Sheikah Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 Fourth? That's a bit of a stretch, don't you think?I mean, yeah sure, technically it counts. But who here actually used it for that purpose? No technically about it, it most certainly was doing it. I lost many an hour to PSO on gamecube.
Pestneb Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 Well if we count the Gamecube, why not the nes (famicom net system), snes (satellaview) and N64 (64DD)....? Sure the gamecube had official support to go online, but it required an add-on peripheral. Counting it is a bit of a stretch imo - how many games supported it officially, 2, maybe 3??? It would be like saying the gamecube had touch controls before the ds (thanks to the donkey konga bongos and dance mat) But if we are counting the GC as being online, then let's not neglect the Nes. Remember the net wasn't as sophisticated back in the beginning, so the network connectivity was pretty impressive.
S.C.G Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 Fourth? That's a bit of a stretch, don't you think?I mean, yeah sure, technically it counts. But who here actually used it for that purpose? Well... technically the NX would be the seventh internet enabled Home Console but this is really clutching at straws, as all I would be referring to would be... NES - Famicom modem, only in Japan, mainly used for banking. SNES - Satellaview, Japan only... although OK not technically online as such but it was still technically impressive. N64 - 64DD, again Japan only, plenty of untapped potential combining that extra storage space with online. But yeah... as for saying who used the GameCube for online as Hero and Sheikah have already said that abbriviation which stands for those magical three words... Phantasy Star Online, pretty much the only online GameCube game released over here - two standalone titles if we're including episodes I&II plus Episode III - and it was more than worth the price of the modem/broadband adapter plus the monthly subscription fee. : peace:
Hero-of-Time Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 Well if we count the Gamecube, why not the nes (famicom net system), snes (satellaview) and N64 (64DD)....? Sure the gamecube had official support to go online, but it required an add-on peripheral. Counting it is a bit of a stretch imo - how many games supported it officially, 2, maybe 3??? It would be like saying the gamecube had touch controls before the ds (thanks to the donkey konga bongos and dance mat) But if we are counting the GC as being online, then let's not neglect the Nes. Remember the net wasn't as sophisticated back in the beginning, so the network connectivity was pretty impressive. If anything though this makes Nintendo look even worse. They were playing with online gaming well before their competitors yet they are the ones who are well behind the curve.
Pestneb Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 If anything though this makes Nintendo look even worse. They were playing with online gaming well before their competitors yet they are the ones who are well behind the curve. didn't sega have online compatibility? Pretty sure Microsoft had something to do with internet explorer, msn messenger etc....
Hero-of-Time Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 didn't sega have online compatibility? Pretty sure Microsoft had something to do with internet explorer, msn messenger etc.... Sega did but it's irrelevant bringing them up due as they aren't in the hardware space anymore. Well, yeah, obviously Microsoft have experience with online stuff but I was ( and thought we all were given the topic ) speaking in terms of games consoles.
Ronnie Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 In terms of serious online support, NX will be the third console. Microsoft took two consoles to get it right.
Hero-of-Time Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 (edited) In terms of serious online support, NX will be the third console. Microsoft took two consoles to get it right. What was wrong with the original Xbox? For the time when it was released it was amazing. Plenty of online games, online chat, the thing was a wonderful piece of kit that helped push online gaming on consoles. Edited August 14, 2016 by Hero-of-Time
Ashley Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 I think it's reasonable to count the GameCube as the first as it was the first one to be released worldwide.
Pestneb Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 I think it's reasonable to count the GameCube as the first as it was the first one to be released worldwide. Nes first but only Japan GC first worldwide with peripheral Wii first worldwide out the box.... All three are reasonable depending on the rhetoric I suppose. But really, in terms of gaming, the internet was fairly week prior to the millenium, even when the xbox was released, wasn't dial up still a thing? I remember playing on dial up with my PC and with some games it worked ok.. but on others it was just horrible. Nintendo seem to prefer to wait for technologies to be mainstream, not emerging, before they embrace them. Same story for HD and arguably several other techs too. So I can understand them not looking too seriously at the net while the GC was being developed, and the modem being, essentially, a last minute consideration (I do think having a lan/modem adapter incorporated would have been a more astute move but can understand them not making it in preference for cost) The Wii I think is where they made a huge mistake. Both the power increase (not enough) and not developing the internet side of things, using a second party service which has collapsed, leaving them a generation behind in terms of know how. Essentially the majority of the "experience" online with the Wii was redundant and the Wii U is like GC 1.5 in terms of net experience for them (because they did have time to see the outside world/piece together bits from the wii service) So yes, I would expect the Wii U to be behind the PS4 and X1. In terms of what I expect from the NX, still some positive progress, but I suspect that it will be somewhere between 1.75 and 1.95 (on an arbitrary scale where X1 and PS4 are around 2) Remember that they have their new Nintendo Network up and running, so they look like they have put some effort behind the scenes and who knows, they may actually surprise us all. So how long till the NX reveal?
