Zechs Merquise Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 I think EA leaving Nintendo had little if anything to do with system specs! They released plenty of game son the 360 and PS3 that could have easily been ported to the Wii U - FIFA especially. I think relations between Nintendo and EA soured over things none of us will probably find out about until years down the line. I believe that EA want Origin to Nintendo's online provider and I think Nintendo got cold feet and pulled away from that deal which angered EA. For the record, I think EA then tried to influence MS and a lot of MS's mistakes in the run up to the release of the XBO were down to EA's involvement, especially the banning of used games. What I am saying, is that I believe EA has wounded both Nintendo and MS this generation, I think EA has some toxic business practices and when they try to push those on console manufacturers the manufacturers either resist them and get shit on like Nintendo, or go with them hoping for an all powerful partnership then end up taking the heat like Microsoft did. Don't get me wrong, I know Nintendo need companies like EA in order to reach a wider audience, and although I don't play FIFA or Battlefield, I would like to see them on the system for others that do. However I still don't like the way EA does business or the effect they have on the industry and some of the franchises and developers I once liked.
Ashley Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 (edited) Although I think it's a word situation, I think you're all over blowing the need for it - like pitching for a job interview you don't know what the job is? EA left nintendo because of Specs? These are all really tenuous excuses for why a small indie couldn't pitch a game. I could pitch a film idea without knowing what cameras or budget I was working with... Just to get some ideas out in the air. Like I say, I think it's a bit of a weird thing for nintendo to say/do; but let's not make out it's an unpitchable situation. Can only speak for myself obviously but how I'm approaching it is by looking at the bigger picture. What does this say about Nintendo's approach to getting in new developers? Or about getting console launch titles? What information they choose to share etc. It's obviously only one example, but with no NX news for a long time it's the best we can discuss I was never saying its unpitchable, I was saying it was not good practice. Edited February 24, 2016 by Ashley
Hero-of-Time Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 Don't get me wrong, I know Nintendo need companies like EA in order to reach a wider audience, and although I don't play FIFA or Battlefield, I would like to see them on the system for others that do. However I still don't like the way EA does business or the effect they have on the industry and some of the franchises and developers I once liked. While I don't agree with a lot of their practices, they are VERY good at what they do. I think they are one of the few in the industry who know their audience very well and can read the market accordingly, both in the console space and mobile markets. The amount of money they make of something like Ultimate Team alone is INSANE. From a business standpoint they really know their stuff.
Sheikah Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 (edited) I think EA leaving Nintendo had little if anything to do with system specs! They released plenty of game son the 360 and PS3 that could have easily been ported to the Wii U - FIFA especially. I think relations between Nintendo and EA soured over things none of us will probably find out about until years down the line. I believe that EA want Origin to Nintendo's online provider and I think Nintendo got cold feet and pulled away from that deal which angered EA. For the record, I think EA then tried to influence MS and a lot of MS's mistakes in the run up to the release of the XBO were down to EA's involvement, especially the banning of used games. What I am saying, is that I believe EA has wounded both Nintendo and MS this generation, I think EA has some toxic business practices and when they try to push those on console manufacturers the manufacturers either resist them and get shit on like Nintendo, or go with them hoping for an all powerful partnership then end up taking the heat like Microsoft did. Don't get me wrong, I know Nintendo need companies like EA in order to reach a wider audience, and although I don't play FIFA or Battlefield, I would like to see them on the system for others that do. However I still don't like the way EA does business or the effect they have on the industry and some of the franchises and developers I once liked. If there was good money to be made porting titles over the Wii U then I believe EA would have done it. I don't believe that soured relations are the reason why EA stopped doing it. If relations were that soured then I don't see why they are on board now for NX. You have to look at the initial 300 quid cost of the console with last gen specs as a major reason (among others) why not many people picked up the console. It was...unexciting, and for the price, undesirable. The kinds of people who want to play EA games also often have a MS/Sony console anyway (and would probably prefer to buy it on those consoles for the online functionality; a spec of those consoles in itself), so I doubt there was much incentive for them to continue to bring their games to Wii U. Their initial run of ports that they did probably told them all they wanted to know. Edited February 24, 2016 by Sheikah
Zechs Merquise Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 While I don't agree with a lot of their practices, they are VERY good at what they do. I think they are one of the few in the industry who know their audience very well and can read the market accordingly, both in the console space and mobile markets. The amount of money they make of something like Ultimate Team alone is INSANE. From a business standpoint they really know their stuff. They don't know their audience that well - they've managed to destroy franchises like Sim City (always on DLC), Medal of Honour (turning it into a yearly paint by numbers shooter because COD exists and they demand some of that pie), Dungeon Keeper (a money grabbing shit fest of a mobile game) and Command and Conquer (ruining the franchise with number 4 and shutting Westwood), then simply shutter the studios who have done little more than carry out the orders from the top! I'm not the biggest fan of Jim Sterling, but he hit the nail on the head with this one! If there was good money to be made porting titles over the Wii U then I believe EA would have done it. I don't believe that soured relations are the reason why EA stopped doing it. If relations were that soured then I don't see why they are on board now for NX. You have to look at the initial 300 quid cost of the console with last gen specs as a major reason why not many people picked up the console (as it still had well regarded Nintendo titles). The kinds of people who want to play EA games often have a MS/Sony console anyway (and would probably prefer to buy it on those consoles for the online functionality; a spec of those consoles in itself), so I doubt there was much incentive for them to bring their games to Wii U. EA went up on stage with Nintendo talking about unprecedented partnerships. They knew the specs and they knew what Nintendo were doing, something happened behind the scenes there, I'm convinced of that! Oh and you're singing from my hymn sheet. I've always said the Wii U failed for three reasons: 1) Cost too much 2) Shit marketing 3) Didn't appeal in any way to the vast majority of people who understood and loved the Wii - as in the controller was complex and confusing in so many ways! I think EA could have thrown out cheap ports of the 360 version of FIFA, they were still releasing versions for the Wii. Either way, they didn't and the rest is history.
