Low specs point to good news

[ShadowV7]

Well remember games will be on par with Xbox 360 on standard TV's dont worry to much bout the specs,no one thought they could do the graphics on Res 4 and TP

[DCK]

Sigh. Penic99, you expect wonders of Nintendo. 'The you will say wow' comment was a big fat lie if you're anything into graphics. There is no secret that could make up for a weak system as it would have to be bigger than the controller, and would go beyond Nintendo's possibilities.

 

You might wonder why I'm being so pissed off about it, but I'm a person who doesn't easily settle for less. The way the specs seem like Nintendo basically ignored everything that has happened in technology world for the last six years and just redid a GameCube (the fact that developers don't expect Nintendo put in shaders says a lot). They could make a (far) more powerful console if they just invested some more in new technology and still sell it for under $200 but they didn't. Therefore the experience of Metroid, Zelda won't be as good as it could have been if Nintendo, in the way I feel it, tried harder.

 

But yeah, now it's able to sell near the same price as the GameCube or the DS.

[Nintendork]

cant remember the cube launch price in Euros, but it was £129.99 in the UK. They stated a price of £179.99 and then lowered it a couple of weeks before the launch, if I remember correctly.

 

BBC April 2002

"Nintendo has announced a price cut for its GameCube games console in Europe almost two weeks before it is even launched.

The machine was originally expected to sell for about £150 when released to shops on 3 May but the company has set a new price of 199 euros (£129)."

 

"He added: "Europe is a very important market for Nintendo and we are committed to making it a success."

 

I'm freaky annoyed I paid £299 for my PS2 now.. even though it had a DVD player in it, which at the time was relatively expensive to buy standalone- especially from a company like Sony renowned for quality.

 

I could have had so much fun for half the price.. I think I might have to pick up one of these pearl white GameCubes going down at the moment for bugger all if I manage to find a job.

 

We're also looking at it on current market prices.. technology gets cheaper every day- well except flash which remains somewhat stagnant. In 6 months the hardware in Revolution may be cheaper, and mean that Nintendo will shave the price from what the analysts expect.

 

While there are estimates of sub $299 today which could be the 'current' hardware price.. if Revolution drops in November the price would be considerably lowe as other analysts estimate.

[YenRug]

DCK, you're quickly heading towards being a troll, to tell you the truth. Tell me this, is the Revolution going to have rubbish graphics, or just graphics that aren't as hi-res as the Xbox360 or PS3? You keep on banging on how bad it's going to be without any evidence to support your arguments. You keep on saying how it's only a souped up Gamecube, when the chips have almost certainly been given other advances other than just a speed increase.

 

You said, in another thread, how the 1.5 times speed increase would probablyt only lead to a 1.25 times performance gain; the reality is likely that the 1.5 times speed increase with an improved chip design would lead to a 2 times performance gain, or even more. Quite frankly, you have been brainwashed by the HD=Better hype being spouted by MS and Sony. Either extricate your cranium from where the sun doesn't shine, or wait until you actually have something to support your beliefs, i.e. E3. Actually, it would be preferable if you did both.

[Demuwan]

DCK, you're quickly heading towards being a troll, to tell you the truth. Tell me this, is the Revolution going to have rubbish graphics, or just graphics that aren't as hi-res as the Xbox360 or PS3? You keep on banging on how bad it's going to be without any evidence to support your arguments. You keep on saying how it's only a souped up Gamecube, when the chips have almost certainly been given other advances other than just a speed increase.

 

You said, in another thread, how the 1.5 times speed increase would probablyt only lead to a 1.25 times performance gain; the reality is likely that the 1.5 times speed increase with an improved chip design would lead to a 2 times performance gain, or even more. Quite frankly, you have been brainwashed by the HD=Better hype being spouted by MS and Sony. Either extricate your cranium from where the sun doesn't shine, or wait until you actually have something to support your beliefs, i.e. E3. Actually, it would be preferable if you did both.

 

Someone had to say it. Well said.

 

e3 where are u?

[DCK]

I'm not saying that. You're obviously misunderstanding me.

