Photography.

Sméagol · August 17, 2021

1 hour ago, bob said:

On 12/08/2021 at 9:37 AM, Sméagol said:

(alright, doing a little experiment)
I've bought a bean bag.
Any recommended fillings? I'm taking into account it may get wet.

I'm a fan of cheese and tomato.

Alright, Bob to the rescue.
I posted this question on another forum which initally got me mostly sarcastic and/or confused reactions, as even within photography it seems to be a niche subject. Was wondering if I'd get sarcastic comments over here, but didn't get one until now. I was counting on you @bob!

A beanbag (or ricebag as we call 'm over here) can be used to stabilize your camera instead ofg a tripod. One of the more exotic suggestions I got was kinetic sand, so I bought some and i'll try that out later.

Will · August 18, 2021

I've not owned a camera for quite a while as, generally, I find my phone OK for most of what I do. I've recently been thinking of picking up the Sony ZV-E10 but I'm not sure if it's just a waste of money. Generally, I want it for better family pictures and would probably use it as a webcam too. I might at some point use it for twitch streaming but given I've never really gotten into that too much it's definitely a lower priority.

Any thoughts on whether it's worth it?

bob · August 18, 2021

16 hours ago, Sméagol said:

Alright, Bob to the rescue.
I posted this question on another forum which initally got me mostly sarcastic and/or confused reactions, as even within photography it seems to be a niche subject. Was wondering if I'd get sarcastic comments over here, but didn't get one until now. I was counting on you @bob!

A beanbag (or ricebag as we call 'm over here) can be used to stabilize your camera instead ofg a tripod. One of the more exotic suggestions I got was kinetic sand, so I bought some and i'll try that out later.

I'm sorry it took so long!

Good luck with your kinetic sandbags.

Sméagol · August 18, 2021

8 hours ago, Will said:

I've not owned a camera for quite a while as, generally, I find my phone OK for most of what I do. I've recently been thinking of picking up the Sony ZV-E10 but I'm not sure if it's just a waste of money. Generally, I want it for better family pictures and would probably use it as a webcam too. I might at some point use it for twitch streaming but given I've never really gotten into that too much it's definitely a lower priority.

Any thoughts on whether it's worth it?

That camera is mostly aimed at the vlogging crows from what I've heard, haven't checked the specs myself.

If you want better pics, buy a better camera.

If you're serious into vlogging (or considering getting into it), this may be worth it.

If I were you, I'd wait until you're sure you're going to twitch (that's a verb right?),and make due with something else as a webcam in the meantime.

Will · August 21, 2021

Yeah the Twitch/Vlogging side of things is definitely a smaller priority right now. I guess it’s mainly that this seems like a good entry-level interchangeable lens camera that has some nice features to ease into having something more than a smartphone. I don’t think I’m too interested in spending more than this costs, it’s more is this worth it as an upgrade from the smartphone really.

Still not sure what to do, I hover between definitely don’t do it and buy it with a load of extra lenses immediately.

Goafer · August 21, 2021

Any camera with manual controls will give you better photos than a phone. Cameras have got to the point now where any bad reviews are generally just nitpicking.

My advice: get any camera that is supported by a wide range of good quality lenses. That will be what you'll want to upgrade in the future and it'll be what makes the most difference. The camera body itself isn't really a big issue and you shouldn't stress too much over it.

I would always recommend Canon, Nikon or Sony, as they all have a great lens catalogue, but I'm pretty out if the loop nowadays. That said, lenses don't really age like camera bodies do. A great lens from 30 years ago will still be a great lens today (assuming it's in good condition).

TLDR: get any camera with manual controls and learn how to use it, then upgrade lenses if you want to. Skills make good photos, not cameras.

Edited August 21, 2021 by Goafer

Happenstance · August 21, 2021

I’ll also add Fuji to that list as that’s what I’m using now. I was originally going to get a Sony but was talked out of it due to the lenses. It was either the price or the selection but either way I was recommended the Fuji XT3 instead. Took me about a year to get around to it so I got the XT4 instead for a bit of future proofing and the inbuilt stabilisation.

