General Gaming Sales/Charts Discussion

[Serebii]

I do have a question.

 

Other than the online issues of the Wii U, how would you have done the launch? Most people just say about adding more games, but that'd have caused more issues.

 

So yeah, do tell

[Goron_3]

I do have a question.

 

Other than the online issues of the Wii U, how would you have done the launch? Most people just say about adding more games, but that'd have caused more issues.

 

So yeah, do tell

 

Probably just release it when they were ready and had the right software to prove that the gamepad is totally worth it. Nintendoland does this on an occasion but we're all still waiting for that killer app that shows off the controller.

 

Same as the 3DS really, just don't rush it and get focused.

[liger05]

I do have a question.

 

Other than the online issues of the Wii U, how would you have done the launch? Most people just say about adding more games, but that'd have caused more issues.

 

So yeah, do tell

 

The name for starters. We saw what happened with the 3DS/DS. People may be silly for not knowing the difference but a different name totally seperate from Wii leaves no doubt that this is no wii add on.

 

E32012 was a mess. I dont think anyone can claim otherwise. What we saw last week with the direct should of been the sort of thing showed at the last E3 before launch. To bang on about a 3rd party port and calling it a different game was insulting.

 

The lineup should of been different. The lineup wasnt bad but when you take into account so many were old games then its a problem. Expensive old ports are not going to make people lay down £300 for a new console. The Japanese one even worse considering they have no new games until March. Thats crazy!!

 

Addressed the lack of demo units in stores and lack of consistency. Some stores had them on, some didnt. Some had a demo, some didnt. The ones that did have a demo had no demo's of the titles that were actually out.

 

A real aggressive marketing campaign just to get the product out there. I saw more Vita adverts before christmas than wii u. That isnt right when one of them is a brand new device.

 

Make sure things like VC, Tivo were up and running from launch and the Eshop had content ready to go. We saw the 3DS launch with no Eshop and for it to happen again where key features were missing was disappointing.

 

Of course its a lot easier for me on the outside post launch to come up with these things but there are people employed to make sure things are right and with the 3DS and Wii U it hasnt been.

[lostmario]

I do have a question.

 

Other than the online issues of the Wii U, how would you have done the launch? Most people just say about adding more games, but that'd have caused more issues.

 

So yeah, do tell

 

The launch lineup wasn't that bad, but it could have done with a AAA title from Nintendo but I have 5 games already, so that isn't the big problem, the big problem is Nintendo's marketing of it.

 

 

3 things they should have done

 

- Called it Wii 2

 

- Designed the console to look completely different than the Wii.

 

- Better showing at E3 2012 to create some much needed hype for the console, giving up almost half the conference to Batman & Nintendoland was not the way to create hype.

[Wii]

To continue on the subject of demo units in shops. While they look great and all, they had 19 titles on the unit and all but 1 were short videos. The 1 playable title? Rayman Legends, a game that wasn't due for release for at least another 3 months. That there encapsulates and highlights all their stupidity and mistakes with the Wii U. 18 unplayable games on a demo unit designed to showcase Wii U software. Take a bow Nintendo, take a bow!

[RedShell]

Probably just release it when they were ready and had the right software to prove that the gamepad is totally worth it. Nintendoland does this on an occasion but we're all still waiting for that killer app that shows off the controller.

Nintendo Land is fantastic at showcasing the features of the GamePad, as is ZombiU.

The only aspect of the GamePad that's not been showcased yet is the NFC reader.

 

I do have a question.

 

Other than the online issues of the Wii U, how would you have done the launch? Most people just say about adding more games, but that'd have caused more issues.

 

So yeah, do tell

For me it would've been much better preparation for the post-launch period.

 

I'm OK as I started with just Nintendo Land and have been staggering my purchases, but anyone that went nuts and picked up a load of launch games on day 1 could now find themselves in the position of having a very long wait for their next game.

 

So really the answer is just more games. Not on day 1, but enough for there to be a steady stream of quality titles every couple of weeks/month.

The fact that the Wii U is around 2 months away from what most would consider (myself included) the next must-have title (MH3U) is not good.

[Serebii]

Posted this on NeoGAF as people are talking about Iwata resigning, figure I'd post it here

 

It will be a very, very, sad day if Iwata ever is forced to leave Nintendo.

 

Iwata is responsible for a lot of Nintendo's policies. Their first-party DLC policy, for example. Games are to be complete at launch, all DLC to be extras developed after launch. This stops the gauging that many developers do these days. He wants everything to be as cheap and complete out of the box as humanly possible. As PhantomR stated, Nintendo is very pro-consumer, even if they do some things that annoy us, the vocal minority (such as Region Locking). If he's replaced, the replacement could turn Nintendo into that. Imagine Animal Crossing with a craptonne of micro-transactions. Mario games where you have 2 worlds and then have to pay $5 for a new one. It'd be horrific.

