Super Mario Maker 2 challenge - June challenge has started!

[Sméagol]

@Dcubed

Gave your level another go, got the key on my own. But still couldn't figure out the rest. I'll give it another go with the hints. Tried to get some in-game hints by abusing that first p-switch, which let me see the top of the left pipe room, and while that did something, I still couldn't figure it out.

As for my level.. I don't have a hatred for CP's, if you haven't reached the first one yet.. What comes after is more deadly. They're are both placed where they are for a reason. If you're getting hit by that one spike cannon (there is only one), you're spending way too much time at that part. It's there for a very specific (puzzle) reason, which you can see in Glen-i's tweet, and is optional, so just avoid it. When I placed it, I considered letting it shoot coins, but decided "it fit the theme" to have it shoot Spikes. It's funny that my brother who playtested it, and doesn't have any major recent Mario platforming experience, and no Mario Maker experience at all, apart from playtesting my levels, had no problem with the spike cannon at all, despite having major problems with basic stuff like the claws and drybones snell mechanics, stuff all new to him.

I didn't place any mushrooms except for at the end as a set-up for some trolls and puzzles (after the 2nd CP), and the requirement that for the true ending you can't get hit at all (until the end). Plus the fact that there are actually few Spikes directly in your way to hurt you. You have more risk of falling to your death, the Spikes are mostly used for puzzles or indirect obstacles.

Edit: Also, damn you for that WR!!   (no it wasn't 100% optimized)

Tried your level again for a third time.. Even with the hints I don't get it.

Spoiler

The trampoline is in the last section, and I don't have it in the seesaw section. I don't see how to progress without using the p-switch door. Still don't know what to do with the pipes either, I (or rather the Spike) hit the Switch, but nothing is happening in the left pipe. I tried jumping at the purple crystals, with the tampoline (which you said isn't used there) but I see no difference.

 

Edited March 8, 2020 by Sméagol

[RedShell]

OK, I’ve played ‘em all, but not managed to complete every level. Going to give those ones a few more attempts before I make a final decision.

@Dcubed I am really struggling with the vertical platform section at your first checkpoint!  The initial few are no problem at all, but once more than one Spike is activating the ON/OFF switches the timing seems bizarre. I think I’m landing on a solid block only for it to disappear right away!  Any tips?

BTW, thanks for the positive feedback on my level, and for finding Baby Face as usual.  The way you did it wasn’t quite the way I intended, the idea was actually to backtrack from the checkpoint:

Spoiler

 

You still needed to die either way though.  

3 hours ago, Dcubed said:

I particularily love how you can save yourself in the penultimate section with a well timed jump if you're running a bit behind

Yeah, that was a very nice touch indeed. I had to make use of it myself:

Spoiler

 

@Sméagol here are a couple of clips from your level:

Spoiler

 

Not managed to clear it, but I have to say that so far your level has been the most fun for me. It’s just so ridiculously cruel. 

 

[Dcubed]

1 hour ago, Sméagol said:

Spoiler

The trampoline is in the last section, and I don't have it in the seesaw section. I don't see how to progress without using the p-switch door. Still don't know what to do with the pipes either, I (or rather the Spike) hit the Switch, but nothing is happening in the left pipe. I tried jumping at the purple crystals, with the tampoline (which you said isn't used there) but I see no difference.

 

 

Spoiler

Take the trampoline back through the key door... You might find that something has changed back in an older area that you may now need that trampoline for...

 

 

37 minutes ago, RedShell said:

OK, I’ve played ‘em all, but not managed to complete every level. Going to give those ones a few more attempts before I make a final decision.

@Dcubed I am really struggling with the vertical platform section at your first checkpoint!  The initial few are no problem at all, but once more than one Spike is activating the ON/OFF switches the timing seems bizarre. I think I’m landing on a solid block only for it to disappear right away!  Any tips?

 

Spoiler

Move slowly upwards, keep the camera under control and don't display more than two Spikes onscreen at the same time as you go.  Spikes will only activate On/Off switches when they are onscreen  

 

Edited March 8, 2020 by Dcubed

[Dufniall]

Looks like almost everyone found my level, if not here is the code:

Had a busy weekend so I'm gonna start now with all your levels!