Kav Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 Also, EA isn't "onboard" with the NX yet, hence the rumoured meeting taking place next month where Ninty and EA will "hash things out".
Hero-of-Time Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 They don't know their audience that well - they've managed to destroy franchises like Sim City (always on DLC), Medal of Honour (turning it into a yearly paint by numbers shooter because COD exists and they demand some of that pie), Dungeon Keeper (a money grabbing shit fest of a mobile game) and Command and Conquer (ruining the franchise with number 4 and shutting Westwood), then simply shutter the studios who have done little more than carry out the orders from the top! I'm not the biggest fan of Jim Sterling, but he hit the nail on the head with this one! I love Jim. On the flipside though you have the success of their Sports franchises, the Battlefield series has gone from strength to strength ( despite the shoddy launch of of 4 ), they are bringing back fan favourite Mirrors Edge even though the original didn't do that well, Dragon Age Inquisition fixed many problems that plagued the second game and was a huge success, Plants Vs Zombies Garden Warfare also proved to be a big success and the sequel looks to be even better. Finally their mobile business is doing very well when compared to others who have tried to enter the market. Like any company of course they are going to make mistakes, but for the most part they have made some good investments in studios, continue to advertise their brand, keep making a lot of money and keep their investors happy.
Sheikah Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 (edited) EA went up on stage with Nintendo talking about unprecedented partnerships. They knew the specs and they knew what Nintendo were doing, something happened behind the scenes there, I'm convinced of that! After the success of the Wii it's not hard to imagine that people thought they would score again. Surely they would not think it would have crashed and burned like it did...else why back it? I don't think anyone could have realised how little the public would care about Nintendo's new gamepad. As well as that, did EA know how much they would sell it for (ie. a lot), or that Nintendo themselves would not support the gamepad properly? Oh and you're singing from my hymn sheet. I've always said the Wii U failed for three reasons: 1) Cost too much2) Shit marketing 3) Didn't appeal in any way to the vast majority of people who understood and loved the Wii - as in the controller was complex and confusing in so many ways! Points 1 and 3 are down to the spec of the console (cost too much because of the spec, and didn't appeal because of the spec itself - a gamepad), which is why I said the spec was a major reason for its failure. I think EA could have thrown out cheap ports of the 360 version of FIFA, they were still releasing versions for the Wii. Either way, they didn't and the rest is history. Again...who would buy the Wii U version and not instead buy it for a competitor console, with fleshed out online infrastructure and existing pools of friends? I'll bet some people...but not that many. Edited February 24, 2016 by Sheikah
Zechs Merquise Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 I love Jim. On the flipside though you have the success of their Sports franchises, the Battlefield series has gone from strength to strength ( despite the shoddy launch of of 4 ), they are bringing back fan favourite Mirrors Edge even though the original didn't do that well, Dragon Age Inquisition fixed many problems that plagued the second game and was a huge success, Plants Vs Zombies Garden Warfare also proved to be a big success and the sequel looks to be even better. Finally their mobile business is doing very well when compared to others who have tried to enter the market. Like any company of course they are going to make mistakes, but for the most part they have made some good investments in studios, continue to advertise their brand, keep making a lot of money and keep their investors happy. Sorry to point score again, but I need to correct you on Battlefield, it is a franchise in decline. It peaked with 3, and Hardline has been a complete flop, I mean like Wii U COD numbers flop lol.
Hero-of-Time Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 Sorry to point score again, but I need to correct you on Battlefield, it is a franchise in decline. It peaked with 3, and Hardline has been a complete flop, I mean like Wii U COD numbers flop lol. +1 to you then.
dazzybee Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 Can only speak for myself obviously but how I'm approaching it is by looking at the bigger picture. What does this say about Nintendo's approach to getting in new developers? Or about getting console launch titles? What information they choose to share etc. It's obviously only one example, but with no NX news for a long time it's the best we can discuss I was never saying its unpitchable, I was saying it was not good practice. Then I agree 100%. I thought people were taking the piss out of Ronnie and saying how the hell are they supposed to pitch anything in that situation. Not a great circumstance, but very very easy.