 

Nintendo are doing things right. People keep saying they should have focused on power rather than these different experinces. Let me put it to you, do you REALLY want a third console that is just exactly the same with different exclusives? I certainly don't.

 

The Wii U sold more in the first two months than the Playstation 3 and Xbox 360 did in the same timeframe. The problems are on three tiers

 

1) Nintendo, along with other people, keep comparing the 3DS and Wii U's sales to the massively anomalous DS and Wii sale trends. Those were anomalies and will never be able to be matched.

2) Nintendo needs to be far more conservative with their estimates and forecasts. If they were more conservative, this whole thing wouldn't be an issue

3) People continue to class Nintendo as being for kids. A friend of mine asked why ZombiU was on the Wii U since Nintendo consoles are for kids. Even when Nintendo tries to sort this out, people still believe it and complain, as seen with Bayonetta 2. Western developers even believe this. Their marketing doesn't help.

 

There's also an issue in the gaming media where they seem to have a massive axe to grind against Nintendo. For what reason, I am unclear. All the Nintendo is doomed articles do not help their public image. Look at the 3DS in the UK, as it was coming out, several media outlets went on a massive negative rant against Nintendo, claiming that the 3D can destroy your eyes, and other such things.

 

Iwata resigning won't solve a damned thing. He has made some mistakes, but you need to consider the mitigating factors and everything. Loads of developers are collapsing, loads of companies including entertainment retailers. The economy isn't in the best of shape. Yes, there could have been better games at launch, but when is that never true?

 

It'd be foolish to thing the PS4 and new Xbox will be any different.

[Magnus]

Imagine a world where you have two levels in Uncharted and have to pay $5 for another one.

 

Thank God for Iwata.

[Serebii]

Imagine a world where you have two levels in Uncharted and have to pay $5 for another one.

 

Thank God for Iwata.

Give it 5 years, considering Sony has mentioned fully embracing free-to-play

[Daft]

Everyone would just wait until the level was free on Plus.

[Grazza]

I Think your getting confused. These aren't launch numbers,n these are 2012 numbers. So it didn't beat the wii when the wii was pretty much dead.

 

Oh, I see. How very stupid of me.

 

Nintendo are doing things right. People keep saying they should have focused on power rather than these different experiences. Let me put it to you, do you REALLY want a third console that is just exactly the same with different exclusives? I certainly don't.

 

Yes - that sounds great to me. A powerful machine, but the only one that plays Mario, Metroid and Zelda.

 

3) People continue to class Nintendo as being for kids. A friend of mine asked why ZombiE was on the Wii U since Nintendo consoles are for kids. Even when Nintendo tries to sort this out, people still believe it and complain, as seen with Bayonetta 2. Western developers even believe this. Their marketing doesn't help.

 

See, I honestly think the Wii has been massively damaging to them. It's just that it made so much money, few noticed.

 

Before the Wii, my acquaintances did respect Nintendo and played their games. There's no way they'd have missed out on Twilight Princess or Metroid Prime. And because the hardware was as powerful as its rivals, people gave those games as much chance of being "the best" as any other. The very few people who thought Nintendo were "kiddie" were just immature and not worth bothering about.

 

With the Wii, though, hardly anyone I knew bothered to play the core games, such as Metroid Prime 3 or Super Mario Galaxy, and who could blame them? However well-designed they were, they couldn't help but be behind the times.

 

Look at the 3DS in the UK, as it was coming out, several media outlets went on a massive negative rant against Nintendo, claiming that the 3D can destroy your eyes, and other such things.

 

This is true. Nintendo will never be able to shake that, unfortunately.

[tapedeck]

I think Nintndo get a lot of flack because they are so synonymous with gaming. If they were a teeny gaming company the headlines wouldn't be there. The negative press comes with the popularity as the media outlets know it will pique reader interest. It's not about 'hating' Nintendo. It's just the way tabloid-esque press functions.

 

There are numerous things wrong with the Wii U as all consoles at launch have. But they have done a lot of good stuff for the system that many of us are forgetting. The truth is: the days of Nintendo getting major third party support is far, far away due to the following:

 

Nintendo first and foremost make their hardware to suit their software. This is in stark contrast to SONY and Microsoft who have different philosophies which cater more to third party developpers.

