Languages - Do you Triumph or Faiiiil?

[Mike]

You've got to start off learning the 'tourist French' and the usual colours/numbers/pets/café stuff, because it's so simple. You can't exactly start to learn a language with genuine conversational stuff, it's just too complicated, especially if, like most children now, you start at primary school age.

 

Anyway, my degree's in French and German, so I'm fairly fluent in French, though not as fluent as foreigners at the same level get in English! Really can't speak that much German though, as I forgot a lot of it when I spent a year in France. :p

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

Actually a Dutch guy in Nagasaki did tell me that he found it hard to understand me because I spoke "proper" English whereas he was more used to strongly dialectual. Do you have similar things, hearing different accents and such?

Well, I'd certainly say that standard English is much easier to understand than heavily dialectual English for me. I'm not entirely sure what you mean by your question?

 

Reading this thread had made me sad i don't know another language. and I reaallyy want to learn one now.

It's also made me miss my Latin lessons.

Although I failed it terribly, I did find it really interesting, albeit hard :/

Looking at the literature was good too; although I don't think i'll ever be able to get Catullus out of my head. Those romans could be romantic (and dirty) when they wanted to <3

Ah, yes, Catullus. I remember his Passer poem was one of the first original Latin texts we read. Boy, did we not believe the interpretation when we heard it!

[Fierce_LiNk]

You've got to start off learning the 'tourist French' and the usual colours/numbers/pets/café stuff, because it's so simple. You can't exactly start to learn a language with genuine conversational stuff, it's just too complicated, especially if, like most children now, you start at primary school age.

 

Anyway, my degree's in French and German, so I'm fairly fluent in French, though not as fluent as foreigners at the same level get in English! Really can't speak that much German though, as I forgot a lot of it when I spent a year in France. :p

 

I've got no problem with learning some of that stuff, because you are right, it is a place to start off at. Just, I felt that there was so little progression, if any at all. Even at the end of A Level, I didn't particularly think that I had learned a lot at all.

 

That degree does sound pretty awesome. I'd love to be able to do something like that.

[Razz]

I speak Italian fluently and I was almost there with French, but I'm no longer immersed in it. I'm still at a more than competent level though. I understand a lot of spanish but I don't really have a clue how to speak it myself.

 

I tried my hand at Japanese for 7 years, through gcse at school and higher when I was at college, but I really didn't gel with it. I can't get my head around it at all.

[Ganepark32]

I was decent enough with languages. French I hated and could never get my head round it but when it came to German, I was really good. I got taught by my school's Rector/Headmaster so it was drilled into use with precision (that does indeed sound wrong for some reason). Anyway, took it up to GCSE and got an A, getting full marks in my oral exam which I was really pleased with. However, it's been like 4 years since then and I haven't used it since. I wasn't exactly fluid in the language but I could speak it well so it's a shame it hasn't been used.

 

I did start teaching myself Portuguese a few years ago and found a website that had audio teaching to help with pronunciation but because I was doing it in my spare time, I never really got stuck in which is a shame as I would have liked to have learned more so maybe I'll go back and start learning again.

 

And to answer Ashley's question, I do think there is a bit of complacency in the British educational system when it comes to a second language with it now being more frequent for those in school to not be taking one when it can be very beneficial. I was taught French and German from the early ages of my schooling but I was at a private school and so it was compulsary but I do feel that it should be pushed more instead of letting it linger because as I said, it can be very beneficial in the development of a person's mind in terms of understanding the world and cultures around a person.

[Febee]

 

 

Ah, yes, Catullus. I remember his Passer poem was one of the first original Latin texts we read. Boy, did we not believe the interpretation when we heard it!

 

Most of the texts we studied in class were quite tame; but our Latin teacher was an amazing man, and often gave us speeches on lesbians, because of the whole lesbia/lesbos thing, and I remember having a rather interesting conversation with him about Lesbia's "cave" that she invited young men into.

[Fierce_LiNk]

I speak Italian fluently and I was almost there with French, but I'm no longer immersed in it. I'm still at a more than competent level though. I understand a lot of spanish but I don't really have a clue how to speak it myself.

 

I tried my hand at Japanese for 7 years, through gcse at school and higher when I was at college, but I really didn't gel with it. I can't get my head around it at all.

 

That's awesome that you had Japanese as a GCSE option in your school. I've always imagined it as a very tough language, though. Might give it a try one day.

 

Also, I think you mentioned before, but you are part or all Italian? If so, then that is also excellent. It sounds like a beautiful language to speak and hear.

