Red Dead Redemption 2 (PS4/Xbox One - 26 October 2018)

[Ronnie]

2 hours ago, dan-likes-trees said:

Yeah I do kind of agree with this. Often with these kind of games it seems like reviewers are too awed by the technical prowess and studio reputation to give an accurate judgement. Fallout 4 springs to mind - though I expect this game to be much higher quality all round. All the discussion I've heard of the game has a tonne of caveats but the scores as you say seem weirdly high in comparison. A lot of the game seems like kind of a slog? TBF I've never really gotten on with Rockstar games for whatever reason.

That all said, I think I'll be picking it up this weekend. Kind of tempted to get Ass Oddessey instead but loads of people I know are picking up red dead so I'm keen to dive into the chat...

Yeah I totally agree about these big tentpole releases getting marked up because of the studio or hype, I've never seen such a huge disconnect between the review itself and the score though. Be interesting to track the reaction to the game over the next week or so.

Anyway sunk a couple of hours into it and it's living up to the hype for me at least. The whole thing just feels impressive, the production values are incredible even though gameplay wise I didn't really do a massive amount lol. I do feel like I'm wrestling with the controller sometimes, the controls are a bit all over the place, and Arthur moves like a tank, but otherwise enjoying it a lot!

Edited October 26, 2018 by Ronnie

[drahkon]

Been playing this for another hour again. Did a couple of side missions and on my way to each of them I had so many awesome random moments.

Two dudes had "a proposition" for me...suuuuuure. I shot 'em dead.

Later, an injured guy fell off his horse. I did the decent thing and brought him to a doctor. While the doctor was treating him I robbed the doc's register. 

Went off to the next side mission, on my way I rode through a swamp but didn't realise that there were quite a few crocodiles in the area. The second I understood what's around me my hose threw me off and I entered panic mode because I thought the animals would attack me. As it turned out, they didn't.  

Few minutes later I approached a guy and his camp, just wanted to see if he got something to do for me. I got off the horse and that dude immediately started shooting. Well...another one bit the dust as I put a bullet in his head.

And during all my travels I managed to "crash" my horse into carriages, trees, rocks, houses and it was always hilarious  

 

Oh and the side missions: Lots of fun  

[dwarf]

A peak into my domestic life, 27/10/2018:

Me: [disinterested tone] Is Read Dead 2 due to arrive before my Birthday?

Ma: I think Amazon said Monday *checks iPad* Oh, it says it's delivered...

We stare each other out. I try to play it cool but Ma seizes the initiative – she squeezes past me and bombs it downstairs. I give chase. We both see the package and there is much hollering. She goes to grab it but she is too late; I have used the Cruyff turn to whisk the package away from her. It is mine.

Giggling, I take the package to my room where it is safe and open it up. Inside is Mama Mia 2: Here We Go Again on DVD.

Ha! Just kidding about the last part. Upshot is I'm rinsing outlaws with dynamite today. Yee-haw, bitches!

Edited October 27, 2018 by dwarf

[dwarf]

What aiming options have people settled on? The gunplay will probably feel slightly off whatever I choose, and at the moment I'm not sure if the middle ground between free-aim and auto-aim is actually preferable to the default or not. 

Did Rockstar set the default (i.e. easy snap-aim followed by a quick flick up for a headshot) because it's most satisfying way to play? It's great when it works but it's also inconsistent given enemies' heads are bobbing all over the place. I'm missing a lot of shots right now. Maybe that's the point, but it makes me sad

Edited October 28, 2018 by dwarf

[Choze]

On 25/10/2018 at 10:20 PM, Ronnie said:

For a game that's at 97 on Metacritic there's a ton of criticisms in the various reviews, it's really weird. Eurogamer, Kotaku, Gamespot etc have big problems with it. Moving the character, gun play, a few even question just how "fun" most of the game actually is. Really weird. If nothing else they seem to have nailed the openworld and all the small details. Still massively hyped, my first Rockstar game, and on my new X.

 

I think lots of these sort of slower open world game devs get a free pass or bonus points. See Dragion Age Inquistion, Witcher 3, GTA, Elder Scrolls, Assassin's Creed etc.

Padding and bad/slow combat ahoy. Its more of a trend.

