Sheikah Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 It's amusing to read all the complaints from people who hate amiibo, as if they think Nintendo should listen to them over the people who buy more of their products. I know for sure who I'd want to please if I was Nintendo. They probably should listen to them if they're not buying their products. Like, really listen. New dungeon sounds cool, but tap amiibo to heal yourself sounds like the kind of thing that I hate to see in games.
Serebii Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 They probably should listen to them if they're not buying their products. Like, really listen. New dungeon sounds cool, but tap amiibo to heal yourself sounds like the kind of thing that I hate to see in games. Then don't do it. It takes nothing out of the game if you don't.
Sheikah Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 Then don't do it. It takes nothing out of the game if you don't. Well obviously I won't do it. But it is blatant pay to win, used in a pretty crappy way. None of us should be afraid to question or highlight it.
Serebii Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 Well obviously I won't do it. But it is blatant pay to win, used in a pretty crappy way. None of us should be afraid to question or highlight it. That is not pay to win.
Hero-of-Time Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 It's amusing to read all the complaints from people who hate amiibo, as if they think Nintendo should listen to them over the people who buy more of their products. I know for sure who I'd want to please if I was Nintendo. Probably the other people considering their shrinking core Nintendo user base.
Hero-of-Time Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 Well obviously I won't do it. But it is blatant pay to win, used in a pretty crappy way. None of us should be afraid to question or highlight it. Interesting. I suppose it could be seen as that, depending if you can use it an infinite amount of times. I suppose its kinda like an easy mode.
S.C.G Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 The way in which the amiibo use is implied could mean that certain Zelda amiibo just give you say... three hearts every hour or so, it's open to interpretation. Also things like Arrows are usually quite easy to obtain, so I can't see myself using this unless I actually got stuck without them which virtually never happens. Do I like the idea of them being included? Not really... Am I completely set against it? Not particularly... Would I have liked them to have been used in another way? Yes... If it was me, I would have incorporated an in-game trophy system similar to the one in The Wind Waker which uses either amiibo or rupees in-game so that you could have a "go" on a contrption in-game which is like a Medievil capsule machine, which still limits you to a certain amount per day no matter how you play, that I would have been OK with. The extra dungeon is cool but then... should we be limiting it to just people who only have the amiibo? Sheikah is right in that we should at least be questioning this kind of integration, not necessarilly condemning it completely but at the very least asking ourselves... Is this really what we want Nintendo games to become in the long-term? I think a Thread-Rip is required here, starting with this page. : peace:
Hero-of-Time Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 The extra dungeon is cool but then... should we be limiting it to just people who only have the amiibo? Sheikah is right in that we should at least be questioning this kind of integration, not necessarilly condemning it completely but at the very least asking ourselves... Is this really what we want Nintendo games to become in the long-term? Its the same kind of integration that Splatoon had, levels that were already on the disc but locked behind an amiibo. I honestly have no issue with it as I collect amiibo. What irks me are the hypocrites who slammed various other comapnies for such practices last generation and yet here we are, Nintendo doing essentially the same thing, and these same people think it's now amazing. Same thing happened when themes came out for the 360 and they all laughed and mocked how you had to pay for a background. The 3DS does it now and everything is gravy.
Sheikah Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 That is not pay to win. It's just about one of the purest examples of pay to win I've seen for awhile. Interesting. I suppose it could be seen as that, depending if you can use it an infinite amount of times. I suppose its kinda like an easy mode. Yeah. If you pay a certain amount of real money you have something that heals you (as much as you want?). I don't see how it could be less pay to win. It can help you literally win fights where otherwise you might have died if you suck.
