Super Smash Bros. Ultimate

[markderoos]

7 hours ago, Glen-i said:

Did the Link from Twilight Princess have those remote bombs? Or the Ancient Arrows? Different Link. "Everyone is here" is a lie! It's the scandal of the century!

And who says Fludd Mario, Mansion Busting Luigi or Giga Bowser aren’t different incarnations of their earlier outages?! 

A tweaked moveset or alternate outfit isn’t enough to pursuade me.

How about BotW Link’s character spot being identicaly numbered to his representation from the original N64 Smash and onward?

Edited September 17, 2018 by markderoos

[Glen-i]

10 hours ago, markderoos said:

And who says Fludd Mario, Mansion Busting Luigi or Giga Bowser aren’t different incarnations of their earlier outages?! 

A tweaked moveset or alternate outfit isn’t enough to pursuade me.

How about BotW Link’s character spot being identicaly numbered to his representation from the original N64 Smash and onward?

Nintendo said so. Mario is Mario, no matter what he's doing. (The only exception is Paper Mario. Paper Jam confirms that Paper Mario is from a parallel dimension) There are many different Links and Zeldas throughout the series. The whole reincarnation thing is the series way of having varied settings. Smash mentions that many times in trophy descriptions and even had Snake and Mei Ling (That's probably the wrong name for that Metal Gear character) talk about it in Brawl.

I mean, if this latest Link somehow counts as a NES character, then why doesn't Young Link or Toon Link? In fact Smash has never even had a NES Link. 64 and Melee went with the OoT design.

It's the character from BoTW, that particular Link has never been in any other Zelda game. So therefore, WiiU. It's just like how DK is not the arcade version.

[markderoos]

3 hours ago, Glen-i said:

Nintendo said so. Mario is Mario, no matter what he's doing. (The only exception is Paper Mario. Paper Jam confirms that Paper Mario is from a parallel dimension) There are many different Links and Zeldas throughout the series. The whole reincarnation thing is the series way of having varied settings. Smash mentions that many times in trophy descriptions and even had Snake and Mei Ling (That's probably the wrong name for that Metal Gear character) talk about it in Brawl.

I mean, if this latest Link somehow counts as a NES character, then why doesn't Young Link or Toon Link? In fact Smash has never even had a NES Link. 64 and Melee went with the OoT design.

It's the character from BoTW, that particular Link has never been in any other Zelda game. So therefore, WiiU. It's just like how DK is not the arcade version.

No, still not convinced. In that case he’s the Super Smash Bros Link incarnation that put on the tunic from BotW Link and decided to use some of his moves. He’s obviously a veteran fighter or he wouldn’t have been in the background when Inkling Girl was invited to join.

So; N64 it is!

[Glen-i]

1 hour ago, markderoos said:

No, still not convinced. In that case he’s the Super Smash Bros Link incarnation that put on the tunic from BotW Link and decided to use some of his moves. He’s obviously a veteran fighter or he wouldn’t have been in the background when Inkling Girl was invited to join.

So; N64 it is!

By that logic, every Smasher would be placed in either N64, GC, Wii, 3DS or Switch.

[markderoos]

22 minutes ago, Glen-i said:

By that logic, every Smasher would be placed in either N64, GC, Wii, 3DS or Switch.

At least my logic is logical!

[Jonnas]

19 hours ago, Glen-i said:

1. It's a fair point. Honestly, Ganondorf is one of the more... Trickier characters to place. There's the whole Ganondorf is Ganon thing, some games say they're two separate beings, some say they're not.

Even so, Smash focuses on Ganondorf the Gerudo and we first saw that one in Ocarina of Time. So I made my decision based on his Smash depiction. If Beast Ganon ever became playable, he'd be immediately placed in the NES catagory.

2. I'm surprised no-one mentioned this sooner. I'm not counting Smash itself. It's perfectly up to interpretation on this matter. Saying GameCube for Roy would be perfectly fine. I'm not gonna try and say GBA is the only answer.

3. In Red/Blue Rescue Team, Lucario is a Rescue Team Member like a lot of the Pokémon in those games. He's basically referred to as the best of the best. The statue Julius Caesar is talking about is a reward given to anyone who reaches the highest rank. Kinda like an honorary thing, I guess. But Lucario is a character in it. Even if most people will never see it.

