The Legend of Zelda:Twilight Princess

[dazzybee]

Eh? Why not? The longer the better. Makes my car journey more enjoyable.

 

It's crazy, isn't it? Where the hell has all the time gone.

 

I listen to about 20 podcasts If it was general chat it'd be good, but just about twilight princess...??! Is it really good then?

[Londragon]

They talk about the usual New Business as well, but most of it is about Twilight Princess. However, they bring up some nice discussion points that I would have never thought to talk about.

[Fierce_LiNk]

I set up my GameCube again and took Twilight Princess for a spin (ie. ride round the overworld, not play the full game).

 

Whatever the intricacies of it, it's certainly a game set up with the right intentions - in particular, riding through the fields, towards and across the huge bridges (Eldin/Lake Hylia) as the GameCube controller rumbles in your hands.

 

It has, however, convinced me even more that the next time we see this game it should be in glorious HD.

 

I loved the scope of the game at the time. To me, it did a lot of things right, but there are definite areas for improvement.

 

The one area that I will argue to the death where it excelled was in terms of its dungeon design and bosses. It contains the best of both of these in the entire series. I was just speaking about it yesterday, but it wasn't until I was halfway through the Arbiter's Grounds that I realised it was a dungeon. Same with Snowpeak Ruins. They both redefined what a "dungeon" was. I'm hoping that this gets explored further in the future, because there's huge potential there to be make an interesting game.

 

Finally, it introduced us to probably my favourite Zelda companion: Midna. That twist at the end with the tear. I've got something in my eye, brah.

[Ronnie]

^ Great post.

 

I was a huge critic of Twilight Princess as and after I played it, but looking back it did some things outstandingly well, dungeons and bosses especially.

 

Also the ambiance and mood of the Hyrule Castle dungeon at the end of the game was so well done. It was just so eerie. Then four great boss fights to cap it off and a bittersweet ending. Really great stuff.

Edited June 7, 2015 by Ronnie

[Fierce_LiNk]

^ Great post.

 

I was a huge critic of Twilight Princess as and after I played it, but looking back it did some things outstandingly well, dungeons and bosses especially.

 

Also the ambiance and mood of the Hyrule Castle dungeon at the end of the game was so well done. It was just so eerie. Then four great boss fights to cap it off and a bittersweet ending. Really great stuff.

 

I think it nailed the atmosphere really well and in the right places. I loved that whole section with this music:

 

	Audio

 

The soundtrack was another strength. It contained samples or links with the previous games, but it managed to make it special in itself. It's a really good soundtrack, perhaps only surpassed by Xenoblade on a Nintendo console.

 

It's a good title that compliments something like the Wind Waker well. You don't want two identical games and they're anything but the same, definitely in terms of style and visuals.

 

I'd rather play this game in HD form on the WiiU than have it condensed on the 3DS. I can't see this particular type of game looking good on a handheld and I think Nintendo fans deserve to see it in HD.

[Goron_3]

All of the hosts of Radio Free Nintendo, as well as the forum/website community, voted to play through this game over the past couple of months. This event has now finished and on this weeks podcast episode they discuss the highs and lows of this entry of the series.

 

It was a great episode and I now have the urge to play through the game again. @Goron_3 & @dazzybee, have you guys listened to it yet?

 

I somehow listened to the whole thing in ONE sitting. It was brilliant and it gave me an itch to play the game again, but...

 

I loved the scope of the game at the time. To me, it did a lot of things right, but there are definite areas for improvement.

 

The one area that I will argue to the death where it excelled was in terms of its dungeon design and bosses. It contains the best of both of these in the entire series. I was just speaking about it yesterday, but it wasn't until I was halfway through the Arbiter's Grounds that I realised it was a dungeon. Same with Snowpeak Ruins. They both redefined what a "dungeon" was. I'm hoping that this gets explored further in the future, because there's huge potential there to be make an interesting game.

 

Finally, it introduced us to probably my favourite Zelda companion: Midna. That twist at the end with the tear. I've got something in my eye, brah.

 

Agreed. Twilight Princess has INCREDIBLE dungeons by far the best bosses (apart from the water boss who doesn't have any attacks apparently). What let the game down imo was:

 

1. The wolf sections started off well but ran out of steam fairly early on. You can tell it was shoe-horned in a bit (I believe Aunoma had the idea when he was brought in to help the troubled development).

