Nintendo subforum opinion on my(Rummy's) ongoing moderatorship (now open, all comments welcomed!)

[Rummy]

TL;DR - this spawned out of a moderation comment I made within the Nintendo Switch Online thread; the premise of this thread is essentially as follows; though due to the nature and splitting it is difficult to elaborate upon the original points within earlier posts, so I will post a summary/quote of the original prompting post here, and some follow-up afterwards/later.

Quote

If you, or anyone else here, has a real major problem with my recent posts and intent to moderate - I'm going to give an option of deselecting me as a moderator. This is setting no precedent, nobody else within the N-E staffing are to be held account to the the same process in future, as this is an extension of my choice to 'resign' as a moderator. I'm literally doing this right here right now on this spot, having asked nobody else; so here it is:

If you or anyone else has an issue with me remaining as a moderator of this forum or my moderation approach(past and very recent present, as I acknowledge a long period of quietness and absences) or even merely discuss this point openly then I'll give full reign for a topic to be posted within the week, quoting this latter section, seeking the democracy of the Nintendo sub-forum and its members. I've long been tired of trying to moderate and being told 'nobody else' or 'only you' in response and unwittingly inciting and inflaming petty battles due to underlying tensions - so if you feel or anyone is confident to do so then please post a thread with Nintendo sub-forum about my moderatorship and enquiring as to whether other members are happy to have me moderate and my interventions. Please quote this bolded and 'embiggened' text in doing so, so that other mods are aware of my proposal and the legitimacy of the thread.

Now there's a srs tl;dr warning to come with this - so be prepared to be called if you don't read it all. First things first;

Apologies -  these are owed both to other staff here for essentially once again being renegade and undertaking things on the spur of a moment of my own accord without discussion due to my afforded authority as a mod; I like to follow a democratic process but fully recognise I often initiate these independently. Next - apologies to any members affected by my posts and the subsequent derailing of the original thread; it wasn't my intention and I thought I'd be able to edit it better than I managed at the time (but I'll come to this too).

What this thread is -  this thread is an extension of my own personal right to resign my moderatorship and nothing else. Nobody else within N-Europe has either sanctioned this or its approach nor should they be held to account due to my actions regardless of what arguments are made. I will stick to and enforce this steadfastly whilst I still have the power to do so.

What this thread isn't - a thread regarding my, or anyone's, right to a presence on the forums in place of modship. Sacrificing my modship does not mean I will abandon these forums as a member. I will continue, until informed otherwise by those who have the say, to exist as a member of this community and these forums. I will continue as a member of these forums, and most likely still express similar views where I can, albeit not from a moderator PoV. Having said this, I am more than happy to have my conduct both as a member, and as a moderator, freely questioned without judgement on those passing it within this thread. I can't guarantee outcomes of any of this, but I will do my best to take everything on board. This includes feedback from other moderators/admins if they wish to contribute; but these are views of these members are members and nothing else. It is no indication of 'official' positions etc. Ofc, if anyone wishes to try and captialised in any sort of percieved division if a criticism comes from a fellow staff member - people are free to do so. I will say resolutely I have very high faith in all of the admin, moderation, and writing staff of the forum. If I did not I would not feel resolute enough to suggest or post this thread.

Why is this thread -  I've always seen problems with this community and in particular this sub-forum. I get frustrated trying to strike a balnace between making the community friendly, welcoming and hospitable for all that they stick around; as well as not acting too harshly in my moderation as to dissuade people from posting. Some members may consider other certain members problematic - but it's a fact that more often than not the views being held and expressed are perfectly valid but the manner in which that expression is conducted is not necessarily always so, imo.

What if you want to say something, but not publicly? - I'm considering this, and probably an anonymous poll as a final result of this, with the ability for those members who wish to put their names publicly to any views they hold in addition. If you wish to comment on the matter, outside of here, please feel free to get in touch with me or another member of staff via PM(again apologies to colleagues I've unexpectedly burdened :p). I am NOT seeking to shut down or stifle any discussion, but I recognise also that some do not wish to necessarily get involved in such public drama etc. where their name will be attached.

But what does this all MEAN? - I can't actually be 100% sure or honest yet. Basically(as seen below in original post) - I get tired trying to moderate and being told it's just me, nobody cares, I'm wrong etcetc. Particularly of note is that I actually feel I'm quite liberal and avoidant of moving too quickly towards punishments such as bans or official warnings. I am not looking to exclude any members from this community if they have productive contributions or points to make or, but I am not keen if I feel them being made in unproductive ways. Depending on the outcome I may become more decisive/harsh in my moderation actions - but I will aim to ensure this isn't just giving me some limitless power to act indiscriminately. As I have always offered - a continuing path of resolution through PMs or public visitor messages will be available(I'm not seeking to act behind any closed doors). I think, in fact, that transparency in my actions are of the best benefit to the forum; hence this topic!

