Dcubed Posted January 31, 2022 Posted January 31, 2022 (edited) Ladies and gentlemen. The art of desperation in action! That is an insane sum of money for a single developer!!! Sony REALLY don't want to lose the FPS crowd! Edited January 31, 2022 by Dcubed 1
Hero-of-Time Posted January 31, 2022 Posted January 31, 2022 Things are just getting stupid now. I knew this would happen. Obviously the deal has been going on in the background for a while now but this bidding war between Sony and Microsoft is going to do a lot of harm to the industry in the long run.
Dcubed Posted January 31, 2022 Author Posted January 31, 2022 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Hero-of-Time said: Things are just getting stupid now. I knew this would happen. Obviously the deal has been going on in the background for a while now but this bidding war between Sony and Microsoft is going to do a lot of harm to the industry in the long run. Honestly? I don't think it has been bubbling for that long... I can't imagine Sony even remotely considering such a ridiculous overpayment for Bungie if they weren't absolutely desperate for an answer to losing COD. They needed an answer and they needed one now. This is an absolute act of desperation, and while it's possible that they might have been in talks for some time? I cannot believe that this decision is anything but a knee jerk reaction, with Sony bosses shouting "Fuck it! Buy them now!! At any price!!". They just paid more than 15x for Bungie than what they paid for Insomniac! This is NOT a reasonable calculated business decision (and if it is? Then it's one of the most moronic failures of business negotiations that I have ever seen in this industry). There is no way that Bungie is worth anything even remotely close to $3.6 billion, you could buy an entire publisher for that kind of money! (Hell, the entierty of WBIE was on sale for just $4 Billion just last year!!). Edited January 31, 2022 by Dcubed
drahkon Posted January 31, 2022 Posted January 31, 2022 Quote We will continue to independently publish and creatively develop our games. We will continue to drive one, unified Bungie community. Our games will continue to be where our community is, wherever they choose to play. bungie.net At least some good news. Still...the industry is slowly but surely going down the drain
Dcubed Posted January 31, 2022 Author Posted January 31, 2022 Just for fun... https://www.ign.com/articles/2000/06/20/microsoft-acquires-bungie From $20 million in 2000 to $3.6 billion in 2022. I think Microsoft got the better deal here
Hero-of-Time Posted January 31, 2022 Posted January 31, 2022 2 minutes ago, Dcubed said: They just paid more than 15x for Bungie than what they paid for Insomniac! This is NOT a reasonable calculated business decision (and if it is? Then it's one of the most moronic failures of business negotiations that I have ever seen in this industry). To be fair, that purchase was an absolute steal back then and even more so now. Sony got away with daylight robbery with what they bought them for. Had Insomniac held out for even an extra year then things would have been quite different. As for it being a moronic business decision, who's to say? Destiny pulls in big numbers with microtransactions, just like CoD. If they are going to stay multiplatform then that means Sony gets a slice of the pie whatever console it's on, just like MS will get with CoD. It could be a good way to recoup the losses from CoD. Sony have been without a strong, online shooter for years now and this is one way to go about getting one sorted in the years to come. I wonder how Nintendo feel about all of this? They've proven that they can operate very successfully in their own little bubble but if this peeng contest starts to bleed over into Japanese companies then they may start raising an eyebrow. 1
Mandalore Posted January 31, 2022 Posted January 31, 2022 No chance of Bungie ever returning to Halo then. How big is Bungie compared to companies like Sega and Square Enix? Is it within Sony's budget to gobble up them too?
Julius Posted January 31, 2022 Posted January 31, 2022 (edited) 46 minutes ago, Dcubed said: Ladies and gentlemen. The art of desperation in action! That is an insane sum of money for a single developer!!! Sony REALLY don't want to lose the FPS crowd! Just, guys, read the room already... I've got to admit I spat out my drink when I read this and started laughing my ass off. It feels like the pettiest imaginable way to get back at Microsoft for acquiring Activision Blizzard: by hooking up with their ex. Honestly, I have very little new at all to say about this, these acquisitions are getting so frequent that I honestly don't have the energy to type up that many original thoughts on the matter. On 18/01/2022 at 4:16 PM, Julius said: I've said it before, and I'll double down and say it again, because I would say the same if this were PlayStation or if this were Nintendo: In the long term, this can only be a bad thing. I don't care if you're silly enough to align yourself with one platform holder over another, these billion dollar companies are destroying the ceiling for growth and creativity in a medium I can safely say that we all care deeply about. They are commodifying the few big companies that remain for the price of the many, in that this will be a price that the rest of the industry - in the long term - could pay for dearly. And that continues to be a worrying thought. I'm doubling down now that PlayStation are doing it too. It's wrong, and I hate to see it. Like with the Bethesda and Activision Blizzard acquisitions by Microsoft, it's inorganic growth, which just feels plain wrong. They're saying they'll remain independent and multi-platform for now, but I can all but guarantee we see that change a bit once Microsoft figure out how they're handling Call of Duty moving forwards, and if it's anything but things continuing exactly as they already are (which lets face it, isn't happening), that PlayStation will try to position Bungie to churn out an FPS for them that isn't