Nintendo and kiddy gamers

[Fierce_LiNk]

There has, for quite some time, been a view that Nintendo caters for mainly the younger gamer. How much truth is there to this? That's what i'm hoping to find out.

 

First of all, a little background information needs to be given by me. I have been playing Nintendo consoles since the SNES, and was there during the N64 and GC eras as well. The early experiences i had with mario allstars and other games inspired me to buy subsequent consoles and their games. This is my experience of games, from the past to the present.

Now for the present. I'm currently studying at Brighton Uni to become a teacher. This has had two effects on me, one as a gamer and the other as an observer to the audience who plays games.

As i'm at Uni, life is sometimes pretty hectic. I didn't bring my Gamecube to uni because i did not bring a tv either. Having to pay a tv licence also put me off, so i left it. However, i brought something which would change my outlook on games forever. I brought a Nintendo DS with me to Uni.

Now, i've never been a massive fan of handheld games. In fact, i was a bit weary about buying a DS because i didn't know if i'd click with it and play it all that much. After playing it the first time, my opinion changed drastically. Wario Ware and Project Rub are insane games! But the main thing that i liked about certain ds games was that you could play them anytime, anywhere for however long as possible. I've played the DS on the coach to my school placement for 10 mins, and i've also played for hours on my bed.

The other thing that i liked about this specific console was that my girlfriend seemed to click with it. Although my girlfriend doesn't really like games, she would at times pick up and play project rub or wario ware by herself. I asked myself why this was happening, and then it became clear. It was accessible to her. Buttons and menus can put off many people, but being able to touch what you need to play the game made it easily accessible to her.

 

Now, for the second part: Me as an observer. Due to my course, i spend a lot of time among young people. My class is a year six class and the abilities of the children from this class vary so much that teaching them is an extremely difficult task.

During one lesson, some of the kids had been given a time called independant study where they just do their own thing. I was watching them, and then i could hear them starting to talk about games consoles. Over the next few days, it became clear that about 90%+ of the class owned a games console for this generation. About 80%+ of them owned more than one home games console. Interestingly, many of the children also opted for a DS. I asked the children what sorts of games they were into (for all consoles) and the common answers were pro evo, mario kart, halo, kingdom hearts, zelda and various others.

During another lesson, just before lunchtime, i heard several of the children talking about the upcoming Nintendo Revolution. One of the children who was leading the discussion seemed to know a fair bit about what he was talking about. Needless to say, i was impressed.

 

So, what does this mean exactly?

 

It seems pretty obvious to me that some adults view Nintendo as a kiddy console maker. Now, its true that many children opt for a nintendo console. But its also true that many children also own ps2s, xboxs, DSs, psps and even dreamcasts. From what i've seen, these kids know what they're talking about when it comes to games. That much is obvious when they choose pro evo for a football game rather than a lesser alternative.

 

 

 

The all important question beckons: What does this mean for the Revolution?

 

In my opinion, this battle will be fought on many levels. However, i think Nintendo could be onto a good thing here.

 

Firstly, the freehand controller/remote opens up new ideas. It also opens up a new idea of accessibility, like the DS. The DS gives you the option to directly touch what you see. The Revolution is building up on this. Why add more buttons? Buttons just make games more complicated to play. Buttons DO put off many non-gamers. How many times have you had a non gamer playing ssb:m or pro evo and told them to press "B" and see that their faces contort into an act of confusion?

 

Secondly, its very apparent that many children or other gamers tend to buy more than one games console nowadays.

 

And finally, these children do know what they're talking about. Why do some many people, who claim to be in the know, disregard younger children as gamers? When a child is young, they are curious. However, when they age, they become more and more biased. Adults are often more biased than children.

 

The children who play Nintendo consoles in this generation such as the Cube or the DS, will go on to play future nintendo consoles such as the revolution. They are, at the moment, young hardcore nintendo fans.

 

So, what are your opinions on all this? Are Nintendo indeed the kiddy console maker? Or, are gamers just getting younger due to games being accessible to a wider audience?

[BigTac]

The kiddy talk about Nintendo is stupid. Also, I hate when developers referr to reasons of not making titles for the GC because it wouldn't sell because it's a kids system.

Truth is, the games make the system.

Do you all think that if GTA or any of the other huge mature titles launched or where availible on the GC exclusive they would not have sold because Nintendo is kiddy ? But because developers have created most "all" of their mature franchises on the PS2/Xbox the mature gamers buy those systems. So when a mature game does come on the GC(exclusive or multi-plat) the games don't sell as much because the gamers that would have brought the games either don't own a GC or would rather keep their collection on their PS2/Xbox.