 

Edited October 27, 2018 by Choze

[Glen-i]

16 minutes ago, Choze said:

I think lots of these sort of slower open world game devs get a free pass or bonus points. See Dragion Age Inquistion, Witcher 3, GTA, Elder Scrolls, Assassin's Creed etc.

Padding and bad/slow combat ahoy. Its more of a trend.

Yeah, it's the main reason I really dislike open-world games. The size of the world seems to take precedent and the combat tends to suffer as a result of trying to avoid many glitches occurring.

The first time I played L.A. Noire, I was floored by how awful any combat scene was. I enjoyed that game otherwise, but it got me apprehensive of the whole open-world thing. I mean, not even Zelda was immune to that issue.

Edited October 27, 2018 by Glen-i

[Goafer]

Whoah, whoah, whoah. I'll have nothing bad said about Witcher 3. It's a masterpiece.

[Ronnie]

Still blown away by the production values of this. I'm really enjoying it. I wouldn't say the moment to moment gameplay is particular "fun" but the immersion, world and all the mini adventures you go on make it enjoyable.

[dwarf]

It's a fucking joke how pretty this game is.

Playing it has reminded about this piece on BotW: http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2017-06-05-how-will-the-legend-of-zelda-breath-of-the-wild-change-the-open-world-paradigm

Quote

Importantly, though, the survival mechanics are handled with a light touch. When the player enters hazardous areas, for example, it isn't long before they find protective gear that shields them from the worst of it. Overly harsh survival mechanics can frustrate players, enslaving them to punitive death-countdown meters and forcing them into a desperate scrabble for food, or water, or oxygen, or what have you. They make the game about survival, and using them like that means you're making a survival game. Breath of the Wild's approach, making use of these mechanics periodically for flavour and in order to vary the constraints on the player, is much more generalisable. It adds texture to the game's world without constantly rubbing the player's face in it. Players moving from Nintendo's title to other open-world games that don't do such interesting things with their environments may find the experience comparatively flat.

There's a dizzying number of systems in the game, many of which don't make for conventionally fun gameplay, but that's not necessarily what they're there for. Normally I wouldn't be such a fan of 'busywork' but here I don't mind it at all, at least not yet. Dat texture, dem graphics, dose immersionz!

[Ronnie]

It's a crazy good looking game, I'm constantly pausing to drool over the visuals. Not just the outdoors, I spent ages in the Valentine store for that reason alone lol

It's great to have another systems-led openworld game after BOTW, it's a little different but easily just as compelling. It's just a shame there are so many small issues hampering my experience at least, but once everything flows, what an experience!

[dwarf]

I was getting annoyed at having to press two buttons to display the map, and then I thought, 'maybe if I hold options down that will take me straight there.' It did.

GOTY

[Dog-amoto]

45 minutes ago, dwarf said:

I was getting annoyed at having to press two buttons to display the map, and then I thought, 'maybe if I hold options down that will take me straight there.' It did.

GOTY

I did exactly the same

Got a bit annoyed when I was far from my horse and it wouldn’t come, had to steal one which put a bounty on me. 

[Babooo]

Agree with others - production values are through the roof. Graphics are gorgeous, weather effects are legit amazing. 

However some gameplay mechanics are rage inducing. Bounty system is just stupid and kills my enjoyment immediately. Controls don't feel very tight (standard for Rockstar I guess) and hand to hand combat feels awful. 

There's still more than enough to chew on but I do think this game is slightly overrated. But then again, I thought BOTW  was crap so ya know....

[Jimbob]

Been on/off this all weekend.  So far, so good.  For me anyway, it's living up to the hype in places.  Loving the missions, the world and the characters i'm coming across.  Per mission i'm completing, i'm hunting rabbits and deer on my way back to camp.  Already got into a bar fight, and various people have attempted to kill me out in the wilderness.

And faceplanted myself into a tree.

Loving the game so far, plenty to see and do.  Certainly playing more this evening.

[Daft]

I get criticisms about the game being slow (animations and looting and such), but it's clearly pretty deliberate and I actually really appreciate it. The world feels lush and alive. I was riding to a waypoint yesterday when a thunder storm hit, it looked unbelievable. The controls are another matter. They feel at best clunky, at worst convoluted. I think I'm getting used to them but they are certainly jarring at first.

The inventory system is kind of trash.

