General Gaming Sales/Charts Discussion

[Wii]

I don't see any expansion into new genres or audiences. It's just a case of wash, rinse, repeat but it's not working like it did on the Wii. Largely in part because that audience is long gone. There's a list as long as your arm as to why Wii U failed. It's like they followed a book of ideas of what not to do for a successful console, in fact they're the author.

[Hero-of-Time]

Wow. Terrible numbers for both Wii U and Vita. Shame as both these have been my most played machines this year and I would like to see them see success.

 

The attach rate for Super Mario 3D World is shocking. Clearly people who have Wii U consoles aren't buying software. It begs the question as to whether the consoles are actually getting played on and from the looks of it the answer would be no.

 

Very surprised at the One numbers. Despite its price point, lack of killer software and bad press it still has done amazing out of the gate. Kudos to Microsoft.

[liger05]

Wow. Terrible numbers for both Wii U and Vita. Shame as both these have been my most played machines this year and I would like to see them see success.

 

The attach rate for Super Mario 3D World is shocking. Clearly people who have Wii U consoles aren't buying software. It begs the question as to whether the consoles are actually getting played on and from the looks of it the answer would be no.

 

Very surprised at the One numbers. Despite its price point, lack of killer software and bad press it still has done amazing out of the gate. Kudos to Microsoft.

 

Yeah considering what a pr nightmare MS had they can be very satisfied with how the console has sold. Great numbers for the 360 as well. That machine is such a beast.

 

I think the wii u and Vita are toxic. If Sony have any sense the Vita TV will be called PlayStation TV in the West.

 

The wii u will be lucky to sell 5 mil by year end. Can Iwata survive this? I hope not.

 

The 3DS could have a tricky 2014 in the West. They have already released all the big guns and the sales are pretty much flat. The dedicated handheld market is shrinking at a rapid rate in the West.

[Serebii]

The Wii U needs a price drop a rebrand and an actual marketing push. They've started with the latter but the Wii U name is poison now. It really need some sort of rebrand.

 

It's a shame. The console is great. The GamePad is a great idea which is decently realised...the problem is that people don't get it until they've had some serious hands-on time. The games are absolutely fantastic and the company is the only one not trying to screw the customer with microtransactions and paywalls.

 

It saddens me that Nintendo is the one failing :/

 

Dropping the Wii U is not an option. Dropping their console business is not an option.

 

Yeah considering what a pr nightmare MS had they can be very satisfied with how the console has sold. Great numbers for the 360 as well. That machine is such a beast.

 

I think the wii u and Vita are toxic. If Sony have any sense the Vita TV will be called PlayStation TV in the West.

 

The wii u will be lucky to sell 5 mil by year end. Can Iwata survive this? I hope not.

 

The 3DS could have a tricky 2014 in the West. They have already released all the big guns and the sales are pretty much flat. The dedicated handheld market is shrinking at a rapid rate in the West.

3DS's sales this November are higher than last November in the US and are up 15% YTD on last year. Hardly "rapidly shrinking" an

Edited December 13, 2013 by Serebii
Automerged Doublepost

[liger05]

The Wii U needs a price drop a rebrand and an actual marketing push. They've started with the latter but the Wii U name is poison now. It really need some sort of rebrand.

 

It's a shame. The console is great. The GamePad is a great idea which is decently realised...the problem is that people don't get it until they've had some serious hands-on time. The games are absolutely fantastic and the company is the only one not trying to screw the customer with microtransactions and paywalls.

 

It saddens me that Nintendo is the one failing :/

 

Dropping the Wii U is not an option. Dropping their console business is not an option.

 

 

3DS's sales this November are higher than last November in the US. Hardly "rapidly shrinking"

 

The handheld market has rapidly shrunk when you look at the whole picture.

 

There are two dedicated handhelds on the market and combined they couldn't sell 1 mil units in November. The Vita drop off from the PSP is unbelievable. 75k in November is what a discontinued platform would sell.