Ronnie Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 (edited) Let's be clear, Nintendo aren't doing "essentially the same thing" as the other companies. Locking a few extra hearts behind an amiibo is very different to charging people ANOTHER 40 quid to unlock a season pass with unknown content. Or pre-order bonuses that unlock extra missions/an hour of content not available anywhere else. Or day 1 DLC that's actually worthwhile (unlike what it was in Splatoon). Or those chests in AC: Unity that only open if you buy the companion app on your phone. Game prices haven't risen with inflation like everything else and do publishers need to figure out ways of charging people extra, hence the dodgy deals on PS4 and Xbox One and Nintendo's move into Free to play and amiibo. But in no way are Nintendo as guilty as the others at this, and bringing up getting a few extra hearts in Zelda as "pay to win" is frankly ludicrous; any excuse to have a dig at Nintendo, it's getting so tedious. Edited January 14, 2016 by Ronnie
Hero-of-Time Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 Let's be clear, Nintendo aren't doing "essentially the same thing" as the other companies. Locking a few extra hearts behind an amiibo is very different to charging people ANOTHER 40 quid to unlock a season pass with unknown content. Or pre-order bonuses that unlock extra missions/an hour of content not available anywhere else. Or day 1 DLC that's actually worthwhile (unlike what it was in Splatoon). Game prices haven't risen with inflation like everything else and do publishers need to figure out ways of charging people extra, hence the dodgy deals on PS4 and Xbox One and Nintendo's move into Free to play and amiibo. But in no way are Nintendo as guilty as the others at this, and bringing up getting a few extra hearts in Zelda as "pay to win" is frankly ludicrous; any excuse to have a dig at Nintendo, it's getting so tedious. My comment was to do with the extra dungeon that may or may not be unlocked with the amiibo. Like Splatoon, you have substantial content that's already on the disc that gets unlocked with an amiibo. This is no different when the likes of Capcom had Resident Evil DLC on the disc already but you had to purchase it to unlock it.
S.C.G Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 Its the same kind of integration that Splatoon had, levels that were already on the disc but locked behind an amiibo. I honestly have no issue with it as I collect amiibo. What irks me are the hypocrites who slammed various other comapnies for such practices last generation and yet here we are, Nintendo doing essentially the same thing, and these same people think it's now amazing. Same thing happened when themes came out for the 360 and they all laughed and mocked how you had to pay for a background. The 3DS does it now and everything is gravy. Yeah, personally I don't have too much of a problem with it being that it is extra content and I buy the amiibo figures anyway, but you can just see it now as there will be lots of people who will buy just the game and be expecting that extra content to be included without having to unlock it using an amiibo. I understand what you're saying about dlc practices as well, themes for Xbox 360? I think I paid for a few, didn't have a problem with it, mostly I tended to get the pre-order bonus ones, on the 3DS I have bought a few themes but only the ones I really like, I don't have a problem with either company doing it but you're right there are some who would say that other companies are evil for doing it and yet Nintendo can do no wrong when they end up doing the same thing essentially. On the whole I think Nintendo have been fairly decent with the dlc, Mario Kart 8 leads the way in this, Super Smash Bros. isn't perfect in its payment model but it's still not bad and at least offers a discount. Should there be a way of buying this extra dungeon for say... £3 though? For people who want the dungeon but really don't want the amiibo figure.
Serebii Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 Its the same kind of integration that Splatoon had, levels that were already on the disc but locked behind an amiibo. I honestly have no issue with it as I collect amiibo. What irks me are the hypocrites who slammed various other comapnies for such practices last generation and yet here we are, Nintendo doing essentially the same thing, and these same people think it's now amazing. Same thing happened when themes came out for the 360 and they all laughed and mocked how you had to pay for a background. The 3DS does it now and everything is gravy. I have no issue with it, most of the time, because the content wouldn't exist if not for the amiibo. When they lock out content that should be there such as the Shovel Knight co-op, then I do agree it's bullshit.
Hero-of-Time Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 On the whole I think Nintendo have been fairly decent with the dlc, Mario Kart 8 leads the way in this, Super Smash Bros. isn't perfect in its payment model but it's still not bad and at least offers a discount. Should there be a way of buying this extra dungeon for say... £3 though? For people who want the dungeon but really don't want the amiibo figure. Indeed. They have certainly been one of the better companies when it comes to DLC. The Mario Kart season pass was amazing value. I just wish that Smash Bros had a season pass, as well. No way i'm forking over £50+ for all the DLC. EDIT: Mario Golf on the 3DS had a great amount of content for the season pass, as well.
Ronnie Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 My comment was to do with the extra dungeon that may or may not be unlocked with the amiibo. Like Splatoon, you have substantial content that's already on the disc that gets unlocked with an amiibo. This is no different when the likes of Capcom had Resident Evil DLC on the disc already but you had to purchase it to unlock it. Did the Resident Evil day 1 DLC get you a nice little figurine to put on your shelf that also unlocks content in two dozen other games, with no doubt plenty more uses to come? I'm not arguing that Nintendo aren't doing similar to the competition, just that their business model is far more generous and unobtrusive. I don't think Nintendo get enough credit for their 1 amiibo for multiple games approach.
