Hero-of-Time Posted May 9, 2016 Posted May 9, 2016 RFN got a little heated this week. James hated Star Fox Zero and Greg loved it. I could really sympathise with James as I also hated the controls and the game wasn't what I wanted from a SF game. I was actually getting annoyed with Greg kind of dismissing James' thoughts about the different vehicles and control schemes. You could tell James was getting annoyed.
peterl0 Posted May 10, 2016 Posted May 10, 2016 Greg was also in one of those moods when he doesn't let anyone else speak. James comments were funny though and the whole section did make me laugh.
Hero-of-Time Posted May 10, 2016 Posted May 10, 2016 (edited) Greg was also in one of those moods when he doesn't let anyone else speak. James comments were funny though and the whole section did make me laugh. Yup. It annoys the hell out of me when he gets like that. His voice is already irritating enough without him butting in every 5 seconds. Speaking of irritating voices, Huber is really doing my head in on the EA podcast. Last week was great due to him not being on it but this week he was back. The guy takes ages to get a sentence out and always over does it. He ruins what is otherwise a very good podcast. It reminds me of the Ross/Russ scene in Friends when Ross kicks off about how long it takes for Russ to get a sentence out. Edited May 10, 2016 by Hero-of-Time
nekunando Posted May 10, 2016 Posted May 10, 2016 Speaking of irritating voices, Hubert is really doing my head in on the EA podcast. Last week was great due to him not being on it but this week he was back. The guy takes ages to get a sentence out and always over does it. He ruins what is otherwise a very good podcast. I actually really like Huber being on the podcast and love the bets they come up with I don't tend to watch his individual material but some of the banter he is involved with in the podcast certainly makes me laugh
Londragon Posted May 11, 2016 Posted May 11, 2016 RFN got a little heated this week. James hated Star Fox Zero and Greg loved it. I could really sympathise with James as I also hated the controls and the game wasn't what I wanted from a SF game. I was actually getting annoyed with Greg kind of dismissing James' thoughts about the different vehicles and control schemes. You could tell James was getting annoyed. Greg did talk too much, but all James had to say was the controls were shite with the walker, etc. And did nothing to counter Greg's points of precision shooting, etc, except to say I don't want Star Fox like this (he wants a corridor shooter 100% of the time, and this is not that game, so why did he get it??). I agreed with Greg on mostly every point. It took a full 2 hours to learn, and then flipping in between the walker and Arwing to take down enemies is amazingly accurate, speedy and responsive. 2 hours to learn, 30 to master. James was getting annoyed, but it was because nobody was backing up his limited, this game controls shite lingo. As John so oft says "Get Gud". I think that's the first time James annoyed me more than Greg.
Hero-of-Time Posted May 11, 2016 Posted May 11, 2016 Greg did talk too much, but all James had to say was the controls were shite with the walker, etc. And did nothing to counter Greg's points of precision shooting, etc, except to say I don't want Star Fox like this (he wants a corridor shooter 100% of the time, and this is not that game, so why did he get it??). I agreed with Greg on mostly every point. It took a full 2 hours to learn, and then flipping in between the walker and Arwing to take down enemies is amazingly accurate, speedy and responsive. 2 hours to learn, 30 to master. James was getting annoyed, but it was because nobody was backing up his limited, this game controls shite lingo. As John so oft says "Get Gud". I think that's the first time James annoyed me more than Greg. Probably because most reviews/previews didn't even mention this. A lot of them were so focused on the control scheme that everything else got left by the wayside. The "Git Gud" mentality doesn't really work for this scenario. If a player is wrestling with the control scheme then it doesn't matter how good a gamer you are, you simply aren't going to enjoy the experience. Having to spend 2 hours to sit and get used to a control scheme is crazy. This is coming from a company who last gen gave us the wiimote and wanted to simplify controls as they said they had gotten too complicated for players. I also didn't care for how Greg essentially baited James when they started talking about Rogue Squadron and how it would be amazing if they put the so called awesome SF controls in that game. The fact that these conversations are happening in regards to the control setup just shows how nuts they are. I'm left wondering about those who have sat for hours upon hours getting used to them if they simply did so because they have nothing else to play or was it due to it being a Star Fox game? Had this been a random 3rd party title I doubt half as many people would have stuck with the game or even defending such a control scheme. I also didn't agree with what Gui said about games needing to evolve and grow. A cracking example of this is the recent release of Ratchet and Clank. Those games have played pretty much the same ever since the first game. What they do is mix up the weapons you get to use, planets you get to visit and they tell a different story. The gameplay remains largely the same. The game has been on top of the UK charts for the past few weeks ( while SF has already disappeared), has apparently sold very well in the US and achieved this by perfecting what it was good at doing in the first place. Ultimately, this is a conversation that neither side will win. There doesn't really seem to be any middle ground for Star Fox and it looks as though you either love it or hate it. I'm certainly in the latter camp and i'm sad to once again leave disappointed with a Star Fox game when, like James, all I really want is for them to pull a Ratchet and Clank and expand and perfect on what Starwing and Lylat Wars started all those years ago.