 

Of course the 3DS November is higher than last year, look at all the software which has been released this year. With such great software and a cheap 2DS I expected a higher number. The platform isn't growing as as it should considering it's less than 3 years old and has already had the big guns released.

[khilafah]

Wii U is dead for sure. Mario Kart and Smash cannot save it!

 

3D World sales in the US just like everywhere else shows that even Wii U owners are not buying games. Really depressing that the current install base is ignoring such a good game.

 

Honestly nintendo have to change there mindset when developing the next console.

 

3DS sales while not awful are not too great either. Should be closer to 1 million!

 

Vita is well and truly dead.

[Goron_3]

People just aren't excited by the hardware. The GamePad is great but completely unnecessary for most games, and when you've got the HD twins for just a bit more or the older consoles with huge back catalogues still going strong...

 

I've said it before but they still need to seriously invest in new western I.P's. They need to prove to people what this console can do that the Wii couldn't and make those games appeal to the market. Quite frankly, a new Donkey Kong just isn't going to cut it and neither is a 3D Land esque family-targeted Mario game.

 

It's over for Nintendo this gen. Hard to believe the Wii did 100 million LTD. Crazy.

[liger05]

People just aren't excited by the hardware. The GamePad is great but completely unnecessary for most games, and when you've got the HD twins for just a bit more or the older consoles with huge back catalogues still going strong...

 

I've said it before but they still need to seriously invest in new western I.P's. They need to prove to people what this console can do that the Wii couldn't and make those games appeal to the market. Quite frankly, a new Donkey Kong just isn't going to cut it and neither is a 3D Land esque family-targeted Mario game.

 

It's over for Nintendo this gen. Hard to believe the Wii did 100 million LTD. Crazy.

 

A rebrand will do nothing. People will still know it's the same console. They have tried a price drop, bundles, new first party software and nothing has changed. What's next? A wii u minus the gamepad? I don't know what else they can do. You can advertise all you want but if the product isn't interesting to people then it still won't sell.

 

The console is toast. I'm needs to be a culture change and a move away from such a Japanese centric company and new ideas put together for for next console as no point wasting them on the Wii U.

Edited December 13, 2013 by liger05

[Dcubed]

The results aren't good in of themselves for Wii U, but on the bright side - it got a much larger November bump than previous Nintendo consoles received going from October-November on their 2nd Xmas...

 

GCN +258,9% 170K-440K

Wii +189% 519K-981K

Wii U "Over +350%" 50k-220k

 

So the results were better than I had expected for Wii U hardware at least... SM3DW's sales are disappointing though. The attach rate to hardware is lower than its equivalent Wii and GCN counterparts...

 

Hardware LTD Mario 3D Sales Attach Ratio

 

GCN 2.120.000 350.000 16.5%

Wii 6.000.000 1.120.000 18.7%

Wii U ~ 1.550.000 215.000 13.9%

 

The real damning part of Nintendo's November performance is the 3DS though. It should've done MUCH better considering the launch of Pokemon, Zelda ALBW, Mario Party IT AND the 2DS...

Edited December 13, 2013 by Dcubed

[Clownferret]

You've got to note that although the sales are at Dreamcast level, Nintendo has far more capital than Sega did at that point. The sales are incredibly disappointing though, Nintendo need to start throwing some money at other publishers otherwise the Wii U will remain a niche product, counter intuitive considering the adoption of Kim's Blue Ocean Business Strategy ensured absolute Nintendo dominance last generation. They no longer refer to their strategy as such, I think it's now 'Market Expansion' or something, I can't find the release of theirs that detailed it any more.

 

Come to think of it, is this why Nintendo is hitting some trouble in certain markets? The Wii U innovates with the game pad (whether or not this is an innovation the masses like looks doubtful), but has there been any expansion in the accessibility? It took them until very recently to get the successor to Wii Sports out for the Wii U, and the software line up on the Wii U in general is merely trying to reclaim existing markets available on other or older consoles (Sequels to games, ports/'remakes' of games available much earlier else where). I don't own a Wii U so if an owner could reply to this post and use some examples of what they feel to be attempts at expanding the video games market into new audiences, that'd be appreciated.