 

But what about you, Rummy? - Good question. My actual response separate from outlining the nature of this thread is going to be made in a post I'll link this comment to as soon as I've made it as a response post to the things I wish to. Please be mindful if just reading the reason for the numerous preceding posts is because this started in another topic and splits preserve times of posting etc. - actual response is this post here now

 

So wait, WHAT is this thread about again? - Ah. Basically are you guys happy with me being a mod, trying to mod, and continuing to do so? Judging on this or past performances? I just do it cos the place is close to my heart, and I've still got strangely high/big hopes for the place. I want the community nice for that though, so I maybe moderate to a level people think is unnecessary. If you agree, or disagree, let it be known! If I continue I do it for here, if I stop, I stop for here too. What sort of mod truly wants to mod where its not seen to be needed by the moderated??

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OP - with quotes and clicks for following back as needed. I had to draw a line somewhere and started with this.

10 hours ago, dazzybee said:

I don't think any (bar you) thought it was flaimbating or trolling. And they're not even remotely contradictory. One is a genuine questions I asked Shiekah, the other is my opinion on the matter. Whatever the answer to the first, doesn't change my opinion. How is that contradictory?

 

Now I've already given you the wiggle room in my original response - but I'll make it clear again. It's probably just your phrasing and not an intent; but I'll take the opportunity to explain to you (unrelated to moderation, I actually agreed with the sentiment of your post).

 

On 19/02/2018 at 9:36 AM, dazzybee said:

Has any company added online after a time and not charged for it?

 

On 19/02/2018 at 2:31 PM, dazzybee said:

I don't care if no ones ever launched a service half way through.

You have posted a question, and within less than 6 hours - responded to a member who has legitimately answered that question by literally stating 'I don't care'. If you did not, or do not, care, then why post the question in the first place for any reason other than to bait or troll? To re-iterate - I am not claiming this is your intent but I highlighted this so that you can hopefully see how it can logically appear. If you reversed the positions, how would you feel? Shall I ask you questions all the the time and then dismiss any response you make with 'I don't care'? What positive discussion does that foster, regardless of intent? So, and to remind you I'm only advising you, consider your conduct and how it can be perceived.

Next up - and I'm not sure why this seems to keep coming up as a point; 

Quote

I don't think any (bar you) thought it was flaimbating or trolling.

So? Does it matter what YOU think regarding this? Yes, that is a very personal approach to start out that argument; but I think you struggle to see this from points of view other than your own, personal, one - and I will expand on why I've made my point like this. The population from which you draw to think you have not asked - nor is it necessarily their place or desire to openly complain or express that view. Why? Because they are here as members and not moderators (of which groups I belong to both, and have to strike a balance in the moderation aspect) - but the idea of moderators is that they are relied upon by the community to police and ensure it is as they expect and take action on their behalf, in order to ensure a good community that fosters productive discussion - at at least that is what I presume the majority of our members are here for. Take into account discussions had with us in private, by a variety of users, and that that avenue is always open to any member of the forum.

Naturally I realise that my posts as a moderator disrupt the flow of a thread or conversation - which is why I usually tend to encourage further discussion of points either via PM, or those wishing to have a public audience or public matter of record, upon my visitor wall. Given this, can I ask that when it's obviously something I'm bringing up regarding conduct rather than the topic at hand - that we please try to pursue the above methods of communicating in response rather than adding it to the thread at hand in what has long already been at times, in my opinion, a rocky community for encouraging some to stick around.

________________________________________________________________

 

If you, or anyone else here, has a real major problem with my recent posts and intent to moderate - I'm going to give an option of deselecting me as a moderator. This is setting no precedent, nobody else within the N-E staffing are to be held account to the the same process in future, as this is an extension of my choice to 'resign' as a moderator. I'm literally doing this right here right now on this spot, having asked nobody else; so here it is:

If you or anyone else has an issue with me remaining as a moderator of this forum or my moderation approach(past and very recent present, as I acknowledge a long period of quietness and absences) or even merely discuss this point openly then I'll give full reign for a topic to be posted within the week, quoting this latter section, seeking the democracy of the Nintendo sub-forum and its members. I've long been tired of trying to moderate and being told 'nobody else' or 'only you' in response and unwittingly inciting and inflaming petty battles due to underlying tensions - so if you feel or anyone is confident to do so then please post a thread with Nintendo sub-forum about my moderatorship and enquiring as to whether other members are happy to have me moderate and my interventions. Please quote this bolded and 'embiggened' text in doing so, so that other mods are aware of my proposal and the legitimacy of the thread.