 

I was decent enough with languages. French I hated and could never get my head round it but when it came to German, I was really good. I got taught by my school's Rector/Headmaster so it was drilled into use with precision (that does indeed sound wrong for some reason). Anyway, took it up to GCSE and got an A, getting full marks in my oral exam which I was really pleased with. However, it's been like 4 years since then and I haven't used it since. I wasn't exactly fluid in the language but I could speak it well so it's a shame it hasn't been used.

 

I did start teaching myself Portuguese a few years ago and found a website that had audio teaching to help with pronunciation but because I was doing it in my spare time, I never really got stuck in which is a shame as I would have liked to have learned more so maybe I'll go back and start learning again.

 

And to answer Ashley's question, I do think there is a bit of complacency in the British educational system when it comes to a second language with it now being more frequent for those in school to not be taking one when it can be very beneficial. I was taught French and German from the early ages of my schooling but I was at a private school and so it was compulsary but I do feel that it should be pushed more instead of letting it linger because as I said, it can be very beneficial in the development of a person's mind in terms of understanding the world and cultures around a person.

 

A few of my friends at uni were taught German in school, but we never had that choice. Maybe if we didn't have to learn Welsh, then maybe German would've been an option? Bluddy awesome that you got full marks in your oral exam.

 

I agree with what you said about the educational system in Britain. Although, I think the issue is that most people in the UK will mainly use English as their first language, bar the odd holiday here and there. There's not much pressure on us to learn another language. But, I think it would be a great skill to have, and as you say, it helps you understand the world and cultures that are out there, that surrounds us. Learning the language is a step towards understanding and being a part of that culture.

 

I feel pretty bad when I go to Belgium and hearing all this Dutch around me. I do try and pick things up and I do want to learn it, but it's hard taking it all in. I think I need to pick up some learning materials, like tapes, books, dvds and stuff.

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

Gaius Vallerius Catullus: Lesbia's Sparrow

All you Loves and Cupids cry

and all you men of feeling

my girl’s sparrow is dead,

my girl’s beloved sparrow.

She loved him more than herself.

He was sweeter than honey, and he

knew her, as she knows her mother.

He never flew out of her lap,

but, hopping about here and there,

just chirped to his lady, alone.

Now he is flying the dark

no one ever returns from.

Evil to you, evil Shades

of Orcus, destroyers of beauty.

You have stolen the beautiful sparrow from me.

Oh sad day! Oh poor little sparrow!

Because of you my sweet girl’s eyes

are red with weeping, and swollen.

Sweet and romantic, isn't it? The sparrow symbolising his unrequited love for his dear Lesbia.

 

Except the sparrow isn't a symbol of his love. It's a symbol of his friggin' penis. The point of the poem? He's gone impotent. But try reading some of those lines again with that symbolism in mente. That's hardcore porn material right there.

[Razz]

That's awesome that you had Japanese as a GCSE option in your school. I've always imagined it as a very tough language, though. Might give it a try one day.

 

Also, I think you mentioned before, but you are part or all Italian? If so, then that is also excellent. It sounds like a beautiful language to speak and hear.

 

Meh to be honest I don't see what all the fuss is about it. I mean don't get me wrong, I have the whole gamer mentality and everything, but I just don't see how it's worth all the hassle! /rant.

 

It was a breath of fresh air from all the usual Spanish and German though, so I guess you're right there

 

I'm actually half Italian through my dad's side, and my mum's British.

 

____

 

On a side note, can I recommend to those who are learning a language to try playing games in that language? It's really helpful and some of the vocab is quite unusual so it can give you that upper hand.

[Fierce_LiNk]

Meh to be honest I don't see what all the fuss is about it. I mean don't get me wrong, I have the whole gamer mentality and everything, but I just don't see how it's worth all the hassle! /rant.

 

It was a breath of fresh air from all the usual Spanish and German though, so I guess you're right there

 

I'm actually half Italian through my dad's side, and my mum's British.

 

____

 

On a side note, can I recommend to those who are learning a language to try playing games in that language? It's really helpful and some of the vocab is quite unusual so it can give you that upper hand.

 

Haha, I definitely see what you mean. For me though, I think it's a good language to learn because it's non-European, so it's quite different to what we're taught in schools or what other languages/countries are particularly close to us.

 

I do agree about the gamer mentality, especially with so many wanting to visit the Nintendo Motherland. But, it wouldn't really be for that factor why I'd like to give it a try.

