Metal Gear Solid HD Collection

[jayseven]

Thanks Nolan.

 

Well, I've become disenchanted with the game. I've been chasing the dog tags, and I essentially need to finish on Hard then get the tags on extreme and finish on that... Which isn't possible for me. I'm on the Rays boss on hard and just finding it grueling. Ever since the harrier boss I just thought "...jeez, this'll be a tad tricky on extreme!" but thought I'd be able to grind through.

 

However, going through 20 metal gear rays? Why? WHY! This is too much. I do fine for ages then get stomped, rocketed, shot and blam that's my health gone. I've spent probably 40 hours playing the game so far, primarily for dog tags, and it boils down to 80G.

 

So I'll give the other MGS2 achievements a whirl. Played snake tales for a bit - the first mission I was facing fatman, and had 3 bombs to defuse in 30 seconds. Lost the faith a little. May just skip to MGS3 to try to recover some love!

[Ramar]

I didn't bother with the dog tags. I got a few whilst doing a run through MGS2, but I spent hours on it back in the PS2 days so I couldn't be bothered this time.

 

Though this topic has reminded me I never did get round to finishing Snake Eater.

[Jimbob]

I'm about 1/2 way through Snake Eater and kind of m'ehed the game to one side. I really need to get back into playing this, was really enjoying it as well.

[jayseven]

Started MGS3, just past the james bond-style intro credits. 4 hours of 'play' time, though admittedly at least an hour of that was snake standing still/codec menu while I was talking on facebook (can't do two things at once). It's going to be a slow burner, but at least there's no dog tags to get!

[Jimbob]

Started MGS3' date=' just past the james bond-style intro credits. 4 hours of 'play' time, though admittedly at least an hour of that was snake standing still/codec menu while I was talking on facebook (can't do two things at once). It's going to be a slow burner, but at least there's no dog tags to get![/quote']

 

Indeed, it's a pretty decent game. First one i played since Twin Snakes on the GC, and that was a pretty good game.

 

Pity it was limited though.

[Ramar]

Got round to finishing Snake Eater this evening, I'd literally saved a few minutes before the final boss. I didn't even know.

 

I decided to give Peace Walker a whirl, I'm not sure if I'm liking it's still. You can clearly tell it's made for a handheld and the animated cutscenes aren't really my thing.

[Jimbob]

I'm still plodding along with Snake Eater, think i'm half-way through now. Which is nice. Next is Sons of Liberty them Peace Walker.

[Hero-of-Time]

I decided to give Peace Walker a whirl, I'm not sure if I'm liking it's still. You can clearly tell it's made for a handheld and the animated cutscenes aren't really my thing.

 

I had it on the PSP and just couldn't get into it, despite me loving the MGS series to bits. I think the cardboard cutscenes mixed with the PSP controls turned me off. I wouldn't mind giving it another go on a console, especially with the online co-op missions.

[Ramar]

I had it on the PSP and just couldn't get into it, despite me loving the MGS series to bits. I think the cardboard cutscenes mixed with the PSP controls turned me off. I wouldn't mind giving it another go on a console, especially with the online co-op missions.

 

I've given it a bit more time today and I'm getting to grips with it. However the missions seem fairly short and it's very un-MGS. I may end up liking it still.

 

It really doesn't translate very well to 1080p.

[Julius]

Buuuuuuuuump.

Started Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty tonight, after playing through Metal Gear Solid for the first time a couple of weeks ago. I really enjoyed that game (for the most part), and while I'm still typing out my thoughts for the Gaming Diary thread for that, I figured after a little break I'm happy to dive into the next game. 

I'm only a little over an hour in, having just defeated Olga, so these are more of my first impressions compared to my experience with the previous game than anything else. The AI is definitely a bit of a step up from the last game, but my encounters with them so far have seemed...more forgiving, I suppose? I'm enjoying the first person view down and firing tranquilizer darts at some of these goons' heads, and it hasn't seemed unmanageable yet.

Admittedly, what I was most excited for from a mechanics perspective moving from the last entry to this game was how the camera and taking cover would be handled this time around, and I'm going to be honest: the generally fixed camera angle coupled with some frustrating "rubbing up against the wall until you're sneaking up on someone against it only for the camera angle to shift, you to lose perspective and accidentally come out of cover" is probably my biggest gripe with the game so far. At least when it comes to the camera angle you can get a first person perspective to try to work around how frustrating that can sometimes be, but taking cover just hasn't been so far, but hey, maybe I adjust to it - and if I do, hopefully it'll be sooner rather than later? 

Biggest complaint is the lack of Mei Ling, though. That one hurts. 

