Will Posted June 4, 2009 Posted June 4, 2009 Yeah I don't see how they could use it with the standard PS eye. At the moment there isn't a way it can connect with the controller no? How do you mean? I was under the impression it was just the standard PS Eye available at the moment. I don't see any reason why they would need a new one.
dwarf Posted June 4, 2009 Author Posted June 4, 2009 Well how does the PS eye have a clue what the controllers are? Does the PS3 read it from the camera or does the camera have to read it to relay to the Playstation? Time will tell. It sounded from the conference you wouldnt need anything new.
Daft Posted June 4, 2009 Posted June 4, 2009 It's the standard PSEye which is a pretty advance piece of kit. And it can recognise objects.
Will Posted June 4, 2009 Posted June 4, 2009 It would just be updated software that worked out what the controllers are, the hardware has very little to do with it. In theory any camera that had a high enough resolution could be used in it's place.
Will Posted June 4, 2009 Posted June 4, 2009 My main problem with Natal is it's just a very very sophisticated Eye-Toy, and that didn't get boring because it was rubbish, it got boring because it just doesn't fit that well with regular games. I really think MS have gone completely the wrong route with this where Sony have taken what Nintendo did and improved upon it.
McPhee Posted June 4, 2009 Posted June 4, 2009 The thing with Natal though is just because there's no requirement for a controller doesn't mean you can't use one. It's completely up to the game developer, the system could work in conjunction with the Xbox 360 pad or maybe with some form of one handed controller. If devs choose to make it EyeToy 2.0 it'll suck donkey balls but I don't really see it. Most will cross develop for PS3 and 360 like they are at the moment and work around the differences between the two techs. Not to say there won't be EyeToy style games for it, it's just that the system has the flexibility to do both (just as the PS3 has, although not in such an advanced way).
Diageo Posted June 4, 2009 Posted June 4, 2009 Unlike Wii motion plus it was 1:1 with the player's movements and tracking much faster and accurately. You could get the arrow from behind your back. Use the stick precisely around the tv. You do not know the specs for both and so you cannot say weather one is better than the other. The arrow from behind your back can easily be done with another wii-mote. The stick did not work around the TV because the camera wasn't pointed around the TV, the stick only works where the camera points. They are the same, stop saying one is better because there is no way you can know.
Diageo Posted June 4, 2009 Posted June 4, 2009 We do actually have some specs and a good idea of how they work as many work for companies that use tech like these. The PS3 1:1 thing doesnt use the PSeye camera as much as you are thinking, that wasnt the point of their presentation. Its just an underrated element of the whole thing that already exists right now with games. e.g look at Eyepet out very soon. Are you saying they don't need the camera? Prove it!
Will Posted June 4, 2009 Posted June 4, 2009 The glow-batons are basically WM+ Wiimotes, with the camera used for extra positioning. Its effectively allowing both glow-batons to use the wiimote pointer functionality without having to do any pointing.
Shino Posted June 5, 2009 Posted June 5, 2009 alot more than you thought? For hardcore games this is going to be great. Care to elaborate?
The Lillster Posted June 5, 2009 Posted June 5, 2009 (edited) As a PS3 and Wii owner, I can tell you I am very excited what the PS Remote could bring to the table. Especially since PS3 games can be patched. (I wouldn't mind played Killzone 2 with this remote thing). Edited June 5, 2009 by The Lillster
McPhee Posted June 5, 2009 Posted June 5, 2009 (edited) You do not know the specs for both and so you cannot say weather one is better than the other. The arrow from behind your back can easily be done with another wii-mote. The stick did not work around the TV because the camera wasn't pointed around the TV, the stick only works where the camera points. They are the same, stop saying one is better because there is no way you can know. While nobody outside the informed know the exact spec sheets for these devices it's easy to speculate. We know how the camera thing work but it's also fair to say that pitch and yaw and roll can't be as accurately mapped via that method. To get the kind of accuracy demoed in the press conference you'd need to have gyros (or a similar tech) built inside the wand. It's then fair to assume that if these gyros are inside the PS3 Wand that Sony wouldn't miss out on using them in the same way the Wii does, allowing them to reinforce the coordinate data obtained by the camera as well as providing yaw, pitch and roll data. Essentially you could expect similar (though likely not as good) results to WM+ by turning the camera off. It's only informed speculation, Sony's system might not use gyros at all or might only use pitch, yaw and roll data to calculate pitch, roll and yaw rather than attempting to calculate relative position with it. However if the speculation is correct then you could turn the PSEye off and get near (or equal) performace to WM+. With the camera on the accuracy should be better. This isn't a pro-Sony or anti-Nintendo post btw, it's more of a "Holy smokes, Batman! Your tech rules!" kind of post. I'm more impressed that someone saw the Wiimote and thought "hmm, i wonder what this would be like if we strapped a light bulb to the top, filmed it with a camera and used some clever software to track it's position in 3D?". That kind of innovation is the best, a nice, simple improvement of an existing idea that *should* yield very impressive results. AKA i really couldn't care less what console it's on it's still impressive and I now look forward to seeing what developers can do with it (followed finally by me getting my hands on it, realising it's shite and selling it on :p). Edited June 5, 2009 by McPhee
