Ramar Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 I've been and voted. It was hard deciding which councillor to go for, none of them have campaigned as far as I'm aware. I knew which party I wanted to go with, but they had multiple candidates. No idea, just put a X in a random box. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rummy Posted May 5, 2011 Author Share Posted May 5, 2011 Of course I vote, I voted Lib Dem last time, at a national level, and Labour locally as she's a good MP and has helped me personally with some things. I thought the Lib Dems stood a chance that time, as they were ahead in all the polls, and they were the less of three evils. Fat lot of good that did. The good it did is it has brought about this oppurtunity to change the system to AV. That wouldn't have happened without you voting for Lib Dems, without them getting some power, and it paves the way for a future where they government in place could be your choice of government. Look at Moogle's example of people winning constintuencies on less than a 30% share of the votes! 70% of people who did not want them, but got them! Ridiculous, and why I'll be voting AV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheikah Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 The good it did is it has brought about this oppurtunity to change the system to AV. That wouldn't have happened without you voting for Lib Dems, without them getting some power, and it paves the way for a future where they government in place could be your choice of government. Look at Moogle's example of people winning constintuencies on less than a 30% share of the votes! 70% of people who did not want them, but got them! Ridiculous, and why I'll be voting AV. Whether it was a 30% share or an 80% that the person wins with, they still had more people vote for them who actually wanted them to win than any other party. Not like if they gave a half shit about them but their vote still went to them. AV realistically would mean that the few people who vote for small parties first and bigger parties lower down would just have their votes allocated to one of the bigger parties. There's also no real way of quantifying how much someone really does like their number two candidate; should their first choice be knocked out, their second choice they might not like much at all (yet marginally more than another party, hence them specifying it as number 2) yet their vote now counts for the same value as a person who's first vote was counted. Don't vote for this silly system. Hopefully No will win out, AV is not the system we should change to (try proportional representation). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supergrunch Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Whether it was a 30% share or an 80% that the person wins with, they still had more people vote for them who actually wanted them to win than any other party. Not like if they gave a half shit about them but their vote still went to them. AV realistically would mean that the few people who vote for small parties first and bigger parties lower down would just have their votes allocated to one of the bigger parties. There's also no real way of quantifying how much someone really does like their number two candidate; should their first choice be knocked out, their second choice they might not like much at all (yet marginally more than another party, hence them specifying it as number 2) yet their vote now counts for the same value as a person who's first vote was counted. Don't vote for this silly system. Hopefully No will win out, AV is not the system we should change to (try proportional representation). You're right that it's not as good as a proportional system, but I'm fairly convinced it's an improvement over FPTP. Firstly, the idea is that it encourages a lot more people to vote for smaller parties, and secondly, if you don't want your second preference to end up being your vote, you don't have to put a second preference. And as all the votes are pooled into the top two choices, AV makes safe seats much less likely, which brings us closer (but by no means all the way) to proportional representation, or at least makes it easier for smaller parties to get seats. The FPTP system only really works with a two party system, which is why having it has imposed a two party system today. Finally, from a more pragmatic perspective, if the outcome of the referendum is no, then it will likely be used to justify keeping FPTP and blocking out any electoral reform, whether proportional or otherwise. Anyway, I voted a couple of hours ago. Yes for referendum, and the Labour councillor (based on the short manifestos of the four candidates). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EEVILMURRAY Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 In all honesty, I think AV would have handed Labour the last election. There was a lot of people (myself included) who guiltily voted Lib Dem knowing fine well it would pave the way for the Tories to take the seat. Under AV I'd have put Labour as my second choice and my vote would have transferred to them. Wouldn't it only get transferred if Lib Dems had the lowest number of votes at the end of the "round" and were thus eliminated? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supergrunch Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Wouldn't it only get transferred if Lib Dems had the lowest number of votes at the end of the "round" and were thus eliminated? Yes. Which could well have been the case in his constituency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbob Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Just returned from voting Couldn't decide on the councillor, because none of them campaigned around the area. Couldn't decide properly on the Assembly party because none of them partook in campaigning. It was basically a "pick one at random" situation i had. The AV was simpler, i voted yes on it. Because if the Yes campaign is what it says, these councillors and candidates will have to campaign harder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EEVILMURRAY Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Yes. Which could well have been the case in his constituency. Capital! Just returned from voting also. They wanted me to vote for two different people already... It's already started! