Retro_Link Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 Right first off soul caliber and f-zero franchises are about 80% multiplayer to 20% single player game experiences. Second, a predominately single player based adventure needs a strong rewarding story. Why do you think a game like GoW or Final Fantasy or even Fire Emblem keep people playing is it for the gameplay, no! Its for the bloody story. Secondly, it doesn't create more fluid gameplay, fluid gameplay comes from a nice neat story from which the characters have objectives so that buy the end of the game all of their realisations have been fulfilled.No fluid gameplay comes from the game being well designed, a game can have as large or small a story as it wants and still have fluid gameplay! This game is in no way trying to compare itself to an epic single player adventure game such as those you've mentioned, nor is it any kind of RPG that needs an grand story! Yes, the game has 'Adventure' in the title, but it is more of a puzzle game along the lines of Super Monkey Ball, Billy Hatcher etc... Super Monkey Ball 'Adventure' (despite being rubbish), had Adventure in the title, but it's main concern was the rolling gameplay in the adventure and standard stages! Pikmin is another prime example! Dewey's Adventure (the adventure is also a tentative title) is about gameplay! Are you actually expecting to be able to compare this game to adventure games such as Zelda, Resident Evil, Final Fantasy, Gears etc... because I think that's where you're going wrong!
James McGeachie Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 So it can produce smoke, I want them pushing the wii harder on the graphics. Not just leave them like it is. They even specifically said they were pushing the graphics technology with this game, they HAVE put a lot of effort into it, the style is rock solid and perfectly fitting to the game and they've put the extra power into effects that fit the style, such as normal mapping on enemies (incredible accomplishment on Wii) and some nice smoke effects, etc, but you don't seem to "get" how a game developer's mind works going by all your posts so I don't know why I'm bothering to type this, you're utterly clueless about game design. Really there are 2 ways a game can originate. There are games that come from someone writing out a story that they want people to experience in game form and then there's games that originate from a gameplay concept, where the story is just a means to an end. Nintendo are ALL about the concepts, Miyamoto specifically has stated he starts any game design with just one simple concept. That's how it should be, becauce the core gameplay is the most important thing to any game as if it sucks, then you don't want to play it. Here's some points you may not have realised. Every Zelda game has started with concepts rather than story. Wind Waker would've originated solely from the sailing idea and the visual theme, they worked from there and created the story around that (they'll have got the idea of sinking Hyrule from asking the question "how do we create a world that's mostly water?".) Majora's Mask was the concept of the 3 day system and how to make clever time based puzzles. Ocarina of Time was the process of recreating the entire Zelda formula for 3d, the story was nowhere near the main focus. Link to the Past was using the extra power of the Snes to expand all the gameplay possibilities they'd set up in the previous games and figure out exciting new ones. I could go on and and on for the other 2d games but would rather not. Twilight Princess I think is one of the few games where it's a bit different because I think they started off from the idea that they wanted to make the ultimate Zelda for fans, that was their initial reason for creating the game. I think they wanted to avoid trying to go for any groundbreakingly different concepts in that respect and just decided to go with the idea of being able to transform into an animal, to see what new gameplay elements they could invent that way. Another random examples for upcoming games by the way are like Super Mario Galaxy, which would've came from 2 ideas, Mario running complete around spherical objects and Mario being in Space. The story would've came from the question "So why does Mario go into space?" Anyway the point of this whole thing was really to say that the point of visuals of a game aren't always to be as realistic and demanding on the system as possible. If the conept for a game actually IS "Mindblowing visuals with a story worthy of them" or something then yeah, it is, but those type of games are more 360/PS3 territory and yes, that IS what game's like Gears of War and Final Fantasy build upon. Nintendo's philosiphy is to build things from the ground up with a strong, creative gameplay concept as the foundation. The visuals and story are a means to an end and although graphics are of course very important to the game, they don't have to rip the system's power at simply for the sake of it, they just need to be as good looking as need be to fit the game's mood and style. Don't know why I bothered to type that anyway, you're obviously an idiot who wont read it.