BeerMonkey Posted June 6, 2009 Posted June 6, 2009 Like in the video. Imagine a game like Uncharted where you use the controller to do everything. Someone needs to invent tactile response! if you play tomb raider on the wii will get sort of the idea
flameboy Posted June 9, 2009 Posted June 9, 2009 One thing I was wondering is how the hell can Natal pick up these kind of movements without the ping pong balls? If this tech is out there why the hell are movie studios still going to all this expense to mo cap when a few of these cameras would do the same thing! My suspicion is it can't pick up quite the depth of movement they are making out? Thinking about this. I think the PS3 solution is quite large and expensive. MS's solution is quite elegant, simple and cheap. Nintendo's is in the middle. Needs work imo. Or it will be another high end situation like the current PS's except an addon. Regarding games i have doubts this will be worked into hardcore games. Seems like publishers want EA sports active(confirmed by EA) type of games. In which case first party will have to fill the gaps as only Sony have spoken about hardcore motion games. Really need to see actual games though i guess. Till then its just useless conjecture. It's not gonna be cheap theres talks of retailing for at least $100. Although I don't expect the PSEye and Wand combo will work out much cheaper, plus you'll need a set for each player. I think for both MS and Sony this is all part of the learning curve for the next gen. Much like MS added Live to xbox and then nailed it for 360, Sony are the same with their online stuff this gen. Whether we will properly see the next gen for a while is another thing. But I think you can expect to see such peripherals packaged with the next gen. Hopefully alongside a standard controller.
Daft Posted June 9, 2009 Posted June 9, 2009 Natal just wont work for gamers because it's trying to out casual everything. Sony will probably just incorporate this tech into a break apart Dual Shock, we've already seen patents of this. As for price, well I already have a PSEye so I'm half way there.
Jamba Posted June 9, 2009 Posted June 9, 2009 It's not gonna be cheap theres talks of retailing for at least $100. Although I don't expect the PSEye and Wand combo will work out much cheaper, plus you'll need a set for each player. Weybush Morgan's Patcher says that the Natal could be between $50 and $100. Really doesn't think that it's going to be very expansive.
McPhee Posted June 9, 2009 Posted June 9, 2009 One thing I was wondering is how the hell can Natal pick up these kind of movements without the ping pong balls? If this tech is out there why the hell are movie studios still going to all this expense to mo cap when a few of these cameras would do the same thing! My suspicion is it can't pick up quite the depth of movement they are making out? It works by picking up the reflections of light off of objects. The reasons for this not yet being used in motion capture in films is because this tech isn't out there yet. Microsoft haven't bought a finished product, they've bought the development process from the company that had the most success developing it. Currently Natal is the most advanced of all of these devices, hence the fuss about it. I doubt movie studios will pick it up for a few years yet though. While it's accurate enough for home uses the studios will require something considerably more accurate.
Shino Posted June 9, 2009 Posted June 9, 2009 If you saw the painting part of the presentation you can see it has nowhere near the resolution needed for films.
Daft Posted June 10, 2009 Posted June 10, 2009 Tretton: PS3 Motion Controller Might Be Back-Compatible Last week at Sony’s E3 press conference, the company unveiled a motion controller for the PlayStation 3. This week, Sony’s President and CEO of SCEA said that the motion controller just might be backwards compatible with older PlayStation 3 games. When asked in an interview with CNBC reporter Chris Morris if updates to existing games would be coming out to make them compatible with the new motion control technology, Jack Tretton responded that he “think that’s absolutely conceivable.†“I think our [motion] controller can be used with every game that’s on the system now — and every game we’re working on,†Tretton continued. Tretton said he believed that the motion control technology that the PlayStation 3 will have is superior to that of Nintendo’s Wii. “Personally, it’s very difficult for me to perceive ‘God of War 3’ being played with the Wii controller,†Tretton said. “It’s a different experience that doesn’t lend itself to certain types of games.†http://www.endsights.com/2009/06/10/tretton-ps3-motion-controller-might-be-back-compatible/ I really think this is what Sony needs to do if they are serious about their motion controls.
dwarf Posted June 11, 2009 Author Posted June 11, 2009 Yeah but it'll probably only be undertaken by a few developers. And the word was 'conceivable' which isn't really a confirmation, more of a 'well we could do it'. Don't know how he means it's different from the Wii controller.
flameboy Posted June 11, 2009 Posted June 11, 2009 Yeah but it'll probably only be undertaken by a few developers. And the word was 'conceivable' which isn't really a confirmation, more of a 'well we could do it'.Don't know how he means it's different from the Wii controller. Because it is true 1:1 movement rather than just using a variety of preset gestures. Although WM+ somewhat negates that issue.
dwarf Posted June 18, 2009 Author Posted June 18, 2009 Sony's claim they were developing motion controls since original Eyetoy. Apparently this video was made in 2000. The guy has the stutter that the bloke at E3 had. Same person?
Caris Posted June 18, 2009 Posted June 18, 2009 Haha, yeah it is and he looks loads younger. So there not just copying Nintendo after all.
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