The absolute worst thing is the tutorials in the upper left-hand corner that appear as you're doing something. It was telling me how to quick-draw in a duel as the duel was happening...and there was no way I was going to win that one. Seems to happen a lot. And it's really shitty. But I guess that'll be less of an issue as the game goes on.

15 hours ago, dwarf said:

I was getting annoyed at having to press two buttons to display the map, and then I thought, 'maybe if I hold options down that will take me straight there.' It did.

GOTY

I'm using the app and have the mini-map disabled on the man screen. I reeeeeeeeeeally love having virtually no HUD.

Edited October 29, 2018 by Daft

[S.C.G]

Well, I finally got to play Red Dead Redemption II last night for a total of two hours.

Which essentially means that I've barely played it but at least I have a grasp of some basic mechanics now.

So far I've killed some things, killed some outlaws, rescued a couple of people, captured someone with a lasso, talked to some people and looted a little bit inbetween the horse riding.

It's a good tutorial so far and a decent introduction to the world of RDRII without being too overwhelming initially.

The game runs fine on my base PS4 but I did have to turn the brightness up to pretty much full in-game, which isn't really normal.

Adjust the slider until the Rock Star logo is barely visible it said... *moves slider all the way up and can still only see a black box where the logo should be* OK then...

Aside from that, no real issues and I'll be looking forward to playing more when I can.

[Daft]

1 minute ago, S.C.G said:

Adjust the slider until the Rock Star logo is barely visible it said... *moves slider all the way up and can still only see a black box where the logo should be* OK then...

I had this issue too and I realised a setting on my TV meant to enhance Blacks was actually crushing them in RDRII (at least in the calibration screen).

[dwarf]

1 hour ago, Daft said:

I'm using the app and have the mini-map disabled on the man screen. I reeeeeeeeeeally love having virtually no HUD.

I thought about using the app but is it not counterproductive to divert your eyes from the screen so often? Maybe if I rested my phone on a makeshift book stand I could make it work.

I'm totally with you on the minimalist HUD in theory but I find the extra hassle isn't worth it. Even the option of turning it off completely and recalling it with a button press is too distracting.

I've kept all the HUD defaults except for GPS, which I got rid of. Journeys take longer but I like making my own choices and going off the beaten track.

Edited October 29, 2018 by dwarf

[Ronnie]

I kept the HUD to a button press as well but I'm pretty much pressing it every 10 seconds when riding, so will probably just leave it on, or try the app and prop my ipad up next to the tv.

I'm probably just bad at the game but I'm finding combat really tough, not so much in missions where there's a big shoot out and cover everywhere but in the open. It doesn't help that I'm struggling with dead eye. I have no idea how that works, it seems to fire when I don't want it to and locks onto the same target about three times. I know you have to drag the cursor through enemies but it seems really sensitive and aiming with the analog stick isn't great to begin with.

The inventory management isn't the clearest either. Guess I'll wrap my head around it all eventually.

I find that I wander around and don't accomplish a massive amount. Like I was going to continue a side missin with a photographer, saw a bear near him along the way, killed it skinned it. Then the sidequest vanished off the radar. I assume it had to do with the bear, but who knows? Lots of little fuck ups like that seem to happen a lot.

Edited October 29, 2018 by Ronnie

[dwarf]

I'm finding dead eye tricky too, for two reasons:

1) I accidentally press R2 to shoot straight away, instead of selecting multiple targets with R1 first, because I'm constantly using R2 in normal combat. Maybe I should remap the controls so I don't fuck it up every single time

2) I forget dead eye exists

[Ronnie]

But that's just it, you don't seem to need to select targets with R1, just rolling over them with the crosshair is enough. But then he starts firing? Maybe I've run out of dead eye and that's the reason. Really weird

[dwarf]

I haven't used it enough to be able to properly identify the problem tbh.

The inventory is indeed crap. It seems dumb that they don't lump all health-only items together, followed by stamina, dead-eye, and mixtures. Plus I think part of the reason things are so complicated is that you don't really know what all the items do, if they can be used in crafting, or what they're worth. For that you need to acquire knowledge about items from the world (i.e. outside of the inventory system), and also get a sense of the value of money and the rate at which you're likely to earn it. 

At best the system is going to take a long time to get used to, and at worst it's just a mess. Will only find out by playing more.