 

Nintendo's key focus with Wii U was the gamepad through and through (a lot of marketing didn't even show the console, which some people think lead to half the world believing it was just an add on for the Wii) it launched with NintendoLand which was a demo of what the gamepad could do and very much a spiritual successor to Wii Sports in that Nintendo thought people would play it once and go and buy the console.

I don'y think Nintendo ever considered that they would need to do anything else other than launch sequels to their AAA in-house library and also obtain the big 3rd party licences at launch and all in glorious HD. In fairness to Nintendo they did all the above very well and riding on the back of the 100+ million selling Wii they probably guilty of assuming that it would be a roaring success.

 

With hindsight I think the problem they have had with Wii U is that everybody who had a PS3 or 360 also had a Wii as a second console, and in that respect Wii U is too similar to those machines, obtaining COD did not matter as everybody already had it on their other console. The other 30+ million Wii sales were probably older people or families who bought it for Wii Sports/Fit etc but are not traditional gamers and the problem here is that Wii U is not priced at an impulse buy point like Wii was and secondly these people don't care about the graphics update to HD. Once you remove these two demographics you are left with people who will always buy a Nintendo console for their in-house library.

 

The gamepad is a brilliant piece of kit and anybody who has a family or has to share a tv will testify to this, even playing COD whilst watching the football is genius and it improves local multiplayer to no end. In my opinion it was more than enough to warrant the purchase of a Wii U and certainly far more innovative than anything Sony or Microsoft have done with PS4 or XB1 and yet these are selling very well. Go figure?

[Hero-of-Time]

The gamepad is a brilliant piece of kit and anybody who has a family or has to share a tv will testify to this, even playing COD whilst watching the football is genius and it improves local multiplayer to no end. In my opinion it was more than enough to warrant the purchase of a Wii U and certainly far more innovative than anything Sony or Microsoft have done with PS4 or XB1 and yet these are selling very well. Go figure?

 

I love the Gamepad and I don't even have to fight for the TV.

 

A big reason the PS4 and One are selling well is due to their online. People have put time and money on the PS3 and 360 building up trophies and achievements as well as meeting new people to play with and adding them to their friends lists. Their online setups have become social networks. As an example, why would you go to something other than Facebook if all your friends are on Facebook?

[Sheikah]

Not just having a good online system, but the number of cracking titles that the other 2 consoles can expect to receive due to their confirmed third party support.

[liger05]

Nintendo's key focus with Wii U was the gamepad through and through (a lot of marketing didn't even show the console, which some people think lead to half the world believing it was just an add on for the Wii) it launched with NintendoLand which was a demo of what the gamepad could do and very much a spiritual successor to Wii Sports in that Nintendo thought people would play it once and go and buy the console.

 

I don'y think Nintendo ever considered that they would need to do anything else other than launch sequels to their AAA in-house library and also obtain the big 3rd party licences at launch and all in glorious HD. In fairness to Nintendo they did all the above very well and riding on the back of the 100+ million selling Wii they probably guilty of assuming that it would be a roaring success.

 

Very guilty. To assume that people wouldn’t of moved on is a huge mis-read of the market. A tablet style controller is old news when for the last 4 years people have been using tablets. I also think Nintendo seemed to think HD was a significant upgrade it itself even if that meant the upgrade was only bringing the hardware to the level of 360/PS3. I just find it crazy that they thought it was a good idea to launch a console 7 years later than the 360 and not think that in 2012 a new console would have to me significantly more powerful than the 360/PS3.

 

Just look at the launch sales of the XB1/PS4. Both consoles launched more expensive than the Wii U with the XB1 costing $500 yet they fly off the shelves yet people some seem to think people don’t care about power? People are ready now just as they was ready last year for next gen consoles but Nintendo decided to ignore this matter and decide to do their own thing and now are paying the price.