Hero-of-Time Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 Did the Resident Evil day 1 DLC get you a nice little figurine to put on your shelf that also unlocks content in two dozen other games, with no doubt plenty more uses to come? I'm not arguing that Nintendo aren't doing similar to the competition, just that their business model is far more generous and unobtrusive. I don't think Nintendo get enough credit for their 1 amiibo for multiple games approach. The thing is, many would like to buy the DLC without the amiibo. Besides, my point i'm making is not about how the DLC is distributed but more about that there is content on the disc that is being paywalled. Again, it doesn't bother me personally. I bought the Resident Evil DLC and I buy amiibo. I just find it funny reading various comments around the net from people who you just know were against this type of thing, now thinking its the best thing since sliced bread and trying to justify why its ok to do now. Fanboys, bless them.
Sheikah Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 I have no issue with it, most of the time, because the content wouldn't exist if not for the amiibo. There's simply no proof of that. The only thing we know for certain is that the content is there from day 1 but only people who pay even more get access to it.
Ronnie Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 The thing is, many would like to buy the DLC without the amiibo. Besides, my point i'm making is not about how the DLC is distributed but more about that there is content on the disc that is being paywalled. Again, it doesn't bother me personally. I bought the Resident Evil DLC and I buy amiibo. I just find it funny reading various comments around the net from people who you just know were against this type of thing, now thinking its the best thing since sliced bread and trying to justify why its ok to do now. Fanboys, bless them. And vice versa, those who excuse the other publishers who do far worse, yet give Nintendo an earful for doing something ten times more generous. No one is questioning that Nintendo do pay-walled content (even if the vast majority are things like skins, costumes and in-game currency), I just think they deserve credit for their business model and how it isn't utter bullshit, unlike say Assassin's Creed Unity where you need to buy the companion app just to be able to open a treasure chest.
Hero-of-Time Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 There's simply no proof of that. The only thing we know for certain is that the content is there from day 1 but only people who pay even more get access to it. While stuff like Mario Kart costumes and Mario Maker skins are obviously created for amiibo, things like extra levels/dungeons are when things get a little hazy. There's no real way to know whether stuff like the levels in Splatoon were actually part of the game and then cut off for amiibo usage. I'm more inclined to believe this was the case and that the levels in question were originally a challenge mode that was unlocked after completion of the campaign. Had these came after the game was released, and weren't already of the disc, then it would be fair to say that those were created separately. The same thing goes for the new dungeon on Twilight Princess, if it is indeed real and already on the disc.
Goron_3 Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 The problem for me is that I would LOVE to buy the additional content, just not the amiibo. Agreed that Mario Kart is one of the better DLC examples out there, but Smash was frustrating.
Dcubed Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 (edited) The new dungeon is probably where the main links between Zelda TP HD and Zelda Wii U come into play in terms of transferable data, so I reckon that the new dungeon's gimmick probably wouldn't work if you didn't have the Wolf Link amiibo anyway. Until we know exactly how it works, we can't really say that it's "DLC in disguise" yet... They're obviously using the writeable storage capabilities of the Amiibo for something here, so it's not just unlocking stuff in Zelda TP HD... Edited January 14, 2016 by Dcubed
Hero-of-Time Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 And vice versa, those who excuse the other publishers who do far worse, yet give Nintendo an earful for doing something ten times more generous. No one is questioning that Nintendo do pay-walled content (even if the vast majority are things like skins, costumes and in-game currency), I just think they deserve credit for their business model and how it isn't utter bullshit, unlike say Assassin's Creed Unity where you need to buy the companion app just to be able to open a treasure chest. Its only generous if you actually want the figure. Some would rather the DLC be simply unlocked via a purchase on the eShop. Yeah, those chests were garbage, luckily Ubisoft seen sense and unlocked those for everyone.
Ronnie Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 Its only generous if you actually want the figure. Some would rather the DLC be simply unlocked via a purchase on the eShop. And then digitally unlocked in the two dozen other compatible games as well presumably, somehow? It's still a generous way of doing things. If you don't want the amiibo, put in the back of your drawer.
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