Londragon Posted May 11, 2016 Posted May 11, 2016 The "Git Gud" mentality doesn't really work for this scenario. If a player is wrestling with the control scheme then it doesn't matter how good a gamer you are, you simply aren't going to enjoy the experience. Having to spend 2 hours to sit and get used to a control scheme is crazy. This is coming from a company who last gen gave us the wiimote and wanted to simplify controls as they said they had gotten too complicated for players. I also didn't agree with what Gui said about games needing to evolve and grow. Ultimately, this is a conversation that neither side will win. I really do think the Git Gud mentality does stick with this, my 9 year old son picked it up, and through the steep learning curve is now racking up higher totals than me on some levels. I really think you have to surrender to the controls and don't fight them. Practice does make perfect on this. If you come at it with a negative mentality than you'll just fight the control scheme, want old Star Fox and claim the game is broken. Which my son can attest to is not. I really don't think the Git Gud mentality applies to games that are artificially difficult to the point of frustration, this isn't. Spending 2 hours to learn a game is nothing new. After 40 hours of Xenoblade X I was still learning new things, sub menus etc. Yes that's not a control scheme, but it's still a learning curve that has to be overcome. And didn't lots of people shout about the Wiimote's over-simplicity and want more hardcore controls. This is as hardcore as they come. No games don't need to evolve and grow just for the sake of it, but I don't want to play the same game over and over again. I haven't played a 2D Mario since Super Mario World, and probably never will again. Neither side will win this argument, but it's not really an argument just an exchange of viewpoints, marmite as hell Star Fox. I also think it comes to down how much people value the GamePad and how they see its uses. Those who detest it seem to conclude that Star Fox is borked, and vice versa.
Hero-of-Time Posted May 16, 2016 Posted May 16, 2016 People were asking James why there wasn't much talk about the Nintendo news over the past couple of episodes of RFN. His response was this. It's a fair question. I think we had room to be more bombastic than we were, and I'm okay with that. To be clear, this is disappointing. The silence is deafening right now, even if its justifiable by internal forces that are hidden from us. At the same time, we all had some time to digest the news, which helped remove some of the bile. We weren't reacting emotionally anymore, and it was more analytical. I think some of it is resignation, which is depressing and I think we desired to move beyond that feeling. Last week's email reaction is something we don't normally do - we tend to go after questions rather than comments. However, the inbox showed our listeners had a lot to say; and we only got through about half of the emails I wanted to include. Some of how depressing this is for me, and my desire to not cover it directly, it is pure selfishness: at this point I need to come up with content for a weekly podcast for the next 10 months. It's not like this impacts anyone but me, but I'm legit worried about what to do with the show. That last part is a bit worrying and understandably so. I mean, if there's no news to report, especially during E3, then a lot of Nintendo sites are really going to suffer. When one of the Nintendo magazines ( can't remember which one ) closed its doors a few years back they mentioned something similar to the situation most Nintendo sites are facing now. They simply didn't have enough content to warrant putting out a magazine and Nintendo weren't very forth coming with games that were on their way, so nothing could really be wrote. Granted, the magazine business was always going to go the way of the dodo, but this year will be especially challenging for Nintendo internet sites and podcast hosts.
Hero-of-Time Posted May 17, 2016 Posted May 17, 2016 Cracking bit of Pokemon banter from the Easy Allies guys this week. They were spot on with the crack and it was pretty much what a lot of us on here have been saying for a while. I'm not sure which of the guys said it but when he said that the game is just a business and lacks any kind of passion was so on point. The fact that the series is pretty old now but refuses to change the formula of the 3 starters, kid on an adventure, 8 gyms etc. says it all really.
Retro_Link Posted May 22, 2016 Posted May 22, 2016 Yeah I think Ian brought that up, completely agree. On a related note, I don't know if you guys have been watching Kyle and Brandon's show 'Brandon Plays Pokemon'... but it's glorious! Brandon is playing his first ever Pokémon game having dismissed it all these years. He's playing Pokémon Red. That nostalgia!! Brings it all back. Here's episode 1... they've done 3 so far.