Destiny, possibly alongside Guerrilla? It's anyone's guess, but that's where my mind goes. What's even stranger about this move for me is that I don't get who this move is supposed to be enticing to, from a customer perspective. Like I said, exclusivity may come down the road, but if it's not for now, then what's the point? And even if it does become exclusive down the road, I seriously fail to see how Destiny of all games is pulling players to PlayStation. As others have mentioned, a move for Square Enix makes much more sense (not that I want to see that come to pass, mind you), and they actually have a number of IP which I think can bring people into the ecosystem. I think it's because Bungie don't have much to offer right now when it comes to making one of their own IP exclusive, hence keeping them multi-platform. For now. It will be interesting to see where this goes. Bungie is one thing, but I struggle to see Sony making a move for anyone much bigger: EA and Ubisoft are certainly too big, Square Enix I think are too big in scale and considering that PlayStation has moved out of Japan I struggle to see them making that move, etc. I mean, God knows we all want to see Konami back in the game, but that is purely an IP acquisition, it would be generous to call their development team a shell of what they were a decade ago. The only thing I think they can do now, unless Sony are pushing unreasonably hard and risking everything when it comes to making more moves, is coming to some crazy arrangements with IP owners for exclusivity moving forwards, and actually announcing them. Things like "PlayStation enter decade-long arrangement with Konami for Metal Gear Solid, Castlevania, and Silent Hill IP's" or "PlayStation have agreed an exclusivity arrangement for the Final Fantasy VII Remake Saga and Final Fantasy XIV for console", etc., and it kind of helps to put Xbox off making those big moves for those companies if there's a contract that's going to be kept for X amount of years for huge IP's that they can't then touch. Not exactly cheap, but I think obviously much cheaper than buying these companies outright. Now I'm going to go wash my hands, because I feel filthy just typing the suggestion that PlayStation should do that See you all in February for Microsoft's acquisition of Ubisoft! Edited January 31, 2022 by Julius 1 1
Ronnie Posted January 31, 2022 Posted January 31, 2022 15 minutes ago, Julius said: It feels like the pettiest imaginable way to get back at Microsoft for acquiring Activision Blizzard: by hooking up with their ex. Haha you're right, that's exactly what it feels like.
Hero-of-Time Posted January 31, 2022 Posted January 31, 2022 Buying someone like S-E or Capcom doesn't make much sense. Their games sell very well on PlayStation already, more so than on Xbox, and so buying them outright and making them exclusive wouldn't really serve them well in the long run. MS buying them would be a better fit. Like it or not, it's these big Western companies that are ruling the console space on both MS and Sony platforms, with games that feature microtransactions and battle passes. It's a constant stream of revenue and it's why they are being targeted. If things continue the way they are I wouldn't be surprised to see EA next on the list. Having the FIFA Ultimate money coming your way on a daily basis must be a tantalizing prospect for both Sony and MS.
Hero-of-Time Posted January 31, 2022 Posted January 31, 2022 As expected, it appears this deal was started 5-6 months ago. I do wonder if Sony caught wind of MS looking to purchase Activision (that deal had also been on the cards for a while) and decided to lock in Bungie to limited the damage of possibly losing CoD or if it was a case of finally getting a studio on board that could make a FPS for them. Maybe a bit of both? 1
Dcubed Posted January 31, 2022 Author Posted January 31, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Hero-of-Time said: To be fair, that purchase was an absolute steal back then and even more so now. Sony got away with daylight robbery with what they bought them for. Had Insomniac held out for even an extra year then things would have been quite different. As for it being a moronic business decision, who's to say? Destiny pulls in big numbers with microtransactions, just like CoD. If they are going to stay multiplatform then that means Sony gets a slice of the pie whatever console it's on, just like MS will get with CoD. It could be a good way to recoup the losses from CoD. Sony have been without a strong, online shooter for years now and this is one way to go about getting one sorted in the years to come. I wonder how Nintendo feel about all of this? They've proven that they can operate very successfully in their own little bubble but if this peeng contest starts to bleed over into Japanese companies then they may start raising an eyebrow. Yeah, Sony got a great deal with Insomniac. I can't imagine that Bungie would be worth that much more though... Destiny isn't exactly a huge IP anymore, and that's all that Bungie have to their name. But yes, I think that you're absolutely right. Sony are definitely going to start stering their shopping cart towards Japan pretty soon and Nintendo had better start making moves soon; or else they're gonna be losing some key 3rd party partners very soon... BTW, Nintendo... Yeah, buy Mercury Steam now while you still can you fools!! Edited January 31, 2022 by Dcubed