 

With hindsight I think the problem they have had with Wii U is that everybody who had a PS3 or 360 also had a Wii as a second console, and in that respect Wii U is too similar to those machines, obtaining COD did not matter as everybody already had it on their other console. The other 30+ million Wii sales were probably older people or families who bought it for Wii Sports/Fit etc but are not traditional gamers and the problem here is that Wii U is not priced at an impulse buy point like Wii was and secondly these people don't care about the graphics update to HD. Once you remove these two demographics you are left with people who will always buy a Nintendo console for their in-house library.

 

The worst thing is Nintendo themselves acknowledged that even though the Wii sold loads but the market they had opened up wasn’t one which was sustainable so they would focus on the more core gamer with the Wii U. Yet they release an underpowered console and within a year they are back with the whole ‘family’ focus and surprise surprise the wii u bombs in November so good luck with the family angle Nintendo. Don’t release a underpowered console for a premium price.

 

The gamepad is a brilliant piece of kit and anybody who has a family or has to share a tv will testify to this, even playing COD whilst watching the football is genius and it improves local multiplayer to no end. In my opinion it was more than enough to warrant the purchase of a Wii U and certainly far more innovative than anything Sony or Microsoft have done with PS4 or XB1 and yet these are selling very well. Go figure?

 

That’s subjective. Personally I don’t really see any use for it. I don’t use off tv play, the battery is very very weak, the screen resolution is low and it lacks multi touch being a resistive screen. Who uses resistive screens these days? I would of preferred a standard controller and the money spent producing the gamepad used instead for more horsepower under the hood of the console.

[Debug Mode]

Nintendo's key focus with Wii U was the gamepad through and through (a lot of marketing didn't even show the console, which some people think lead to half the world believing it was just an add on for the Wii) it launched with NintendoLand which was a demo of what the gamepad could do and very much a spiritual successor to Wii Sports in that Nintendo thought people would play it once and go and buy the console.

 

But this poses a question, why were the masses so quick to embrace Wii Sports but not Nintendoland? You mention earlier that the gamepad does have enormous potential, and I agree, but there are a couple of reasons why it might not have been embraced

 

Marketing. There was definitely a period of hype leading up to the Wii, we didn't really get that with the Wii U. Did Nintendo do enough pre-launch to get the Wii U into the hands of people to try it out? I've noticed on every demo station I've played, there is no NintendoLand demo. Why the fuck?

 

Neutrality. Nintendoland is a fresh IP, but it's an IP that only those with experience in Nintendo products can fully appreciate. The problem here? Not expanding the market. I have a feeling one of the crucial aspects that made Wii Sports into a phenomenon is just how neutral the theme was. There was no Nintendo. No Nintendo characters. No glaringly obvious Nintendo themes. Just the fact it was sports, it could only be experienced on the Wii, thus Wii Sports. It was very different for a Nintendo game, but any one who played it and had previous experience knew it was definitely a Nintendo product.

 

Cost. Price equals accessibility these days. With that higher price tag comes the inevitable thought process of "Who is this for?", rather than "Oh wow, that's cheap, I could get it for (insert any demographic here)"

 

People don't see the deal with a-synchronous gameplay. TV's practically dominating each room in the house these days, some people are going to ask whether off-screen play is really needed/cross screen gameplay offers much to the immersion.

[liger05]

The biggest criticism against the gamepad is Nintendo themselves have showed no reason as why people need it.

 

I forgot Mario Party was released. Another one of the Wii/DS era juggernauts which has bombed.

 

Mario Party: Island Tour < 60K

Mario and Sonic at the Sochi Winter Olympic Games > 20K

 

Time to move on from these kind of games. The audience just isnt there anymore.

Edited December 13, 2013 by liger05

[Sheikah]

Yeah, totally agree. People saying it's mostly an issue of marketing/price point are way off. The kinds of games that they made that were really popular just aren't liked as much anymore. I'd extend that to Wii Sports/Fit too.

[khilafah]

Yeah, totally agree. People saying it's mostly an issue of marketing/price point are way off. The kinds of games that they made that were really popular just aren't liked as much anymore. I'd extend that to Wii Sports/Fit too.