Sméagol · August 21, 2021

3 hours ago, Will said:

buy it with a load of extra lenses immediately.

Well in any case, don't do that (unless money really isn't any objection).

You'd have to look at reviews to see how that ZV-E10 performs, for both vlogging, and still photography.

Here's what I'd buy, if I had the money: A Sony A6600 with a Zeiss Loxia 21mm lens. Mirrorless because I want something compact, Sony because they have one of the best sensors, the Zeiss Loxia because of its image quality and size (it's very compact), 21mm because that's 31.5mm equivalent if I understand correctly, and I like shooting land- and cityscapes / streetphotography so I need something wide. The only downside is the lens doesn't have a low aperture, and I like shooting in the dark, so my 2nd lens would compensate for that particularly. I personally would buy a body only (without kitlens), and I have a strong preference for primes.

But that is to demonstrate what I'd like because even with my limited experience, I roughly know what I want, and you probably need to still figure that out.

In your case you may want a kit zoomlens, just to figure out what focal lengths you want to use. For Twitch, you're just going to need one prime, probably wide, but it depends on your set-up, so you'll need to figure that one out. For family photos, it depends a bit on what exactly you mean by that, but you'd probably want something wide and standard. If you actually mean formal portraits than obviously a portrait/telelens would be nice, but I'm suspecting more action orientated (running kids) or in the moment pictures. But again, this is why a kitlens in your case would come in handy, just so you can figure out what you need.

Long story short: don't just buy stuff (I know it's tempting..), figure out what you need first, make sure you're actually going to use what you want to buy. Couldn't quite capture that landscape last time? Buy a wide lens. Couldn't get close enough to that bird? Buy a telelens. Etc.

To come back to that ZV-E10, again, personally I haven't really looked into it, and you should read reviews, but from what I can quickly glance is that one of it's features that make it suitable for out-of-the-box vlogging is the built-in microphone. Generally, if you shoot video, you don't want to use the built-in mic, so I assume this one is of much better quality than the average built-in mic. Probably perfect for Twitch and webcam use, though in other situations you may still want to use external mics.

Edited August 21, 2021 by Sméagol

Will · August 22, 2021

15 hours ago, Goafer said:

TLDR: get any camera with manual controls and learn how to use it, then upgrade lenses if you want to. Skills make good photos, not cameras.

This all makes sense, and gives me confidence the Sony route is a good one to go down.

14 hours ago, Happenstance said:

I’ll also add Fuji to that list as that’s what I’m using now. I was originally going to get a Sony but was talked out of it due to the lenses. It was either the price or the selection but either way I was recommended the Fuji XT3 instead. Took me about a year to get around to it so I got the XT4 instead for a bit of future proofing and the inbuilt stabilisation.

The Fujis look nice but those models are 2 to 3 times as expensive as what I’m looking at and I think a bit beyond what I’d like to spend.

13 hours ago, Sméagol said:

Here's what I'd buy, if I had the money: A Sony A6600 with a Zeiss Loxia 21mm lens. Mirrorless because I want something compact, Sony because they have one of the best sensors, the Zeiss Loxia because of its image quality and size (it's very compact), 21mm because that's 31.5mm equivalent if I understand correctly, and I like shooting land- and cityscapes / streetphotography so I need something wide. The only downside is the lens doesn't have a low aperture, and I like shooting in the dark, so my 2nd lens would compensate for that particularly. I personally would buy a body only (without kitlens), and I have a strong preference for primes.