[RedShell]

13 minutes ago, Dcubed said:

Move slowly upwards, keep the camera under control and don't display more than two Spikes onscreen at the same time as you go.  Spikes will only activate On/Off switches when they are onscreen

Well I’m reaching the top more consistently now, but oh man... getting into that pipe!  

I’ve fallen into the pit at least 100 times I reckon. Check out your failure points, they’re probably all me.  

[Sméagol]

@Dcubed quickly before I go replay all the levels for more comments;

Regarding super hint, I must be missing something obvious.

Spoiler

When I have the trampoline, I don't have a key.

When I have the key, I can't enter any of the key doors, they're both inaccessible from where I get the key?

Also, I didn't complain about this before, but yeah, that vertical section! You really could have tweaked that to force only 2 active Spike's at most. What you say isn't true.. They will activate switches if they're barely above or below screen. Which, depending on how high you jump or how low you fall, results in various numbers of active Spikes. Combined with the fact that Switching also depends on how fast they throw their balls, makes this very unpredictable. 2 simultaneous thows result in one switch activation. You also can't rely on sounds for that reason, and for the fact that some sounds get cancelled when Spike's throw in really short succession. All this combined has various results: you can have 1 switch, 2 switches in short succession, 3 switches in short succession, or even no netto change at all, with often not knowing which one will happen. To top it off the pipe entrance has a very tight timing. I wouldn't have a problem with that last one if the rest were predictable, but it isn't. I suspect most of the endless runners give up here and don't even make it to the puzzles.

I didn't complain about it before because.. I miraculously did it first try the first time. After that.. It took numerous tries. I sometimes fall in the pit deliberately, just to reset the timings.

@RedShell that second tweet haha. That was a welcome side effect. The pipe actually has a very specific purpose, and it was one of the things I was breaking my head over on Monday, and I was considering removing it yesterday. But seeing it in full effect made my day haha. 

Edited March 8, 2020 by Sméagol

[Dcubed]

17 minutes ago, Sméagol said:

@Dcubed quickly before I go replay all the levels for more comments;

Regarding super hint, I must be missing something obvious.

  DCubed's level (Reveal hidden contents)

When I have the trampoline, I don't have a key.

When I have the key, I can't enter any of the key doors, they're both inaccessible from where I get the key?

Also, I didn't complain about this before, but yeah, that vertical section! You really could have tweaked that to force only 2 active Spike's at most. What you say isn't true.. They will activate switches if they're barely above or below screen. Which, depending on how high you jump or how low you fall, results in various numbers of active Spikes. Combined with the fact that Switching also depends on how fast they throw their balls, makes this very unpredictable. 2 simultaneous thows result in one switch activation. You also can't rely on sounds for that reason, and for the fact that some sounds get cancelled when Spike's throw in really short succession. All this combined has various results: you can have 1 switch, 2 switches in short succession, 3 switches in short succession, or even no netto change at all, with often not knowing which one will happen. To top it off the pipe entrance has a very tight timing. I wouldn't have a problem with that last one if the rest were predictable, but it isn't. I suspect most of the endless runners give up here and don't even make it to the puzzles.

I didn't complain about it before because.. I miraculously did it first try the first time. After that.. It took numerous tries. I sometimes fall in the pit deliberately, just to reset the timings.

@RedShell that second tweet haha. That was a welcome side effect. The pipe actually has a very specific purpose, and it was one of the things I was breaking my head over on Monday, and I was considering removing it yesterday. But seeing it in full effect made my day haha. 

Spoiler

You don’t need the trampoline to get back!! You can just jump back up when you get the key and just go back to the key door! (Be sure to bring the trampoline with you though; you’ll figure out why when you get there).

 

Edited March 8, 2020 by Dcubed

[drahkon]

Just bought this digitally from the US eShop. It's on sale for $39.99 and I was able to get $40 of credit for 27€.  Seemed like a no-brainer.

Depending on how much time I can invest currently I might take part in this challenge. Probably only as a player for now, though.

