Jamba Posted June 21, 2007 Posted June 21, 2007 Beat them Cooky! Beat them with razor blades! Edit: Whoops! Miss read your post. Damned Wii
Cookyman Posted June 21, 2007 Posted June 21, 2007 Beat them Cooky! Beat them with razor blades! Nah plastic bags are more my thing - choke the bastards into seeing sense - seriously though I'm just giving you guys as much info as I can find on the banning of Manhunt 2 as I think the majority of forum users on this site are as cheesed off with the BBFC as I am. I would encourage people to listen to the Gamespot UK podcast though as they do raise some interesting issues and I love a good discussion!
aenaos Posted June 21, 2007 Posted June 21, 2007 I think rockstar do all these just for hype!!!they know well what they do!lol just joking..but if the game finally manage to be released on Wii it will sell very good..it is already popular..
Gaijin von Snikbah Posted June 21, 2007 Posted June 21, 2007 Thompson sounds like a smart ass 10 year old in that reply. Perhaps we should demand that the reason for the ban be revealed.
The fish Posted June 21, 2007 Posted June 21, 2007 Thompson sounds like a smart ass 10 year old in that reply. Perhaps we should demand that the reason for the ban be revealed. I think we should demand that Jack Thompson be banned. He's responsible for a lot of damage to property. There is a dent in the wall next to me where I've hit my head after reading his rants.
Gizmo Posted June 21, 2007 Posted June 21, 2007 Apparently there was an image of that young lad who was abducted and murdered in a shopping centre but some 8 year old lads about 10 years back in the game. If thats true, that is absolutely sick. A game created image of a guy getting his balls ripped off is one thing, but just an image of a real lad who was killed so viciously is absolutely despicable.
Cookyman Posted June 21, 2007 Posted June 21, 2007 From gamesindustry.biz ELSPA "surprised" by language BBFC used to explain Manhunt ban Talks with certification board set to take place ELSPA director general Paul Jackson has revealed the organisation plans to contact the BBFC over the language used to announce the ban of Manhunt 2. "What I think we've been incredibly responsible in doing is making sure there are checks and balances in place so we're working responsibly... We support the age rating system that operates in this country," he told GamesIndustry.biz this morning. "I would say that I was surprised at some of the language the BBFC used when they reported on the matter, but we'll be talking to them about that separately." Manhunt 2 is effectively banned from sale in the UK after the British Board of Film Classification refused to grant the game a rating. In a statement issued yesterday, BBFC director David Cooke said that Manhunt 2 featured an "unremitting bleakness and callousness of tone" along with "sustained and cumulative casual sadism". He concluded that allowing the game to go on sale "would involve a range of unjustifiable harm risks, to both adults and minors". Jackson today reiterated his support for the BBFC's decision, telling GI.biz, "With any truly cultural industry, the creativity within that industry will always push the boundaries. It's what creative people do, and that's excellent. "But I think it's right that as a responsible industry we support the structures that are in place." It's not yet known whether Manhunt 2 publisher Rockstar will appeal against the BBFC's decision. The game is still set to go on sale in the US, where it has been issued with a preliminary 'Adults Only' rating.
The-Ironflame Posted June 21, 2007 Posted June 21, 2007 Apparently there was an image of that young lad who was abducted and murdered in a shopping centre but some 8 year old lads about 10 years back in the game. If thats true, that is absolutely sick. A game created image of a guy getting his balls ripped off is one thing, but just an image of a real lad who was killed so viciously is absolutely despicable. That was another game. Not Manhunt 2. That was Law and Order: Double Or Nothing never heard of it myself..
Helmsly Posted June 21, 2007 Posted June 21, 2007 "Take-Two Interactive Software has temporarily suspended plans to distribute Manhunt 2 for the Wii or PlayStation platforms while it reviews its options with regard to the recent decisions made by the British Board of Film Classification and Entertainment Software Rating Board," a representative told GameSpot. "We continue to stand behind this extraordinary game. We believe in freedom of creative expression, as well as responsible marketing, both of which are essential to our business of making great entertainment." http://www.gamespot.com/news/6172931.html Also its now Banned in Italy: Italian Communications Minister Paolo Gentiloni banned on Thursday 'Manhunt 2', describing the blood-and-guts computer game as "cruel and sadistic". The game, made by US firm Rockstar Games for Sony's PlayStation 2 and Nintendo's Wii games consoles, contains "encouragement of violence and murder," Gentiloni said. He also filed a complaint with the Interactive Software Federation of Europe (ISFE), the European association of publishers of video and computer games. http://www.dnaindia.com/report.asp?NewsID=1104985
Aalborg Posted June 22, 2007 Posted June 22, 2007 looks like "that was that" with the suspension.. im not buying a censored version thats for sure..