 

isnt Wii Fit out today in retail.

 

Trust me, on monday we will see how much it has bombed in the UK/Europe. Its time nintendo gave up on these games.

[Serebii]

isnt Wii Fit out today in retail.

 

Trust me, on monday we will see how much it has bombed in the UK/Europe. Its time nintendo gave up on these games.

Give up on them? Hell no. Stop using them as a focus? Absolutely.

 

Seriously, Wii Fit has changed my life and I have used one variation or another daily for over five years. It is one of the greatest things they have ever done

[khilafah]

Give up on them? Hell no. Stop using them as a focus? Absolutely.

 

Seriously, Wii Fit has changed my life and I have used one variation or another daily for over five years. It is one of the greatest things they have ever done

 

yeah, give up a bit OTT.

 

Definitely bigger focus on other projects though. That Wii Crowd is gone and are not coming back.

[liger05]

Give up on them? Hell no. Stop using them as a focus? Absolutely.

 

Seriously, Wii Fit has changed my life and I have used one variation or another daily for over five years. It is one of the greatest things they have ever done

 

It was a very clever idea but now people can find fitness games on multiple platforms as well as android/ios. Very difficult to sell wii u fit in todays environment.

[Goron_3]

Yeah I'm not sure how effective Wii Fit is when compared to competitors on the market, especially when you compare it to what is available on the XBOne (P90x, Insanity), which are actually fantastic gym alternatives.

 

Wii Fit is only really aimed at the casual market and I doubt they are going to come back again. If you want an exercise tool there are better alternatives (including joining a gym!).

[Dcubed]

But this poses a question, why were the masses so quick to embrace Wii Sports but not Nintendoland? You mention earlier that the gamepad does have enormous potential, and I agree, but there are a couple of reasons why it might not have been embraced

 

Marketing. There was definitely a period of hype leading up to the Wii, we didn't really get that with the Wii U. Did Nintendo do enough pre-launch to get the Wii U into the hands of people to try it out? I've noticed on every demo station I've played, there is no NintendoLand demo. Why the fuck?

 

Neutrality. Nintendoland is a fresh IP, but it's an IP that only those with experience in Nintendo products can fully appreciate. The problem here? Not expanding the market. I have a feeling one of the crucial aspects that made Wii Sports into a phenomenon is just how neutral the theme was. There was no Nintendo. No Nintendo characters. No glaringly obvious Nintendo themes. Just the fact it was sports, it could only be experienced on the Wii, thus Wii Sports. It was very different for a Nintendo game, but any one who played it and had previous experience knew it was definitely a Nintendo product.

 

Cost. Price equals accessibility these days. With that higher price tag comes the inevitable thought process of "Who is this for?", rather than "Oh wow, that's cheap, I could get it for (insert any demographic here)"

 

People don't see the deal with a-synchronous gameplay. TV's practically dominating each room in the house these days, some people are going to ask whether off-screen play is really needed/cross screen gameplay offers much to the immersion.

 

I would think that the reason why Nintendo Land didn't resonate in the same way as Wii Sports would be obvious. It's too abstract and cannot sell the Wii U's unique gameplay experiences just by sight alone.

 

With Wii Sports, you take one look at it and you instantly know how to play (swing your arm like a tennis racket!); with Nintendo Land (and the Wii U in general) however, it's far more convoluted and isn't instantly accessible. The fact that even Nintendo struggled to explain the game back at their disastrous E3 2012 presentation should be evidence enough of the difficulty involved in their Wii U messaging (I do also agree that the lack of Nintendo brand baggage associated with Wii/Wii Sports also helped big time as well BTW).

 

But the time for those discussions has long since past... Now they have no choice but to soldier on and try to carve out a niche for themselves. They're not getting the wider Wii audience back en masse at this point, but they can still at least try and eke out a profit from the console...