Oh and I loved the intro, it definitely got me hyped, looooove that main theme: 

 

[Hero-of-Time]

Yup, the theme tune is top tier video game music and one of my all time favs. Such a shame they can no longer use it.  

MGS2 was a game I was stupidly hyped for. I remember getting a DVD with one of the PS2 magazines I used to get (think it was PSW) and I watched the trailer over and over again. The E3 trailer that was around 7 mins long and shown at the show is a great video to find on YouTube. Seeing all the press at E3 gather around the large TV and be in awe at what was being shown is a great watch.

The game was doing some crazy things with physics for the time. The ice cubes always come to mind when thinking about this, as well as being able to shoot certain things that would effect the guards. I remember pratting around for ages in the tanker demo that came with ZoE just to see what you could do.

I'm glad the game didn't get released in this day and age. The Internet was still in its infancy back then and the outrage about Raiden wasn't half as bad as it would be now.

The writing in this game, especially towards the end, is so on point for what's occurring in the world today that it's actually quite scary how Kojima and company predicted the way the world was heading. 

I look forward to reading more of your thoughts, @Julius.

[Julius]

@Hero-of-Time, funny that you mention the trailer and the reaction for the game at E3, I've actually checked them out already! It's been something I've been trying to do when returning to games like this, I find that it makes me excited but also has this weird effect where it also tempers my expectations.

I think it goes without saying that returning to these games I'm going to be finding that they aren't as advanced in many ways as most modern games, so seeing the game ahead of playing it, and the reactions for it (and checking out what was around at the time) I find is doing a great job of making me understand opinions on the game. Things like graphics, and as you mention some of the mechanics, were clearly very advanced for their time, so I think it just gives me the chance to give the game a fair shake and accept it for what it is today, but also helps to understand some of the other opinions I might find/hear about the game after I've finished it. In spite of that, I was still pleasantly surprised by how well the first game holds up! 

Something that I forgot to mention actually, now I've briefly mentioned graphics, is some of the shots of the rain on the Hudson at the very start of the game. I actually finished a PS3 game just last night from 2010, and while I know this game has been polished somewhat being a HD remaster and all, I found that the rain specifically managed to set the tone really well, and I was surprised by how good it looked - it looked much better than that PS3 game did, that's for sure. There was a weight and attention to detail to it that I just can't quite put my finger on. 

And I'm really interested to see where the writing and story goes. I had that same experience with Kojima's forward thinking and writing a few times in the first game, where I just sat there and asked myself: how could he have known?! They nailed it in the first game with writing that has remained relevant to this day, so I'm looking forward to seeing how that pans out now that you've mentioned it. 

Also, quick question H-o-T, I know I'm a couple of games away from it still, but its inclusion in this collection has piqued my curiosity, so I figured I'd ask: do you think that Peace Walker is worth checking out? How did you find it? 

Edited April 21, 2020 by Julius

[Hero-of-Time]

Peace Walker is certainly worth playing if you are interested in the narrative of the whole series. It plays a big part in setting up certain events in the latter games. However, the change in gameplay style may not be to your liking. It was released when the Monster Hunter craze exploded on the PSP and PW was Kojima's take on that genre. 

[drahkon]

@Julius Peace Walker is great. As H-o-T mentioned it's a little different in set-up but the story is quite important. 

By the way, is this your first foray into the MGS series? Have you played Snake Eater before? If not...I envy you. Wish I could experience it again for the first time.  

Edited April 21, 2020 by drahkon

[Julius]

2 hours ago, Hero-of-Time said:

Peace Walker is certainly worth playing if you are interested in the narrative of the whole series. It plays a big part in setting up certain events in the latter games. However, the change in gameplay style may not be to your liking. It was released when the Monster Hunter craze exploded on the PSP and PW was Kojima's take on that genre. 

Thanks! I suppose I'll take it as it comes, I've really been enjoying the story of the series so far so if that's a big reason to check it out, I'm sure I'll give it a try. It being a departure from the series has certainly piqued my interest a little more too. 

2 hours ago, drahkon said:

@Julius Peace Walker is great. As H-o-T mentioned it's a little different in set-up but the story is quite important. 

By the way, is this your first foray into the MGS series? Have you played Snake Eater before? If not...I envy you. Wish I could experience it again for the first time.  

Yeah, I'll be sure to give it a go 

And yes, it's my first time checking the series out; never played Snake Eater before.