Zechs Merquise Posted June 22, 2007 Posted June 22, 2007 Apparently there was an image of that young lad who was abducted and murdered in a shopping centre but some 8 year old lads about 10 years back in the game. If thats true, that is absolutely sick. A game created image of a guy getting his balls ripped off is one thing, but just an image of a real lad who was killed so viciously is absolutely despicable. That's NOT manhunt, is soemthing callled Law and Order or soemthing liek that. Was in the Daily Mail wednesday. http://www.gamespot.com/news/6172931.html Also its now Banned in Italy: http://www.dnaindia.com/report.asp?NewsID=1104985 looks like "that was that" with the suspension.. im not buying a censored version thats for sure.. It's not coming out, expect maybe on PC. Cut down console version to surface soon. Big publicity stunt.
Teppo Holmqvist Posted June 22, 2007 Posted June 22, 2007 Rockstar say Manhunt 2 has been shelved Suits me. I had already four games on the que. Good luck for Rockstar.
Jamba Posted June 22, 2007 Posted June 22, 2007 I know I have been advocating freedom of the games industry and freedom of choice earlier in this thread but at the same time I think Rockstar and Take-Two probably deserve a slap on the wrists. The BBFC are pretty reasonable with their decisions and although I dont support the ban it is obvious that Manhunt 2 is very likely to be unjustified violence. I'm disappointed with them, not for making aggressive and violent content but for making it pointless and therefore making a pointless game.
Zechs Merquise Posted June 22, 2007 Posted June 22, 2007 I know I have been advocating freedom of the games industry and freedom of choice earlier in this thread but at the same time I think Rockstar and Take-Two probably deserve a slap on the wrists. The BBFC are pretty reasonable with their decisions and although I dont support the ban it is obvious that Manhunt 2 is very likely to be unjustified violence. I'm disappointed with them, not for making aggressive and violent content but for making it pointless and therefore making a pointless game. I am totally against censorship, but I find it difficult to support companies who produce games or any other form of media which push the envolope for the sake of it. I obviously haven't played the game, but from what I've heard the game is just very OTT. However saying that, films like Natural Born Killers completely glorify serial killers and paint them in a light of 'heroes'. Especially when the conclusion of such works is the killer getting away with it. Personally, I found the scene in that film where they decide to simply kill a waitress for the hell of it a lot more sickening than the concept of Manhunt 2, where you kill those trying to kill you. What's more, in the above mentioned film, both the protaganists escape justice to roam free and are portrayed as heroes, when really they have just killed in an unjustifiable manner through out the film. Yet this is acceptable? I don't think Manhunt 2 revolved around killing innocent people then riding into the sunset with your girl. Although the violence was most likely over the top, and some of the themes not to the liking of the large sections of the public, is it really more moraly repugnant than Natural Born Killers? I would say no, and had Manhunt 2 been a film it would no doubt have been classified and released.
Jamba Posted June 22, 2007 Posted June 22, 2007 But that's the point of Natural Born Killers. You are meant to feel uneasy watching it and it explores how you feel about glorifying violence. It also gives a philosophy as to why they are violent. It gives you a peak into the mind of killer who is within their right mind, which is even scarier than a psychopath. The film is meant to disturb you and make you question things. That's why its such good cinema. They use the violence to illustrate this, it's a tool. In Manhunt 2 I could see the violence being justified if they were illustrating how torture and manipulation drives the character to do such things. But I have a feeling that Rockstar haven't done this. They have (for want of a better phrase) used violence for a pointless end. For a start the game should center around the fact that the character is a victim, which is hard to do in a film. Have you seen Oldboy, Zechs?