Ashley Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 Nes first but only JapanGC first worldwide with peripheral Wii first worldwide out the box.... All three are reasonable depending on the rhetoric I suppose. But really, in terms of gaming, the internet was fairly week prior to the millenium, even when the xbox was released, wasn't dial up still a thing? I remember playing on dial up with my PC and with some games it worked ok.. but on others it was just horrible. Nintendo seem to prefer to wait for technologies to be mainstream, not emerging, before they embrace them. Same story for HD and arguably several other techs too. So I can understand them not looking too seriously at the net while the GC was being developed, and the modem being, essentially, a last minute consideration (I do think having a lan/modem adapter incorporated would have been a more astute move but can understand them not making it in preference for cost) ...(because they did have time to see the outside world/piece together bits from the wii service) Oh yeah there's different ways you can argue it, obviously. Was just pointing out why I would personally consider the GameCube the first one. Hell the DreamCast had a greater online service and it was released three years before the GameCube And for what it's worth, the GameCube was released after the millennium Didn't Nintendo admit a few years ago (maybe around the Wii U launch) they hadn't looked at what Sony and Microsoft did online? They just kind of decided themselves what they want to do without doing any market research?
Ronnie Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 What was wrong with the original Xbox? For the time when it was released it was amazing. Plenty of online games, online chat, the thing was a wonderful piece of kit that helped push online gaming on consoles. Wii and Wii U have online too. The Xbox 360 was when Microsoft got online spot on, on their second attempt. Let's see if Nintendo can do it on their third, altough they're after a very different market.
Hero-of-Time Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 It will be interesting to see if any of these online wants/needs get addressed with the NX. If they do then what they hell are we going discuss and arguing about? Didn't Nintendo admit a few years ago (maybe around the Wii U launch) they hadn't looked at what Sony and Microsoft did online? They just kind of decided themselves what they want to do without doing any market research? Yeah, I remember that. Absolutely baffling that they just ignored what the competition were doing and standardizing.
Ashley Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 It will be interesting to see if any of these online wants/needs get addressed with the NX. If they do then what they hell are we going discuss and arguing about? Lack of VR
Pestneb Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 (edited) And for what it's worth, the GameCube was released after the millennium Didn't Nintendo admit a few years ago (maybe around the Wii U launch) they hadn't looked at what Sony and Microsoft did online? They just kind of decided themselves what they want to do without doing any market research? Sure, but it was in development before the millenium... I can't imagine much is substantially changed in the latter part of design, just the minutiae and then there is preproduction. The PS2 wasn't that big on the online element either was it? And then the dreamcast flopping would hardly have screamed "hey, copy me!" to them... They threw that idea out there. I think just as likely as not that is a cover for "we didn't copy that, we came up with a different way of doing it independently" type thing. The Splatoon developers stated they play on other consoles, right? so some people at Nintendo will know how things work on the competition. And also it's been said that younger employees would be listened to more in the future.... how much of this informs the NX and background infrastructure for online services I guess we have to wait and see. Edited August 14, 2016 by Pestneb
Ashley Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 Sure, but it was in development before the millenium... I can't imagine much is substantially changed in the latter part of design, just the minutiae and then there is preproduction. The PS2 wasn't that big on the online element either was it? And then the dreamcast flopping would hardly have screamed "hey, copy me!" to them... They threw that idea out there. I think just as likely as not that is a cover for "we didn't copy that, we came up with a different way of doing it independently" type thing. The Splatoon developers stated they play on other consoles, right? so some people at Nintendo will know how things work on the competition. And also it's been said that younger employees would be listened to more in the future.... how much of this informs the NX and background infrastructure for online services I guess we have to wait and see. The DreamCast failed in spite of its online. Or at least critically (not sure how much of a financial strain it was on Sega). I can't actually recall the PS2 online architecture, I never actually owned one. Yeah obviously some people within Nintendo use online services and for what it's worth I think Nintendo is now more open in to look outside of itself, I can just remember reading their statement and thinking "that's a bloody stupid approach". But they have certainly changed since those days. I am curious who is part of the decision making group when it comes to the NX. I doubt it's the 'lower' employees but who knows? Maybe they went to their own teams that made online games and asked what could have made it better/easier.