 

Ahh, that's a nice mix, heh.

 

When I was younger, I remember I had a few video game manuals which featured more than one language. So, I used to read the English, then look at the French, for example, and try and familiarise myself with it, or match up words.

[Razz]

Haha, I definitely see what you mean. For me though, I think it's a good language to learn because it's non-European, so it's quite different to what we're taught in schools or what other languages/countries are particularly close to us.

 

I do agree about the gamer mentality, especially with so many wanting to visit the Nintendo Motherland. But, it wouldn't really be for that factor why I'd like to give it a try.

 

Ahh, that's a nice mix, heh.

 

When I was younger, I remember I had a few video game manuals which featured more than one language. So, I used to read the English, then look at the French, for example, and try and familiarise myself with it, or match up words.

 

Yeah I think the main reason me and Japanese have a hate-hate relationship is because I refuse to bow down to it's (IMO) silly rules and sentence structure, and that I get frustrated with myself not being able to get it. I do love how it sounds though.

 

Also talking of languages, when I was younger I had a little Ancient Egypt obsession, and tried learning hieroglyphs. It was hard but fun, I remember going to the British Museum and recognising a few glyphs and getting all excited. I might hunt out my old books now I've been reminded of that

[Paj!]

my school's Rector/Headmaster

 

What a dick. He forced me to stay in top-set French despite there obviously being some mistake in me being there the entire year (I cam top the year before in second set cause we had some insane Jamaican woman replace Mrs. Stark, and so no one except me listened), and he made me resit my oral exam in front of the class.

Him: "Comment t'appelle tu?"

Me:... *wtf*

Him: *facepalm* "Just sit down."

 

Obviously I knew how to answer what he said, but I was so used to the other way of asking I just sat there.

 

Anyway.

 

He was a dick.

[Roostophe]

Despite my Brummie drawl/whine and my tendency to speak so fast I sometimes lose track of what I'm saying so it comes out as crap, I've found it rather easy to learn languages.

 

I think I used to be quite good at French, especially in Year 9 when my teacher was from France. He said in my report book that he 'strongly recommend I do French GCSE'. I didn't, though.

It's been over five years now since I last took a French lesson, and I have forgotten most of what I'd learnt. Although the most basic stuff still lingers "Je n'ai pas un petit-dejeuner et stylo." et cetera.

 

At the moment, I'm trying to teach myself Japanese. I'm honestly finding it easy to learn how to speak it. It's just the writing system that's difficult. I sometimes forget what certain characters mean and I have next to no clue about the Kanji save for a few random ones I learnt from playing Shenmue. (e.g - 山 = yama = mountain).

[Emasher]

I just got back from France/Germany today. I realized my french was a little better than I thought it was, I can't really speak it besides a few important words, but I could usually look at things and figure out what they said. I've never learned any German though, so I would have been completely lost if I hadn't been staying with relatives while in Germany.

[Iun]

Languages I can speak to near fluency:

 

French, German, Italian, Chinese, English,

 

Languages I can understand in written or spoken form:

 

Spanish, Dutch, Japanese, Shanghainese (yes it's a different language!), Latin

 

That is all.

Edited September 6, 2009 by Iun

[Rummy]

Caecilius est in horto. Caecilius ist im Garten. Caecilius is in the garden.

 

Those are the three languages I was educated to speak. I suck thoroughly at the first two, though I did kind of like latin its lack of applicability I guess and it's long effortness put me off learning it beyond what was neccessary(though I had a choice between more latin or a year of french in year 9, I chose latinz). We also had a cute teacher who taught us, so that probably helped things along

 

I'd love to know another language, I kind of wish I'd move somewhere whenever I have kids so they learn something else growing up, though that's probably rather unlikely to happen, but I reckon it's one of the best ways to learn another language.

 

As for this supposed superiority of the british system, I dunno, I think the reason alot of non-natives end up learning to speak very good english is because it IS a largely prevelant language and they are more forced and subjected to it. I rarely encounter non-english(and when I do it's generally non-european) language websites in my internet travels, but if the internet was largely german I am sure I'd be better at speaking it. Just like someone who suggested playing a game in another language to help you along and stuff. However, such as our non-uk members on this site, they're forced to speak in english upon it, and exposed to lots of it, so it's kind of better for learning and brushing up their english skillz.

[Beast]

I did French in school and got a C and I still remember what I was taught and I left school five years ago. Then again, that would probably be because I have the 'teach yourself French' game for the DS . I'm not fluent but I can survive a day in France, haha.

