Beijing Olymics 2008

[Cube]

I've just seen the stadium. Quite possibly one of the fugliest things I've ever seen.

[Daft]

Shame we all know London's will be not as good by +4.

 

At least we'll have a clean conscience.

 

China should never have been given the Olympics. They defy everything the Olympics stand for.

[Shino]

I've just seen the stadium. Quite possibly one of the fugliest things I've ever seen.

 

Only now? Don't you watch the news? I rather like the Bird's nest.

[Sparko]

Poor Zambia were overshadowed big time in the opening ceremony, there was about only ten of them. Plus they had to walk in after Australia who had about a hundred people in their group and got a massive reception from the crowd, and then straight after Zambia was China, who again had a huge group and got a huge ovation.

[Shino]

At least we'll have a clean conscience.

 

China should never have been given the Olympics. They defy everything the Olympics stand for.

 

You forget that countries such as Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union already hosted the Olympics. I don't think the Olympics ever stood for freedom of speech.

[chairdriver]

If anything, the Olympics is a good thing to give to China, because they have had to become more "normal" in order to give a good impression to the rest of the world.

[Daft]

You forget that countries such as Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union already hosted the Olympics. I don't think the Olympics ever stood for freedom of speech.

 

Ok, so because something has been abused before it should always be treated like that? Great thinking there.

 

If anything, the Olympics is a good thing to give to China, because they have had to become more "normal" in order to give a good impression to the rest of the world.

 

But they haven't done that. Their atrocious human rights record remains, the mass censorship is still there and the pollution has marginally improved.

[Shino]

Ok, so because something has been abused before it should always be treated like that? Great thinking there.

 

Nobody forced the Olympic committee to choose Nazi Germany, Soviet Union or China. Its quite obvious they don't care much about human rights.

[Cube]

Only now? Don't you watch the news? I rather like the Bird's nest.

 

 

Generally, no. I have links to loads of top stories on my homepage and only read ones that interest me.

 

One thing that always amuses me is when people say "the Olympics brings loads of countries together"

 

They always seem to forget to finish the sentence...it's missing "to compete against each other" at the end.

[rokhed00]

Nobody forced the Olympic committee to choose Nazi Germany, Soviet Union or China. Its quite obvious they don't care much about human rights.

 

If they did they wouldn't have given it to London.

People are being forced out of their own homes because of it.

[Daft]

Nobody forced the Olympic committee to choose Nazi Germany, Soviet Union or China. Its quite obvious they don't care much about human rights.

 

Why does people not caring make it better?

 

Also the Nazi Olympics were in 1936, over 70 years ago. I really would have hoped humanity as a whole would have progressed since them.

 

As for the Soviet Union getting the Olympics, 62 Countries and regions took part in the US led boycott.

 

The goddamn tag line for the Chinese Olympics is:

 

One World, One Dream.

 

If that doesn't cause some vague concern, I don't know what will.

[LazyBoy]

China boy here. I'm not watching the olympics because I think they're boring as all hell, but I wanted to jump in for a bit of defence. Firstly, i'm all for human rights, and I agree the situation now is not acceptable, but people need to understand where China has come from, and how quickly it has done it. Only 50 years ago millions were starving to death every year as a result of a brutal dictatorship, and now in a country of 1.3 billion the majority have jobs and have access to electricity, food, water, heat, things we all take for granted these days. So yeah, they protect themselves politically, but they have to, because that country needs communism, whatever your views on it are. They've come along way, but they're gonna need a bit more time.

 

And beijing isn't as polluted as everyone says it is.

[Shino]

China boy here. I'm not watching the olympics because I think they're boring as all hell, but I wanted to jump in for a bit of defence. Firstly, i'm all for human rights, and I agree the situation now is not acceptable, but people need to understand where China has come from, and how quickly it has done it. Only 50 years ago millions were starving to death every year as a result of a brutal dictatorship, and now in a country of 1.3 billion the majority have jobs and have access to electricity, food, water, heat, things we all take for granted these days. So yeah, they protect themselves politically, but they have to, because that country needs communism, whatever your views on it are. They've come along way, but they're gonna need a bit more time.

 

And beijing isn't as polluted as everyone says it is.