3a. I considered F-Zero GX for R.O.B. It's a unique situation because back then R.O.B was a toy. Nothing more than that. Mario Kart DS was the first time R.O.B was given an actual personality (Yes, personality is a bit strong for R.O.B but it was sentient). It became a video game character then in my opinion.

4. Glad you asked. Completely average. Every Animal Crossing character shares the same animations as Villager these days, especially in New Leaf. So before I agreed that Villager should be moved to "It depends", he was in "Completely average" Because Isabelle is not a custom made character, it's a pretty easy decision for me to place her in Villager's old spot.

5. Yep. It's one of the strangest video game facts really. Plenty of people know about Mario's first appearance. But Sonic's appearance there is something I can imagine would surprise a lot of Sonic fans. (I only learned about it because it's mentioned in a Smash 4 loading screen)

1. How could they be two separate beings? t's just a transformation alongside a nickname. He even turns into Ganon in this game.

2. Then Gamecube it is!

3. Very well. Point conceded, thank you for the clarification.

3a. Can't really agree with that, myself. I'd personally count ROB as an NES debutant. But hey, it's your rules. What about Warioware for the GBA? There's a microgame where you control him.

5. Definitely surprised me. I went into the Sonic wiki to check what the heck you were on about, and there it was: Sonic's keychain wagging his finger and laughing at me from a tiny screenshot.

[Glen-i]

31 minutes ago, markderoos said:

At least my logic is logical!

We're clearly not gonna agree, so if anyone else is reading our discussion, what do you think? Link and Zelda in Smash Ultimate, both from the NES or WiiU/3DS?

24 minutes ago, Jonnas said:

1. How could they be two separate beings? t's just a transformation alongside a nickname. He even turns into Ganon in this game.

3a. Can't really agree with that, myself. I'd personally count ROB as an NES debutant. But hey, it's your rules. What about Warioware for the GBA? There's a microgame where you control him.

1. The Ocarina of Time one, sure. But some Ganondorfs, like the NES and SNES one are a separate thing. Classic case of reconning for convenience, really.

3a. Honestly forgot about the Stack-up game from Warioware. But...

Are you controlling R.O.B or the NES controller?

[Sméagol]

He should be his own catagory. he debuted as an actual, physical robot. or toy, accessory, whatever. That's too significant too dismiss. he's the only Smash character that's actually real.

So a real-life or miscellaneous catagory for Rob.

[Jonnas]

You know what, Sméagol makes the best point.

28 minutes ago, Glen-i said:

We're clearly not gonna agree, so if anyone else is reading our discussion, what do you think? Link and Zelda in Smash Ultimate, both from the NES or WiiU/3DS?

1. The Ocarina of Time one, sure. But some Ganondorfs, like the NES and SNES one are a separate thing. Classic case of reconning for convenience, really.

Wii U & 3DS. Sakurai made sure that each Zelda character resembled a specific game, so it makes sense that you categorized Link&Zelda that way.

The Ganons on the NES/SNES games aren't a separate entity. They're the same dude, but a few centuries after. People get old, they turn into pigs, their skin gets bluer, etc.

Regardless, since Ganondorf's design comes from OoT, I'm still okay with the placement you gave him.

[Glen-i]

Will update the list on Thursday. But for now...

Spoiler

Assist Trophy: Shovel Knight

Blue armour, horns and a large shovel...that's right, it's Shovel Knight! With his trusty shovel, he can bury an opponent in the ground, or throw rocks as he digs. He may even dig up some food.

Shovel Knight continues to be in every thing, I guess.

 

[ArtMediocre]

Made a mock-up of how I would design a Smash Bros Joy-con pair. I don't know if you like it, but I think it's way better than the two lines on the Special Edition. It's such a missed opportunity on Nintendo's behalf...

Edited September 19, 2018 by ArtMediocre

[Glen-i]

That's a much nicer concept.

[Charlie]

Is anyone else not getting this? I would really like to but realistically I'd never actually play it. I don't think it's the same playing online and I have no one locally to play with.

[bob]

Is anyone else not getting this? I would really like to but realistically I'd never actually play it. I don't think it's the same playing online and I have no one locally to play with.

