navarre Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Question for all the Christians/Jews/Muslims/Hindus/Sikhs/Bahais on this forum. Could God, if he so chooses, commit suicide? I mean, if he could then he wouldn't be immortal. But if he couldn't, then he isn't omnipotent. I'm just interested to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gizmo Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 This is a pretty rubbish anti-omnipotency argument. Worse even than the "immovable object" theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wesley Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Suicide is illegal he'd get arrested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EchoDesiato Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Nah, he'd chicken out eventually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navarre Posted June 5, 2009 Author Share Posted June 5, 2009 This is a pretty rubbish anti-omnipotency argument. Worse even than the "immovable object" theory. Actually, it's a pretty strong argument. If God can do anything, then why can't he kill himself? Surely that defeats the meaning of being omnipotent? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan_Dare Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 but omnipotence also implies indestructibility, ergo his inability to kill himself would also prove omnipotence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gizmo Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Who is to say that "God" is a creature that has a life/death cycle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DomJcg Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Think about it, omnipotent, can do anything, thus an omnipotent being can commit suicide Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caris Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Who is to say that "God" is a creature that has a life/death cycle? /Thread..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daft Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Define "God". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navarre Posted June 5, 2009 Author Share Posted June 5, 2009 Who is to say that "God" is a creature that has a life/death cycle? That is the sort of argument I was looking for. But doesn't it say, or at least imply, that in the holy books God is a living thing? He's almost always referred to as 'He' and Christians call him the Father. Of course, God could be an entity that is not part of any religion- ie any religion that we know right now hasn't actually got across the true message of God or know God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McMad Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Define "Can". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Odwin Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 This thread is likely to be locked. Try not to descend into crazy religion bashing, or go totally off-topic and it will not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gizmo Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 That is the sort of argument I was looking for. But doesn't it say, or at least imply, that in the holy books God is a living thing? He's almost always referred to as 'He' and Christians call him the Father. Of course, God could be an entity that is not part of any religion- ie any religion that we know right now has actually got across the true message of God. Just because he is the "Father" doesn't mean he can die. In fact, probably the contrary: he is called the "holy spirit", and isn't the whole point of Christianity that after death our spirit lives on? Hence, spirits do not die, and God cannot then commit suicide. Wow, I think this is the first time I've ever argued for the religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightwolf Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Suicide is illegal he'd get arrested. Or end up in Hell, how ironic. I could imagine if I were the cause of everything in this world I'd like the ability to kill myself hah! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EEVILMURRAY Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Who is to say that "God" is a creature that has a life/death cycle? And changes his appearance Doctor Who style each time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McPhee Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 He could potentially could commit suicide but he'd just be reincarnated as himself again anyway rendering it pointless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoogleViper Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Who is to say that God exists? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navarre Posted June 5, 2009 Author Share Posted June 5, 2009 This thread is likely to be locked. Try not to descend into crazy religion bashing, or go totally off-topic and it will not. I think everyone here is both perfectly aware and compliant with the rules, thank you. Just because he is the "Father" doesn't mean he can die. In fact, probably the contrary: he is called the "holy spirit", and isn't the whole point of Christianity that after death our spirit lives on? Hence, spirits do not die, and God cannot then commit suicide. Being a parent, such as a father, is a biological term applied to living things. By definition, living things die, so as such it is possible God could commit suicide. Yes, but God isn't a spirit surely? And if is, he's allegedly omnipotent- so and omnipotent spirit that can't kill itself? Well, it isn't omnipotent then, is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirkatronics Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 What if he doesnt want to? Theres a difference between cant and not wanting to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navarre Posted June 5, 2009 Author Share Posted June 5, 2009 Who is to say that God exists? This is under the assumption that he does exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoogleViper Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 That is the sort of argument I was looking for. But doesn't it say, or at least imply, that in the holy books God is a living thing? He's almost always referred to as 'He' and Christians call him the Father. Of course, God could be an entity that is not part of any religion- ie any religion that we know right now hasn't actually got across the true message of God or know God. In the Bible it says that god created man in his own image. Therefore he at least looks like us. To me this implies he is an actual being rather than something like a force or energy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EEVILMURRAY Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Well they say when you die and shit you live forever in the afterlife, so unless bustin' makes you feel good, can a ghost commit suicide also? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gizmo Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 I think everyone here is both perfectly aware and compliant with the rules, thank you. Being a parent, such as a father, is a biological term applied to living things. By definition, living things die, so as such it is possible God could commit suicide. Yes, but God isn't a spirit surely? And if is, he's allegedly omnipotent- so and omnipotent spirit that can't kill itself? Well, it isn't omnipotent then, is it? I'm pretty sure the modern day definition of "Father" derivates slightly from the one 2000 years ago. I don't think you can use it as a counter argument; also, translation discrepancies. How do we know what he is? A spirit seems just as likely as anything else. And being omnipotent means beign able to do anything, but thats anything in the world. Death may not physically exist as something that is possible to his "species". In the same way that he can only make a massive rock because mass exists, or walk on water because buoyancy exists. In the same way that the human brain cannot comprehend colour beyond what they know - we couldn't describe any other colours, because all we can use to describe a colour is another colour - who are we to say that "death" is a physical thing that could affect such a being? I am atheist / agnostic, depending on your definition. I do not believe in God, or any other similar thing. I am a Physicist, essentially. Give me evidence for a God, and I will believe you, in the same way that I believe in gravity even though I can't see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daft Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 God, if he/she did exist, exists beyond human understanding; that is why he/she is God. You then applying a human idea to God; suicide. Durkheim says suicide is a social fact and since God is above society why would God ever want to do it. Which brings us to another point, if God is perfect then he does not progress he just is and so it would be impossible for him to change his state, commit suicide, unless he was fallible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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