Hellfire Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 Wow James, I... uh.... totally agree with you. This is odd.
pedrocasilva Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 ^ Nice post James McGeachie Completly right for that matter, Nintendo tends to focus on gameplay then on history, that's Miyamoto's way of doing things I guess. Continuing your reasoning about mario in Space... shouldn't it be pretty cold there? But we don't see mario is a astronaut suit, should there be sound? sound doesn't get transmited in sapce, should there be air? I don't think so, and why do tilting the controller arround stars makes it as if you where in a cannon, who shoots you into another plannet? Right, makes no sense, and I(we) don't care at all, the game just looks FUN.
Speedfreak Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 He designed the gameplay first and then the story. Urk! Why didn't he design the story first then made the gameplay match seems a bit clueless if you ask me The fact that you, ZeldaFreak, are saying this when Zelda games are designed in this exact way is fucking mind-boggling.
ZeldaFreak Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 Em well its like this: (1)Majoras mask - we want to tell the story of link losing navi (2)Wind waker - we want to tell the story of link trying to rescue his sister I have jut attened a lecture today at uni all about this sought of thing. We have to think of a story and from that explain the gameplay concepts. And turn this in a project design document. All great gameplay innovations come from truely unique stories.
The Bard Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 All great gameplay innovations come from truely unique stories. Er...I fail to recall any particularly unique story traits in Tetris and Super Mario Bros...o_0... I'd have to say you're talking bullshit. But then thats not much of a deviation from the norm is it?... As for this games degree you're supposed to be doing at uni; I say it's a load of bollocks...
Retro_Link Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 All great gameplay innovations come from truely unique stories.Yeah you keep saying that and it really is one of the stupidest comments!There are probably way more innovative games with no/poor stories than those with good stories!
ZeldaFreak Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 Er...I fail to recall any particularly unique story traits in Tetris and Super Mario Bros...o_0... I'd have to say you're talking bullshit. But then thats not much of a deviation from the norm is it?... As for this games degree you're supposed to be doing at uni; I say it's a load of bollocks... Well its to train you as a games programmer but they teach you core elements of design. Anyway I think this game looks crap and will be reviewing it when it comes out for a friends site. So meh, do I bother what a bunch of randoms on the internet think. Do I? The answer is no!
pedrocasilva Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 Anyway I think this game looks crap and will be reviewing it when it comes out for a friends site. So meh, do I bother what a bunch of randoms on the internet think. Do I? The answer is no! We don't care about you either. But still, you're nitpicking everything about this title, even if you pick it afterwards, you won't like it, you don't want to like it. Zelda's are made first gameplay and scenarios, then the rest, complain all you want, but it's true. Dewy's Adventure seems to be a puzzle game, complaining about it not being epic and whatnot it's just... dumb. Now go troll the DDR thread too, since it's clearly gameplay over story.
The Bard Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 Well its to train you as a games programmer but they teach you core elements of design. Anyway I think this game looks crap and will be reviewing it when it comes out for a friends site. So meh, do I bother what a bunch of randoms on the internet think. Do I? The answer is no! Er, right, even though I find it hard to believe that you actually managed to get into university with your total inability to actually spell, punctuate or even string basic sentences together, I'm gonna go ahead and take your word for it on that one. As for not caring for a bunch of "randoms' think, surely that can't be the case, you'd have to be a right dumbass in coming to an online forum. Oh wait.
mcj metroid Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 He designed the gameplay first and then the story. Urk! Why didn't he design the story first then made the gameplay match seems a bit clueless if you ask me First you are a graphics whore and now this?games do not need storys.Sure it is certainly better but gameplay comes first.Why did you buy a wii?
SimonM7 Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 All great gameplay innovations come from truely unique stories. Absolutely terrifying statement.
McMad Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 Looks weird, but I have liked kiddy games in the past. Lets just hope this is a game who's artistic design is reflected in its gameplay, e.g. Klonoa. (Namco really should make a sequel by now...)
Fresh Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 *Thread title changed to "ZeldaFreaks great fall from fame"*
ZeldaFreak Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 First you are a graphics whore and now this?games do not need storys.Sure it is certainly better but gameplay comes first.Why did you buy a wii? I bought a wii, because simply I believed the spin doctor, Reggie.