Zechs Merquise Posted June 22, 2007 Posted June 22, 2007 But that's the point of Natural Born Killers. You are meant to feel uneasy watching it and it explores how you feel about glorifying violence. It also gives a philosophy as to why they are violent. It gives you a peak into the mind of killer who is within their right mind, which is even scarier than a psychopath. The film is meant to disturb you and make you question things. That's why its such good cinema. They use the violence to illustrate this, it's a tool. In Manhunt 2 I could see the violence being justified if they were illustrating how torture and manipulation drives the character to do such things. But I have a feeling that Rockstar haven't done this. They have (for want of a better phrase) used violence for a pointless end. For a start the game should center around the fact that the character is a victim, which is hard to do in a film. Have you seen Oldboy, Zechs? No I haven't seen that one. However, saying that is the point of Natural Born Killers is my point lol. I feel the point of that particular film and in my opinion the way it glorifies the violence and sets up those who kill innocent people as 'Heroes' is far worse than someone who kills people that our out to kill him!
Jamba Posted June 22, 2007 Posted June 22, 2007 I see your point. Definately watch Oldboy tho man. It is subtitled but it basically seems to follow a similar story to Manhunt 2, I'm guessing. Warning tho, it is quite a shocking movie but it is good, not to mention that the BBFC didnt censor it. (And for all you under 18ers out there, DONT DO IT!)
Cube Posted June 22, 2007 Posted June 22, 2007 Thinking in one way - Surely Manhunt 2 is better than games like GTA because it doesn't see killing as "Meh, you've killed around 100 people, including police, and have been run over by a tank. After 5 seconds in hospital, you are fine and free to do whatever you want again"? Isn't the point of the game that you HAVE to kill, rather than CAN? Surely showing that killing is horrible and gruesome is a good thing? And, from some points of view, when the game goes too far, isn't that really showing that YOU are the victim, because you HAVE to do it? I think these murderer psychologists should play this game. It could help them in an educational way.
... Posted June 22, 2007 Posted June 22, 2007 Natural Born Killers does not glorify violence, what the hell are you guys talking about? The film is a satire, an exaggeration of the world we live in, and it is used to criticize sensationalist media and the society that feeds it. It is Robert Downey Jr.'s character in the film (the journalist Wayne Gale), along with the rest of sensationalist media, that paints Mickey and Mallory as heroes, and the society that gets into the crazyness, with t-shirts and all sorts of merchandising. The fact that Wayne Gale becomes himself a killer in the end of the movie only reinforces this aspect and then he gets killed by Mickey and Mallory, showing that killers should NOT be glorified stupidly. It's as much a satire as Paul Verhoeven's RoboCop and Starship Troopers in the way these films portray television. I think these murderer psychologists should play this game. It could help them in an educational way. Hmm.... because you think the programmers who created Manhunt 2 know more about criminal psychology than... errr, criminal psychologists?
Cube Posted June 22, 2007 Posted June 22, 2007 Hmm.... because you think the programmers who created Manhunt 2 know more about criminal psychology than... errr, criminal psychologists? It'll give them the opportunity to be a psychologically-damaged criminal, though. Manhunt 2 has been allowed in France, Norway and the Netherlands (although MPs in the Netherlands are trying to get the game banned). PEGI rating of 18+ Will Rockstar release the uncensored version there?
Zechs Merquise Posted June 22, 2007 Posted June 22, 2007 Natural Born Killers does not glorify violence, what the hell are you guys talking about? The film is a satire, an exaggeration of the world we live in, and it is used to criticize sensationalist media and the society that feeds it. It is Robert Downey Jr.'s character in the film (the journalist Wayne Gale), along with the rest of sensationalist media, that paints Mickey and Mallory as heroes, and the society that gets into the crazyness, with t-shirts and all sorts of merchandising. The fact that Wayne Gale becomes himself a killer in the end of the movie only reinforces this aspect and then he gets killed by Mickey and Mallory, showing that killers should NOT be glorified stupidly. It's as much a satire as Paul Verhoeven's RoboCop and Starship Troopers in the way these films portray television. Hmm.... because you think the programmers who created Manhunt 2 know more about criminal psychology than... errr, criminal psychologists? I believe it glorifies murderers, yes, it is also a critic of the journalists and sensationalism that surrounds these type of cases. However it also shows the two protaganists getting off scott free and effectively escaping justice. They don;t have to pay for their actions.
... Posted June 22, 2007 Posted June 22, 2007 Showing bad guys winning does not imply glorifying them. Or maybe the censors are right in believing that some people out there cannot understand this.
Gio001 Posted June 22, 2007 Posted June 22, 2007 Showing bad guys winning does not imply glorifying them. Or maybe the censors are right in believing that some people out there cannot understand this. The whole film glorifies them. You talk like a fully paid up member of the P.C brigade.
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