Minority Report is here, and not in a cool way

[Emasher]

Protests are a security issue. Which is pretty dangerous when near a place of immense terrorist interest.

 

So they should postpone the wedding or change the route or something if they're concerned for their safety. You don't start arresting people who disagree with you.

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

no need to be cunt though.

 

It was you who insulted the intelligence of people who are not anti-monarchy.

 

So they should postpone the wedding or change the route or something if they're concerned for their safety. You don't start arresting people who disagree with you.

 

Postponing such a huge event wouldn't help a thing. Besides, they weren't arrested for their opinion, they were arrested for being obviously provocative and thus being a risk to the peace.

[Magnus]

It's already been said by everyone else while I was writing my post, but...

Don't like them, fine, no need to be cunt though.

I'm pretty sure a professor of anthropology is less of an idiot than you are.

 

The thing is, Monkey, maybe these people should have been arrested or maybe they shouldn't. But you're being really obnoxious about it. Some people think that the police did the right thing because this thing could potentially have spiraled of control. Your response? We don't know that, because no one can predict the future. But by the same token, you can't say for sure that it wouldn't have spiraled control. The police made a judgment call. Maybe it was the wrong one, but you seem way too concerned with turning this into a bigger issue than it is. All this talk about how the government is involved and how we're losing our rights is just conjecture on your part, so please stop acting like it's fact.

 

Also, it's really hard to take you seriously when you're so obviously against the monarchy. If this had been a wedding with a handicapped groom and a group of people decided to protest against the rights of the handicapped and had staged a mock execution, we likely wouldn't be having this discussion.

 

This thread is still terrible, by the way.

[ReZourceman]

Who is this....Speech character, and why should we release him?

[Happenstance]

Who is this....Speech character, and why should we release him?

 

He was a notorious cannibal warlord who would attack then eat cute children and puppies.

[ReZourceman]

I demand he be freed at once.

[Emasher]

It was you who insulted the intelligence of people who are not anti-monarchy.

 

 

 

Postponing such a huge event wouldn't help a thing. Besides, they weren't arrested for their opinion, they were arrested for being obviously provocative and thus being a risk to the peace.

 

I know it wouldn't. What I'm saying is that in a democracy the people should have just as much right to protest (regardless of how they do it, as long as they're peaceful) as the royals do to have a wedding. One shouldn't be a higher priority than the other.

[Ashley]

Protesters did have the right to do so, there were several groups there.

[Frank]

So obvious that The Mad Monkey is trying to be a wannabe Diageo.

[or else you will DIE]

i hope the rabbit will be ok

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

I know it wouldn't. What I'm saying is that in a democracy the people should have just as much right to protest (regardless of how they do it, as long as they're peaceful) as the royals do to have a wedding. One shouldn't be a higher priority than the other.

 

But the entire point of their arrest was that they weren't peaceful. They were blatantly trying to provoke. Provocation can be a powerful tool, but it does not belong in a protest as it can turn the protest into a riot.

[LegoMan1031]

Nobody can predict the future.

This is where the problem starts.

Lets face it, in real situations of actual protest they do the worst possible thing by kettling and provoke a confrontation, we can't trust the police to predict when they next have a shit.

 

As others have said protesting did go on and it was fine, what they were planning could have breached the peace and a judgement call was made.

 

Look at this another way. If the police did nothing and it all went to shit, wouldn't everyone be complaining then how shit the police were for doing nothing?

 

And how they handled the protests if a different issue, again a judgement call was made. All the damage that was caused is what made the police react as they did, they obviously felt they had to do something. I don't know if they made the right decision or not, i wasn't there but i have heard both sides to that arguement.

[Magnus]

So obvious that The Mad Monkey is trying to be a wannabe Diageo.

This was exactly my thought when Mad Monkey brought up the futility of kids believing in Santa Claus.

[The fish]

*wades in*

 

Firstly, where I stand generally: I'm very, very much a republican (note the small "r", before you make links between with certain Americans and me), and I feel that if a way to resolve the Crown Estates issue could be found, the monarchy should be removed from any form of power in this country. I'm also very, very much in favour of free speech (I may not agree with what you have to say, but etc, etc....).