 

What I'm saying is that I'm very pissed off about these specs, as they mean that Nintendo hasn't been investing into new technology at all besides their controller. I'm not even looking to the 360 and PS3 and their HD mumbojumbo and graphic talk, I'm talking about improvement over next gen, which seems close to zero. The specs don't show much potential - the GameCube was already very efficient for its time and making it even more efficient is going to be very hard. I don't have much confidence in much graphical improvement. As the Revolution will probably be my only new console within the next three years, I kind of feel ripped off about that already. I want more improvement than the controller.

 

Again, I'm not saying anything about rubbish graphics. I pointed out that this level of improvement in power doesn't give as much better graphics, and I think you can all agree with me on that. The lack of improvement in hardware has made me angry and most of all dissappointed in Nintendo. I can live with a slight improvement over Cube graphics, but that doesn't mean I have to be satisfied with it and just smile and say 'oh well, there's still the controller'. I'm not like that. I want the whole package.

 

The way you're accusing me of trolling and being brainwashed by Microsoft and Sony dissappoints me, YenRug. Because I don't agree with the rest of the forum I should just go away and hide? That's not the way it works here.

[monkeyDluffy]

lets just wait for E3, its only a month and a bit away, then we'll see it and see what else ninty have going on!

 

EDIT: plus was playing ico and shadow of colossus last night and if the PS2 can produce games as beautiful as that, the rev will be powerful enough.

[Demuwan]

I'm not saying that. You're obviously misunderstanding me.

 

What I'm saying is that I'm very pissed off about these specs, as they mean that Nintendo hasn't been investing into new technology at all besides their controller. I'm not even looking to the 360 and PS3 and their HD mumbojumbo and graphic talk, I'm talking about improvement over next gen, which seems close to zero. The specs don't show much potential - the GameCube was already very efficient for its time and making it even more efficient is going to be very hard. I don't have much confidence in much graphical improvement. As the Revolution will probably be my only new console within the next three years, I kind of feel ripped off about that already. I want more improvement than the controller.

 

Again, I'm not saying anything about rubbish graphics. I pointed out that this level of improvement in power doesn't give as much better graphics, and I think you can all agree with me on that. The lack of improvement in hardware has made me angry and most of all dissappointed in Nintendo. I can live with a slight improvement over Cube graphics, but that doesn't mean I have to be satisfied with it and just smile and say 'oh well, there's still the controller'. I'm not like that. I want the whole package.

 

The way you're accusing me of trolling and being brainwashed by Microsoft and Sony dissappoints me, YenRug. Because I don't agree with the rest of the forum I should just go away and hide? That's not the way it works here.

 

I can understand your frustration. However, before you write this console off wait for e3. Many have said that power isn't everything. I believe that many of us will be gobsmacked when we see the graphics it can produce. Try to understand that without all the deatails it is almost impossible to gauge. I am frustrated too. I think we all are. Personally I don't agree with Nintendo's hush hush policy. I think more should be revealed. It would prevent IGN from causing up a frenzy. (bet their loving it).

 

Think about the amount have times you have been dissapointed with a 1st party Nintendo game with respect to graphics. Hardly ever. At times like this we need to trust that Nintendo know what they are doing and that is the hardest part.

[DCK]

It's not purely the point of graphics being 'bad' actually. The way the specs seem like, and despite all efficiency magic Nintendo casts upon it, Nintendo seems to have that anti-improvement air over them again. The way they were against disc media, because it was unimportant for games and caused loading times, and the way they were against online gaming, because it didn't enrich the gaming experience and was not profitable. Now, they won't invest in better graphics because it doesn't need it with the FHC.

 

When Nintendo discovers something important they completely rule out the other thing, as if they don't match. Nintendo doesn't seem to learn or understand that things like online gaming and competitive graphics have their own value and are worth investing in.

 

It seems Nintendo is making the old mistakes again. The have invented the controller and then they cut down the rest of development for the console. They are so convinced that their way works that they don't need to think about improving others.

 

I understand that it would cost ridiculous amounts of money to be on par with the 360 or PS3, but they could have invested a bit in new, 100% up to date technology. That way it would be more competitive with the 360 and PS3, instead of seeking new markets that they're not even sure of.

 

Glad to see you understand me though

[mario114]

Sigh. Penic99, you expect wonders of Nintendo. 'The you will say wow' comment was a big fat lie if you're anything into graphics.