Hero-of-Time Posted June 7, 2016 Posted June 7, 2016 The NX siren that RFN are now using is absolutely hilarious. Every time it goes off I find myself laughing away. I didn't care too much for this weeks episode, but that was mainly due to it being a Retro Active about a game I have never played and was never fussed about. I'm looking forward to hearing their thoughts about Zelda Wii U next week.
Hero-of-Time Posted July 5, 2016 Posted July 5, 2016 I've been looking at what Retronauts have been discussing lately and seen they had a Resident Evil episode. They go through the first 3 games and talk about the inspiration behind them and how they influenced the industry. HERE @Aneres11 it's well worth a listen. I've also just finished listening to this weeks RFN. Man, poor Jon. Nintendo really need to sort out their account system to stop stuff like that happening. The thing is an absolute joke and really should have been sorted this generation with the 3DS and Wii U.
Hero-of-Time Posted July 5, 2016 Posted July 5, 2016 I've been looking at what Retronauts have been discussing lately and seen they had a Resident Evil episode. They go through the first 3 games and talk about the inspiration behind them and how they influenced the industry. HERE @Aneres11 it's well worth a listen. I've also just finished listening to this weeks RFN. Man, poor Jon. Nintendo really need to sort out their account system to stop stuff like that happening. The thing is an absolute joke and really should have been sorted this generation with the 3DS and Wii U.
Hero-of-Time Posted August 16, 2016 Posted August 16, 2016 Great to hear Dr Metts back on RFN, even if it was just a special appearance. I've missed his opinions about Nintendo and gaming in general. When they were talking about E3, the point about Nintendo's showing was so true. Zelda has been revealed at past E3's and has always shone, despite it being on show with other Nintendo games. All it done at this years E3 was highlight just how empty Nintendo release schedule really is. Jonny hit the nail on the head. I missed not having the NX siren playing this week.
Goron_3 Posted August 16, 2016 Author Posted August 16, 2016 Great to hear Dr Metts back on RFN, even if it was just a special appearance. I've missed his opinions about Nintendo and gaming in general. When they were talking about E3, the point about Nintendo's showing was so true. Zelda has been revealed at past E3's and has always shone, despite it being on show with other Nintendo games. All it done at this years E3 was highlight just how empty Nintendo release schedule really is. Jonny hit the nail on the head. I missed not having the NX siren playing this week. Such a great episode. Really love having Metts back - his voice is literally perfect for podcasts Funnily enough I actually really liked Greg this week - he wasn't super annoying. Probably my favourite episode in a while and I'll be checking out the other podcast that Jonny features on as I miss hearing him talk about video games.
Hero-of-Time Posted August 16, 2016 Posted August 16, 2016 Such a great episode. Really love having Metts back - his voice is literally perfect for podcasts Funnily enough I actually really liked Greg this week - he wasn't super annoying. Probably my favourite episode in a while and I'll be checking out the other podcast that Jonny features on as I miss hearing him talk about video games. Haha. I thought exactly the same thing.
Goron_3 Posted August 16, 2016 Author Posted August 16, 2016 Haha. I thought exactly the same thing. If I'm honest, I do think that the podcast has been pretty average for a while but a lot of this is down to the fact that there is simply nothing to play or get excited about
dazzybee Posted August 17, 2016 Posted August 17, 2016 I've stopped listening to it now. Though tempted to listen to the last one now Found another podcast which I think is pretty good, called 'If We Ran Nintendo' and it talks thorough different topics about what they would do - fix Mario, launch nx, with amiibo etc. Nice concept and the kinds of discussions we have on here. Really like it.
dazzybee Posted August 20, 2016 Posted August 20, 2016 @Hero\-of\-Time and @londragon don't know if you saw it. But the podcast above I think you may like!