[Pit-Jr]

I have been playing Nintendo consoles since the SNES, and was there during the N64 and GC eras as well. The early experiences i had with mario allstars and other games inspired me to buy subsequent consoles and their games. This is my experience of games, from the past to the present.

 

Too bad you didnt get to give the NES a whirl.

 

I think Nintendo accepts and takes pride in being attractive to kids. Im glad they were there with theyre camp, inoffensive, and totally addictive games when i was a kid. I cant imagine being 6 or 7 years old and having Grand Theft Auto or Killer 7 as my first videogame.

[Fierce_LiNk]

Too bad you didnt get to give the NES a whirl.

 

I think Nintendo accepts and takes pride in being attractive to kids. Im glad they were there with theyre camp, inoffensive, and totally addictive games when i was a kid. I cant imagine being 6 or 7 years old and having Grand Theft Auto or Killer 7 as my first videogame.

 

I do own a NES, but i only brought that around 2 or 3 years ago. What i meant was that i wasn't 'into' gaming during the NES era.

[AshMat]

I hate nintendo being called kiddy, they are't. How many 5 year olds do you know that play resident evil? Just because we don't have a lot of violent games like PS2 and Xbox do. I wouldn't let little kids near my DS, they'd probably lose the stylus and bash the screen. I'd let them on my PS2 though, that' a simple pad you pick up. I think nintendo's new controller is a bigger approach to older gamers, aswell as casual ones.

[dabookerman]

truth be told, ive seen more kiddy games on the ps2 and ps1. look at the psone, you tell me that doesnt look kiddy or a toy

[Bogbas]

The kiddy image comes from people who probably don't play the so called kiddy games. I just started playing paper mario 2 and, surprisingly, there are some jokes that only a teen/adult would understand. Bit like the simpsons, kids laugh at the slapstick or other obvious funny things, while adults laughs to political satire. And it's a cartoon, which is considered kiddy in western cultures.

 

And for the so called 'mature' games, excessive violence/gore make games more appealing to preteens/teens. And that's the same with age ratings. If a 13 year old boy would have to choose between 2 similar FPS's which both have gotten similar reviews. And the other is rated Teen and the other Mature. Which do you think he would get?

[djamb3]

Nintendo is not for a kiddy audience. You play Paper mario or pikmin and they are full with something that only the adults will understand. What makes other gamers say they are kiddy it's normally the colorful games with fluffy characters (any non gamer who looks to paper mario 2 will say firstly that game is for kids). But that influenced the rest of ppl and the press in general (When DS was lunched some news I saw was that console was aimed to de younger boys.Just that). Now what can Nintendo do? Well they don't have a foto-realistic Mario just because they don't want to. But are starting to change that.Look at zelda for example (a friend of mine said me he would never play TWW because it looks kiddy, and now is so enthusiasted with TTP as I am.)

 

Don't change much Nintendo. I like you and I always will.

[The Peeps]

There is a certain kind of person that wont buy a game purely because of how it looks. If it looks 'kiddy' (usually any game that isn't made in 60 different shades of grey) then they wont buy it because of what their friends would say. Image is all that matters to them.

 

If someone tells me a game is fun then I'll buy it and see for myself, graphics or kiddy styles don't matter. It's just not important what it looks like but how it plays.

 

The Legend of Zelda: Wind Waker looked kiddy (apparently) but to me it just let me see more expression on characters faces and more detail etc. It still played like any other Zelda game (though I thought Ganon was too easy).

 

It'd be great if everyone could get past this whole image conscious thing and just get a game because it's fun to play, not because of what other people will think.

[Jay]

Very good point, I think the thing is that Nintendo push their so caled 'kiddy' franchises a lot as they make up the bulk of first party games whereas Sony have developers working on the likes of Ratchet & Clank, but also push 'adult' games such as The Getaway and Killzone just as much. The problem is Nintendo have become far too associated with Mario whereas with Sony and Microsoft you can't think of one franchise that defines their system.

 

It would be a step in the right direction for nintendo to develop, and market more adult games - Geist, Eternal Darkness and Metroid were a step in the right direction but all got very little hype compared to the likes of the latest Mario Kart and consequently got shunted to the back, but with a bit more advertising and a bit more of a shine on the actual products then they could make a success of it. Thats not to say Nintendo should abandon Mario but if they really want to appeal to the average gamer they need to give just as much time to more mature franchises, that don't involve a plumber "Wahoo" and "Waha" 'ing his way around levels.