DS.

 

I'm into graphics and those shown in wind waker and metorid made me go wow, so I have every faith that the graphics won't disapoint me.

 

That way it would be more competitive with the 360 and PS3, instead of seeking new markets that they're not even sure of.

 

They tested the market with the ds, and that has done ok so far.

[Demuwan]

It's not purely the point of graphics being 'bad' actually. The way the specs seem like, and despite all efficiency magic Nintendo casts upon it, Nintendo seems to have that anti-improvement air over them again. The way they were against disc media, because it was unimportant for games and caused loading times, and the way they were against online gaming, because it didn't enrich the gaming experience and was not profitable. Now, they won't invest in better graphics because it doesn't need it with the FHC.

 

When Nintendo discovers something important they completely rule out the other thing, as if they don't match. Nintendo doesn't seem to learn or understand that things like online gaming and competitive graphics have their own value and are worth investing in.

 

It seems Nintendo is making the old mistakes again. The have invented the controller and then they cut down the rest of development for the console. They are so convinced that their way works that they don't need to think about improving others.

 

I understand that it would cost ridiculous amounts of money to be on par with the 360 or PS3, but they could have invested a bit in new, 100% up to date technology. That way it would be more competitive with the 360 and PS3, instead of seeking new markets that they're not even sure of.

 

Glad to see you understand me though

 

Who says they haven't invested on up to date technology. How do you know that those specs are even real. How do you know there isn't a critical underlying factor in the technology. The point is we deon't know these thing. It would be pointless to try and analyse evidence that is quite possibly erroneous. I don't think that Nintendo will sacrifice technology. They are not stupid.

 

I don't even think that many 360 games look 2-3times better than original Xbox games! Would you say Perfect Dark 0 looked 3 times better than Halo 2 or would you say Kameo looked 3 times better than Conker live and Reloaded because I dont.

 

Wait till e3.

[1UP]

I'm into graphics and those shown in wind waker and metorid made me go wow, so I have every faith that the graphics won't disapoint me.

 

 

 

They tested the market with the ds, and that has done ok so far.

OK, more like amazing. The fastes selling console ever and sold more than the ps2 in 13 months than the ps2 did in 24 months.

[goku21]

I'm not saying that. You're obviously misunderstanding me.

 

What I'm saying is that I'm very pissed off about these specs, as they mean that Nintendo hasn't been investing into new technology at all besides their controller. I'm not even looking to the 360 and PS3 and their HD mumbojumbo and graphic talk, I'm talking about improvement over next gen, which seems close to zero. The specs don't show much potential - the GameCube was already very efficient for its time and making it even more efficient is going to be very hard. I don't have much confidence in much graphical improvement. As the Revolution will probably be my only new console within the next three years, I kind of feel ripped off about that already. I want more improvement than the controller.

 

Again, I'm not saying anything about rubbish graphics. I pointed out that this level of improvement in power doesn't give as much better graphics, and I think you can all agree with me on that. The lack of improvement in hardware has made me angry and most of all dissappointed in Nintendo. I can live with a slight improvement over Cube graphics, but that doesn't mean I have to be satisfied with it and just smile and say 'oh well, there's still the controller'. I'm not like that. I want the whole package.

 

The way you're accusing me of trolling and being brainwashed by Microsoft and Sony dissappoints me, YenRug. Because I don't agree with the rest of the forum I should just go away and hide? That's not the way it works here.

 

do you want a 3,2 GHz(64bit ) 512mb ram board in a sd-tv-console? you´re crazy? and don´t think they did´nt invest in technology!!!!!

havn´t you seen all those patent about proprietary graphics-accellerators?

you know, MS and Sony both use a proprietary Host-CPU, why not using proprietary graphics-cards? It´s not that hard with a partner like ATI and 5 years of time!!