[dazzybee]

@rummy on my phone, so can’t quite effectively. So I’ll just post in here. 

Forst point. I wasn’t dismissing his point. They are two separate, non contradictory (I’m glad at least you’ve admitted this was a false statement you made)  comments. One, genuine curiosity if anyone did. Two, irrespective of everything, I don’t think it matters if a company has or hasn’t done it before. I mean, it’s so simple, so clear, I don’t understand how anyone can have the reaction you had. 

 

Sedond point. Do you really not see the utter hilarity of condemning me for speaking for other posters, while doing EXACTLY THE SAME THING!!!! Oh boy. The difference being I have evidence in that no one, like in the above, expressed annoyance. There was just a discussion between a few posters. Seemed okay to me. Yet you come in, and speak for the forum And express your dismay at the posts. 

With this. And your final point. I do think it would be best if you do step down from moderation. Not only have you not been seen in months, the moment you do you’ve completely derailed the thread and soured it,  making bizarrre  accusations.

 

Edited February 23, 2018 by dazzybee

[Happenstance]

Rummy stepping down would be a massive mistake, a lot of the time it feels like he is the only one who makes an effort on this forum and if he did after calls from people who I really do think are the problems with this place then I doubt I’d stick around to see what it looked like afterwards.

Edit: Re-Reading this post obviously I sound over dramatic but I really don’t want to see rash decisions made.

Edited February 23, 2018 by Happenstance

[Ronnie]

 

11 minutes ago, dazzybee said:

And your final point. I do think it would be best if you do step down from moderation. Not only have you not been seen in months, the moment you do you’ve completely derailed the thread and soured it,  making bizarrre  accusations.

I agree. This thread was going fine until it was completely and bizarelly derailed with pointless arguments and accusations, and not for the first time either. In no world did @dazzybee deserve any of the condescending stuff thrown his way.

Edited February 23, 2018 by Ronnie

[Glen-i]

2 hours ago, Nicktendo said:

So I guess I'm the sad act who has the highest play time. 185 hours and counting, it's even overtaken Zelda as my most played Switch game. 

No, you're not. Fire Emblem Warriors, 225 hours. Have you never looked at the Gaming Log threads? I'm the king of saddos!

For what it's worth, I think @Rummy does a fine job. Some of you guys get a bit carried away at times and I just end up quickly backing out of a thread when I see an argument still going on.

I think @dazzybee is being way harsh. It can't be easy being a moderator. I don't think I can do it.

[Ronnie]

1 minute ago, Glen-i said:

Some of you guys get a bit carried away at times

Which could equally apply to @Rummy's excessively long and over-bearing way with words. I'm not saying it's easy being a mod, but heavy handedness is never a good thing on a forum.

[drahkon]

8 minutes ago, Glen-i said:

It can't be easy being a moderator. I don't think I can do it.

You're not alone with that sentiment.

Spoiler

 

Edited February 23, 2018 by drahkon

[Happenstance]

Just now, drahkon said:

You're not alone with that sentiment.

Especially in this place. It’s got better lately but while some of it is just to do with Nintendo doing better, I think some is through the effort of people like Rummy who put a lot of time into trying to sort out the issues this place has had over the years.

[drahkon]

I was just making a joke at Glen's expense. Don't drag me into this

[Hero-of-Time]

2 minutes ago, drahkon said:

You're not alone with that sentiment.

  Hide contents

 

Pfft. It's easy. Just do what I done when I was a mod on here and start banning everyone who gets in your way! It explains why our member numbers are so low.  

[dazzybee]

1 minute ago, Happenstance said:

Especially in this place. It’s got better lately but while some of it is just to do with Nintendo doing better, I think some is through the effort of people like Rummy who put a lot of time into trying to sort out the issues this place has had over the years.

Runny hasn’t been here for months and months and it’s been great. He was about when the place was a disaster. Not all his fault, not blaming, but just saying that he hasn’t been around here while it’s been great. But in my opinion the first time he comes back it drags it back down, completely unnecessaraiky, to the awful wii u days when we lost loads of our best members. 

[Glen-i]

2 minutes ago, drahkon said:

I was just making a joke at Glen's expense. Don't drag me into this

Burn Backfire! Better luck next time!

[dazzybee]

Double post. 