[tapedeck]

Marketing is vital. Where is the marketing? Heck, SONY and Microsoft are managing to market new consoles showing literally NO games - and their graphics are their focus so you think they would be showing their games off ALL of the time. Instead we get Microsoft and SONY focusing on 'for the players' or 'come with us' hype messages. But guess what. It works as it is hype-enducing.

Wii u has no hype. It has no good marketing behind it. We're back to pre-Wii days where Nintendo consoles were considered niche. Unfortunately, Nintendo are waaaay behind now without much third party support. The fact they continue to actually LOSE key support rather than gain it is just...bizarre. It's like they have to convince third parties every time they bring a new system out.

Something needs to change if they are to survive. Gaming is too big now to just have a handful of titles released in a year (as good as they may be). And to have a lack of a marketing in the face of your competitors is insane.

 

Nintendo need a theme park or something where they can at least do what Disney have done and have kept interest in their past and present brands strong.

[liger05]

Marketing is vital. Where is the marketing? Heck, SONY and Microsoft are managing to market new consoles showing literally NO games - and their graphics are their focus so you think they would be showing their games off ALL of the time. Instead we get Microsoft and SONY focusing on 'for the players' or 'come with us' hype messages. But guess what. It works as it is hype-enducing.

Wii u has no hype. It has no good marketing behind it. We're back to pre-Wii days where Nintendo consoles were considered niche. Unfortunately, Nintendo are waaaay behind now without much third party support. The fact they continue to actually LOSE key support rather than gain it is just...bizarre. It's like they have to convince third parties every time they bring a new system out.

Something needs to change if they are to survive. Gaming is too big now to just have a handful of titles released in a year (as good as they may be). And to have a lack of a marketing in the face of your competitors is insane.

 

Nintendo need a theme park or something where they can at least do what Disney have done and have kept interest in their past and present brands strong.

 

Well Marketing can only take you so far. If the product is not desirable then there isn’t much you can do. When MS can spend $900 dollars marketing Surface tablets and the end result is very little market penetration then that tells you all you need to know. Nintendo could spend a fortune marketing the Wii U but would it really make that much of a difference.

 

The damage has already been done. People know the console is a failure and even if someone wants one why bother? Why not just wait until it hits the true bomba prices like the Gamecube did. Perception has hit and there is no way back from that.

 

Nintendo handled the whole launch badly. From the first reveal to the final E3 there was no hype for the console at all. Post launch its just got worse!!

 

It’s amazing how Nintendo have messed this up as the Wii actually created an opportunity for Nintendo to get back into the Console sphere. They made so much money with the Wii and they had the means to get back into the game seriously. I want the Nintendo which isn’t so defeatist which thinks it cannot compete in this industry.

 

Go back to the drawing board, speak to developers and ask them what they would want from a console in 3 years’ time? Look at what Sony and MS do which makes there consoles so popular and then look at how they can improve on those services.

 

The Wii U being a failure isn’t going to kill the company but there has to be a huge change within if they want to come back from this and remain a player in the home console market.

 

No more apologies, no more hoping one game will amazingly change the fortunes, no more gimmicks and half assed attempts at offering services which have become standard practice for gamers.

 

Don’t think Nintendo need a theme park they need more diversity. When you think of Disney you think Mickey Mouse but how many mickey mouse movies do you see? Nintendo will always be Mario but it’s time to offer a much more varied range of software.

[Clownferret]

That’s subjective. Personally I don’t really see any use for it. I don’t use off tv play, the battery is very very weak, the screen resolution is low and it lacks multi touch being a resistive screen. Who uses resistive screens these days? I would of preferred a standard controller and the money spent producing the gamepad used instead for more horsepower under the hood of the console.

 

Not really. I said that people with families who had to share the TV it was genius. And the gamepad battery life is fine for average use. Sure if you're the sterotypical spotty teenager who plays in his bedroom for hours on end then your comments are valid. If Nintendo just released a more powerful console with just the pro controller then they would be going directly head on with PS4 and XB1 and history has proved that there is not enough room for 3 similar consoles in a single generation.