 

I would love to try and learn all languages if I'm honest but the one that has most interested me is Japanese. My friend knows how to speak it and it sounds hard to learn. I know a few greetings but that's as far as I go.

 

I think, in the morning, I say 'Ohaiyo Gozaimasu' (can't spell it but it's pronounced a little like that, lmao)

[weeyellowbloke]

I was reading this thread and thinking about how if you don't use a language you lose it. I was just wondering whether non-native English speakers on here, such as Danny, find that posting on a forum in English helps at all. I mean I would imagine it would be like practicing and so it might work in reverse, say if I were to post on a Spanish forum I might pick up a bit. Also the changing the language settings on games sounds like a quality tip, especially with RPG's. I'd imagine FPS's would be less helpful.

 

I can remember some very basic Italian, French and a bit of Spanish from school and holidays. Usually I'm much better at reading in other languages, when speaking my mind goes completely blank and sentence structure goes straight out the window. Also hearing about Latin makes me want to try it out. I've got a copy of Winnie the Pooh downstairs in Latin and I think I'm going to get it.

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

Indeed, I believe that my frequent activity on here helps a lot in improving my English. Surfing the Internet improves my understanding of English, using it actively on a forum improves my ability to express myself in English.

 

I was actually having this talk with a friend of mine on my A levels English team. She reads a lot of books in English and can thus understand English very well, but she isn't on any forums or the like and thus doesn't use English very actively, so her ability to express herself in English is not nearly as good.

[Ellmeister]

Did Spanish up to AS, I shall take it on again when I can. Possibly night classes I don't know.

 

I gave it up because the teacher destroyed my enjoyment of it

[Shorty]

When I started secondary school, I really got into German, I was one of the best in my year, and my best mate who normally competed with me in every subject was in the group below me. But then I moved schools and the German department was terrible, a really crappy class and a teacher that had no control over the students. They only offered foundation level German and at the end of it the best I or anyone else could get was a C. My aforementioned mate from my previous school ended up with an A.... Lame.

 

I took Japanese for two years at Uni and really enjoyed it, but I can feel my knowledge of it slipping away as I don't keep up with my studies. I'd love to learn a second language fluently and I'm good at them, I just don't have the time :/

[Mundi]

Pretty much the same as everyone here, I can easily survive on English but my french is pretty much just good at reading text and listening to others.

 

Then there´s Danish which in my opinion I´m quite decent at and knowing Danish means you pretty much know the basics of Norwegian and Swedish.

Also being a native speaker of Icelandic helps a lot with that too.

 

I dappled in German for a bit but I just couldn´t.

 

Also a pro-tip on those keen on Danish, the best way to speak is to show a potato down your throat.

The same can be used with German, except the potato must be burning hot.

[MoogleViper]

I took French and German up to year 9, and whilst I was really good at both achieving top marks, I never felt like I actually learned the language. More I was learning how to pass exams. But I can't even remember a tenth of what I once knew.

[Shino]

Its all about the exposure you get to the language, I played games in english, watched movies in english and the part of the internet I frequent is mostly english. That and a few years of english at school was enough. You guys simply have no use for other languages most of the time so there's no place for you to practice to reach a high level of proficiency.

 

But still, its always good to know a different language as it not only opens up a larger part of the world to you, it also helps you understand the culture behind said language, the way they talk and write it, or the different expressions and proverbs says a lot of that culture as a whole.

[Wesley]

I'm terrible at languages... after 4 years of being taught French I could say "My name is Wesley" and that I lived in Sleaford... that was all. I think, and I'm not even joking, that I got 1/100 in the final test to see if you should take it as GCSE. There were a few problems with me learning French though.

 

Firstly, I wasn't actually comfortable with my own native language... I struggled a lot until the age of about 14 when I suddenly seemed to be pretty good at it; but, more importantly, started to enjoy it.

 

The second problem came when I improved with English though. In my school your languages lessons were linked. So, if you were in top class for English you were in top class for French, etc. And being terrible at French I was also in a very low class for English; which made me hate French even more. This was especially the case when I finally started with GCSEs, thinking, "Finally, I'll be in a English class I deserve! No longer French will ruin me! Hurrah!" (or something like that). However, they decided not to change the grouping system... so although I scored higher in my English tests than half the class in the top set, I was still kept in the second from bottom set. Man... I hated my school for that.

 

Motherfuckers...