 

That's exactly what I think, China has the system it needs at the moment. Its a big country that's evolving incredibly fast, both economically and culturally, and it need this form of "communism" so it doesn't break apart.

 

However as a Western it makes me apprehensive that we're so forgiving to China's misdeeds. I guess now its to late to tell then anything.

 

And let me tell you that opening was freaking beautiful and scary, the perfect coordination of thousands of Chinese is frightening. Even the camera's were coordinated.

[Mokong]

Back on topic of the games itself,

 

Just finished watching my recording of the opening ceremony and damn did I enjoy that. The start with the drummers, the typewriter thing, the giant globe with people running round it, all amazing to watch. And the bit with the piano and the people wearing yellow which turned white was amazing, watching the over head shot seeing the color change i was like "how the hell did they do that?" till they zoomed back in and saw it was lights on the clothing.

 

Only thing I was disappointed with was I thought there'd be more Kung Fu involved, shame. (was half hoping to see Jackie Chan or Jet Li appear )

 

Even though i had it recorded I didn't forward through the March of Nations, only ones I missed was when RTE took ad breaks, damn them. Still got to see the ones I wanted to, mainly Ireland and the Philippines, though I question how Manny Pacquiao was the Philippines flag bearer when he's not competing... although he could be there as a coach for their one man boxing team, but still I always thought it should be an actual competing athlete.

 

And then the lighting of the cauldron was pretty awesome. When the flame got to the last guy I spotted the wires on him and was thinking "holy hell what have they thought up fr this". It looked awesome and my 2nd fav cauldron lighting (first still has to be Barcenlona 1992 with the bow and arrow, just for the danger aspect of it going wrong had the archer missed and it landed on someone in the crowd)

 

I've always loved my sports and the Olympics to me is the pinnicle of the sporting world. When I was younger I dreamed representing Ireland in the Olympics (i would have done track and field) but due to a few factors such as a lack of skill and lack of athletics programs in the schools i went to and town i lived in I had nowhere to train or try compete in any competions, possibly my biggest lifetime regret.

 

But I still love watching the Olympics and seeing the athletes enter in the opening ceremonies. Can't explain it, gives me a mixed feelings, one of excitement for seeing the various sports over the two weeks and one of "i wish I was there".

To quote John Candy from Cool Runnings "Those guys have earned the right to walk into that stadium and wave their nation's flag. That's the single greatest honor an athlete can ever have. That's what the Olympics are all about."

 

Maybe a bit of a romantic view of the Olympics that I'm sure many will disagree with but that's just how I view it.

[KKOB]

And beijing isn't as polluted as everyone says it is.

 

Are you trying to say the reading the WHO have put out aren't accurate and that the air is of a good quality suitable for athletes?

 

I doubt there'll be much WR breaking in the track and field events as a result of the poorer air quality.

 

China needs to give Tibet back their independence. I can understand them not wanting to go the way of Russia with all their former soviet states splintering all over the place, but i feel Tibet should be an exception.

 

While i'm on the subject, i wish Scotland would just get it's independence from the UK so i can stop hearing some Scottish pillock yabbering about it. The fact is Scotland can't survive on it's own.

 

My question is could Tibet?

[Daft]

China boy here. I'm not watching the olympics because I think they're boring as all hell, but I wanted to jump in for a bit of defence. Firstly, i'm all for human rights, and I agree the situation now is not acceptable, but people need to understand where China has come from, and how quickly it has done it. Only 50 years ago millions were starving to death every year as a result of a brutal dictatorship, and now in a country of 1.3 billion the majority have jobs and have access to electricity, food, water, heat, things we all take for granted these days. So yeah, they protect themselves politically, but they have to, because that country needs communism, whatever your views on it are. They've come along way, but they're gonna need a bit more time.

 

And beijing isn't as polluted as everyone says it is.

 

Yeah, but that doesn't really cut it. China hasn't met the conditions set on being given the games.