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rummy Posted May 5, 2011 Author Share Posted May 5, 2011 Wouldn't it only get transferred if Lib Dems had the lowest number of votes at the end of the "round" and were thus eliminated? This seems of implies there's just one round and thus it makes no difference if they aren't last first off. In a constintuency like Moogle's, I think it could make a lot of diffrence having AV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoogleViper Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 In a constintuency like Moogle's, I think it could make a lot of diffrence having AV. Actually in mine probably not. I can't say whether people would vote differently (I doubt it though), but the MP got more than 50% so would be voted in in both AV and FPTP. Unless you meant the example I gave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McPhee Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Wouldn't it only get transferred if Lib Dems had the lowest number of votes at the end of the "round" and were thus eliminated? The Lib Dem would have been eliminated third (most likely, though she might have been one of the final two if she picked up all of the votes from the already eliminated candidates, there wasn't much between her and the Labour bloke). At this point the 2nd choices of those Lib Dem voters would have been looked at to determine who won out of the Tory MP (who has held the seat for almost 25 years off of around 40% of the vote each time) and the Labour candidate. I suspect we'd have a new MP under AV, the chances of a significant number of Lib Dem voters even bothering to rank a Tory candidate are slim to none (which from what I gather is a major reason why Ed Miliband is in favour of AV, his party will gain seats from the Tories because most people who don't currently vote Tory would rank them behind Labour on their ballot sheet). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoogleViper Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 (edited) I've put a fiver on YES to win on betfair. 32/1 for YES (1.03 for NO) isn't looking great. EDIT: I put a tenner on in the end. Edited May 5, 2011 by MoogleViper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McPhee Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 (edited) I think I'll do the same. Those odds are ridiculous! Is anyone else THAT certain that 'No' will be the answer? EDIT: Even better, use the code 'bet789' and your first bet is insured up to £25. If the result is 'No' they credit your account with the value of your bet Edited May 5, 2011 by McPhee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoogleViper Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 There's another reason why you should all vote YES. It'll help me win £300. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReZourceman Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 (edited) Where is the page for it on betfair bleds? Oh found it. Lawl, cheers Moogle. I popped £5 on YES, and £5 into casino, roullette, just quit out at £21. Edited May 5, 2011 by ReZourceman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McPhee Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Low turnout at my polling station, we're talking dozens rather than hundreds of people this year. I abstained from voting in the local council elections, I've heard nothing of/from the candidates so it'd be unfair of me to vote on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowan Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Yup I put a couple of quid too on Betfair, really surprised at the odds. How can people be so sure that No is going to win? Oh and I voted Yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debug Mode Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Yup I put a couple of quid too on Betfair, really surprised at the odds. How can people be so sure that No is going to win? Oh and I voted Yes Probably because of the incredible bullshit spread via the 'Say no to AV' campaign. Off to vote now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReZourceman Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Is it likely that Conservative/Labour voters will vote no? Which system is this vote using? Surely everyone should be forced to use both systems in this instance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shorty Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Stupid question but: can you only vote today? I didn't realise I wasn't registered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LegoMan1031 Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Stupid question but: can you only vote today? I didn't realise I wasn't registered. Yep, only today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmac Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Is it likely that Conservative/Labour voters will vote no? Which system is this vote using? Surely everyone should be forced to use both systems in this instance? well when there is only two choices FPTP works perfectly fine since one side has to get over 50% of the vote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReZourceman Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Ah but some people might not list a second option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diageo Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Shut up ReZ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoogleViper Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Stupid question but: can you only vote today? I didn't realise I wasn't registered. Did you register for last year's general election? I believe you should still be registered (I am). Is it likely that Conservative/Labour voters will vote no? Conservatives are voting no. Labour is yes but they appear to be split. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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