 

Whilst I very much agree there is a need for limits, I don't feel the one today crossed them, and arresting them was without doubt the wrong course of action. Yes, they were attempting to provoke, but whether it was a fight or, like most controversial protest methods, media coverage, is indeterminable. Whilst staging a mock of anyone, especially a person's uncle on their wedding day, is, to say the least, ridiculously distasteful, you should still be allowed to do it. Whilst staging such a protest makes you a dickhead, you have the right to be a dickhead. I don't think anyone seriously believes they were calling for the murder of Prince Andrew.

[Diageo]

Please, no one can live up to me.

[EddieColeslaw]

This was exactly my thought when Mad Monkey brought up the futility of kids believing in Santa Claus.

 

Oh man, I enjoyed that thread

[Emasher]

But the entire point of their arrest was that they weren't peaceful. They were blatantly trying to provoke. Provocation can be a powerful tool, but it does not belong in a protest as it can turn the protest into a riot.

 

But they weren't violent (towards people).

 

If people choose to react to it, that's their decision, and its their fault if they break any laws because of their reaction.

 

I'm not saying what they were going to do was appropriate, just that they should be allowed to do it.

[The Peeps]

Why is it only violence people are allowed to react to? There are different forms of abuse than physical harm.

[Emasher]

Why is it only violence people are allowed to react to? There are different forms of abuse than physical harm.

 

People can react to anything. All I was saying was that people shouldn't be arrested unless they're causing actual harm to someone else or their property.

[The Peeps]

People can react to anything. All I was saying was that people shouldn't be arrested unless they're causing actual harm to someone else or their property.

 

I respectfully disagree. For example if someone was protesting the war at a soldier's funeral, that's fine, but if they did so by creating an effigy of the dead soldier and proceeded to burn it (or similar), I think that's more provocation than protest and they should be detained. Not charged with anything but at least removed from that location.

[Emasher]

In that case though they would be breaking the law (burning without a permit), and would be creating an actual danger (the fire itself), so there's actually a legitimate reason to arrest them. I fail to see how beheading a dummy is remotely more provoking people than protesting. If anything, it seems comedic.

[EEVILMURRAY]

So, how would you have the public react to a government decision they disagree with?

Just lie down and give up their rights?

According to the first link, laying down is the first sign of trouble.

 

"Chris was arrested first. He lay down on the pavement opposite his house to make the arrest difficult,"

 

Which I found weird because they're always telling you to get down on the ground. I can only assume it was a busy road and he lay down on the other side of the street to cause panic. Calculative bastard.

It doesn't matter what they are protesting against, or the occasion, the fact is they are being arrested for something they haven't actually done yet, and something that is not actually against the law.

I'm not sure which side of the coin you're siding with here. If someone hasn't done something wrong they can't be punished for it, meaning attempted murder, conspiracy to commit a crime and someone planning to blow themselves up are innocent because they haven't done it yet?

 

How do you know the act that they'll end up doing won't be criminal?

 

You said it yourself:

Nobody can predict the future.

 

Well said. Now be silent.

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

But they weren't violent (towards people).

 

If people choose to react to it, that's their decision, and its their fault if they break any laws because of their reaction.

 

I'm not saying what they were going to do was appropriate, just that they should be allowed to do it.

 

It's their job to make sure things don't get out of hand. That means taking precautions before troubles arise.

[Emasher]

It's their job to make sure things don't get out of hand. That means taking precautions before troubles arise.

 

There's still no law against beheading a dummy. Arresting someone because you think someone else is going to do something illegal because of what they did is just a little bit overboard.

 

There's a difference between arresting someone who's acquired a number of weapons and have wrote about shooting up their school and arresting someone because they might make a scene.

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

There's a difference between arresting someone who's acquired a number of weapons and have wrote about shooting up their school and arresting someone because they might make a scene.

 

True, true. But then we're moving into subjective territory, and the police had to make a judgement call in the situation. Whether you like the monarchy or not, the fact remains that they're huge targets, and there was a dangerous amount of people gathered today - not to mention that emotions were high. Then, someone chose to demonstrate by beheading a model representing one from the royal family. If that doesn't scream "disturbing the peace", I don't know what does.