 

2. The areas outside of dungeons were mixed. The world was completely empty and some of the villages were poor. I also thought the atmosphere was pretty poor - The world was supposed to be coming to a end but the people in Hyrule Market had no idea. Such an odd inconsistency given that the Castle was covered in a weird forcefield.

 

3.The Gamecube controls were much better due to the lack of input lag. The sword play is bloody incredible on that version. It also didn't have that bloody fairy on the screen that was kept making that awful noise.

 

I would love to replay the game, but actually all I want is to replay the dungeons and nothing else.

[Fierce_LiNk]

Agreed. Twilight Princess has INCREDIBLE dungeons by far the best bosses (apart from the water boss who doesn't have any attacks apparently). What let the game down imo was:

 

1. The wolf sections started off well but ran out of steam fairly early on. You can tell it was shoe-horned in a bit (I believe Aunoma had the idea when he was brought in to help the troubled development).

 

2. The areas outside of dungeons were mixed. The world was completely empty and some of the villages were poor. I also thought the atmosphere was pretty poor - The world was supposed to be coming to a end but the people in Hyrule Market had no idea. Such an odd inconsistency given that the Castle was covered in a weird forcefield.

 

3.The Gamecube controls were much better due to the lack of input lag. The sword play is bloody incredible on that version. It also didn't have that bloody fairy on the screen that was kept making that awful noise.

 

I would love to replay the game, but actually all I want is to replay the dungeons and nothing else.

 

I'm curious about the GC version, although I had good fun with the Wii version at the time.

 

I'd probably agree with your criticisms. Although, my mind is blown with playing The Witcher 3 with how villages and towns could potentially by created. They're done really well in that.

 

The problem with the wolf bits is that the moveset isn't particularly massive, so it'll either be some form of platforming section or kill the shadow beasts. I don't think they were too much of a problem because there wasn't an awful lot of them. I could live with it and thought that they started off particularly well.

 

Thinking back, the worlds in Zelda games don't feel populated enough. Particularly in TP. It would be nice if you could discover small settlements here and there, rather than everyone living in CastleTown or Ordon.

[Goron_3]

I'm curious about the GC version, although I had good fun with the Wii version at the time.

 

I'd probably agree with your criticisms. Although, my mind is blown with playing The Witcher 3 with how villages and towns could potentially by created. They're done really well in that.

 

The problem with the wolf bits is that the moveset isn't particularly massive, so it'll either be some form of platforming section or kill the shadow beasts. I don't think they were too much of a problem because there wasn't an awful lot of them. I could live with it and thought that they started off particularly well.

 

Thinking back, the worlds in Zelda games don't feel populated enough. Particularly in TP. It would be nice if you could discover small settlements here and there, rather than everyone living in CastleTown or Ordon.

 

I guess this comes down to hardware limitations tbh. There's a limit to what they can do and TP was essentially a GC game.

 

What's interesting to me is that Wind Waker, Twilight Princess and SS are all very different games, albeit basically on the same hardware. They have their own strengths and weaknesses imo.

 

Wind Waker: Captured the feeling of going on an adventure incredible well. The Ocean was great and the characters was ridiculously brilliant. The downside was the pacing in the second half of the game and mixed dungeons.

 

TP: Incredible dungeons but art style didn't age particularly well. Textures are ridiculously muddy which makes the game look a bit ugly in outdoor sections. Terrible intro and world didn't capture my imagine as well as Wind Waker.

 

SS: Areas outside of dungeons were great although dungeon quality was a bit mixed. The game had incredible pacing issues and the repeat boss fights were frustrating. Motion controls were tacked on..why use motion+ to swim when there's a bloody analogue stick on the controller? The hub world was also disappointing.

[Ronnie]

I somehow listened to the whole thing in ONE sitting. It was brilliant and it gave me an itch to play the game again, but...

 

 

 

Agreed. Twilight Princess has INCREDIBLE dungeons by far the best bosses (apart from the water boss who doesn't have any attacks apparently). What let the game down imo was:

 

1. The wolf sections started off well but ran out of steam fairly early on. You can tell it was shoe-horned in a bit (I believe Aunoma had the idea when he was brought in to help the troubled development).