 

Don't misunderstand me, I personally don't believe the likes of the Mario titles are childish. As Bogbas said, Paper Mario contains some humour only adults would understand, much like The Simpsons and kids tv shows (ITV's Ministry of Mayhem is a great example of this), children can still enjoy it but their are comments that are subtle enough for children not to understand but direct enough for adults to find hilarious. However mass market perception is that such titles are childish, purely based on visuals and as they are Nintendo's marketing focus they just assume that its all Nintendo are about.

 

I don't believe the amount of 'Kiddy Games' makes the console appear to be a kids system, I believe its the lack of mature titles and the advertising focus on 'Kiddy Games' that does it, although to be fair the Gamecube's design and name didn't help. As someone said, PS2 has more kiddy games however the majority of them are third party ones that you wouldn't even hear about unless you saw in the shops, based on movie franchises and cartoons and they're all absolute crap but no-one pays them any attention because they never hear of them.

 

If Nintendo put as much of a focus on their adult games with the Revolution - F-Zero, 1080, Wave Race, Excitebike, Metroid etc they could turn them into huge must have, adult franchises that can co-exist with the likes of Mario Kart.

[Konfucius]

The problem is that most of the games just don't look violent but friendly and therefore are considered to be for kids. Take Wind Waker as an example: the cel shading look and general even pretty non violent sword fights make it appealing to Kids too but my 9 year old neighbour can't even complete the first quest. It took him a lot of time to even get the first sword.

But I also made the mistake that I took graphics for gameplay with Mario Sunshine, a mate got it and I was watching him play constantly making fun of the graphics and the water pack, then he let me play. I was immersed in my surrounding, the water pack was fun, jumping, running around. It didn't have the kiddy feeling I saw before.

So my conclusion: The graphics make the games look kiddy, when in reality they aren't at all.

[Kurtle Squad]

The Legend of Zelda: Wind Waker looked kiddy (apparently) but to me it just let me see more expression on characters faces and more detail etc. It still played like any other Zelda game (though I thought Ganon was too easy).

 

Yeah...The Wind Waker is one of the most immersive games I've ever played. I loved exploring around and meeting all the interesting and funny characters.

[demonmike04]

Very true fierce link, accesability does make things more appealing.

But personally, the overall kiddy look definitly came from the original GBA and the cube. Personally, GameCube is the ugliest peice of work i've ever bought, but i love it. You had the choice of a purple or black cube on the launch, PURPLE?? The black was a good choice, but purple matching with your nice silver or black TV? It doesnt look right when you want your living room to look good.

 

The GBA also contributed by the amount of movie tie-ins it had for kids and the amount of useless crappy games bought out for kids. My younger brothers have bought these titles and admit there crap, kids do know what they want in a game. But sometimes, its just the trend.

 

Thats why we see so many redesigns from Nintendo, the new DS lite will look sleeker than the original DS, so more appealing to those who thought the original is too clunky (which it is to me, very crampy). The SP and Micro also boosted the GBA, changed many opinions too from my friends.

 

The Revolution im yet to predict about the kiddy aspect, i dont think its kiddy. But many people might take the Nintendo name and base it on it. But it does have the look and the completely different way of playing. Cant say its unique because some games are using a similar way on the PS2.

 

The Nintendo kiddy image will soon decrease, and depending on revolution, may dissapear.

[Nintendork]

The buttons on the DS are too small.

Can't be arsed to read all you want.. Nintendo is a cultural icon.. it is aimed at kids, but big kids.. we've had Nintendo 20 years now.. it's part of everyone and a household name.

 

We were kids when we played it, and our kids will play it.. I think they are still a child orientated company.. but they cater for their children that grow up and still have brand loyalty.

 

Ultimately.. the argument that Nintendo only make kiddy games is not sound. The argument that Nintendo have touched us all as children and perhaps captured that magic for us however is more debatable.

 

I was playing electroplankton today and smiling like I did when I was a kid.

[Shino]

The kiddy image for nintendo came along with the launch of the Playstation, wich was advertised as an mature console for cool and grown up people, thus making every other console kiddy. I remmember when I was about 12, all the kids in my class called nintendo kiddy and every one seemed to have a playstation, and still until today I see more kids playing PS2 than a gamecube. The problem is ,at least here in Portugal (and I think in most Europe), most people started playing consoles in the PS era, and people don't call each console for its name it's all the same, it's all playstation (much like in the US in the late 80's and early 90's every console was a nintendo, at leasts that's what I see in movies :p ). Not counting some of my more instructed friends, every time someone see's my GC they call it Playstation.