You know MS came around one year before the 360 launched and said to ATI: "hey dude, give me the best pc-card that you made and please customize it for our machine...." that´s the full story! Now they have a

DX10 ( - 0,4) card... it´s the best around no doubt!!! But if Nintendo really uses all of these patents they really could give us our wow... no doubt :wink:

 

 

And to all those morrons that say Nintendo better sell it for 100 € or less...

you know, even the development of the fhc is 100 for me... it´s not just a controller that detects...they probably did ^hundred´s of studies with different people of different age waving the controller to specific schemes and scientists collecting this into the logical-motion-capture-brain of the fhc... sorry i´m not english-man , hope you understand that above and that the contoller has to fit everybody (big , small , long arms, short arms)....

Then you don´t even know the last seret that´s fully being unveiled @E3...

So please don´t judge before thinking!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That´s so childish!!!

[Pestneb]

DCK. improvements over the GC.

better CPU.

better GPU.

SD cards

online.

smaller.

new control.

more space available on game discs.

Virtual console.

 

GC graphics aren't appalling. the revo will be 480p, same as the cube.

 

now on the chips themselves, as has already been stated, they can improve them over the Mhz value.

your "GC pretty efficient" comment... seems ill thought out.

do you honestly believe the GC CPU was the pinnacle of efficiency?

that even with 5 years of experience, technology advances etc its impossible to improve the GC CPU?

nope. the revo could be 1000 times more efficient than the GC chip, for all we know. unlikely, but it is equally unlikely that the Revo chip will be equal in its efficiency.

[Yoshiking]

I don't really care much about graphics. I would never need graphics any better than those you see in say, Twilight Princess. Some times I even wish it'd go back to OoT-graphics. Those were the days..

Anyway, I pretty much only play games on my DS nowadays. And I'm pretty sure that's just because of the innovative, intuitive controls. If Revolution pulls that off, that's all I could ever ask for. The graphics, I don't really care. They're better than Gamecube, and I don't need more than that to be satisfied.

 

As for the price.. I don't really care about that either. I'll get it no matter what it costs. If it costs less, I'll just afford one game more when I buy it.

[Hellfire]

This is all bull. Nintendo decided to make an affordable console, that would be kind of impossible with expensive hardware. Saying Nintendo is making the same old mistakes is a bunch of crap. First of all Nintendo never was behind in terms of graphics in the home console market. Second, what's that 100% up to date tech BS? two of the leading hardware makers in the world have been working on the Revolution for years, using the platform of one of the most balanced hardware designs to ever grace a console and because of a rumour that isn't even detailed you think it's some pre hitorical technology? Let's put things straight: if Nintendo made a PS3 like console with HD and whatnot, people still wouldn't buy it. A new aproach is needed, if Nintendo doesn't succeed with the masses that play today, try appealing to other people. If people buy XBOX360 or PS3, why not convince them buy something different in addition? But for that, it must be something cheap.

[nekunando]

..I find it a bit ridiculous that everyone is complaining about all this when absolutely nothing has been seen with respect to games or graphics.. just be patient.. I wanna see the revolution in action as much as the next person but I'm prepared to wait to E3 and be hit with everything.. i reckon it will be exciting..

[guarana]

1.you can play zelda on revolution , in enhanced mode (not using the controller but using some other mysterious feature)

2.Not one game was shown yet

3.pandemic says they seen something on revolution and its mind blowing.

4.nintendo releases its secrets on its controller before the final secret.

5. revolutions demo shows people playing revolution , anyone could notice that no problem .. but the part that interested me was the fact that when the fly swating part came on the girls were not just looking at the screen , if you watch there eyes you'll notice they are not looking far at all , like the bugs are only a inches away , and there eyes were not focused were the tv would be .

 

1.If this ENHANCED mode isnt using the controller(and they said it wasnt),then it has to be the visuals that are enhanced ...why is this special? cus the enhanced visuals in zelda (played on rev) shows off the final secret nintendo doesnt want anyone to know yet.whys that special (cus its projection)

2.Because any game video or screens , would show off the final secret nintendo doesnt want anyone to know yet. (nintendo wouldnt just hide its games unless some new idea could risk being stolen - projection)

3.pandemic doesnt talk that nice about xbox 360 or ps3 , and there more powerful .. they seen something new like seeing mario 64 for the first time (in this case - projection)

4.easy to copy and it would be copied if shown to early (the projection-ness)

5.they were seeing bugs and swating bugs that apeared right in front , and beside them .(something that projection does)

 

I want to believe in this projection stuff more then anyone .. i just dont want to be let down ... there are alot of things that lead me the believe that the final secret will be 3d visuals (projection).. no one has come up with a better idea as to what they could be hiding .