 

The Charter of the Olympic Games states that Olympism has as a goal 'to place sport at the service of the harmonious development of humankind, with the objective of creating a peaceful society with the preservation of human dignity'

 

This clearly isn't happening with restricted freedom of speech. The Chinese government often uses it's power to imprison anyone who are critical of them. ( http://www.reuters.com/article/businessNews/idUSPEK10194620080403 ) Along with, as I think I already said, internet censorship. ( http://hrichina.org/public/PDFs/CRF.2.2006/CRF-2006-2_MediaControlChina.pdf )

 

China's treatment of it's migrant laborers is appalling. "Sending up to 50% of their earnings home, migrants play an important role in spreading wealth down to the villages. Yet they are still treated like second-class citizens by a system so discriminatory that it has been likened to apartheid."1

 

You also seem to be ignoring China's treatment of Tibet which goes hand in hand with the restiction on religious freedom they impose. ( China tells living Buddhas to obtain permission before they reincarnate )

 

The we get to the One Child Policy. It contributes to forced abortions, human rights violations, female infanticide, abandonment and sex-selective abortions ( http://edition.cnn.com/WORLD/asiapcf/9806/11/china.abortion/ ) . An this is believed to be commonplace in some parts of the country. ( http://www.voanews.com/english/archive/2005-09/2005-09-26-voa6.cfm?CFID=17626358&CFTOKEN=49646296 ) This has also lead to gender imbalance ( http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2007/jan/24/china.international , http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5953508 ).

 

Capital punishment is still in use (Sorry to quote from wikipedia) :

 

Amnesty International reports state that, in recent years, China has had the highest number of executions of any country. In 2005, it topped the list with 1,770 people executed. Figures from 2006 and 2007 are reported to have been 1,010 and 470 executions, respectively. In January 2007, China's state media announced that all death penalty cases will be reviewed by the Supreme People's Court. Since 1983, China's highest court did not review all cases. This marks a return to China's pre-1983 policy. In light of these changes, figures from 2007 display a substantial reduction in executions with only 470 reported executions compared with figures from previous years. However, Amnesty International analysts argue that this drop is only temporary since the figure includes only confirmed executions

 

I could go on and on, I probably will tomorrow, but I'm tired. Conditions are unacceptable in China and there is no way to justify the Olympics being there.

 

Saying they have "a bit more to go" in terms of basic human respect is the understatement of the century.

 

1 - Macleod, Calum and Macleod, Lijia China's migrants bear brunt of bias, The Washington Times, July 14, 2000.

 

EDIT: And another one I forgot, China is a supporter of the Sudanese government which is responsible for genocide in Darfur.

 

HOW anyone can say it's alright for the olympics to be held there need to have their head checked.

[Charlie]

How about we create a "Beijing Olymics 2008 Controversies" thread for people who don't actually want to talk about sport?

 

Franklin, I completely agree with you, there's something about seeing all the countries come out which is really special. Really looking forward to the next few weeks to see sports I'd never normally watch and then being able to cheer on our lads.

 

Going to get up early tomorrow morning to watch some of the swimming I think, then up all night on Saturday night for tennis, all night Sunday for badminton and then Daley doing his diving in the morning.

[Indigo]

If anything, the Olympics is a good thing to give to China, because they have had to become more "normal" in order to give a good impression to the rest of the world.

The ironic thing is that it seems to have achieved the reverse, unleashing all China's authoritarian tendencies. Just look at the security operation and how quickly protest is being stamped out. Then in the press areas foreign journalists can't even access certain websites because of the government censorship. It's also been made known that Chinese intelligence services are using the opportunity these games present (ie. the concentration of foreign government officials in Beijing) to attempt to steal any information they can.

 

It's just bullshit, the whole thing.

[flameboy]

I've just seen the stadium. Quite possibly one of the fugliest things I've ever seen.

 

The designers of that stadium, only design one stadium per country and for little old England its going to be Portsmouth's new stadium

 

Anyway just watched some Judo a German woman beat an Algerian 101-0 then the next match was only 10-1...curious!

[LazyBoy]

Damn, should've kept my mouth shut. Ah well.

 

Are you trying to say the reading the WHO have put out aren't accurate and that the air is of a good quality suitable for athletes?

 

I doubt there'll be much WR breaking in the track and field events as a result of the poorer air quality.

 

I'm saying that Beijing isn't the smog infested cesspool that the western media says it is. It's not any worse that London in my eyes.

 

China needs to give Tibet back their independence. I can understand them not wanting to go the way of Russia with all their former soviet states splintering all over the place, but i feel Tibet should be an exception.