 

Now it seem's that nintendo is losing is kiddy brand, but the playstation brand is so well implemented in the peoples mind, that the revolution seems to be the only solution for Nintendo, and separate themselves froms the other consoles in the market, its such a great idea that it will certenaly work.

[Enigma]

The kiddy image for nintendo came along with the launch of the Playstation, wich was advertised as an mature console for cool and grown up people, thus making every other console kiddy. I see more kids playing PS2 than a gamecube. The problem is ,at least here in Portugal (and I think in most Europe), most people started playing consoles in the PS era.

You read my mind. That is so true.

 

I´ve played Nintendo since the NES days and I see Nintendo more as a family-name than a kiddy-name.

[Gaijin von Snikbah]

The reason for me still playing Nintendo, is because Nintendo were "kiddy" when I was young too. Because it was easy to play, it was also easy to have fun with their games. This created a fond memory in my brain, a unique taste like no other.

 

Making games for everyone is one of the hardest things to do. This is what makes Nintendo so special. They breed the most loyal fans of them all.

[Jamba]

Here's a good example... Project Rub. Kiddy game or not?

 

Most people would look at the graphics and say "Oh no that's sooo kiddy, it's all colourful and stuff" but if they actually played it they would fund that it's got loads of pretty "riskai" (sp? I can't!) jokes and material. Not to mention people would claim that the mini game aspect is childish.

 

But heaven help us, at least we have Sprung! *hides behind sofa to avoid being pelted with stones*

[Hellfire]

Most kids prefer violent games because they feel grown up playing them. To me a mature game is a game that relies on content and quality instead of blood and boobs. Nintendo makes games tat are playable by everyone, including kids, so they're imediately kiddy. Besides games were largely associated with kids in the old days and Nintendo is also associated to the past, so they're stuck with that label.

[Librarian]

oh no...not this whole kiddie thing again... could we move on please??

[YenRug]

Nintendo is the videogaming equivalent of Shrek; looks like a kids cartoon, has slapstick that the kids love, but the dialogue is appreciated by those mature enough to perceive it. Now, if we could just get as many people who watched Shrek to play Nintendo games and systems...

[raven_blade2006]

In order to change this image they must have an extremely diverse selection of games on the Rev. Also Marketing is very important for the so called 'mature' games. Let people know the range the Rev offers and do not get postioned into one demographic.

[Patch]

How many times have you had a non gamer playing ssb:m or pro evo and told them to press "B" and see that their faces contort into an act of confusion?

 

LOL! I totally agree with you. Great post.

 

My reasoning for SSBM's phenomenal success is down to its universal appeal. For hardcore gamers, there is plenty to learn, lots of modes and trophy collecting.

For non-hardcore gamers, it has a very simple pick-up-and-play appeal to it. My five year old cousin can have a whale of time by pressing A for the whole match.

 

Unfortunately it's very difficult to create a single game that caters to these two groups that have very different needs. The next best thing is to create an environment for which both types of games (hardcore and casual) can be made easily. I think this is why the DS has been so successful and why Revolution has the potential to be.

[OVERLORD]

If Nintendo can capture enough of the T4/MOM/CDUK market they'll do fine this gen. They need to sponsor more shows in those slots! They need to be more proactive around media events. Sponsor Brit's or equivalent!

 

They need to rid themselves of retailers like Game who are a poor excuse for a supposedly independant retailer. They give Nintendo a bad name. Even retailers like Tesco's & Argos do better.

 

Whilst seeking better partners. They could setup countrywide demo booths in cinema's. Imagine playing demo's while you wait to see the latest flicks.

 

Revo's Vitrual capability in these locations could also come in handy as you could download retro games to memory card like you would MP3 in Music shops.

 

Nintendo could quite easily sponsor someone like Odeon or UCI @ Film Premier's getting even more publicity. Forget Warner as I don't think Sony would allow it.

 

They need to advertise their games like Movie trailers. Even lame films have more impact than current Nintendo marketing achievements!

[Nintendork]

If Nintendo can capture enough of the T4/MOM/CDUK market they'll do fine this gen. They need to sponsor more shows in those slots! They need to be more proactive around media events. Sponsor Brit's or equivalent!

 

You're onto something there, originally I wanted a PSP.. but after researching the games lineup over 2006, I found it to be piss poor.

 

I didn't go to the nintendo DS until I saw how much fun it could be in the channel 4 adverts in touch with original comedy.

 

their marketting guy Merrick did a good job and is probably the reason why I have a DS in my pack.