot of people were wowwed by what the Xbox could achieve, people should stop knocking the Wii for being able to produce better. Yes, it would have been nice to be as good as the competition, it isn't, get over it already.

 

3. Thanks to development costs, Sony need the PS3 to last about 10 years to recoup them. Xbox360? Hard to say, I think you should expect that to last at least 5 years; Microsoft would probably like to draw out the system life as long as possible, this time, but it's possible they could push for the 5 year point. Now, Nintendo are in the best position; they've introduced their new technology, now they can spend the next 5 years refining it and pushing towards the more powerful machine to use it on. If HDTV takes off enough in that time, they can easily work to that; I think they took the better position of the long-look on it.

[Eenuh]

This is probably just me, but I don't like all these almost photorealistic graphics and stuff that the PS3 and Xbox360 have. It sort of... doesn't fit in with my view of gaming. The screens/videos I've seen of Twilight Princess show awesome visuals I think; the game just looks great. And that's GC/Wii graphics. More than good enough for me.

 

Honestly, graphics are just a very small part of the entire package. There's only so many more improvements they can make in regards to graphics; at one point they -will- have to look at something else to change and improve. And Nintendo has just been smart enough to do that now already, instead of a couple of years down the line from now. Also, if the team (especially artists and animators) working on the game aren't all that great, you'll probably get a crappy looking game, no matter what power the console has. Plus better graphics also means more money and time has to be spent on the art of the game. Which we can notice now already in for example, the price of games (Xbox360 right now).

 

I don't know... I think Nintendo is taking the right path here. I was honestly getting bored of gaming because everything just started looking the same. But then there came the DS, with its great innovative new way of playing. Sure, the graphics cannot be compared to those of the PSP, but I haven't enjoyed gaming this much in a long long time. I've been playing AC:WW pretty much every day since December, just because it's so fun. And that fun is not related to the graphics at all. And I think the Wii will do just the same, just in a different way. It's gonna be innovative and fun. And the graphics will be good enough to compliment that. I don't think we really have to be worried. Except for maybe people who only really care about graphics (and sadly, those exist).

 

I'd say, wait and see. And have fun playing all the awesome games that are going to come our way soon. =D

[Zechs Merquise]

Looking back to Nintendo's last two consoles, the N64 and Gamecube it was a couple of issues (like the graphical one with Wii) that kept them from achiving true greatness and being THE console of the day.

 

For the N64 it was the use of cartridges rather than CDs which pushed up costs for developers and prevented them from using more detailed textures and including FMV and the kind of music that helped to sell games like Wipeout. Now, I always feel slightly hypocritical giving criticsm to the N64, as for me I can't remember a system which had so many classic and ground breaking games, Ocarina of Time, Mario 64, Goldeneye, Lylat Wars etc. Plus it brought the innovation of analogue control, rumble feedback and for me the most comfortable controller ever made. However, it still must be said that with CD storage, it may have achieved more.

 

As for the Gamecube, again I love my Gamecube and play it almost everyday. It has seen some of the best games of this generation. For me, the best game of this generation was Metroid Prime. But, I feel Nintendo missed out. With the lack of DVD playback, which I feel now is a nothing as everyone has a stand alone player - but back at release was a nice extra. I also felt that the colour - PURPLE, I mean PURPLE!!! It pt people off the console, it looked silly. I shock my head in dismay when years later they released the silver version, WOW - the coolest looking console to date? It look wonderful, that sat under your widescreen TV look wonderful, a perfect compliment to your living room. Why not launch with silver? But no, it was purple.

 

For me, I feel Nintendo has always made the best games, this generation there has been only two reasons I played on my mate's PS2 - MGS2 and MGS3. The only games that attracted me to the XBOX were Halo, Halo 2 and the great tactical FPSs which were superior on that system. However Nintendo has given us Metroid Prime, Smash Bros, Pikmin, Zelda WW, Mario Sunsine, Mario Kart, Battalion Wars, Donkey Konga, Fire Embelm... the list ges on. Plus we've had some great 3rd party support. The kind of diversity and brilliance seen in Nintendo titles is not seen anywhere else in video games.

 

But making the best games just doesn't seem to be enough today. The system must be marketed right, it must be attractive to the general public and be seen as 'cool' and cutting edge. I just wish Nintendo could get it totally right, they have the best games, bring us TRUE inovation which then goes on to be industry standard. But then go on to make silly decisions - PURPLE anyone?

[Eenuh]

I bought a black GameCube at launch; you didn't have to go for purple really (though in the end I don't think I would've really cared about the colour anyway). Sure, purple isn't the best of colours for a console, but then again the Xbox is ugly too (its shape, not the colour). It's all about what you can do with it.

 

 

And I think Nintendo are starting to get the more general kind of audience to notice them, finally. At least that's what I see happening with the DS (Lite) right now. I hear (and see) about people playing games on it; people who didn't play games before. And if they can get those people to become interested in the Wii as well, then I think they might have something going for them.

[Zechs Merquise]

I agree, XBOX was an ugly oversized console, but it wasn't purple. I think that colour made the Gamecube unfriendly to the average living room. Sure, it fits well in any kids bedroom, but a purple box under your widescreen silver TV looks a little silly. I'm well aware that you could get them in black from launch, as I did, I have two actually, and both are black (I got the second to get the Zelda compilation). Sadly, though the purple was what people saw, it was the 'standard', it was the one on adverts, the one in on show in the display pods. Bad choice.

 

Which brings me on to a positive - the Wii looks fabulous. It looks very hi-tech, very sleek, can stand on it's side or be layed down. It comes in a lovely modern colour. It's the nicest looking of the next gen consoles. The PS3 looks ugly (in my opinion) and the 360 looks cool, but not as nice as Wii. It kind of reminds of the cool look of the iPod.

 

I hope the standard controller is nice on the hand, this is something I have very few doubts about, as for me Nintendo has always produced the best controllers of any generation. SNES vs Megadrive, those Megadrive controllers were horrid, absolutely horrid, the SNES pad just clung to my hands. Then came the N64 - best controller ever, and one that shaped the future of gaming forever. I also love the gamecube on, it kinda just clings to my hand and the analogue sticks feel great. As for Dual Shock, lets say no more!

[Dilli Gee]

I also worry that because of the lack of graphical power we won’t see as many multi-platform games coming to the Wii, and if we do they’ll be a stripped down and ugly version. I fear that we may not see the next instalments of the Rainbow Six series, or the Time Splitter series, or the next true Resident Evil game.

You might see Time Splitters 4, because the second game sold well on all formats, so I assume that included GameCube.

 

As for Rainbow Six, that's possible, but it was built directly for Xbox 360 and then ported to PS3, so downgrading it might be an issue.

 

Resident Evil 5 isn't going to be on Wii, we've got Umbrella Chronicles instead.