[Eenuh]

5. revolutions demo shows people playing revolution , anyone could notice that no problem .. but the part that interested me was the fact that when the fly swating part came on the girls were not just looking at the screen , if you watch there eyes you'll notice they are not looking far at all , like the bugs are only a inches away , and there eyes were not focused were the tv would be .

 

You do realize this is just a promo video for the controller right? To me it just looks like those girls are sitting awfully close to the tv, or the camera is just zoomed in on them for some more "drama". Anyway, don't get too excited about projection stuff only because of this video; try to base it on other facts if you must.

I don't think I'd be much of a fan of projection anyway; seems weird. But then again I wasn't a fan of 3D games at first either. Just takes time to get used to it. But at the moment I'm not convinced that's what their secret is.

[James McGeachie]

They didn't say Zelda isn't using the controller, they said it's using the Revolution in a way "no one would expect", it's pretty much already been confirmed though that the controller will be part of it.

[plufim]

I honestly think there will be nothing "special" about how the graphics are displayed. Miyamoto's comment about filling rooms is being taken out of context - he was talking about the distant future. The revolution is not going to be a freaking holodeck.

 

It will, however, look very nice. Remember, a certain percentage of gamecube power is being used for non-graphical tasks: AI, physics, object tracking, etc. Much more power will now be available for purely graphical tasks when comparing rev to cube.

 

And finally, "power", as has been said by others here, is not just a matter of clock speeds. It was irresponsible of IGN to imply this, and especially so to compare to xbox (comparing an optimised ATI chip to a simple celeron is borderline idiotic).

[Yoshiking]

As for that Revolution video shown last E3.. Wasn't the TV off for the entire video? I mean, the TV was never turned on.. Was it? I firmly believe that the games will be displayed on a TV screen, but I'm just saying. I don't think that video was people actually playing the Revolution, it was people acting like they were playing it. It was simply to show what it could do, and to have the people looking through the air as if not on the TV is just to make it all seem like they were interacting more with it.

I don't think you should gather much from that video.

[Fierce_LiNk]

As for that Revolution video shown last E3.. Wasn't the TV off for the entire video? I mean, the TV was never turned on.. Was it? I firmly believe that the games will be displayed on a TV screen, but I'm just saying. I don't think that video was people actually playing the Revolution, it was people acting like they were playing it. It was simply to show what it could do, and to have the people looking through the air as if not on the TV is just to make it all seem like they were interacting more with it.

I don't think you should gather much from that video.

 

The TV was on, because the bloke playing the "sword fighting game" turned it off at end using the power button on the Revolution controller.

The whole video (apart from the ending and shots of the controller) were shown from the Tv's point of view/perspective. Great video, i still enjoy watching it.

[Yoshiking]

Uhm, isn't he turning off the Revolution with that button..?

Why/how would the Revolution controller have a button to turn off a TV. That would be way more expensive for them to produce, and they'd have to have a system that allows the controller to be programmable (there are programmable remotes, mind, but they're somewhat expensive and this controller is bound to already be).

Also, why would it have an off button for the TV and not the Revolution? Is it a 2 in 1? Turn off both in one click? That would be pretty inconvenient if you want to watch TV after you're done playing.

[Fierce_LiNk]

Uhm, isn't he turning off the Revolution with that button..?

Why/how would the Revolution controller have a button to turn off a TV. That would be way more expensive for them to produce, and they'd have to have a system that allows the controller to be programmable (there are programmable remotes, mind, but they're somewhat expensive and this controller is bound to already be).

Also, why would it have an off button for the TV and not the Revolution? Is it a 2 in 1? Turn off both in one click? That would be pretty inconvenient if you want to watch TV after you're done playing.

 

That's a very good point. Hmm, i don't have an answer for that.

 

*hurries off to watch video again in hope of finding an answer*

 

Edit: Just watched it again. What lead me believe that the TV was on is that when he presses the power button on the controller, the screen turns dark. We can still see from the guy from the tv point of view. Maybe its some sort of sleep mode?