Hero-of-Time Posted August 26, 2016 Posted August 26, 2016 Hero-of-Time and londragon don't know if you saw it. But the podcast above I think you may like! I listened to their latest episode yesterday and thought it was alright until the main guy started spouting absolute rubbish when speaking about Rare. I agreed with the guy who said that letting them go was one of Nintendo's biggest mistakes but when the other guy started underplaying their importance I was getting pretty mad. Microsoft as a whole didn't think they owned Donkey Kong, it was a single guy, which is what the other host was trying to tell him. The current generation of ‘enablers’ won’t even know they own the IP… Here’s a true story.. When Rare was first bought by MS a group of execs came on a tour.. One of them noticed the Donkey Kong. ..Posters everywhere and said.. ‘Hey that’s great.. We own Donkey Kong right??’ The guy started waffling on saying that Rare needed baby sitting and that their output wasn't enough. Rare pretty much kept the N64 running! Not only that but they created some new IPs in that generation, with Jet Force Gemini, Perfect Dark, Conker's Bad Fur Day, Banjo Kazooie and Blast Corps. He then went on to say that you just had to look at Rare's output for Microsoft to see that they weren't worth the money. Again, not true. Viva Pinata, Kameo, Kinect Sports, Nuts & Bolts were all great games that had that Rare charm. It's also been reported numerous times that a lot of Rare's creativity was held back by Microsoft, with various projects being cancelled. The talk of Microsoft swooping in at the last minute with a bag of cash to outbid Nintendo is also garbage. As far as i'm aware, Nintendo had first dibs of buying out Rare but simply didn't want to. At that point Rare started to look elsewhere for the sale. There was no bidding war going on. Nintendo, for whatever reason, just weren't interested in paying the asking price for the remaining shares. The final straw was when he said that Retro were the new Rare and far more valuable. Give over. You wanna talk about needing baby sitting, just look at the mess that studio and Metroid was in until Nintendo sent people over to sort it all out. Retro's output has been far worse than Rare's, in quantity, quality and variety.
Rummy Posted August 26, 2016 Posted August 26, 2016 I haven't listened to the podcast but I do think Nintendo were right to sell Rare, given the turn of events since. I'm also aware of a lot of the stuff you mentioned, compared to what people tend to generally believe. Rare had already lost key members before the sale, and it seemed as if they might lose more after - what's the point buying a studio just for its name alone if all the talent's jumping ship? Obvs as you say some of the charm remained but their output wasn't quite the same after(Viva Pinata was a great IP tho, enjoyed it for a little while at least). Definitely agree they certainly didn't need babysitting either, as you've said Rare pretty much held up the N64 alongside Nintendo - I'd say they're one of the reasons the console saw the success it did - that's why I'm quite excited for Playtonic now.
Hero-of-Time Posted August 26, 2016 Posted August 26, 2016 (edited) I haven't listened to the podcast but I do think Nintendo were right to sell Rare, given the turn of events since. I'm also aware of a lot of the stuff you mentioned, compared to what people tend to generally believe. Rare had already lost key members before the sale, and it seemed as if they might lose more after - what's the point buying a studio just for its name alone if all the talent's jumping ship? Obvs as you say some of the charm remained but their output wasn't quite the same after(Viva Pinata was a great IP tho, enjoyed it for a little while at least). Definitely agree they certainly didn't need babysitting either, as you've said Rare pretty much held up the N64 alongside Nintendo - I'd say they're one of the reasons the console saw the success it did - that's why I'm quite excited for Playtonic now. The few staff members who left to form Free Radical were the ones that had experience with the shooters they made. I'm not sure how influential they were in other projects. The other key staff were still kicking around until Microsoft came in. A lot those left due to how unhappy they felt about the changes being made in the workplace. Outside of the Free Radical group, I imagine the others that left would have stayed on board had Nintendo bought the company. A complaint about Nintendo in recent times has been the lack of new IPs. Rare could have brought these to the table, as well as using the already established franchises that they had created. Nintendo could have also expanded their VC lineup with the games that Rare had made in the past. Edited August 26, 2016 by Hero-of-Time
Rummy Posted August 26, 2016 Posted August 26, 2016 Whole-heartedly agree that Rare could have brought those to the table - but only in the form they were before the decision forthat transaction(which I guess, is obvious in itself). The Stampers looked like they wanted out; they asked Ninty for a price that they weren't prepared to pay and then it ended up with Microsoft and Ninty selling their ends for a nice cash injection. I do think it would have been good for them to try and keep Rare, but not at literally any cost. There's opportunity costs in everything and who knows, maybe it could have been the best thing they ever did had they taken Rare when the offer was there - but I still stand by that having seen the results since they haven't had to face the potentially stiff competition they would have from Rare otherwise. I do, in someways, believe Nintendo and Rare were a strangely beautiful synergy that was based on a legacy and time, one that wouldn't have been fully respected by anyone new coming in. It's a grand shame, but I honestly sometimes wonder whether Rare could have been any better than they were, as they were, with Nintendo back in the N64 days. It's almost the perfect formula - any change was bound to mess it up.
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