I'm in two minds, but I suspect that the FOMO may win though in the end. I may actually buy it and hope I end up playing it due to the Switch's portableness, but I similarly lack enough local people to play it with.

[Glen-i]

Spoiler

Onett

Ness's hometown has a drugstore in the middle and houses on either side. Watch out for cars entering the stage from the right – they can hit you for 30% damage!

Every time someone from my community centre tries Smash for the first time and this stage gets picked, I have to explain that a drug store is a real thing and it's not what they're thinking.

Thanks America.

This week's music is a remix of "Happy Home Designer - Title Theme" It's arranged by Kazumi Totaka, who worked on the original game.

 

 

[Glen-i]

I went back and updated the two tier lists I did.

Spoiler

• Added Isabelle to "Completely Average"
• Moved Cloud from "Blatant Refusal" to "Dad at Wedding"
• Moved Villager from "Completely Average" to "It Depends"

Spoiler

• Moved Roy from "Game Boy Advance" to "Gamecube"
• Added "Real Life" catagory
• Moved R.O.B from "DS" to "Real Life"
• Deleted "DS" catagory

 

[Glen-i]

Spoiler

Assist Trophy: Moon
From The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask, this Assist Trophy will appear in the sky and slowly approach the centre of the stage. When it hits, it deals a lot of damage to opponents nearby!

Out of the new Assist Trophies this game brings, this is my favourite. Because it's utterly hilarious! It's also worth noting that it damages everyone, even the person who summoned it. Which only makes it funnier.

 

Edited September 24, 2018 by Glen-i

[RedShell]

On 20/09/2018 at 6:04 PM, Glen-i said:

• Moved Roy from "Game Boy Advance" to "Gamecube"
• Added "Real Life" catagory
• Moved R.O.B from "DS" to "Real Life"
• Deleted "DS" catagory

• Left Captain Falcon in the wrong place. 

[ArtMediocre]

Whenever anyone summons an assist trophy and it turns out to be the moon, everyone is gonna be like "...oh god, not again!"

[Glen-i]

10 hours ago, ArtMediocre said:

Whenever anyone summons an assist trophy and it turns out to be the moon, everyone is gonna be like "...oh god, not again!"

Those kind of assist trophies are my favourite. Skull Kid, Nintendog, Nightmare. The ones that mess with everyone are the funniest.

[Glen-i]

Spoiler

Actually, there isn't a Pic of the day today, just music. Which is... Odd...

Anyway, the music sample is a remix of "Battle (Steven)" from Pokémon OmegaRuby/AlphaSapphire, which is also odd, because that's a remix of the same song from Pokémon Ruby/Sapphire. Wonder why they classified it as such, when it's not the original source?

 

 

[Glen-i]

Spoiler

Now there's two updates. Someone at Smash Office needs to get their act together!

Brinstar

This stage is an underground cavern on Planet Zebes, from the Metroid series. Although the rising and falling acid at the bottom of the stage can deal severe damage, touching it when you're falling off the stage can actually help you recover!

Death's Scythe

You can KO highly damaged opponents with a well placed smash attack from this scythe. A black aura will surround your oppponent right before you attack, signaling an instant KO!

Brinstar is the one from Melee. The one from N64 is called Planet Zebes and doesn't appear to be showing up for Ultimate.

Death's Scythe on the other hand... Yeah, say KO all you like. No-one's buying it.

 

[Glen-i]

Spoiler

Assist Trophy: Kapp'n

When Kapp'n takes the stage, he hops in a bus and drives around the stage. Careful! When he hits a fighter, he'll carry them off of the stage in his bus!

This assist trophy is stupid. Which means I love everything about it! I wonder if it can pick up multiple characters, or just one.

 

[Glen-i]

Spoiler

Saffron City

A stage based on Saffron City from Pokémon Red Version and Pokémon Blue Version. Pokémon appear from the doorway of the building at the centre of the stage. Watch out when Electrode appears!

I love that the Pokémon that appear here are still sprites. They could have easily used models, but no. Let's redo the sprites, and don't make them high quality, that would be wrong.

The music this week was a remix of "Afternoon on the Island" from Tomodachi Life. It's arranged by Masafumi Takada.

 

 

[bob]

This was my favourite stage from the N64 version. Love it.