[Sméagol]

Spoiler

Like I said, both keydoors (I assume they're the same one) are inaccessible from where I get the key. The one to the left is behind a one-way gate. The one to the right is blocked off with spiketraps and the seesaw section, which I don't know how to do. I can barely get the ball from the big Spike down below on the bottom seesaw, but can't get it on the one above it.

 

32 minutes ago, drahkon said:

Just bought this digitally from the US eShop. It's on sale for $39.99 and I was able to get $40 of credit for 27€.  Seemed like a no-brainer.

Depending on how much time I can invest currently I might take part in this challenge. Probably only as a player for now, though.

Next one will be first Saturday of April, so you have a month to practice in the editor! You can play the 6 levels from this month right now. 

Since videos are more fun:

I also had videos of @londragon's level, but I messed up the timing of capturing, so they're not really interesting, and, by now, obsolete thanks to @Dcubed 

Edited March 8, 2020 by Sméagol

[Dcubed]

24 minutes ago, Sméagol said:

  puzzles (Hide contents)

Like I said, both keydoors (I assume they're the same one) are inaccessible from where I get the key. The one to the left is behind a one-way gate. The one to the right is blocked off with spiketraps and the seesaw section, which I don't know how to do. I can barely get the ball from the big Spike down below on the bottom seesaw, but can't get it on the one above it.

 

Next one will be first Saturday of April, so you have a month to practice in the editor! You can play the 6 levels from this month right now. 

Since videos are more fun:

I also had videos of @londragon's level, but I messed up the timing of capturing, so they're not really interesting, and, by now, obsolete thanks to @Dcubed 

Oh right, I get you now.  Didn’t quite get where you were at in the level...

 

Spoiler

Ground pound to make the ball fly up.  Make sure that the ball gets to roll back in the direction towards the Spike/Hard Blocks first, before you make it fly up onto the other seesaw!

 

Edited March 8, 2020 by Dcubed

[Sméagol]

Ah right, I didn't try that no. Probably experience of my own level getting in the way in that case!

I updated the challenge post with all the levels, I'll update votes later since I think I've only seen one actual vote? I'd have to check, but please do them on a single line and in bold!

 

Edited March 8, 2020 by Sméagol

[RedShell]

@Sméagol, somehow (not sure how ) I’ve made it to the boss on your level. Very cool mechanics on that I must say, but I really cannot see myself surviving long enough to defeat it. Is it the end of the level after that battle, or is that just a miniboss?  

*EDIT*

Oh my God! I just got past it, I could see the goal... You are such a bastard!  

Edited March 8, 2020 by RedShell

[Sméagol]

Haha. You're almost there!

That one last jump wasn't meant to be a huge obstacle, I suspect performance anxiety must have been doing you and @Glen-i in! Now I'm really curious how you two would have reacted to the troll that was originally there..

Edit: Boss tip: visually it looks frantic, but what you have to do and focus on is very simple. For those who haven't defeated it yet and want to see what's going on: stand still when you enter the room, you'll automatically land on the only (temporary) safespot.

Edited March 8, 2020 by Sméagol

[RedShell]

13 minutes ago, Sméagol said:

That one last jump wasn't meant to be a huge obstacle, I suspect performance anxiety must have been doing you and @Glen-i in! Now I'm really curious how you two would have reacted to the troll that was originally there..

Well, I defeated the boss twice, and fell down the hole right in front of the goal... twice. I concede defeat.  

My vote for the March Mario Maker Challenge goes to:

Sméagol

Your level was absolutely evil, but I just found it incredibly entertaining throughout.  Even though I didn’t officially clear it, I saw everything it had to offer, including the boss battle, which was spectacular! That’s one of the best Mario Maker boss battles I’ve ever seen, very clever and super exciting to play! Well done.  

Anyway, I won’t go into detail on the other levels, a lot of what I’d say has already been said. But thanks to everyone who took part, it was great playing all of the different Spike themed stages.

 

[Sméagol]

4 minutes ago, RedShell said:

Your level was absolutely evil,

Oh, trust me.. You haven't seen real evil yet.

[Glen-i]

@Sméagol that video of @RedShell's level where you say nothing was there?

Are you certain about that?

[drahkon]

Is there still time to put in a vote?

I'll most likely give each level a go later today.