 

Nintendo focus on 'fun' gameplay experiences first. Many third party games are based around concepts such as simulation, graphical fidelity, action, imitating certain mature genres like horror, stealth, violence, racing, competitive sports. When Nintendo show off a green cartoon dinosaur running around a stitched playground the philosophies clash and so they stick to the SONY and Microsoft boxes, which are positioned to appeal to an older gaming audience.

 

As a creative house, Nintendo are difficult to predict and are very secretive. This doesn't fill third parties with confidence. Especially the bigger software houses like EA who like to be in control.

 

Nintendo are predominantly a Japanese company and remain that way even with NOE and NOA. There are all kinds of sociological factors at play because of such an aspect.

 

I think owning a Nintendo product can be frustrating for a hardcore gamer. Yet the products ultimately stay true to the hardware design and philosophies resulting in experiences that are usually not found on alternative systems. Them's the breaks but for me, but the experiences from this philosophy throughout the years have proven to be irresistible. Duck Hunt, StarFox, Donkey Kong Country, Mario64, OoT, Sunsine, Wind Waker, Smash Bros, Wii Sports and the rest...all worth the lack of third party games.

 

You only have to look at the VC to see that Nintendo will be fine in their own as long as they don't change. And as for third parties, if they come along: great. If not: why not just buy another system for those other experiences?

Edited January 31, 2013 by tapedeck

[Zechs Merquise]

1) Nintendo, along with other people, keep comparing the 3DS and Wii U's sales to the massively anomalous DS and Wii sale trends. Those were anomalies and will never be able to be matched.

2) Nintendo needs to be far more conservative with their estimates and forecasts. If they were more conservative, this whole thing wouldn't be an issue

 

This is so true. Nintendo have simply over estimated what the Wii U would do. What's more, a next gen system will most likely be compared to the last gen system produced by that company. People are comparing the Wii U to the Wii, they're also comparing Wii U sales to the PS3 and 360 sales at this time, which are now heavily discounted and reaching the end of their life cycle.

 

The PS3 had an appalling start and the 360's wasn't much better. The Wii U hasn't sold as well as Nintendo hoped, but it's hardly flopped.

 

With the Wii, though, hardly anyone I knew bothered to play the core games, such as Metroid Prime 3 or Super Mario Galaxy, and who could blame them? However well-designed they were, they couldn't help but be behind the times.

 

Just because you don't know people who played Galaxy and Prime 3 doesn't mean they didn't sell well. Galaxy sold over 10 million copies - double an Uncharted or Gears of war title! Prime sold nearly 2 million units - strong for a Metroid game, which like Castlevania have been hugely influential but never set the sales charts on fire as one may mistakenly believe.

 

The Wii U had a LOT of problems at launch, for me the key ones were:

 

1) Poor name, should have been the Nintendo U, as the NU.

2) Poor advertising and marketing, adverts were barely seen and little buzz was generated making it almost a stealth launch.

3) No supermarket support, Nintendo totally failed to reach out to UK supermarket operators.

4) Lack of cohesive online service, Miiverse it great, but games like Nintendo Land and Mario not being online hurts the system in the West.

5) Unfair negative publicity.

 

But despite all this it still outperformed the PS3 for the same period of its life cycle.

 

However there is a much bigger issue that no one's talking about, and it's not tablets, smart phones or dickheads pretending Angry Birds or Cut the Rope will replace home gaming. It's all about the mindset of the public at this moment in time.

 

When the Wii was out in around 2007 it seemed people had a lot more money. People were out spending and buying new things, a purchase like a games console would be made on impulse without a second thought. Things are VERY different now. People are being more conservative with their spending and watching their pennies. It's not a time when people are running out and spending large sums on expensive things non-essential items.

 

A combination of a poorly managed launch and the current economic climate have hurt Nintendo. But to say it's flopped is a long way off the truth.

 

And just because the Wii U hasn't got off to the start that Nintendo wanted, let's not rewrite history and start saying the Wii was some form of disaster that has ruined Nintendo. The fact is Nintendo just haven't capitalised on the Wii's popularity as they should have. Instead of going all guns blazing for the launch, they've tried to rely solely on their brand name and the Wii's name - this clearly hasn't worked.