Speedfreak Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 Em well its like this: (1)Majoras mask - we want to tell the story of link losing navi (2)Wind waker - we want to tell the story of link trying to rescue his sister I have jut attened a lecture today at uni all about this sought of thing. We have to think of a story and from that explain the gameplay concepts. And turn this in a project design document. All great gameplay innovations come from truely unique stories. Congraluations, you've identified yourself to me as the third jackass on this here forum. Seriously, are you totally braindead? You honestly think the starting points for Majora's Mask was a story about Link losing Navi when Navi wasn't even mentioned IN THE ENTIRE BLOODY GAME? I really must thank you, arguing with someone has never been so easy as now. I can cripple your entire arguement with one statement!
ZeldaFreak Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 Congraluations, you've identified yourself to me as the third jackass on this here forum. Seriously, are you totally braindead? You honestly think the starting points for Majora's Mask was a story about Link losing Navi when Navi wasn't even mentioned IN THE ENTIRE BLOODY GAME? I really must thank you, arguing with someone has never been so easy as now. I can cripple your entire arguement with one statement! Yes majoras mask travelling through the forest the skelleton kid thing steals epona and navi hows that. Who may I ask are the two other jackasses then.
The Bard Posted February 6, 2007 Posted February 6, 2007 Looks weird, but I have liked kiddy games in the past. Lets just hope this is a game who's artistic design is reflected in its gameplay, e.g. Klonoa. (Namco really should make a sequel by now...) + 2043704753874584754 billion props to you for even acknowledging the awesomeness that was Klonoa 2 for PS2. The GBA games are pretty awesome too.
Dante Posted April 20, 2007 Author Posted April 20, 2007 Dewy's Adventure IGN's Hands-on Those of you lucky enough to get your hands on a Wii in the past few months are likely thankful to Konami for its early investment in the console. Last year, the company had one of the finest launch-window games in the form of Elebits, a fun, light-hearted romp that made great use of the Wii controller. Elebits turned out to be a sleeper hit, increasing the notoriety of the game's producer, Shingo Mukaitoge. A few months ago -- at the Konami Gamers Day -- Mukaitoge announced the development of Dewy's Adventure, a new Wii-exclusive title headed to the console later this year. Recently, Konami was kind enough to stop by our offices with the latest build of the game so that we could do the dew for ourselves. Dewy's Adventure has a look and feel that is somewhat similar to Elebits. The game centers on an animated dew droplet charged with saving the world from the forces of the maniacal Don Hedron. Dewy (as the lead has been so cleverly dubbed) happens to be the last surviving hope the world has of defeating Don Hedron and eliminating his Dark Water from this world. To rid the earth of this blight, Dewy must traverse a series of platform stages while solving puzzles, fending off baddies, and cleaning up puddles of Dark Water. Much like other Wii titles including Super Monkey Ball: Banana Blitz and Kororinpa: Marble Mania, Dewy's Adventure uses the Wiimotes's accelerometers to tilt the world and thereby move Dewy. Luckily, with Dewy's Adventure, Konami sidestepped the problems that those aforementioned games ran into regarding the tilt controls; namely the discomfort associated with holding the Wiimote in the standard pointer position. Dewy's Adventure forgoes this, opting instead for the horizontal alignment seen in Excite Truck and Super Paper Mario. This works out great for the game, as the controls feel more fluid than earlier tilt-based Wii titles. The controls are fairly sensitive, allowing for players to maneuver Dewy with minimal effort. Because of the small number of buttons available while holding the Wiimote in this position, Dewy only has a limited selection of moves. The '2' button jumps, whereas the '1' button pulls off a slam attack. Dewy's attack can only be executed if you have built up enough momentum, so you will often need a sliding start before you can come crashing down onto an enemy. Beyond those most basic maneuvers, players can also use the Wiimote's motion-sensing capabilities to execute different skills. The player can move the Wiimote in a fanning motion to create gusts of wind or in a side-to-side motion to cause an earthquake. These abilities will hopefully be used to solve puzzles later on in the game, although their efficacy was pretty limited in the early stages. From what we played, the majority of the game's puzzles revolve around Dewy's temperature-altering abilities. Pressing down on the d-pad will lower the temperature of the world, which will not only turn the ground into ice, but also freeze Dewy, making him all the more formidable in combat. Pressing up on the d-pad will increase the environmental temperature, turning Dewy into a cloud of vapor and giving him the ability to rain lightning bolts down on the