 

2. The areas outside of dungeons were mixed. The world was completely empty and some of the villages were poor. I also thought the atmosphere was pretty poor - The world was supposed to be coming to a end but the people in Hyrule Market had no idea. Such an odd inconsistency given that the Castle was covered in a weird forcefield.

 

3.The Gamecube controls were much better due to the lack of input lag. The sword play is bloody incredible on that version. It also didn't have that bloody fairy on the screen that was kept making that awful noise.

 

I would love to replay the game, but actually all I want is to replay the dungeons and nothing else.

 

Your second point is probably the biggest problem with the game. The world felt very empty and the sense of dread you had in games like OOT (adult link) and Majora's Mask was completely absent. Hyrule Castle Town in general was a big disappointment. Looked nice but there wasn't much to do there. Kakariko similarly was pretty soul-less although maybe that was the point. I also think they shoehorned in Ganon at the last minute.

 

 

Wind Waker: Captured the feeling of going on an adventure incredible well. The Ocean was great and the characters was ridiculously brilliant. The downside was the pacing in the second half of the game and mixed dungeons.

 

TP: Incredible dungeons but art style didn't age particularly well. Textures are ridiculously muddy which makes the game look a bit ugly in outdoor sections. Terrible intro and world didn't capture my imagine as well as Wind Waker.

 

SS: Areas outside of dungeons were great although dungeon quality was a bit mixed. The game had incredible pacing issues and the repeat boss fights were frustrating. Motion controls were tacked on..why use motion+ to swim when there's a bloody analogue stick on the controller? The hub world was also disappointing.

 

Sums up the three games perfectly, nice one. I'd add the poor soundtrack for SS, especially compared to WW and TP.

Edited June 7, 2015 by Ronnie
Automerged Doublepost

[Fierce_LiNk]

I guess this comes down to hardware limitations tbh. There's a limit to what they can do and TP was essentially a GC game.

 

What's interesting to me is that Wind Waker, Twilight Princess and SS are all very different games, albeit basically on the same hardware. They have their own strengths and weaknesses imo.

 

Wind Waker: Captured the feeling of going on an adventure incredible well. The Ocean was great and the characters was ridiculously brilliant. The downside was the pacing in the second half of the game and mixed dungeons.

 

TP: Incredible dungeons but art style didn't age particularly well. Textures are ridiculously muddy which makes the game look a bit ugly in outdoor sections. Terrible intro and world didn't capture my imagine as well as Wind Waker.

 

SS: Areas outside of dungeons were great although dungeon quality was a bit mixed. The game had incredible pacing issues and the repeat boss fights were frustrating. Motion controls were tacked on..why use motion+ to swim when there's a bloody analogue stick on the controller? The hub world was also disappointing.

 

Yeah, I can forgive TP for its misgivings because of the hardware at the time. At the time, the game looked pretty great to me. It won't age as well as something like WW due to the art style.

 

Out of those three, SS has the most glaring, obvious and concerning issues. I'd also argue that it didn't really excel in any area compared to previous Zeldas. There's not one area I can confidently say, "This was better in Skyward Sword than in every other Zelda."

[Ronnie]

Out of those three, SS has the most glaring, obvious and concerning issues. I'd also argue that it didn't really excel in any area compared to previous Zeldas. There's not one area I can confidently say, "This was better in Skyward Sword than in every other Zelda."

 

I'd agree with that. To give it some credit, whilst I think the lack of a connected overworld was probably the game's biggest crime, exploring the various parts individually was quite good. Especially compared to Twilight Princess where geographically speaking it maybe wasn't quite as much fun? It had some nice locations, especially the forest, waterfall, volcano etc and the way it reconfigured each in future visits was quite cool

 

Also visually the game could look quite stunning at times.

Edited June 7, 2015 by Ronnie

[Retro_Link]

I'd personally say SS has the best story and possibly characters too.

[Ronnie]

Yeah I'd give SS best story of the past three console games.

 

Wind Waker's was a little vague and the storyline vanished half way through Twilight Princess.

[Hero-of-Time]

I wonder if we will see this drop on the eShop during E3 next week? With Zelda Wii U being pushed back this could help soften the blow, that's if they aren't remastering it, of course.

[EEVILMURRAY]

Although, my mind is blown with playing The Witcher 3 with how villages and towns could potentially by created. They're done really well in that.

Except when you're exploring and desparately need a blacksmith/signpost to fast travel to somewhere with a blacksmith they suddenly become a little sparse.