This looks like a great setup, but again that camera and lens would be going way over budget for me. The A6600 seems to me to be the next step up in equipment, not really entry level as I’m going for. Definitely tempted to go body only but…

13 hours ago, Sméagol said:

In your case you may want a kit zoomlens, just to figure out what focal lengths you want to use. For Twitch, you're just going to need one prime, probably wide, but it depends on your set-up, so you'll need to figure that one out. For family photos, it depends a bit on what exactly you mean by that, but you'd probably want something wide and standard. If you actually mean formal portraits than obviously a portrait/telelens would be nice, but I'm suspecting more action orientated (running kids) or in the moment pictures. But again, this is why a kitlens in your case would come in handy, just so you can figure out what you need.

Long story short: don't just buy stuff (I know it's tempting..), figure out what you need first, make sure you're actually going to use what you want to buy. Couldn't quite capture that landscape last time? Buy a wide lens. Couldn't get close enough to that bird? Buy a telelens. Etc.

This probably makes sense. Buy the camera with the included kit lens and just use it and see what I need/want to buy next. The Twitch/streaming thing is definitely a try it out in my setup and see what works, I’ve tried a ton of webcams and other solutions since working from home and none have quite got it right for me. The family picture thing is definitely more in-the-moment action shots than formal portraits, have never really liked pictures like that.

13 hours ago, Sméagol said:

To come back to that ZV-E10, again, personally I haven't really looked into it, and you should read reviews, but from what I can quickly glance is that one of it's features that make it suitable for out-of-the-box vlogging is the built-in microphone. Generally, if you shoot video, you don't want to use the built-in mic, so I assume this one is of much better quality than the average built-in mic. Probably perfect for Twitch and webcam use, though in other situations you may still want to use external mics.

For sure. To me, as a total newbie, it looks great and has a lot of features I’d want to play with as I learn more. The mic thing is definitely a good point, I’ve basically been thinking I’d see how the camera on its own goes and then maybe buy one of the Rode wireless systems or a more permanent mic for my desk dependent on what the needs are.

Thanks for all the comments and advice, I kind of feel comfortable picking one of these up now and seeing what happens with it. Just need to find one in stock.

Happenstance · August 22, 2021

3 hours ago, Will said:

The Fujis look nice but those models are 2 to 3 times as expensive as what I’m looking at and I think a bit beyond what I’d like to spend.

Oh yeah I wasn’t necessarily suggesting going for either of those, they were just the ones I was recommended in comparison to the Sony I was originally gonna get.

Will · October 3, 2021

Took my new camera to Jewel Changi, a crazy mall we have here. Some of my favourite shots:

I still don’t really know what I’m doing, pretty much just shooting what I like and seeing what happens. Feedback most welcome!

Happenstance · October 3, 2021

Did you end up getting the Sony E10?

Will · October 3, 2021

29 minutes ago, Happenstance said:

Did you end up getting the Sony E10?

I did! So far very happy with it, the family pictures have been vastly improved with it and that was the main point of getting it. I also used it as a webcam for a bit last week and it really made a huge difference to that too. Still need to learn how to use it properly but so far the pre-sets have been working great for me.

Will · October 5, 2021

I’m really loving this thing, still haven’t gotten into the details on the settings but absolutely want it to be with me all the time. Going to buy a few bits to enhance the experience:

capture003_38124114342_o_copyb.jpg?v=1568063085

This clip so that I can attach it to the strap of my bag for easy access. And:

clutch-pdp-2_1024x1024.jpg?v=1591643732

a hand strap so I feel a bit more secure holding it in odd places.

Anything else that you guys would recommend? Not going to look into anything really big until I have a bit more of a clue what I’m doing, just quality of life accessories right now.

Sméagol · October 5, 2021

On 22/08/2021 at 4:41 AM, Will said:

This looks like a great setup, but again that camera and lens would be going way over budget for me.

I never addressed this, mainly becausae my point seems to have come gotten across, but to state it explicitly: I never intended to recommend that setup specifically, I was just mentioning what I would buy, but more importantly, also why I'd buy it. But you seem to be doing the thing I recommended, buy stuff as you need it.

1 hour ago, Will said:

Anything else that you guys would recommend? Not going to look into anything really big until I have a bit more of a clue what I’m doing, just quality of life accessories right now.

