My swords

[Bren]

who gives a fuck if he likes swords?

 

get over it bitches

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

Art ... no one seems to agree on what it is. So I'll leave it at that.

 

About things being pointless or meaningless, isn't being a nerd meaningless? Hell, isn't being alive meaningless? Couldn't it be argued that life in general is meaningless? What is the meaning of life, anyway?

 

I don't know what the meaning of life is. But I know that I want to make my life as pleasure-filled an experience as possible. Being a nerd gives me pleasure. My interest in swords give me pleasure. A beautiful girl is pleasure for my eyes. A girl I love regardless of looks is pleasure for my soul.

 

EDIT: Gah, forgot the main topic! Damn, sorry. Beautiful swords, Chris. I'm very jealous. :p

[Oxigen_Waste]

I wasn't arguing whether it was an 'artistic' art, and no i'm not talking about fine arts. I'm talking about martial arts.

 

A quick look in the Oxford dictionary provides two definitions of the word art that can apply to the martial arts themselves.

 

4 (arts) subjects of study primarily concerned with human culture

 

Most schools of the martial arts teach that learning to be a great fighter comes second to learning how to become a great human being, and the elements of human culture that allow this.

 

5 a skill

 

Well that's pretty obvious isn't it.

 

Is that all you got? Semanthics?

 

Wow, you know your movies but you know shit all about the martial arts. Firstly Muay Thai does have all that 'philosophy' and stuff beyond what you saw in Ong Bak and now makes you think your an expert on. In fact the art of Muay Thai is extensive and contains multiple progressions, meditations, internal styles and theories.

 

No, it doesn't... I know my Muay Thai, it has tradition and religious customs, but no life spiritual philosophies attached to it (which is what I meant about pretension). I understand traditions and customs, I just don't get the spiritual philosophies attached to these things.

 

Also, that 'pretension' you refer to is a major cornerstone of Eastern culture, containing wisdom and learning passed down over thousands of years on the subject of human nature and the natural laws. If I were you I would really refrain from commenting on, especially degrading something you have never studied and don't understand.

 

Ah, the usual excuse... trying to pass it off as something noble. Seriously, I miss Bruce Lee, one of the few guys who were honest about it, he made Jeet Kune Do as unspiritual as possible, all metaphors going towards emptying your mind... and taking good care off your body... he knew it was a purely physicall drill... and that's why he mastered it, he accepted it's hollowness and made it his own. The greater warrior is that which acts on instinct. Of course this is all pretty subjective, as the importance/significance of martial arts is practically null, thus making it a personal taste or dislike. So I guess this is a pretty pointless argument, there's no greater truth here. It's just you vs me.

 

Art ... no one seems to agree on what it is. So I'll leave it at that.

 

About things being pointless or meaningless, isn't being a nerd meaningless? Hell, isn't being alive meaningless? Couldn't it be argued that life in general is meaningless? What is the meaning of life, anyway?

 

I don't know what the meaning of life is. But I know that I want to make my life as pleasure-filled an experience as possible. Being a nerd gives me pleasure. My interest in swords give me pleasure. A beautiful girl is pleasure for my eyes. A girl I love regardless of looks is pleasure for my soul.

 

Who said anything against that? And yes, all of life is meaningless.

[LazyBoy]

Is that all you got? Semanthics?

 

It does the job.

 

 

No, it doesn't... I know my Muay Thai, it has tradition and religious customs, but no life spiritual philosophies attached to it (which is what I meant about pretension). I understand traditions and customs, I just don't get the spiritual philosophies attached to these things.

 

Then why comment on it? You've obviously never studied it. And yeah Muay Thai does contain the spiritual side, i've met Muay Thai masters who taught me about it. They talk off the spirit of the warrior and protector and their role its spirit in the greater community. Really, trust me on this one.

 

Ah, the usual excuse... trying to pass it off as something noble. Seriously, I miss Bruce Lee, one of the few guys who were honest about it, he made Jeet Kune Do as unspiritual as possible, all metaphors going towards emptying your mind... and taking good care off your body... he knew it was a purely physicall drill... and that's why he mastered it, he accepted it's hollowness and made it his own. The greater warrior is that which acts on instinct. Of course this is all pretty subjective, as the importance/significance of martial arts is practically null, thus making it a personal taste or dislike. So I guess this is a pretty pointless argument, there's no greater truth here. It's just you vs me.

 

You mean the same Bruce Lee that died prematurely? The great-grandmaster of my school lived to 106, and was winning medals at 94. He observed the true nature of the art.

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

Who said anything against that?

 

You sorta did when you argued about something being meaningless and something not being meaningless. When you get that nitpicky about definitions, you can argue that everything is meaningless. I disagree with you about meaning being something definitive.

[Chris the great]

Yeah, I do agree with you, but I suppose because I'm not as fascinated by them, I'm taking it on face value, and I'm bored of japan/anime/swords/rpgs/ninjas in general.

 

I'd prefer to collect Halberds.

 

in fairness, the halberd is very nice. a wedding i was at in durham castle had a display of halberds on the wall. i almost tried to access them, but was rather drunk and decioded not to.