 

Why? China's claim to occupation to Tibet is more valid than the Uks control of the Falklands but you don't here anyone yelling about that. My problem with Tibet is the religious freedom, but Tibet is far better under the Chinese government than it was under the Tibetan theocracy (education, no serfdom, freedom to marriage). Yeah, Buddhism fares worth, but between a fairy tale and education, i'd pick education.

 

Yeah, but that doesn't really cut it. China hasn't met the conditions set on being given the games.

 

 

 

This clearly isn't happening with restricted freedom of speech. The Chinese government often uses it's power to imprison anyone who are critical of them. ( http://www.reuters.com/article/businessNews/idUSPEK10194620080403 ) Along with, as I think I already said, internet censorship. ( http://hrichina.org/public/PDFs/CRF.2.2006/CRF-2006-2_MediaControlChina.pdf )

 

I agree, that needs to get better, but compared to what it was like 20 years ago (random groundless torture to create false claims of treason) they've made progress. It can't happen all at once.

 

China's treatment of it's migrant laborers is appalling. "Sending up to 50% of their earnings home, migrants play an important role in spreading wealth down to the villages. Yet they are still treated like second-class citizens by a system so discriminatory that it has been likened to apartheid."1

 

I have friends who are these migrant labourers you talk of. When I ask them if they have a hard life, they say 'yeah, but I can feed my family now, which is better than it used to be'.

 

You also seem to be ignoring China's treatment of Tibet which goes hand in hand with the restiction on religious freedom they impose. ( China tells living Buddhas to obtain permission before they reincarnate )

 

Covered above

 

The we get to the One Child Policy. It contributes to forced abortions, human rights violations, female infanticide, abandonment and sex-selective abortions ( http://edition.cnn.com/WORLD/asiapcf/9806/11/china.abortion/ ) . An this is believed to be commonplace in some parts of the country. ( http://www.voanews.com/english/archive/2005-09/2005-09-26-voa6.cfm?CFID=17626358&CFTOKEN=49646296 ) This has also lead to gender imbalance ( http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2007/jan/24/china.international , http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5953508 ).

 

Not only is the one child police completely necessary, it should be implemented elsewhere. Over-population is a far bigger threat to our world than global warming or dwindling oil reserves, with recent increases in food prices being prime example (though that being only half reason). The amount of countries that are under-populated in the world doesn't make it into double figures.

 

Capital punishment is still in use (Sorry to quote from wikipedia) :

 

People in China support capital punishment, just like the majority in the USA do.

 

I could go on and on, I probably will tomorrow, but I'm tired. Conditions are unacceptable in China and there is no way to justify the Olympics being there.

 

Saying they have "a bit more to go" in terms of basic human respect is the understatement of the century.

 

1 - Macleod, Calum and Macleod, Lijia China's migrants bear brunt of bias, The Washington Times, July 14, 2000.

 

EDIT: And another one I forgot, China is a supporter of the Sudanese government which is responsible for genocide in Darfur.

 

Yeah awful, but no worse than Britain or the states or anyone else throughout history.

 

The ironic thing is that it seems to have achieved the reverse, unleashing all China's authoritarian tendencies. Just look at the security operation and how quickly protest is being stamped out. Then in the press areas foreign journalists can't even access certain websites because of the government censorship.

 

I actually agree with this point.

 

It's also been made known that Chinese intelligence services are using the opportunity these games present (ie. the concentration of foreign government officials in Beijing) to attempt to steal any information they can.

 

It's just bullshit, the whole thing.

 

Yeah everyone is doing that. You don't think MI6 and the CIA are spying on China?

[Dan_Dare]

FYI, if anyone's missed it so far the BBC site is running a multi channel stream + live text commentary for just about everything. Good shit.

[Falcon_BlizZACK]

...Some of you just seem severely paranoid towards China, but what has China done to YOU?

[Dan_Dare]

alot of good, personally.

 

Who saw the men's Gymnastics? Bloody amazing stuff. Just the peak of physical ability if you ask me.

[KKOB]

FYI, if anyone's missed it so far the BBC site is running a multi channel stream + live text commentary for just about everything. Good shit.

 

I love the BBC. And people bitch and moan about having to pay a license fee when we get quality stuff like this.

[Dan_Dare]

Ace, innit. Top quality coverage all day, whatever you're in to. Love it