unsuspecting enemies. These bolts of lightning are weak and simply stun most enemies, although they can be charged up to deliver a devastating shockwave to a number of enemies caught in the wake of the blast. While these temperature-based transformations do increase Dewy's strength, they do not come without their drawbacks. When in vapor form, Dewy will float above the stage, but will be immobile unless blown around by stray gusts of wind. Similarly, Dewy may have an improved set of combo attacks when frozen, but controlling him will become more difficult as he slips across the icy terrain. These temperature alterations are limited in time; a meter of the left side of the screen will begin counting down as soon as the ability is activated, although this was never too intrusive in our experience with the game. In the levels that we played, these abilities were used primarily for combat rather than for puzzle solving, although we were promised that later stages would offer more of the latter than we were privy to. In the early stages, the puzzle solving was limited to flipping all sorts of switches with Dewy's various skills to unlock new pathways. However, in one later boss fight against a chameleon enemy, players will have to freeze the ground so that the boss's tongue will get frozen in place, allowing the player to bash him over the head unmolested. This was a nice little touch, and we are hoping that there are a wealth of puzzle-solving elements like this spread throughout the rest of the game. As Dewy makes it through the world, he must save his friends from the oppressive Dark Water that holds them prisoner. He does this simply by gliding over them, and restoring them to a pristine state. Much like in Elebits, at the end of each level, players are giving a letter grade based on how many little buddies were freed as well as how long it took players to work their way through the levels. In fact, Dewy's Adventure bears more in common with Elebits than we could have previously assumed. The game even features a similar level creator and photo-taking option to Elebits, although just how either of them works in the game is yet to be divulged. We did find out that these user-created levels will be playable by up to four people in some sort of multiplayer mode, although it was unclear exactly how this would work in the game. Konami reps confirmed that both your photos and edited levels can be shared with other players via WiiConnect24, which is most definitely a welcome addition. Anyone reading up to this point has most likely caught on the fact that Dewy's Adventure is heavily cutesy -- almost saccharine -- in tone. While this might get in the way of some people's enjoyment of the game, we couldn't help but find ourselves smiling as Dewy's compatriots called out to him in little squeaks and yelps. The enemies in the game are equally cute, retaining the same monochromatic, primary color scheme as the rest of the game's world. Nevertheless, the enemy designs were pretty awesome for the most part, sporting some nice soft shading and lighting effects as well as normal mapping on some of the more striking foes. The art design for the enemies was equally appealing; creating a sort of twisted, nightmarish tone to what would otherwise be a fairly carefree game. The relatively simple graphical presentation of the game was still quite polished. There were a number of small graphical touches that help liven up the game's visuals. When using the temperature alteration, the screen will become lightly misty when hot, and icy when cold. The game also employed some beautiful depth of field blur at many points. Minor additions like this subtly augmented the game's overall visual presentation. As is rapidly becoming standard for Wii games, Dewy's Adventure was running in 480p and widescreen. Several of us at IGN were huge fans of Elebits, so it is nice to see Konami allowing Mukaitoge the chance to try his hand at yet another original IP. While Dewy's Adventure was most certainly designed with kids in mind, the puzzle-solving and platforming elements should hopefully prove fun for even the most hardcore gamers. Mukaitoge started development on Dewy at almost the same time as Elebits, so it will certainly be interesting to see what he can do with an extended development time. We should getting a more complete build in the coming weeks, so be sure to check back for all the Dewy's Adventure coverage you can handle. In the meantime, be sure to check below for new screens and a beautiful new trailer. Screens Video Compilation of New Dewy Footage
Tyson Posted April 20, 2007 Posted April 20, 2007 I don't know what looks better graphics-wise, this or Mario Galaxy, but in terms of character models, I think this actually looks nicer.
Zechs Merquise Posted April 20, 2007 Posted April 20, 2007 The graphics are nice, and it is very bright and colourful. Still looks like a kids game, sorry but this kind of thing will never appeal to me.
DCK Posted April 20, 2007 Posted April 20, 2007 Awesome visuals. Hope this game will be a challenge though, that's about the only problem this one seems to face yet.
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