[Oxigen_Waste]

You mean the same Bruce Lee that died prematurely? The great-grandmaster of my school lived to 106, and was winning medals at 94. He observed the true nature of the art.

 

The sad part is, Bruce Lee was a better martial artist than your master and arguably the best martial artist who ever lived.

And c'mon, he died because he was "allergic" to painkillers... Are you telling me your master never had a headache? Seriously, the way you talk it seems like your master was Stephen Hawking...

 

On the Muay Thai subject, I've read countless pages about it, never was it mentioned to have a spiritual component, however, if you spoke to a master and he told you so, I believe that to be the true. Nevertheless, I guess you pretty much got it by now that this is my silly personal fight against spirituality in martial arts, as I personally believe there is no meaning to be had in pain, only in the actions such pain may cause to happen (or not).

 

You sorta did when you argued about something being meaningless and something not being meaningless. When you get that nitpicky about definitions, you can argue that everything is meaningless. I disagree with you about meaning being something definitive.

 

Life is meaningless, this is a universal truth.

That doesn't mean we can't make meaningful for ourselves, though.

 

(Please tell me you're not religious )

[LazyBoy]

The sad part is, Bruce Lee was a better martial artist than your master and arguably the best martial artist who ever lived.

 

No really mate, Bruce Lee was a legend because he broke the tabu of bringing Kungfu to the West, but by no means was he either the greatest martial artist of all time or even the greatest martial artist of his generation. Not by a long way. He was not some prodigy child of the arts, the only difference between him and any other student was that he liked the fame.

 

c'mon, he died because he was "allergic" to painkillers... Are you telling me your master never had a headache? Seriously, the way you talk it seems like your master was Stephen Hawking...

 

Let's just say i've seen some fascinating sh*t.

 

the Muay Thai subject, I've read countless pages about it, never was it mentioned to have a spiritual component, however, if you spoke to a master and he told you so, I believe that to be the true. Nevertheless, I guess you pretty much got it by now that this is my silly personal fight against spirituality in martial arts, as I personally believe there is no meaning to be had in pain, only in the actions such pain may cause to happen (or not).

 

 

I think this is where you may be misunderstanding (and please don't think I'm trying to be patronising here). The martial arts aren't about inflicting pain (not true martial arts at least). It's about discipline of the mind, body and spirit. Control over oneself, and the correct way to live. You may look at kickboxing and think "that's not art", and no it's not. But you're looking at the wrong stuff. The great martial arts are about far more than petty competition or flashy jumps. They're about the beauty that lies in training, persistence, endurance, discipline and respect. That is why it is art.

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

Life is meaningless, this is a universal truth.

That doesn't mean we can't make meaningful for ourselves, though.

 

(Please tell me you're not religious )

 

BINGO! There! I nailed you! You have just admitted that meaningfulness is something we create for ourselves! Which contradicts what you've been arguing so ferociously through this whole thread.

 

But what do my religious beliefs have to do with this?

[Raining_again]

I can't believe people are getting so het up about his swords, good god, give the guy a break.

 

If the he gets pleasure out of collecting them then there's nothing wrong with that.

 

@ chris the great: Is there much aftercare involved with them, or is it just an ornamental thing?

[Zero]

Life is meaningless, this is a universal truth.

 

PROVE IT!!!!

 

 

Anyway, let's not have anymore meaningless arguements about art, life, etc... We should try to at least stick to the topic of this thread.

 

What sword do you plan on getting next Chris_the_great?

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

PROVE IT!!!!

 

 

Anyway, let's not have anymore meaningless arguements about art, life, etc... We should try to at least stick to the topic of this thread.

 

What sword do you plan on getting next Chris_the_great?

 

Agreed, we are getting carried away. Even I who normally defend on-topic-ness.

 

I'd actually like to see your other swords, Chris. I'm very fascinated by Japanese swords in particular.

[Chris the great]

I can't believe people are getting so het up about his swords, good god, give the guy a break.

 

If the he gets pleasure out of collecting them then there's nothing wrong with that.

 

@ chris the great: Is there much aftercare involved with them, or is it just an ornamental thing?

 

well, if you use oil, and alot of the metal is exposed often, its a ton of after care, though i use a wax, which should last as long as i live, provided i got a good covering.

 

PROVE IT!!!!

 

 

Anyway, let's not have anymore meaningless arguements about art, life, etc... We should try to at least stick to the topic of this thread.

 

What sword do you plan on getting next Chris_the_great?

 

theres a viking sword posted a page back i think, im very tempted by that, but im more likly to go for a better katana, with a matching wakazashi.

 

a big two handed war sword would also be nice.

 

in a few years, im hoping i can aford a couple of grand to have a blacksmith tailor make me a sword, ive had a few designs in mind (some being used in a book im attempting to write) but nothing is set.

 

i may go for a helmet or sheild if i can afford a decent one, a replica of the gladiator helmet may be good for dispalying the gladius.

[Zero]

i may go for a helmet or sheild if i can afford a decent one, a replica of the gladiator helmet may be good for dispalying the gladius.