I just wasn't old enough to play these games when they first released, though thanks to Super Smash Bros. Brawl and seeing clips of the games here and there when I was much younger, I was at least somewhat familiar with Solid Snake and have extremely vague memories of seeing some of the locations in-game before (Shadow Moses in the original game in particular, but I'm not sure if some wires are getting crossed with similarly directed camera styles). Played a few hours of MGS V a few years ago, felt completely lost when it came to the story, and while I was excited to experience Death Stranding, it didn't feel right to pick it up without being familiar with some of Kojima's earlier work (you know, besides the popularity and critical acclaim of the series being a big pull too). 

So I picked up a PS3 last month, and these games were the first to go on my shopping list  really enjoying it so far, in any case! 

[drahkon]

9 minutes ago, Julius said:

never played Snake Eater before.

You're in for a treat  
One of the greatest games ever and surely Kojima's best work, yet. 

10 minutes ago, Julius said:

Played a few hours of MGS V a few years ago, felt completely lost when it came to the story

Well, that won't change even when you're familiar with the series  The story felt a little barebones but was still pretty good, in my opinion. It's sad to see the obivous restrictions Kojima got by Konami...this game could've been so much more. Still, gameplay wise MGSV is awesome. Well worth playing.

[Julius]

Played another hour and a half or so of MGS2, game definitely picked up a bit there, though a lot of my session today was taken up by cuteness (not complaining). Loved the tension in the dark corridors deep in the tanker, though I thought the shootout down there left something to be desired. 

Taking the photos of RAY against the clock was pretty fun. Naturally, immediately after the cutscene where Otacon explained everything and about how important stealth was down here, I slipped and instead of pressing the action button to start making my way down the ladder, I pressed my weapon button instead, firing off the gun still equipped from the shootout and immediately getting caught  seeing all of the marines turn around and look up at me was hilarious. 

Anyway, Ocelot turned up a couple of times, the second time with Liquid toying around in his head after Revolver seemingly got Liquid's arm to replace the one he lost in the last game. Oh, and Ocelot said "Patriots" and this guy had a stroke, "La-li-lu-le-lo". Seemed like a response to the phrase, so I'm guessing this has something to do with the nanomachines? Be interesting to see how that plays out. Oh and they also got RAY and the Tanker kind of went under. Whoops. 

Now we're playing as Raiden, some rookie being introduced to the systems and the mission a lot like Solid at the start of Shadow Moses, and we've spotted Solid Snake - or someone who looks like him? Hmm... - making his way up the Plant. Seems to love his VR missions that Raiden guy. Him referring to having completed the Shadow Moses incident in VR training makes me even question whether or not we were really even Solid Snake in the first game, and on the Tanker in this one. The Colonel has brought Rose into this, I'm guessing that's something to do with Shadow Moses and learning how a love interest (I'm guessing she's that?) can be used to spur a soldier on, like with Meryl. 

The Colonel said that our analyst-to-be was in an accident. Man, that better not have been Mei Ling... 

Edited April 21, 2020 by Julius

[Goron_3]

I played through MGS2 for the first time a few years back and just couldn't get into it. That said, I really appreciate the game and think it's pretty special. The plot itself is absolutely genius. You'd never get that nowadays.

[Julius]

Put a few more hours into MGS2 tonight. 

Ran into a lot of new faces, love the variety and personality to the antagonistic Dead Cell members I've met so far. Vamp is exactly who you would expect from someone with that name, and Fortune's theme is great. I love me some saxophone. 

Ran into Sna...Pliskin. Then later on we ran into Nin...Mr X. Hmm. Not sure how I feel about the handling of some of the returning character archetypes so far, as the game's story really is mirroring the first in a lot of ways. But I'm guessing there's going to be a reason for that, so I'll hold off on my judgement until I see how it all unfolds. 

What I'm not going to hold judgment off on is unfortunately something that I think has only got worse compared to the first game, and that's the camera. Good lord. Top-down + wall + first-person perspectives might have been a good mix back then, but as someone new to that and as someone who didn't mind it too much in the first game (besides certain instances where you literally cannot see something up ahead without going into first-person, which you get a LOT more of in this game), yikes. I tried to pull back on how I sometimes aggressively played certain games when playing the first game, which I adjusted to after a while, but this game just takes the cake at times. Somehow, wider corridors on the Plant feel tighter than some of the hallways in the depths of the Tanker, and it just doesn't work with all of the camera perspectives we've got going on.

Absolutely my biggest gripe with the game so far, and while I'm generally pretty good when it comes to appreciating older games with things like this, it does become frustrating when I know that a lot of my frustration with the game at the moment isn't down to my playing style or anything that I can control, but is in large part down to the camera. It feels almost like an arcade game at times, like the first one did, with lucky timing running between soldiers a much more effective tactic than the patience I'm ready to put into this game. 