[Dufniall]

Right, I gave everyone's level a go. Couldn't finish them all, but I'm willing to go back tonight for a second round.

Great idea though, it was cool to go back to Mario Maker! Can't wait for April's theme.

As for voting? I will go back to the levels I haven't finished but it's safe to say the winner here is RedShell!

Thoughts:

 

@londragon: Nice and simple, and cool to see a 3D World level. Spike+pipes is a nice combination which I wasn't expecting. Morgan's level is hard, and it gave me flashbacks to his previous walljump levels haha. I didn't finish it yet.

@Glen-i: Cool level, the optional red coins are a nice addition and they require some looking around but aren't too hard to get. All in all a really fun level to play.

@Dcubed: A classic Dcubed level filled with Mario Maker mechanics of which I only understand about half haha. I made it to the three pipes with the trampoline but couldn't figure it out. Even with the hints I gave up after two time-outs. I like it, but I'm much more a fan of more straightforward levels. Speaking of which...

@RedShell: Yes, yeeeeees, these are my favourite kind of levels in MM. A variety of mechanics, but all in a classic level. Plenty of humour as well, I like the chillout zones. It feels a lot like a level that Nintendo would make and that is of course a good thing. You are generous with coins though!

@Sméagol: Another one I couldn't complete (yet), I stalled right in front of the first flag. Am I correct in thinking that I need the dry bones shield to reach it? Knowing that it will get more difficult I'll have to see if I can push through! It's a bit too difficult and complex for my liking (I'm a simple man) but there are some cool mechanisms there (such as said dry bones shell).

As for my own level: Indeed, the only way past the big Spike is to take a hit. I thought it was clever, guess not that clever haha. You can always go back to get a new fire flower from the pipe so you would wind up big at the halfway point. Those hitboxes on the spike traps near the vines are indeed annoying, only figured that out when playing my level. And to get up in the final part trampolines do indeed work, but so does the spin jump on the big Spike's spike!

Great idea though, it was cool to go back to Mario Maker! Can't wait for April's theme.

As for voting? I will go back to the levels I haven't finished but it's safe to say the winner here is RedShell!

Edited March 9, 2020 by Vileplume2000

[Sméagol]

3 hours ago, Glen-i said:

@Sméagol that video of @RedShell's level where you say nothing was there?

Are you certain about that?

@RedShell replied to me in a tweet, so I'm quite certain it's the opposite! (and I replied back I didn't check your spoiler)

@Vileplume2000 It's the last part where the drybones shell is required yes. You didn't lose it the the lone and optional Spike in that room, right?

2 hours ago, drahkon said:

Is there still time to put in a vote?

I'll most likely give each level a go later today.

Technically you have all month. Have fun!

Edited March 9, 2020 by Sméagol

[Londragon]

So, I've played all the levels on offer, and while there's a small chance I'll go back to them later on in the week, I've played enough to give my vote to;

Redshell

Once again, I'm not good at 2D Mario games, but good enough to finish Nintendo's offerings.  When it comes to fan made levels they are always so drastically difficult that I don't enjoy the frustration.  With that;

Spoiler

Redshell - The first part is really nicely balanced, especially liked the bouncing trampoline large spikes to break the wall.  After the checkpoint was where my skills were pushed, but I did find it doable and pushed myself to finish it.

Gleni - Love how you teach the player the mechanic of Spike changing the On/Off switch at the beginning, but this was a level I'll never see the end of.  The fast moving treadmill was just so random as to whether I'd make it through or not, followed by bouncing Spike balls, finished me.

Dcubed - Nice start, straight forward, but the platform switching climb finished me.

Smeagol - Just no way.  Took me so long to chance my way through the first seesaw, then the next screen, wasn't sure what to do, and can't get through the first seesaw again regularly enough to try the next section, and that's the easy part???

Vileplume - Nice verticality and ideas work well, but the bouncing Spikes and their balls after the checkpoint, argghh.  Didn't matter where I went, spike to the head, amazing aim on those Spikes.

Morgan's - One of the easier ones, came close to the end, but that Spike tower at the end put me off.