 

We had a gladiator helmet and armour in my high school that we got to wear. The helmet was the most uncomfortable thing i've ever worn. I'm sure we eventually had to pad because it was starting to cut people (there was a big, sharp pointy bit inside it. Might have been why it was so uncomfortable :p).

[Chris the great]

well, this is maximus helmet from the films, its very nice, but a tad over priced.

 

may go for a knights helmet instead

some of these seem pretty nice.

[Kirkatronics]

Princeton got ir right. Except for the beautifull. It's pretty much proven... fashion has attempted several times to be recognized as the "8th art", and it will never be it, because it's not significant, merely beuatifull. Beauty means nothing or something pretty close to nothing.

 

 

 

I'm not saying it's meaningless, I'm saying it's pointless. It obviously holds some meaning to him, or else he wouldn't do it, right? Also, doing something just because it makes you feel good is infantile gratification, like masturbation, which is alright, do it as much as you like, just don't claim it's something more than it is, which is what I'm blaming him for, not collecting them. I mean, collecting swords is ok, what's not ok is for him to claim they are something which they obviously are not. You know, denying facts is kinda lame.

 

 

You gather wrong... Princeton kinda nailed it, it's pretty much the creation of things that appeal to your senses, emotions and thought, while being significant.

 

It's my opinion? No, it isn't. Honey, I collect rubber dicks. It's pointless. I admit it. I love chainsaws and plan on getting some, it's pointless, I admit it. Swords are also pointless, and I have a genuine love for swords, spears, halberds and most of all, axes. I'd love to have some. It's still pointless, despite what I may think. And this is what I'm saying: I, me, the person me, is wrong. I'm wrong, my opinion is incorrect. It is WRONG. Because no matter how much I may derive from collecting these things, nothing changes the FACT that they are pointless and meaningless objects. It's what they are, no matter what you think of it, that's reality. Want me to admit I'm wrong? Prove to me that it isn't so.

 

 

 

Once again, I'm not saying it's wrong to collect swords and enjoy them, I'm just saying it's wrong to claim them to be anything more than what they are: stunningly beautiful ornaments designed to establish atmosphere, NOT art. I love swords, I just preffer to spend my time on more enriching experiences... It's like the difference between having sex with someone you have no feelings for and having it with someone you love, they're both great, but while one of them is an enriching experience, the other one is just empty pleasure, thus making it a worst experience, overall. Make sense?

So no one gets emotional over swords? They are thought envoking, and are significant. your trying to force your view down our necks again, i believe youve done something like this before.

 

And yes, swords do have a point.. Theyre vvery sharp ones too!

 

these aren't art. Craftsmanship (in a limited sense- none of these are unique, right? but not art by any means. Nooooo way.

Id consider them art, even if they can be mass produced.

 

 

Also, id consider some ornaments art/istic.

[Zero]

And yes, swords do have a point.. Theyre vvery sharp ones too!

 

QFT. Your wit is just as sharp.

[EEVILMURRAY]

*Saves this response for the next time Murray shows a painted figure.*

The suspense is killing me.

 

[Chris the great]

Well done?

 

 

yeah, that was sweeeeeeeeeeet

[Rummy]

The sad part is, Bruce Lee was a better martial artist than your master and arguably the best martial artist who ever lived.

And c'mon, he died because he was "allergic" to painkillers... Are you telling me your master never had a headache? Seriously, the way you talk it seems like your master was Stephen Hawking...

 

On the Muay Thai subject, I've read countless pages about it, never was it mentioned to have a spiritual component, however, if you spoke to a master and he told you so, I believe that to be the true. Nevertheless, I guess you pretty much got it by now that this is my silly personal fight against spirituality in martial arts, as I personally believe there is no meaning to be had in pain, only in the actions such pain may cause to happen (or not).

 

 

 

Life is meaningless, this is a universal truth.

That doesn't mean we can't make meaningful for ourselves, though.

 

(Please tell me you're not religious )

 

Man, I don't know much about alot, but I gotta say I take a certain arrogance from this post. Seriously Oxigen, do you not see it? I don't even care whether you're right or wrong(for the record, you're both wrong, or right, or a bit of both each, sometimes there just isn't right and wrong). As I said, I don't know alot about much, but I'm sure the spiritual aspects of certain martial arts(and sure, maybe later developed styles did away with it, just how things and views change in our world) are perfectly valid in their own way. On top of which, without such aspects at some point in their history, they would not be what they are now today, and some appreciation should be shown for that fact, surely? I do not agree that a martial art is simply about fighting or bashing the crap out of the other guy as hard and fast as you can, do you think they all stem from that? I thought a shit load of them were devloped by buddhist monks anyway, aren't those guys all about the peace and that?

 

On a more broader aspect of your attitude however, I think you should chill out and step back. You seem to have so much conviction in your opinion as if it were fact, I'm not saying not to have conviction in your own opinion, it's only natural to do so, just be aware of the possibility it neccessarily right, or the only way, or that there are no other possible alternatives, such an attitude just makes you look like a shit person, at least to me anyway.

Art is art, art is defined and undefined, and different people have different interests, so someone has interests for their own reasons they then present, who are YOU to tell them their own reasoning is wrong? You cannot base it off the same assumptions you base your own, that's just plain foolish, surely?