 

And I'm not interested in arguments that the 'core gamer' has deserted Nintendo due to the Wii. This is rubbish, Nintendo have always been criticsed in this way, it's just the criticism subtly changes each generation. In the SNES era the system wasn't 'cool' because it didn't have Sonic who was 'hip' and it didn't have blood in Mortal Kombat (which obviously completely changed the game play). In the N64 era Nintendo was the 'kiddy' console, every game was bright colours, tweeting birds, flowers and only children played it (except for Zelda, Goldeneye, Perfect Dark, Quake, Quake 2, Duke Nukem, Doom, Shadow Man, The Turok Series etc). This 'kiddy' image followed through to the Gamecube era. Then came the Wii era Nintendo were cool, they weren't kiddy - they were just casual - boo. As we all know any system purchased by anyone who wants to play games that don't involve bald headed men with guns in grey worlds is just not hardcore! Now the Wii U is out and has games like COD, ME3, Batman, Dark Siders etc, it's 'last gen'. Because all of a sudden generations (ie something defined by time) are now defined by arbitrary power increases agreed upon by bickering 15 year old Sony fan boys on N4G!

[Serebii]

People say the Wii U was bad marketing due to the name, but you forget the power of the brand, especially in America. That's why the Pokémon logos have been like this:

 

 

It was right of Nintendo to utilise the Wii name in this

 

But despite all this it still outperformed the PS3 for the same period of its life cycle.

 

However there is a much bigger issue that no one's talking about, and it's not tablets, smart phones or dickheads pretending Angry Birds or Cut the Rope will replace home gaming. It's all about the mindset of the public at this moment in time.

 

When the Wii was out in around 2007 it seemed people had a lot more money. People were out spending and buying new things, a purchase like a games console would be made on impulse without a second thought. Things are VERY different now. People are being more conservative with their spending and watching their pennies. It's not a time when people are running out and spending large sums on expensive things non-essential items.

 

A combination of a poorly managed launch and the current economic climate have hurt Nintendo. But to say it's flopped is a long way off the truth.

 

This is what I have been saying from the get-go, and people have been shooting me down -_-

[Zechs Merquise]

This is what I have been saying from the get-go, and people have been shooting me down -_-

 

Well I think I've agreed with you on most things actually, with the notable exception that I believe Nintendo Land should have been online!

[liger05]

But despite all this it still outperformed the PS3 for the same period of its life cycle.

 

However there is a much bigger issue that no one's talking about, and it's not tablets, smart phones or dickheads pretending Angry Birds or Cut the Rope will replace home gaming. It's all about the mindset of the public at this moment in time.

 

When the Wii was out in around 2007 it seemed people had a lot more money. People were out spending and buying new things, a purchase like a games console would be made on impulse without a second thought. Things are VERY different now. People are being more conservative with their spending and watching their pennies. It's not a time when people are running out and spending large sums on expensive things non-essential items.

 

A combination of a poorly managed launch and the current economic climate have hurt Nintendo. But to say it's flopped is a long way off the truth.

 

Yet people are buying Ipads, Nexus tablets, Kindle Fire tablets etc so to pin it on the economy really doesnt cut it.

 

People say the Wii U was bad marketing due to the name, but you forget the power of the brand, especially in America. That's why the Pokémon logos have been like this:

 

Its not simply about the brand. The console looks similar to the Wii. If a person walks into a game shop and sees the demo unit with the nunchuck and wiimote attached you can see why they could think its a wii. Same logo, similar looking console, same controllers. I have seen media reports calling it the Wii. We saw the confusion with the 3DS/DS and after that I dont think they should of left it to chance again.

 

Prior to the 3DS every piece of Nintendo HW had a different logo. If Nintendo had no problem dropping thre Gameboy Brand which was huge there is no reason why they couldnt do the same with the Wii.

[Serebii]

Yet people are buying Ipads, Nexus tablets, Kindle Fire tablets etc so to pin it on the economy really doesnt cut it.

 

Those aren't gaming devices so are more easily explainable

[liger05]

Those aren't gaming devices so are more easily explainable

 

Not really. If the argument is people are not spending money on essential items and penny pinching then they wouldnt be spending £400 on ipads. The difference is people have more choice now so its up to all those fighting for the consumers money to make there product desireable.

[Zechs Merquise]

Yet people are buying Ipads, Nexus tablets, Kindle Fire tablets etc so to pin it on the economy really doesnt cut it.

 

Its not simply about the brand. The console looks similar to the Wii. If a person walks into a game shop and sees the demo unit with the nunchuck and wiimote attached you can see why they could think its a wii. Same logo, similar looking console, same controllers. I have seen media reports calling it the Wii. We saw the confusion with the 3DS/DS and after that I dont think they should of left it to chance again.

 

Prior to the 3DS every piece of Nintendo HW had a different logo. If Nintendo had no problem dropping thre Gameboy Brand which was huge there is no reason why they couldnt do the same with the Wii.