Ahh, for a straight forward level. I think that sums up my feelings of Super Mario Maker.  People throw too many ideas into a single level and the levels become confused because of it.  Plus I'm shit and too impatient to play through a level 100 times.

Morgan is still playing through them, is there a cutoff date for the voting?

[Sméagol]

12 minutes ago, londragon said:

Morgan is still playing through them, is there a cutoff date for the voting?

I edited my previous post before you posted, but technically you have until the start of the next challenge as we need a theme by then. Would be cool if you voted way before then!

The seesaw was one of he first sections I came up with. I thought there was more margin for error, but watching my brother play and then replay it myself, I found it's a bit more specific. Still..

Spoiler

When you enter the room, keep running, jump off the edge to the ceiling, keep running until you hit the wall on the seesaw, and stop. Then simply jump over the ball.

But yeah, I don't think you're going to enjoy the rest.

 

Edited March 9, 2020 by Sméagol

[Dufniall]

7 hours ago, Sméagol said:

 

@Vileplume2000 It's the last part where the drybones shell is required yes. You didn't lose it the the lone and optional Spike in that room, right?

Nah, I lost it at the big spike ball before that. Anyway, managed to get to and beat the boss... and fail in that final jump like many before me. I don't think I can muster the spirit to do it again haha.

[Sméagol]

Haha, I have no idea why that final jump is such a problem.. It's really not a tight jump, and you've done more difficult jumps by then. Performance anxiety I tell you!

[Glen-i]

@londragon, you might find that conveyer belt more manageable if you utilise Spin Jumps so that you can land on the Spike Ball without taking a hit.

[Sméagol]

More comments.

A Seriously Spiky Situation @RedShell
The level with the most attention to the aesthetics, it's just pleasing to look at. They're being functional as well, with you using background as hints. This mostly flew over my head (I've only now found all the 1-UPs while replaying the level.. I didn't even find those the first time I hit that slide. I was like "Cool. Coins"). But those for the trampoline were really clever and your eyes would naturally gravitate towards them. Loved the "preview" rooms, just a nice detail, and funny to watch the Spike's doing their thing. Loved the ending with all the spinjump bouncing, and the ball clearing the way. My only criticism would be that.. For me personally, your level is too easy, though that didn't stop it from being fun. But one more specific thing: the ending, while being cool, could be a bit longer at the start. You start wth a slope towards a saw.. And because you are bouncing, on something else that's already bouncing, it's hard to time your jumps, and you're likely to hit that first saw. Would have liked to start with a horizontal section, and more space before and between saws, just to adjust to the timing of the bouncing.

Spike's Very Own Level! @Glen-i
To me you had the most satisfying overall platforming experience. Cool use of the Spike's hitting on/off switches in the first section, then in the second section a very cool puzzle to start, and a fun p-switch race. Not a superfan of the slow green snake ride at the end, but I'll overlook it.

Spike's Silly Prickly Puzzles @Dcubed
By now I have said most already. I spent most time on your level for various reasons. Went back for another time, and finally cleared it the intended way, with all the hints. My two biggest issues are the vertical section.. I feel it's out of place in the level, and the level would be better off without it completely. Which would also free up a CP. The other one would be the softlock. Correct me if I'm wrong, but using the p-switch the way I did, leads to the 2nd half without being able to do the puzzles. If you miss your one chance to reach the goal, you're stuck in a big area with the 2nd half of a puzzle, which isn't obvious. It was genuinely the first thing I tried. Now I know I'm not typical, and have seen too many videos of troll levels, and most people won't try that on first attempt.. But still. it's obvious some people will, and get stuck without knowing they're stuck. Having only access to half of the puzzle obviously doesn't help with solving it. The puzzles are very cool when you know the solution.. But I think the puzzle section needs some streamlining and tweaks overall.