I've got random shots in my head of Snake Eater being third-person, if memory recalls, and based on that I'm guessing that it's going to be a bit more to my liking in terms of minute-to-minute pacing of its gameplay. My fingers are crossed for that. So damn hard. 

Maybe I'm blowing it out of proportion, but that's how I feel about it at the moment. Curious to see if my thoughts change by the end of the game. That the camera is my biggest and maybe only real gripe with the game though is definitely a good thing. 

So, camera from hell aside, I'm still enjoying myself, and that's the main thing. There are some really interesting mechanics and ideas on show, and I feel like the story is just about to start picking up (just beat Fatman). Can't wait to dig into a bit more tomorrow. 

Edited April 23, 2020 by Julius

[Julius]

A few more hours put into MGS2 tonight after work. 

Yep, I really hate that camera. It somehow managed to get worse. 

On the upside though, I'm liking where the story is going. Nanomachines, the Patriots, heck, even The Colonel and Rose at times seem to be pretty on the nose about this game being about free will and control being the core themes that we're digging into. Definitely made me wonder about Raiden... - again, especially with how so many of the events are so reminiscent of what happened on Shadow Moses. Could just be tropes from the series, but The Harrier compared with the Hind D? Fatman's battle almost feeling like a mix of a few of the boss battles in the first game (darting around that room with Ocelot and the set up of the second battle with Vulcan Raven come to mind)? Even the people that we're meeting and saving, our journey mirroring Solid's in a lot of the structure just seems too similar for me to brush it off as a coincidence, I feel like there's something going on there. Could be totally wrong, but guess I'll see soon 

Found Johnson, got a lore dump - probably the longest one I've experienced across the two games so far? Then got a call from Snake and got even more exposition over the codec before I could even save after leaving the room with Johnson. Loved it. Did not love Rose going off on us when we went to save, but led to me finding that one of my favourite things in the game is pressing R2 during codec conversations. 

Rose: Jack, why won't you sleep in the same bed as me?

Raiden: Weirdo

Feel like I could wrap this up with a few more hours tomorrow/later today, and I've got the day off. The story's really picking up. I've watched that awesome E3 trailer for Snake Eater. Depending on how the ending of this game hits me, might end up diving into that later on tomorrow  

[Julius]

And credits are rolling on MGS2. 

Yeah, that camera doesn't hold up at times, in my opinion. But the cast of characters were great and varied, there's some excellent cinematography and music to back it up, and some great twists and turns (though one or two of the bigger ones I guess I snagged onto). Grin on my face at times, eyes welling up at others.

The opening to the game felt like a demo/prologue, which was interesting and fun, though I feel like the middle has some pacing issues and probably the most issues of any part of the game. The final third is absolutely worth putting up with that camera and middle section for, though: best character moments/interactions, story beats, and gameplay moments, in my opinion. Plenty of commentary on identity and control in the Information Age too, which I loved. 

And that post-credits clip, and then the stinger to tease 

Going to let it ruminate a little longer before I figure out exactly where I stand on it, guess I'll stick that in the Gaming Diary, but camera aside, big thumbs up from me 

Edited April 24, 2020 by Julius

[drahkon]

Spoiler

 

Eerily accurate...

[Julius]

After taking a bit of a break to digest MGS2 and spend some time with some of my other hobbies this weekend, I put a bit under 3 hours into the start of MGS3 this evening. 

Like with MGS2 HD, the game looks stunning for a PS2 game, and, one or two textures side, could easily get away with being a mid-gen PS3 game. Love the stronger focus on narrative so far than in the previous two games by this point, awesome cinematography and direction once again, and I'm a big fan of Cold War era stories, so this is right up my alley so far. 

Gameplay mechanics like camouflage, injuries (and how you go about curing them), and FINALLY getting to enjoy the series with a third person camera mean that I'm really enjoying my time so far from a gameplay perspective, too. I've caught a glance of batteries, too, so the emphasis on realistic survival is sinking in, and I'm finally getting to go at that much slower and more methodical pace that I mentioned not being the case in the first two. 

Also, the intro cinematic (which doesn't "unlock" until you move onto Operation Snake Eater - awesome touch) reminds me a lot of the James Bond intros, and I love it: 

For anyone wondering, I've just met up with EVA. Can't wait to play some more of this tomorrow 

[drahkon]

That song

I'd give my life
not for honor, but for youuuuu

[Dcubed]

Yeah, MGS 1-3 are absolutely brill.  Yeah, MGS3 is not subtle about its 007 influence at all, you're gonna love it!

 

MGS4 and beyond though? Ehh...