 

The rise of tablets is just like the rise of laptops before them. People use them for a variety of different reasons. They are not a dedicated games console. They are also cheaper then a games console and don't require another string of large purchase in the wake of the initial purchase. Once you've dropped £300 on a Wii U, you've then got to but the games at £45-£50 a shot. Once you've got your tablet for £199 that's it. The people who once used a laptop to sit and browse the internet and play on Facebook whilst watching Eastenders are now using a tablet.

 

Although I do agree with you about the branding. Nintendo dropped the Gameboy brand and after seeing the confusion with the DS/3DS they should have learned their lesson.

 

A new console should launch with a new and clear set of branding that sets it apart from its predecessor, I honestly don't know why when the Wii U name got so much stick after E3 and there was the issue with the DS/3DS branding Nintendo didn't just change it!

[Dcubed]

In more positive news, it looks like Fire Emblem Awakening is doing really well in the US!

 

It has sold out at Gamestop and managed to take the number 1 spot on Amazon across all platforms! (though I think it now sits at around No6 or 7 - but still ahead of both versions of Dead Space 3!)

 

Looks like it's continuing the trend of outperforming the series' Japanese sales in the west (and considering that it's the 2nd best selling game in the series on public record in Japan, it looks like it's gonna blow every other FE game out of the water in terms of US sales )

 

I hope that NOE give it as much of a push as NOA have, cause it seems to be working wonders for the game!

[Serebii]

In more positive news, it looks like Fire Emblem Awakening is doing really well in the US!

 

It has sold out at Gamestop and managed to take the number 1 spot on Amazon across all platforms! (though I think it now sits at around No6 or 7 - but still ahead of both versions of Dead Space 3!)

 

Looks like it's continuing the trend of outperforming the series' Japanese sales in the west (and considering that it's the 2nd best selling game in the series on public record in Japan, it looks like it's gonna blow every other FE game out of the water in terms of US sales )

 

I hope that NOE give it as much of a push as NOA have, cause it seems to be working wonders for the game!

I feel Nintendo is past the days of not localising and not marketing. They've had a swift kick in the arse.

 

A cornered Nintendo is the best Nintendo

[liger05]

In more positive news, it looks like Fire Emblem Awakening is doing really well in the US!

 

It has sold out at Gamestop and managed to take the number 1 spot on Amazon across all platforms! (though I think it now sits at around No6 or 7 - but still ahead of both versions of Dead Space 3!)

 

Looks like it's continuing the trend of outperforming the series' Japanese sales in the west (and considering that it's the 2nd best selling game in the series on public record in Japan, it looks like it's gonna blow every other FE game out of the water in terms of US sales )

 

I hope that NOE give it as much of a push as NOA have, cause it seems to be working wonders for the game!

 

Been saying forever that nintendo need to localise so many more games. Not all of them will sell huge amounts but there is enough of a core 3ds audience who will get those games.

[Dcubed]

I feel Nintendo is past the days of not localising and not marketing. They've had a swift kick in the arse.

 

A cornered Nintendo is the best Nintendo

 

I surely hope so. The last Nintendo Direct restored much of my faith in that respect as it was nearly identical to the Japanese one in terms of content. Would've been devastating to see X and FExSMT in the Japanese one and not in ours!

 

Though we're still missing Tomodachi Collection 2 and Jam with the band 3DS... (I don't expect the former for technical reasons but the latter should be coming to Europe at least!)

[RedShell]

Though we're still missing Tomodachi Collection 2 and Jam with the band 3DS... (I don't expect the former for technical reasons but the latter should be coming to Europe at least!)

There are no technical reasons. They totally lied about that (the voice synthesis) with the first Tomodachi Collection, and will probably do the same again, but in reality they could localise the game.

Thing is it's a lot of work for probably not much reward, so they don't bother.

[tapedeck]

I personally think Wii Sports 2 would turn this whole sales thing around. Where's the tech demo they used when they first showed the Wii U? Make it online, integrate Miiverse and add to the depth with motion plus and multiplayer using the Gamepad and you are on to a winner sales wise.

 

Nintendo built a new consumer base using Wii Sports. They would be stupid not to put a direct sequel on Wii U.

Some of you may be thinking the casuals wont buy it 'again'. But just look at the 'casual' gamers who buy consoles for the latest FIFA etc.

And the value for money Wii Sports has had to those casual gamers will play upon their minds.

 

Either way, Wii Sports is a HUGE selling point and one worth exploring due to the insane popularity of it. At least they are bringing Wii Fit (and I'm hyped for that!)...it's a start.

Edited February 1, 2013 by tapedeck