Thing is, I'm sure you can get by without paying too much attention to the item management stuff. Sure you might miss out the odd upgrade here or there, but as long as you play a fair few missions and keep your wits about you in shootouts, you'll be fine.

[Ronnie]

My other big problem is not knowing when to steal enemies weapons. The option comes up to swap my gun for another on the floor, but I have no idea if it's any better. For that I need to check the stat of my current one, do the swap, then check the stat on the dropped one. Too much hassle tbh

[killthenet]

I agree with the dissenters on resetera that nothing happens in the first two hours - all I got was a blue screen and a progress bar and about an hour in I was asked to change discs. The trawling through the snow that came after that was really impressive though, it was a really unexpected introduction to the game that went against fan expectations and instead focused on immersing you in the world of RDRII. My favourite moment in the opening section was probably during the hunting mission where I winged the second deer and had to go over and finish it off, the deer's pained cries were really emotionally effecting. So far what has impressed me the most is just how immersive the world is, its strange for a developer who has historically produced really outlandish open-worlds to create one that attempts to be so grounded in reality. 

I definitely feel like Arthur's movement is a little too slow, I feel like they could have made control a bit more fluid without sacrificing the deliberate slow pace of the game but I suppose it was just jarring at first and I feel like I'm already used to it so hopefully it doesn't bother me much going forward. I think it was a bold move having such a slow-paced opening, I can imagine that the majority of people who bought this on Friday didn't enjoy there initial time with the game but for me it was a really effective opening that set up the main themes of the story while introducing the player to the typical flow of the game. 

I played it on Friday night until the end of Chapter One, then I've played it maybe 3 or 4 more times in 2 hour+ chunks. I've spent most of my time interacting with the people at the camp and doing little side missions so I'm still in the first area. I did some of the Gunslinger mission last night and ended up in Saint Denis and spent a good chunk just walking around the town and soaking up the sights - this is a really gorgeous game but I think their take on New Orleans has been the most impressive part for me so far, it just feels like such an alive town and I'll definitely be spending more time here later regardless of where the story takes me. 

I've run into a couple of glitches that have broken immersion a little bit but thats to be expected in a game this size, and I also have had trouble with some of the context sensitive buttons - leading my horse seems only to work half the time and I can never seem to match the speed of the other riders in my party (just end up annoying them by running into their backsides) but the interactions between characters - in the camp especially - is impressive enough by itself to paper over any little cracks that have appeared. I wish I was more inclined to play Arthur as a complete bastard but I seem to help people out a lot more than I bother them, only had one instance of getting a wanted level outside of a mission and that was only because I was trying to clean up the aftermath of helping out a stagecoach driver who was getting robbed by some O'Driscoll's. 

EDIT: Just read @dwarf's comments on the inventory and it reminded me how clunky it was, the weapon wheel is okay - can generally get around it quickly enough - but the whole process of cooking food is pretty slow and then selecting it from your inventory when your cores are low is a bit annoying. The UI is pretty flawed overall, the mini map isn't really helpful unless you've got a waypoint set up and the menu design is just weird and confusing. 

Edited October 29, 2018 by killthenet

[Daft]

3 hours ago, dwarf said:

I thought about using the app but is it not counterproductive to divert your eyes from the screen so often? Maybe if I rested my phone on a makeshift book stand I could make it work.

I'm totally with you on the minimalist HUD in theory but I find the extra hassle isn't worth it. Even the option of turning it off completely and recalling it with a button press is too distracting.

I've kept all the HUD defaults except for GPS, which I got rid of. Journeys take longer but I like making my own choices and going off the beaten track.

Ah, yeah, at first I had it flat on the sofa next to me but I found a way to easily prop it up and have it sitting in front of me. If you can have it so it's easy to glance at on a stand, I 100% recommend it. 

Also, I went the other way with GPS and turned it on. I use the 'cinematic' thing a lot to auto-ride and just pay attention for any blips that pop up on the radar. I tend to switch between cinematic and manual quite a lot; usually manual when I have a good idea where to go and the auto when the journey requires a lot of turns and looking at the map and screen at the same time is impractical.

When I'm not going anywhere in particular, having the map on the app isn't an issue. Yes, it's slightly more convenient to have it on the screen but it's also butt-ugly and I much prefer it without.