Your images aren't working for me. I was mostly happy with the camera bag I bought. You may not need one if the strap is working for you (is what i gather from the filename that is displayed), but I wanted a dedicated camerabag. I've got a ThinkTank Mirrorlessmover 20. I wanted something very compact, so I can take it with me when I go cycling somewhere. It's a tad too compact occasionally for my SLR, as I can't fit a 3rd lens in it, but should be perfect for a mirrorless camera.

I'd get a gorillapod. Mind you, it's not a fantastic tripod. It won't work in windy conditions or if there are vibrations from other sources. It's will wear down much quicker than a good tripod. But it's literally flexible, so can do stuff regular tripods can't, and will mostly do the job under normal circumstances, and it's pretty portable and relatively cheap. You may also want to consider a good monopod instead or in addition. Or, if you think you're willing to carry it around, get a good travel tripod. Good ones are expensive though.. But a good (travel) tripod is probably the single most important accesory you can buy if you're serious about photography.

Oh, something I won't have to think about, but consider spare batteries and SD cards.

Edited October 5, 2021 by Sméagol

Will · October 6, 2021

7 hours ago, Sméagol said:

Your images aren't working for me. I was mostly happy with the camera bag I bought. You may not need one if the strap is working for you (is what i gather from the filename that is displayed), but I wanted a dedicated camerabag. I've got a ThinkTank Mirrorlessmover 20. I wanted something very compact, so I can take it with me when I go cycling somewhere. It's a tad too compact occasionally for my SLR, as I can't fit a 3rd lens in it, but should be perfect for a mirrorless camera.

I'd get a gorillapod. Mind you, it's not a fantastic tripod. It won't work in windy conditions or if there are vibrations from other sources. It's will wear down much quicker than a good tripod. But it's literally flexible, so can do stuff regular tripods can't, and will mostly do the job under normal circumstances, and it's pretty portable and relatively cheap. You may also want to consider a good monopod instead or in addition. Or, if you think you're willing to carry it around, get a good travel tripod. Good ones are expensive though.. But a good (travel) tripod is probably the single most important accesory you can buy if you're serious about photography.

Oh, something I won't have to think about, but consider spare batteries and SD cards.

That bag looks nice! I was pretty lucky as they were doing a pretty decent launch deal and I got a bag, extra battery, and memory card all included. I also got a mini-tripod / Bluetooth controller included which has been pretty good so far.

The gorillapod is a great idea! Now that I think about it I actually have one somewhere, I think I bought it when I moved to Japan and used it with my phone to take time lapses sat in Starbucks while I studied - I’ll try and dig it out as it would definitely be easy to bring around with me.

Goafer · October 7, 2021

On 05/10/2021 at 5:02 PM, Will said:

Anything else that you guys would recommend? Not going to look into anything really big until I have a bit more of a clue what I’m doing, just quality of life accessories right now.

Depends what style of photo you plan on taking really. I'd just play with the camera and try different things. Once you've got an idea of what genre of photography you prefer, you'll have a better idea of what you'll need.

One thing I'd always recommend is a decent strap. I personally use a Sun Sniper strap, as it's far more comfortable than a neck strap (especially for heavier cameras/lenses), plus it has steel cable in it, preventing would-be theives from just cutting the strap and running off with your camera.

It's a bit of a redundant recommendation, as it looks like you're covered for straps, but I'd still recommend it as an upgrade at a later point.

Other than that, spare batteries and cards as already mentioned.

I personally don't use my tripod, as it doesn't suit my style of photography, but again, it depends what you plan on doing. Landscapes, studio stuff or selfies? You'll want a tripod. Street/event photography (or anything where you need to keep moving)? I wouldn't bother. Monopods are a good compromise between stability and mobility, but I'd only recommend those for heavier cameras or long events where it can be tiring to hold a camera up to your face for long periods of time.

Edited October 7, 2021 by Goafer