Pestneb Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 Bit of a stretch bundling the Gameboy and Advance together. Same goes for the DS and 3DS. They are 2 completely different generations. If it's a branding thing then surely Wii and Wii U would be bundled together? And the NES and super NES would also make sense to group together... unless the criteria has to do with backwards compatibility. But then you could group the GC with the Wii and Wii U....
dazzybee Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 @Clownferret clearly didn't think this one through X is cross platform. Obviously
Clownferret Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 @Clownferret clearly didn't think this one through X is cross platform. Obviously There's more chance of Spurs winning the league than that being correct. ...oh hang on!
Kav Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 The X symbolises it being a hybrid, right? :p Street Fighter X Tekken Fire Emblem X SMT Nintendo (home console) X (handheld)
Clownferret Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 I could pitch a film idea without knowing what cameras or budget I was working with... Just to get some ideas out in the air. On that subject, I've been writing a book over the last few years, working title is "football is broken" I've come to the realisation that it needs to be a visual medium rather than ink on paper, as a man in the industry how do I go about pitching this as a documentary.
dazzybee Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 There's more chance of Spurs winning the league than that being correct. ...oh hang on! I think we all know this is Spurs' year!! On that subject, I've been writing a book over the last few years, working title is "football is broken" I've come to the realisation that it needs to be a visual medium rather than ink on paper, as a man in the industry how do I go about pitching this as a documentary. Well although there are formal processes with Sky Arts and Film Four, occasionally BBC they don't come up too often. Without a direct contact within one of those, the best way is to make a trailer, easier to get people to meet with you and then use various film tax reliefs to get investors on board. But with a title like that you better have some good research and theories
Clownferret Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 I think we all know this is Spurs' year!! Well although there are formal processes with Sky Arts and Film Four, occasionally BBC they don't come up too often. Without a direct contact within one of those, the best way is to make a trailer, easier to get people to meet with you and then use various film tax reliefs to get investors on board. But with a title like that you better have some good research and theories What's wrong with the title? I played football for Jamie Redknapp's father-in-law a few years back, maybe I should go down that route, although I think he was in a nut house last I heard. It's basically about the rules of the game and how some of them should be changed and how players use the rules to cheat. Lot's of other content, FIFA, finances etc. It started out as a kind of diary and grew and grew. I coach Under 10's football and some of the new rules put in place by the FA to development grass roots are so stupid it beggars belief.
Ashley Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 Guys this is nice but super off topic. Mind moving it to PMs please? Good luck with it though! Cheers.
Clownferret Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 Guys this is nice but super off topic. Mind moving it to PMs please? Good luck with it though! Cheers. Isn't this the football documentary thread?
liger05 Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 EA don't walk away from money. They ditched the wii u after seeing the disastrous hardware sales early on and games like madden and NBA 2K bombing hard. Can anyone honestly say they were wrong?
Jamba Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 I've just been catching up on the whole "pitch us something" thing. I would put a big speech up here about business development and building relationships with companies but really it's not going to contribute to the discussion. I think everyone's on the same page about it to the most extent. Nintendo feel like that kid you knew at school that only liked one game. It was sitting in the flower bed at the edge of the playground and just digging a hole in the ground with a stick... on his own. Keep your business model as niche as you like Nintendo. Your figures are showing that even that isn't profitable for you like it was back in the Gamecube days.
Hero-of-Time Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 Adding more fuel to the fire, the director of Ori and the Blind Forest isn't happy at all with Nintendo and its secrecy. http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2016/02/ori_and_the_blind_forest_director_criticises_secrecy_and_lack_of_access_to_nx_devkits
Pestneb Posted February 24, 2016 Posted February 24, 2016 Adding more fuel to the fire, the director of Ori and the Blind Forest isn't happy at all with Nintendo and its secrecy. http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2016/02/ori_and_the_blind_forest_director_criticises_secrecy_and_lack_of_access_to_nx_devkits not really fuel to the fire: And just to be clear, it's not just Nintendo, every hardware manufacturer is treating their devkits and their unreleased consoles like they're the second coming and are insanely secretive about it to a stupid degree in todays [sic] time So Sony and Microsoft are also doing the same thing... Tbh it's not insane to me. Big developers who have been around some time and have a reputation are a little more reliable than a small developer who hasn't been through console launches before. So it makes some sense to trust them with information somewhat further down the line than a bigger developer. Why keep it secret? same as games, too much info too soon takes heat off the launch and reduces interest. I think with the internet it isn't stupidly early. Whatever Nintendo release I can guarantee the 1 weaker point would be picked up on and magnified and made to sound bigger than it already is... and for that matter Sony and Microsoft as well. Having control over what goes out to the public can go some way to limiting PR disasters. I mean the X1 had a huge issue about some feature (can't recall what even now). They pulled it, but I think the pr has resulted in the PS4 having an early edge. Anyway.. main point for me is it is STANDARD practice.. even if perhaps not well liked practice.
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