Hero-of-Time Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 The PS2 had a few great online games. Monster Hunter, FFXI, Resident Evil Outbreak, Twisted Metal. It wasn't a patch on Xbox Live, though. Playing online with the PS2 could be a bit of a hassle at times.
Nolan Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 Didn't PS2 online also require a bit of hardware? Or am I just thinking MMOs for the HDD.
Hero-of-Time Posted August 14, 2016 Posted August 14, 2016 Didn't PS2 online also require a bit of hardware? Or am I just thinking MMOs for the HDD. Yeah, a network adaptor was needed if you had an original model. This plugged into the back of the console. If you had the PS2 slim then the adapter wasn't needed as everything was built into the console already.
Nolan Posted August 15, 2016 Posted August 15, 2016 Yeah, a network adaptor was needed if you had an original model. This plugged into the back of the console. If you had the PS2 slim then the adapter wasn't needed as everything was built into the console already. That's what I thought. And Slim models also removed the capability of the HDD. Sooooo PS2 falls into the same sort of category as the GC did in terms of online, just with far more support. (Also of note, Dreamcast only came with 56k and a broadband modem was a separate purchase.)
Hero-of-Time Posted August 15, 2016 Posted August 15, 2016 I found that quote, @Ashley. “We got the chance to talk to some more senior people in Nintendo, via a phone conference, as they were gathering feedback on our development experiences and their toolchain,” the developer wrote. “The discussion started off well enough and covered off our experiences with the hardware and (slow) toolchain and then we steered them towards discussing when the online features might be available. We were told that the features, and the OS updates to support them, would be available before the hardware launch, but only just. There were apparently issues with setting up a large networking infrastructure to rival Sony and Microsoft that they hadn’t envisaged. “This was surprising to hear, as we would have thought that they had plenty of time to work on these features as it had been announced months before, so we probed a little deeper and asked how certain scenarios might work with the Mii friends and networking, all the time referencing how Xbox Live and PSN achieve the same thing. At some point in this conversation we were informed that it was no good referencing Live and PSN as nobody in their development teams used those systems (!) so could we provide more detailed explanations for them?” While looking searching for it I came across this quote from Iwata. It was an interview discussing the online setup of the Wii U, prior to it's launch. Nintendo president Satoru Iwata has said that the company remains uninterested in copying features from successful online gaming services such as Xbox Live and PlayStation Network. "We have not thought that offering the same features that already exist within other online communities would be the best proposal for very experienced game players," Iwata told IGN.
Kav Posted August 15, 2016 Posted August 15, 2016 It used to surprise me, the idiocy of the top brass at Nintendo. Now I just expect it!
khilafah Posted August 15, 2016 Posted August 15, 2016 (edited) That's what I thought. And Slim models also removed the capability of the HDD. Sooooo PS2 falls into the same sort of category as the GC did in terms of online, just with far more support. (Also of note, Dreamcast only came with 56k and a broadband modem was a separate purchase.) Pretty amazing how well that 56k modem performed. I remember playing PSO with the world and NFL 2k1 on a damn dial up connection. Little lag and first experience of online gaming. That shit was the BOMB! It used to surprise me, the idiocy of the top brass at Nintendo. Now I just expect it! Best way dude. I have accepted that Nintendo have no desire to match what the competition does. It's never gonna be on that level as Nintendo don't feel that it has to be. It's sad but it's very true. Edited August 15, 2016 by khilafah
Falcon_BlizZACK Posted August 15, 2016 Posted August 15, 2016 I need some official Nintendo news mane
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