Edited February 23, 2018 by dazzybee

[drahkon]

2 minutes ago, Hero-of-Time said:

Pfft. It's easy. Just do what I done when I was a mod on here and start banning everyone who gets in your way! It explains why our member numbers are so low.  

Oh.

Hey admins? I'd like to become a mod. My first action would be: Ban H-o-T until he collects Salt & Sanctuary's platinum.

[Ronnie]

1 minute ago, dazzybee said:

Runny hasn’t been here for months and months and it’s been great. He was about when the place was a disaster. Not all his fault, not blaming, but just saying that he hasn’t been around here while it’s been great. But in my opinion the first time he comes back it drags it back down, completely unnecessaraiky, to the awful wii u days when we lost loads of our best members. 

This.

[Hero-of-Time]

1 minute ago, drahkon said:

Oh.

Hey admins? I'd like to become a mod. My first action would be: Ban H-o-T until he collects Salt & Sanctuary's platinum.

Given the state of this place at times, you'd be doing me a favour. 

[Happenstance]

Dazzybee I’m trying to figure out the best way to say this without seeming insulting but imo a lot of issues when it comes to you can be from your aggressive and dismissive style of posting. I think it’s happened in this thread. I understood a lot of your points but with the way you were putting things it just causes problems that don’t need to be there. It’s not the first time I’ve noticed it and I’m sure I’ve seen others mention it. To me, you were the problem here not Rummy and I think it is something that could be easily rectified.

[drahkon]

1 minute ago, Hero-of-Time said:

Given the state of this place at times, you'd be doing me a favour. 

Well, that's boring.

Go on, then. Stay here forever and ever...

[Rummy]

Ok well another great way to illustrate my point of not being listened to when I made a lengthy response specifically asking this not be done in this thread but a different one. I can't cut these now. I'll go home later and do so on my laptop - feel free to continue both debates but rest assured all that this will not be the overriding theme of this thread as I'll split them into a seperate topic later.

[Glen-i]

7 minutes ago, dazzybee said:

But in my opinion the first time he comes back it drags it back down, completely unnecessaraiky, to the awful wii u days when we lost loads of our best members. 

Hey! That's when I joined! Silver linings, am I right?

...Anyone?

Has @Rummy really been absent for months though? I swear I see him pop up every now and then...

EDIT: Oh woops. Sorry, you posted that last post telling us to stop this conversation before I finished this post.

Edited February 23, 2018 by Glen-i

[drahkon]

1 minute ago, Glen-i said:

Hey! That's when I joined! Silver linings, am I right?

...Anyone?

[Hero-of-Time]

4 minutes ago, Rummy said:

Ok well another great way to illustrate my point of not being listened to when I made a lengthy response specifically asking this not be done in this thread but a different one. I can't cut these now. I'll go home later and do so on my laptop - feel free to continue both debates but rest assured all that this will not be the overriding theme of this thread as I'll split them into a seperate topic later.

You could probably slam the content in here.

https://forum.n-europe.com/topic/35127-lets-talk-about-this-place/?tab=comments#comment-1683415

 

[dazzybee]

6 minutes ago, Happenstance said:

Dazzybee I’m trying to figure out the best way to say this without seeming insulting but imo a lot of issues when it comes to you can be from your aggressive and dismissive style of posting. I think it’s happened in this thread. I understood a lot of your points but with the way you were putting things it just causes problems that don’t need to be there. It’s not the first time I’ve noticed it and I’m sure I’ve seen others mention it. To me, you were the problem here not Rummy and I think it is something that could be easily rectified.

I’m not insulted. You have to express yourself. That’s fine. 

Not your final point though 😂 How you can think that is bizarre other than through loyalty. 

[Ronnie]

6 minutes ago, Rummy said:

Ok well another great way to illustrate my point of not being listened to when I made a lengthy response specifically asking this not be done in this thread but a different one. I can't cut these now. I'll go home later and do so on my laptop - feel free to continue both debates but rest assured all that this will not be the overriding theme of this thread as I'll split them into a seperate topic later.

If you're so concerned about not derailing threads you should have PM'd myself and @dazzybee instead of launching into paragraphs of argument and nitpicking in the first place.

 

[Ike]

I think we need to draw a line under the current discussion, it's currently not productive due to the lack of information from Nintendo and it seems to be going around in circles.

Myself or Rummy will clean up the thread later (I'm at work and on mobile). If you have issues with the moderation staff please take it up with them privately, another moderator, with the Admins, or the thread Hero Of Time posted. This isn't the place.

I don't want to lock the thread but I will if needs be.