Dcubed Posted January 31, 2022 Author Posted January 31, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Hero-of-Time said: As expected, it appears this deal was started 5-6 months ago. I do wonder if Sony caught wind of MS looking to purchase Activision (that deal had also been on the cards for a while) and decided to lock in Bungie to limited the damage of possibly losing CoD or if it was a case of finally getting a studio on board that could make a FPS for them. Maybe a bit of both? The deal might have started that long ago, but there is no way in hell that they were planning to spend $3.6 billion on Bungie; no way in hell. I also highly doubt that Sony were the only party that Bungie have been talking to since they went independent in 2019... (no doubt they were also talking to the likes of EA, Microsoft and Tencent behind the scenes too). This is, with absolute certainty, a panic move in response to the ABK purchase. Sony undoubtedly saw the ABK purchase go through and their bosses went "Oh shit! Fuck!! Close the deal on Bungie NOW!! I don't care how much!! Make it happen before Microsoft get a chance to bid!!". Sony then came running to Bungie with their ridiculous offer and Bungie got to dictate terms; it's the only reasonable explanation for why Sony would be willing to overpay to such a ludicrous degree, while still allowing Bungie to operate independently. Sony are getting absolutely reamed on this deal, while Bungie are making out like bandits. This is a panic move, end of. And if it isn't? Then it is the most incompetent business deal in the history of the medium! You could literally buy WBIE (an entire western publisher!) for this amount of money!!! Edited January 31, 2022 by Dcubed
Dcubed Posted January 31, 2022 Author Posted January 31, 2022 https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2022-01-31-playstation-bungie-will-considerably-accelerate-our-journey-with-multiplatform-live-service-games Quote "I've been on record talking about increasing the size of the PlayStation community, and expanding beyond our historic console heartland. This can take many forms. And definitely one of the main ones is the ability for the wonderful games that we've been making over the past 25 years to be enjoyed in different places and played in different ways. We are starting to go multiplatform, you've seen that. We have an aggressive road map with live services. And the opportunity to work with, and particularly learn from, the brilliant and talented people from Bungie... that is going to considerably accelerate the journey we find ourselves on." "Philosophically, this isn't about pulling things into the PlayStation world. This is about building huge and wonderful new worlds together." Sounds like Sony are starting to move away from their current hardware sales model and are starting to follow Microsoft's hardware agnostic model... We could be looking at the beginning of the end of the traditional console gaming model for Sony now; as it sounds like they want to start following in Microsoft's footsteps. 1
Sheikah Posted February 1, 2022 Posted February 1, 2022 (edited) 17 hours ago, Dcubed said: Yeah, Sony got a great deal with Insomniac. I can't imagine that Bungie would be worth that much more though... Destiny isn't exactly a huge IP anymore, and that's all that Bungie have to their name. You would be surprised. Destiny 2 makes loads of money from microtransactions. In that sense you could argue it's a better buy (in terms of profitability) than Bethesda, which was much more expensive for Microsoft to buy. Across their studios Bethesda make a lot of single players games with far less microtransaction revenue. Also many of Bethesda's games take a very long time to come out, so there's that to factor in too. One of their main series hasn't had a new title in 11 years (Skyrim) and the next one is still miles out. I'd argue that Bungie make the best FPS games in terms of how the gunplay feels so there is a prestige element to this acquisition too. Basically, I can see why Sony would put value in their talent and pedigree, as they're likely to do a great job in whatever future games they release. Also, let's be real, there's no way this deal (or the cost of buying them) is a reaction to Microsoft's recent mega acquisition. These deals (including the valuation) take months to iron out. It's not like they would have been close to a deal at 1 billion then 2 weeks ago they immediately tripled their offer in reaction to the Activision Blizzard deal. It's very likely to be a reaction to slightly older acquisitions, though. And in general, it sucks. Edited February 1, 2022 by Sheikah
Dcubed Posted February 1, 2022 Author Posted February 1, 2022 (edited) BTW, tangentally related... https://variety.com/2022/biz/news/att-spin-off-warnermedia-43-billion-deal-1235168480/ AT&T are fully divesting themselves of Warner Media as a spin-off, instead of keeping them as a split-off; to Discovery for a mere $43 billion! The big game publishers missed out on getting WBIE for a cool $4 billion last year because it didn't come with exclusive rights to WB's massive slate of IP... but I could easily see the likes of Apple, Amazon or Sony (the full entity, not SIE) jumping at the chance to buy Warner Bros Discovery for less than 2/3's of an Activision Blizzard... I can definitely see it happening... $43 billion is a ridiculously low sum for the entierty of Warner Media; and it would not only give an interested party instant leverage into the TV, Movie and Streaming Entertainment industries (DC, HBO, WB, LOTR, Harry Potter etc), but they would also be grabbing the 4th largest western video game publisher too... Edit: Oh God, I just realised that Netflix could even do the deed... They are looking to get into the video game industry in a big way... this would do it in one fell swoop... while wiping out a big competitor, securing a massive amount of content for their core streaming service and taking the fight directly to Disney! Edited February 1, 2022 by Dcubed
Julius Posted May 5, 2022 Posted May 5, 2022 Hoo boy: this is another deal the FTC are taking a look at. Doubt it will have any surprising outcome, but it's going to be a long year of deals being followed by outcry being followed by probes. Oh well, at least we have Not-E3 to look forward to
Dcubed Posted May 6, 2022 Author Posted May 6, 2022 This comes across as posturing in the wake of the ABK purchase and the FTC's new "hard ass" stance on M&A. There are no grounds to block Sony's Bungie purchase whatsoever. If Sony want to overpay massively for Bungie? That's their perogative to do so.
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