Spoiler

I think you give too many options at once. I personally think you should have made the level more linear, forcing people to go to the place where you want them to go. I thought the key puzzle would lead to some optional bonus room, it didn't seem required to me, since it looked so self-contained from the other puzzles. If you reach the pipes in the correct order.. Then it's not super obvious what you have to do. You numbered the pipes, but there's nothing to do in pipe 1 & 3 unless you go back. The numbering (when you get that hint) makes it more confusing, since it suggest you need to do those in order, but there are steps missing. The trampoline is so far removed from where you need it, that it's not obvious. I would have it made more obvious that the trampoline is really important (put more emphasis on where it drops), and would have added a trampoline behind a blue switch around where you need it (so you can only access it when it's appropriate). Serves as a clue to bring the other one, and makes the juggling easier, because it's a bit finnicky with just one (and more finnicky if you have the fire flower, as it's easy to accidentally kill the big Spike.

It's a shame, because it's very satisfying to see it all coming together.

A Spike up the Butt! @londragon
I didn't have the energy to try to optimize it more, and since it's a simple level, I don't have much add to what I already said. Except for that it seriously needs more variation. Most of the fun came from speedrunning and optimizing it. For a casual playthrough, it's not super interesting, as it's too easy and you do the same thing until the end of the level (..just jump over the spike balls). It's a shame, because you're the only one using clearpipes, which look cool at first glance, but you're not actually doing anything interesting with them. Players bypass them completely by jumping on top of them. But still, being simple makes it automatically suitable for speedrunning. There are some fun optimizations that you clearly haven't thought of, seeing your clear check time!

The SPIKE castle @londragon's son Morgan
Yeah first of all, one big thing I forgot first time: the big softlock at the start. Again correct me if I'm wrong, but falling down in that first section below the first skull lift, drops you into an area you can't get out of. That's a softlock, and a big no-no.  At least give me something to kill myself with! I have not much to add to what I already said beside that heinous softlock, but I do like the jumping challenges. I just don't like them when I have to do 50 of those, one after another, without pause!  So this is a huge step up. I like the little avoid the lava walljumps, and the big walljumps over the lava later. And the "Spike towers", which look intimidating, but actually aren't. I mentioned he should do something about aesthetics, but forgot about that "clown factory", which has no function at all, besides looking silly!  Yeah I don't know. There's nothing to do gameplay-wise, but it was strangely satisfying to see those Spike's drop in the clown cars!

Don't drink Spiked drinks! @Vileplume2000
Also not much to add. Like I said, not a big fan of forced hits, specifically if there's no reason for it. It's fine if it's for a puzzle or set-up later, as long as it's obvious. Your level doesn't look like a place where you may encounter such a thing, so it left me wondering how I was supposed to get rid of it. Being short, I suspect it may also be suitable for speedrunning, but I haven't tried that. I did like the 1-way gates section. At first I thought "what's with the ugly gates and the messy jumping". Then the fireballs lined up perfectly, and that was satisfying to watch! And another slow green snake block finish.. Forunately, you don't need to spend much time on it. I also liked how you made the secret a bit tricky to jump to.

My vote goes to Glen-i for Spike's Very Own Level!
I enjoyed the running and jumping in it more than any other levels, and I really liked the overall use of the theme, with the Spikes hitting switches and stuff.

Best title - A Seriously Spiky Situation
Best overall use of theme - Spike's Very Own Level!
Best individual use of theme - Spike's Very Own Level! - Boomeranging the Spike with its own ball.
Most satisfying jump(s) - A Seriously Spiky Situation - Spinjumping on the Spike balls at the end.
Best overall platforming - Spike's Very Own Level!
Best speedrun level - A Spike up the Butt!
Funniest troll - Spike's Silly Prickly Puzzles - Timing the jump over the switch floor.
Best puzzle - Spike's Silly Prickly Puzzles - Key puzzle
Best WTF moment - Spike's Silly Prickly Puzzles - Bypassing all puzzles.
Best visuals - A Seriously Spiky Situation
Most balanced difficulty - Spike's Very Own Level!
Best pacing - A Seriously Spiky Situation
Coolest ending - A Seriously Spiky Situation - Waiting for the parachute ball after a series of spinjumps.
Best softlock - Spike's Silly Prickly Puzzles - Abusing the 1-way gate and getting stuck in the process.
Best red herring - The SPIKE castle - Return to start when going to the narrow passageway (same as Glen-i's tweet)
Coolest secret - A Seriously Spiky Situation - Baby face
Best level overall - Spike's Very Own Level!

Edited March 11, 2020 by Sméagol